What is God's role with Born Disabled?
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Peace hawk99, zone and to All
2680 We All believe that When we are ill, HE is the one who cures us.
12106 And most of us do not believe Allah without associating partners.
10100 It is not for any person to BELIEVE, except by the leave of Allah,
and HE will place doubt who will not reason.
3163 They are in varying grades with Allah, and Allah sees what they do.
Thus, one would believe that when Iam ill HE cures me through
a. Modern Medicine -
Doctor of Medicine, Specialised Doctors, Surgeon, Specialised Surgeons ..,
b. Siddha
c. Ayurvedha
d.Homeopathy
e. Naturopathy
f. Pranic Healing, Reiki etc..,
g. Acupuncture and so on..,
And when all the above system fails ALLAH ALONE- BELIEF HEALING Triumphs.
So there are varying grades to the degree we associate with Allah, we choose
Modern Medicine which is born out of war, from our utter hastiness , wherein
butchering organs is order of the day. Depending upon one's sincerity
in their prayer , reasoning increases as their patience increases day by day and
ultimately one day they would realise that Allah Alone would be sufficient,
not only for health but for all needs.
3179 Allah would not leave us in the present state, until he separates evil from
good, nor will HE disclose the unseen. If you believe and fear Allah Alone,
then there is a great reward without measure.
8419 You shall surely experience from one stage to other.
Depending upon one's belief one would experience better or worse
for the days to come.
As regards to the person who believe that surgery has saved their life ,
the quality of life they lead is pitiable.
The above said is from my own experience from within and around me,
and for people who look for evidence and proof,
1096 For you it is your way, me it is mine.
Regards
Balachandran
Peace newmoon.
I have my own personal encounter with ?faith healers,? following people to see those people. From my experience, there are several categories of them
- Those who said they can see jinns, good ones and bad ones, and how the bad ones disturb and disrupt our bio-chemistry-physical systems and I have seen them performing the challenge and fight with those beings
- Those who can see people in other zones/places from their house
- Those who can cure people from their ?prayers=duas? by either touching or from a distance
- Those who can control the mind and characters of other people for approximately five months.
I have witnessed their ?miraculous? powers in healing, their ability to see and describe people that they have not met, healing the pains of patients, controlling people minds and behaviors, etc.
They did it with certain ?prayers?, chants and whispers. I didn?t hear exactly what words they muttered. When asked, most of them said they used only Quran and hadith.I am Quran-only as guidance believer. I construct my worldview from ayats of Allah as my frame of reference. From this angle, my only concern and the question that lingers in my mind, is, what ?forces? are they using to be able to see and perform all those things? Are their abilities and forces coming directly from Allah or something else?
I have my own perspective on the matter from my own observation, experience, knowledge and worldview.
Zone.
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Peace,
Most of the time these people are fake. If the "patients" get well it is due to the placebo effect.
But on the other hand, there may be some serious practitioner, but they would be a clear minority in that case. A prayer healer can only help the patient get confidence in God, if the patient goes there with doubt in their heart the prayer will have no effect. You can of course pray for someone, but the person with the problem must have their own strong Faith in God.
I have no doubt though that God may send people as signs with "supernatural" abilities to heal etc, Jesus had just that, but I am sure not the guy-next-doors will get that ability, and they probably need to be very devoted servants of God.
God bless you
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Salaam justamuslim,
I completely agree with what you said. However, I would also suggest you to remain active on the site as a newbie like me needs more and more information that actually makes sense) from a person like you to strengthen beliefs.
Myself, I have found many articles written by hadith lovers and by the people who are against Quran alone movement in this site. That does not mean we have to follow all of them. do we? God has sent us clear guidance and given us wisdom to choose between good and bad. We can use those to decide what to follow and what not. reading all those crap does not mean we follow them too. We only follow that actually makes sense and are according God's message.
Peace
This website has become a medium for crusaders, saviors, messengers and such. I don't believe we have had a prophet - not yet. It has become not a place to discuss and share but for persons to minister bringing along their followers.
There is no way I would tell my friends or family that I am a member of this forum or invite anyone to check this website. I know what my friends and family would say questioning my sanity and why I am wasting my time with characters like drfazl.
As I am reading posts from years ago, many persons who contributed much seemed to have left or not active. I have gotten so much and this is a place where I have frequented during some lonely difficult times. And so, stillearning, my feelings are mixed as there is a part of me that wants to leave this site completely.
