:: Adam? The first person or ....? ::
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This is one very topic where we all are not sure.
The version of Khalifa seems more logical.
We were all in the heavenly kingdom before and Satan was an angel who eventually rebelled due to given powers. As Khalifa pointed out, Satan thought he could be a god himself. Even on Earth, when a simple human being gets money and power, he tends to be corrupted and tyrannical. This "tendency" is due to Satan influencing him. And Satan himself got this tendency in heaven itself. And he rebelled against God.
It is very likely that Satan and his jinns ruled on Earth before humans. Bear in mind that before the coming of humans on Earth, millions of species already existed (dinosaurs, giant mammals). What was the purpose of having these dinosaurs on Earth? And why did God exterminate them? To provide fossil fuel for us???
God allowed us to follow Satan's order in heaven and eat from the tree, in order to distinguish those amongst us who would do better.
Jinns and humans were sent to Earth to serve as a test for God to prove who would do better. The human being tends not to believe things unless he is shown the proof twice. Our lives on Earth serve as a double-check for our real intent. This we cannot fool argue with God. This is the ultimate justice.
Since Quran mentions that jinns were made from fire, they cannot be simply an evil nature. They must be creations similar to humans and they will have a garden for themselves as well(sura 55). Why?If you dont believe that there was a destiny before our lives on Earth, please explain why some people are born dead, some die young, some die at 110 years old, etc. Why did this person deserve to die so young? What was his crime on Earth? No person bears the sin of another, so why are some children born in famine? There must be a reason to all this.
Please remember that Quran says that we all witnessed that there is only one God because our creation. -
Peace StopS.
Do you believe the Qoran? I am addressing those who believe Qoran is from GOD.
I have given verses from the Qoran along with every question!
God is talking to " Humans", there is a verse that says " Shall We just ignore the fact that you transgressed the limit"?
That to me means " original sin" What does it mean to you?
You do not have to get involved if you do not believe that Qoran is the word of GOD.
Thank you.
Peace.So your questions should be ignored by 80% of all humans, when Islam states it is intended for 100% of humans? Aren't you a bit presumptuous?
You are taking words which are meant spiritually and transferring the implications derived from interpretation into the everyday and real world. You can't do that. What I was trying to say is that Adam was not physically the first man and thus not the bearer of any sin.
However, if you decide to think only in a surreal world without any hooks into reality, then you are right, I am not in a position to help or provide input.
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So are you saying there are a number of people in the quran who are adam's?
I actualy agree with that.
peace
Salaam 357,
I mean to say that we all are Adam, that's why we are also addressed as bani Adam in AlQuraan.
May Allah increase us in knowledge and guide us to His true path pr
mmKhan -
Salaam 357,
I mean to say that we all are Adam, that's why we are also addressed as bani Adam in AlQuraan.
May Allah increase us in knowledge and guide us to His true path pr
mmKhancome on;
Then how do we apply ;
We said "O Adam! dwell thou and thy wife in the Garden; and eat of the bountiful things therein as (where and when) ye will; but approach not this tree, or ye run into harm and transgression."
to a person who isn't a male or female?
peace
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come on;
Then how do we apply ;
We said "O Adam! dwell thou and thy wife in the Garden; and eat of the bountiful things therein as (where and when) ye will; but approach not this tree, or ye run into harm and transgression."
to a person who isn't a male or female?
peace
What is it you ar quoting?
Salaam
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What is it you ar quoting?
Salaam
mmkhan said
I mean to say that we all are Adam
So if we are all Adam, how do you apply this ayah to everybody?
235
We said "O Adam! dwell thou and thy wife in the Garden; and eat of the bountiful things therein as (where and when) ye will; but approach not this tree, or ye run into harm and transgression."
especially to a person who isn't a male or female, or to a child or to someone whose wife is now dead, or someone who doesn?t have the appetite for women and wants to remain so?
What i believe, we aren?t all Adam, but only if we go through a certain unfortunate incident can we be characterized as such, therefore only certain people of the Quran are Adam .
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No, 357, you put something with quotation marks
"O Adam! dwell thou and thy wife in the Garden; and eat of the bountiful things therein as (where and when) ye will; but approach not this tree, or ye run into harm and transgression."
So what is that quotation you are making?