God says clearly there will always be persons like drfazl and the like. There are those who will use God's words to serve their purposes or positions. From reading the Koran, we know that satan's intent is to lead people astray. What best way to do that than using God's words. Satan has already mislead the vast majority of the Muslims with the hadith and it is only expected that satan will find more clever ways of misleading those who rejected hadiths with God's words. And those who listen to such nonsense not using their sense are responsible for their actions.
I have been asked by Sunnis if I belong to a cult and these same persons if they read this nonsense absurd claims and posts by drfazl would surely think God alone people are crazy. I know what my impression would have been if I read such absurdity years ago when I came to this website. And those who are lurking and seeking to learn about Islam based on Quran alone, I sure would hate for them to think that members here are all "wacko".
And so for now, stillearning, will stick around here much to satans disappointment.
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We do not need any monitory paid intercessor between us and GOD for communication of any kind. Otherwise, it?s nothing but a fraudulent trade in which the con artist intercessor is the winner and the gullible payer is for sure the loser.
Peace,
Khalil -
Peace kgwithnob,
That is in its clarity true. They should not charge any money to begin with, if they were seriously God's servants.
Someone with powers like Jesus would never ask for money anyway. Regarding prayer healing, it is best to trust your own Faith than relying on intercessors like you said. To ask someone for money to pray for them is fraudulent, is it not?
God bless you
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Peace.
Peace.
I seek to follow the God?s way from His guidance, the Quran in context of the Quran?s touch-time zone. That means the following are my present viewpoints
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I have not found any aya of the Quran on dua to ask Allah to help heal someone. If you find one, please share. My point is, true healing and cure is Allah?s business, seeking true cure is our business. Asking help directly from Allah through dua is in accordance to His Guidance.
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My view on miracle, whatever miracle (also known as aya as sign from the God) that has happened has been mentioned in the Quran, whether performed by prophets, and about whoever and whatever. In the context of the Quran?s touch-time zone, the only miracle we are witnessing is related to the Quran. If you find any aya which says about other miracles about anything other than the Quran we can witness in this Quran?s touch-time zone, please share.
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Supernatural stuff performed by people to affect the lives of other people in this Quran?s touch-time zone is possible, only as a trial, for those who choose to seek help from those things (magical knowledge) brought down by malayka in the history of mankind with the permission of Allah as mentioned in the Quran. In the present life, one can actually get the powers and abilities if they seek those things.
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My point is we need only Allah directly for help and protection through dua (all the pertinent and relevant ones to be said for the sake of our goodness (hasanah) in this life and the next can be obtained from the Quran).
To Allah I seek refuge from the whisperers of syaithan.
Zone.
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Aoa justamuslim
It has become not a place to discuss and share but for persons to minister bringing along their followers.
The very reason why people like you need to stick around
As I am reading posts from years ago, many persons who contributed much seemed to have left or not active. I have gotten so much and this is a place where I have frequented during some lonely difficult times. And so, stillearning, my feelings are mixed as there is a part of me that wants to leave this site completely.
Exactly the reason why I was attracted to this site many yrs ago. Unfortunately for me time is in short supply & also sad to see many of Quran believers leave this site.
God says clearly there will always be persons like drfazl and the like. There are those who will use God's words to serve their purposes or positions. From reading the Koran, we know that satan's intent is to lead people astray. What best way to do that than using God's words. Satan has already mislead the vast majority of the Muslims with the hadith and it is only expected that satan will find more clever ways of misleading those who rejected hadiths with God's words. And those who listen to such nonsense not using their sense are responsible for their actions.
I am afraid I have no polite word other than fraudsters (which is v polite compared to what I really think). CHARGING usd2000 & claiming to be doing God's work. Well anyone with an ounce of intelligence can make up their own mind.
Personally I consider it a criminal act and should be treated as such. Apart from fraudulently obtaining money, God knows how many cases of manslaughter these people are responsible a for. Sorry if I appear to be harsh. But I have seen the damage these people cause & hence the contempt.And so for now, stillearning, will stick around here much to satans disappointment.
Cool.
Aoa zone
Correct there is no aya.