Salaam
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Peace,
Interestingly enough, this question took me back to my days as a Christian. An atheist asked my pastor "If Adam and Eve were the first people on earth, and had two sons, then their sons got married, who did they get married to?" The pastors response was "Well, obviously Adam and Eve had other children, and they had children." The atheist said "So you are saying that they committed incest with each other? Isn't that a sin in the Bible?" The pastor said "That is how it had to be at that time."
Even I couldn't wrap my head around that one...makes more sense to me that there were other people on the earth at the time. That Adam and Eve were just the "first" created ones...not the only created ones.
Amina
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No, 357, you put something with quotation marks
"O Adam! dwell thou and thy wife in the Garden; and eat of the bountiful things therein as (where and when) ye will; but approach not this tree, or ye run into harm and transgression."
So what is that quotation you are making?
Salaam
Just a quranic ayah 235
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mmkhan said
So if we are all Adam, how do you apply this ayah to everybody?
235
We said "O Adam! dwell thou and thy wife in the Garden; and eat of the bountiful things therein as (where and when) ye will; but approach not this tree, or ye run into harm and transgression."
especially to a person who isn't a male or female, or to a child or to someone whose wife is now dead, or someone who doesn?t have the appetite for women and wants to remain so?
What i believe, we aren?t all Adam, but only if we go through a certain unfortunate incident can we be characterized as such, therefore only certain people of the Quran are Adam .
Salaam 357,
Brother, We all are Adam means only men, because when I said that we are also called Bani Adam, bani is not children but sons.
mmKhan
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Interesting topic. Like most here, it's one I've thought a lot about, as well.
I've often wondered if there were men who were part of the evolution of the earth--like the animals of the earth--who were created in a much different way than Adam. There is physical evidence of the cavemen types, such as Neanderthals and other "types." Maybe Adam was more refined, spiritually and physically.
While I don't want to go and dig up references (and maybe someone here knows more about this), I remember reading a couple of articles about theories of how the cavemen types from what was, back in the day, the land that later became the European countries...how the mixed and mingled with more advanced men (based on bones) from the Middle Eastern and N. African areas.
And I should note that I use "men" for both genders here, and that I am an American woman with British and Welsh blood coursing through my veins. But I do believe my early ancestors were often referred to as total barbarians!
Also...I've often thought that the "descend" part of Adam and Eve's expulsion from Eden might have been a spiritual descent. They were no longer on a high spiritual plane or dimension, no longer elevated above other earthly beings in terms of closeness to God. That is, if we think about being enlightened, we usually think of it in terms of "rising up" to a higher level of understanding.
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The story of Adam, which is narrated metaphorically, is, in fact, the story of mankind itself. In this story, Adam stands for Man, his mate for Woman, Malaika for forces of nature, Iblees (or Shait?an) for baser human desires which become a powerful impediment in the way of accepting or following the Divine Guidance.
Read the explanation of Al Bakara by Parwez from verse 29 in this link; http//www.tolueislam.org/Parwez/expo/expo_002.htm
QURAN & EVOLUTION
http//www.parvez-video.com/insight/islam/evolution_quran/index.asp
Support for evolution in Quran
http//www.linamalkawi.com/2009/07/support-for-evolution-in-quran.html
Creation and Evolution in Quran
http//www.aljazeerah.info/Islamic%20Editorials/2007/October/Creation%20and%20Evolution%20in%20the%20Holy%20Qur'an%20By%20Hassan%20El-Najjar.htm
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I agree that Adam is the species. I think humanity is not so much a more or less evolved race or variety, but rather the ability to discriminate right an wrong. The physical make-up is not determinant.
On the other hand it seems a fsact that we have Neanderthal dna. Whatever happened in the past, it seems today we are clear as to who are human and who are not and what is foreseeable is that we will be genetically modified, if we have not been already by human intervention and that the future may bring a new race, more "human" than others is geneticla modifications are made selectively, for instance, those who cna pay can get nice modifications.
Salaam
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Even I couldn't wrap my head around that one...makes more sense to me that there were other people on the earth at the time. That Adam and Eve were just the "first" created ones...not the only created ones.
Inbreeding depression is bad for humans. There couldn't have been incest involved, or the progeny would've become genetically very weak or there would not be much genetic diversity! In fact, since our genome has relations between many other creatures on Earth, we could only have been progressively made (at least in body). Maybe Intelligence or sense of self-awareness is our soul, so does that mean some mentally challenged people have no soul?
Also about Neanderthals, if we assume that "One Human couple (Adam & Eve)" and the rest "Neanderthals", then we have problem with human sub species in Africa. Modern humans are theorized to have met Neanderthals when a group came "out of Africa" and Neanderthals aren't the only sub-species we have mated in human history.
http//en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neanderthal_admixture_theory#Neanderthals -
Question What was that tree, that they were asked not to go near?
Answer Some say it was an apple tree, some say grapes, some say fig, some say pomegranate, some say wheat , some even say it was mushroom. Whatever it might be, why people still eat those items? Are all people who are eating them are wrongdoers?
Question What is the logic behind eating that shajar making them zaalimeena?
Answer It is not tree or fruit that makes them zaalim, but their act against Allah's order made them zaalim. It has nothing to do with tree or fruit.
720
720 But Satan whispered to them to make apparent to them that which was concealed from them of their private parts. He said, "Your Lord did not forbid you this tree except that you become angels or become of the immortal."Question Apparent the them their private parts? Today also many people eating those items/fruits, why their cloths are not getting disappeared? Was it only for Adam? Was rules, laws and shariah made different for Adam and different for all of us?
Answer Unfortunately, translators are heavily influenced from the Bible. Where is it mention of private parts in the above aayat? Private parts are called furooj in AlQuraan, please refer 2430-31, 6612. The word used in above aayat is sau-aatihima which is a derivative of soou that means evil habits. Please click here to see its derivatives.
Question What is this Shajar used in 719 and 720?
Answer Shajar means something that comes out slowly and then grow and grow and grow. Please check 465 and 1424-26
Question Shaitaan said you both were stopped to go near this Shajar by your Lord because you will become malakaini or you will be living here always. Why?
Answer Malak means one who holds possession or one who is authorized or one who is holds power . Shaitaan said, you both may get power if you eat that tree or you may live forever.
Living for ever
7175
7175 And recite to them, the news of him to whom we gave Our aayaats, but he detached himself from them; so Satan pursued him, and he became of the deviators.7176
7176 And if We had willed, we could have elevated him thereby, but he adhered to the earth and followed his own desire. So his example is like that of the dog if you chase him, he pants, or if you leave him, he pants. That is the example of the people who denied Our signs. So relate the stories that perhaps they will give thought.akhlada is the word used in 7176 is a derivative of khaalideena used in 720. When Shaitaan pursued him when he detached himself from the aayaats and he thinks that he has to live forever on this earth, that is was Shaitaan said in 720 to Adam and his partner.
That means Shaitaan shows ways to Adam and his partner that earn more and more and more even if it is enough for you as if they were going to live forever in this earth. And they tasted it 722 and ate this Shajar 20121 and still they are in process of eating this Shajar.
Salaam
Sorry for my english.I remember i have read article from brother ayman where djinn means fantasy.
So djinn, wich is same root as majnoun (madness), could be the fantasy that is in us.i wonder if the famous tree (of adam) is not a vegetable entity but a spiritual entity. The tree of own fantasy that make us go far from truth.
i thank you, brother mmkhan, to remeber me the sense of shajar. Fantasy is also something that grow and grow.
We dont have to eat from the tree of fantasy God have forbidden to us. However other trees and other fruits of our fantasy can be allowed.Sheytan is related to words chatat or chayt, wich means going far or separate (from truth ??? ).
Sheytan would be rebellion against truth of God. Sheytan followed his fantasy to rebel against GOD and is the ancestor aff all our fantasies.
A Muslim Djinn would be a fantasy devoted to come nearer from truth of god.
Even God can be considered as a fantasy in our world since we have no direct proof of existence of God.To became muslim to god, we have to submit to him our fantasy and our spirit. It is not a physical action of our body.
The descent of Sheytan is in every one of descent of Adam. We have to submit it to God.I like very much this interpretation. Life is not battle between good and bad but between good fantasy and bad fantasy.
good actions with bad fantasy worth nothing.I have problems however with story of solomon where djinns seems to have done a very particular apparition in the human universe.
I am trying to understand that story using my "fantasy" to see if i can understand that story using fantasy interpretation.
Not easy.
Did solomon temple existed in our world ?
Is name Suleyman combination of silm and number two wich is submission in our world and world of our fantasy?
Really not easy.Peace