Unfortunately I find it difficult (unlike yourself) to be polite to some the characters here
Regards
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...1) I have not found any aya of the Quran on dua to ask Allah to help heal someone. If you find one, please share. My point is, true healing and cure is Allah?s business, seeking true cure is our business. Asking help directly from Allah through dua is in accordance to His Guidance...
See 2186, 2286, 2762, for the start.
Peace,
Khalil -
Aoa
See 2186, 2286, 2762, for the start.
The aya refer to praying to the good lord, cannot see any evidence asking you ask someone else to pray on your behalf. Is God multilingual?
Regards
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Aoa
The aya refer to praying to the good lord, cannot see any evidence asking you ask someone else to pray on your behalf. Is God multilingual?
Regards
highlight is from me.
1st Try 3;159, 4;64, 7;151-155, 12;97-98, 14;41, 19;47, 40;7, 47;19, 48,11, 59;10, 63;5, 71;7-28
2nd What do you mean by, "Is God multilingual?"?
Peace,
Khalil -
Peace,
Of course you can pray for someone, but God is the grantor of all prayers and thus the doer. Praying for someone else can even be a bonus since you think of someone other than yourself.
God bless you
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Peace kgwithnob.
Thank you for sharing those ayats.
If there are any differences between us, it is because of my position on the notion that we can?t DUA TO ASK ALLAH TO HEAL SOMEONE FROM ILLNESS.
Not about asking FORGIVENESS FROM ALLAH FOR YOURSELF AND YOUR BELIEVING BROTHERS AND SISTERS. Not about asking FORGIVENESS FROM ALLAH for those who come to you to become believers or to the God?s way and ask you to seek Allah?s forgiveness from them.
Yes my position is clear in the sense we can ask forgiveness for ourselves and fellow believers especially when we are together in jihad for the cause of Allah and also those who come to us to repent and not to fight or against us anymore. In fact we can offer to them to ask forgiveness from Allah on their behalf should there stop fighting against us. To me the asking of forgiveness from Allah for others or on their behalf is precisely clear in context they are believers among us or they come to us to ask for forgiveness from the God, though they are actually hypocrites and only Allah knows.
My words in the previous post
- I have not found any aya of the Quran on dua to ask Allah to help heal someone. If you find one, please share. My point is, true healing and cure is Allah?s business, seeking true cure is our business. Asking help directly from Allah through dua is in accordance to His Guidance.
Just to highlight some of the verses
7128 (Noah said) My Lord, forgive me and my parents and whoever enters my house a believer and the believing men and believing women. And do not increase the wrongdoers except in destruction."4716-19
And among them are men who listen to thee, but in the end, when they go out from thee, they say to those who have received Knowledge, "What is it he said just then?" Such are men whose hearts Allah has sealed, and who follow their own lusts.But to those who receive Guidance, He increases them in Guidance, and bestows on them their Piety and Restraint.
Do they then only wait for the Hour,- that it should come on them of a sudden? But already have come some tokens thereof, and when it is on them, how can they benefit then by their admonition?
Know, therefore, that there is no god but Allah, and ask forgiveness for thy fault, and for the men and women who believe for Allah knows how ye move about and how ye dwell in your homes.4811 The Bedouins who were left behind will say to thee, 'We were occupied by our possessions and our families; so ask forgiveness for us!' They say with their tongues what is not in their hearts. Say 'Who can avail you aught against God, if He desires hurt for you, or desires profit for you? Nay, but God is ever aware of the things you do.
Zone
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Peace.
If there are any differences between us, it is because of my position on the notion that we can?t DUA TO ASK ALLAH TO HEAL SOMEONE FROM ILLNESS.
I wish to correct myself. THAT STATEMENT ABOVE IS WRONG. I don't find a verse from Allah about dua asking Allah to heal someone whether we know or don't.
My Lord, forgive me should I forget and in error.
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I am afraid I have no polite word other than fraudsters (which is v polite compared to what I really think). CHARGING usd2000 & claiming to be doing God's work. Well anyone with an ounce of intelligence can make up their own mind.
Personally I consider it a criminal act and should be treated as such. Apart from fraudulently obtaining money, God knows how many cases of manslaughter these people are responsible a for. Sorry if I appear to be harsh. But I have seen the damage these people cause & hence the contempt.I don't find calling and describing people for what they are is being impolite. And no you are not being harsh in speaking out. One of the characteristics of a momeen is when s/he sees or knows someone committing evil/crime, a momeen does not sit quiet, being neutral or passive or politically correct but instead will aim to bring justice upholding and establishing salat=code of conduct as described by God.
I am not bothered with these so called "faith healers" as their due is awaiting them. God has made it clear what will happen if you use the words of God for personal gain may it be monetary,fame or otherwise. However there are people who are so simple, innocent, lacking in knowledge or so desperate that they are taken advantage by such frauds. I feel obliged to not only expose these fraudsters but to hold them accountable. Just as doctors are liable, so should these so called faith healers be held accountable and be liable.
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Aoa zone
Correct there is no aya.
Unfortunately I find it difficult (unlike yourself) to be polite to some the characters herePeace stillearning and justamuslim.
Please be patient, though sometimes I find it hard too. For your information esp justamuslim, I have left this site (community) in the first year it started. I came back recently. Treat it as there is a test and there is something for us to discover. To me you have spoken the right things. Hope these are comforting words for both of you.
Zone.
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Peace,
Of course you can pray for someone, but God is the grantor of all prayers and thus the doer. Praying for someone else can even be a bonus since you think of someone other than yourself.
God bless you
Salam
"And be not faint-hearted in pursuit of the host; if you suffer pain, then surely they too suffer pain as you suffer pain, and you hope from Allah what they do not hope; and Allah is Knowing, Wise."
Abiding by Allah's order, prayerfully, we shall stand for Allah; they definitely suffer pain throughout their lives visiting doctors until they die a more painful death in the hospitals where they went seeking doctors' protection against the death to save their lives; and they say believing in Allah alone is like playing with death; and it is insane. For they consider such "insane-belief" will lower a mumin's honour and dignity before the rejecting people who would always be the majority people till the end of the world. We hope from Allah; while they do not. Be not faint-hearted in reaching out to them.
"Those who take others with Allah for guardians rather than the believers! What! They seek honor from them? Then surely unto Allah is all Honour."
Salam
drfazl -
Peace
617
And if God should touch thee with misfortune, there is none who could remove it but He; and if He should touch thee with good fortune - it is He who has the power to will anythiing (61 for He alone holds sway over His creatures, and He alone is truly wise, all-aware.
640
Say "Can you see yourselves invoking any but God when God's chastisement befalls you , or the Last Hour comes upon you? if you are men of truth! (641) Nay, but it is Him alone that you will invoke - whereupon He may, if He so wills, remove that which caused you to call unto Him; and you will have forgotten all that to which you ascribe divinity side by side with Him."
642
And, indeed, We sent Our messages unto people before thy time, and visited them with misfortune and hardship so that they might humble themselves (643) yet when the misfortune decreed by Us befell them, they did not humble themselves, but rather their hearts grew hard, for Satan had made all their doings seem goodly to them. (644) Then, when they had forgotten all that they had been told to take to heart, We threw open to them the gates of all things,33 until - even as they were rejoicing in what they had been granted - We suddenly took them to task and lo! they were broken in spirit;34 (645) and the last remnant of those folk who had been bent on evildoing was wiped out.35 For all praise is due to God, the Sustainer of all the worlds.646 Say "What do you think? If God should take away your hearing and your sight and seal your
hearts - what deity but God is there that could bring it all back to you?" Behold how many facets We give to Our messages - and yet they turn away in disdain!We are at the time when "the gates of all things have been open" and we are rejoicing , However; ask your doctor if he could return to you the hearing and the sight if God took it away, or if they could open the hearts that have been closed by God.
drfazl you should go forth on earth walking into every town and village looking for the sick, and help them achieve peace and believe in God alone, but don't take anything from them except the food they provide you with, and no more than a full belly enough to get to the next village, then God you will have a great reward for you in heaven. And help the sick and dying accept God's will, because God's will shall be accepted joyfully.
peace may God increased our wisdom
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Peace wrkmmn,
The last part sounded like the orders Jesus gave to his disciples -)
God bless you
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Wrkmmn talks lots of ayats but his final command or advise has no relevance or reference to any of those ayats. What a way to read and cite! Refer from Quran and preach from bible!
About the alms in kind, and in service, and in cash
"And of them there are those who blame you with respect to the alms; so if they are given from it they are pleased, and if they are not given from it, lo! they are full of rage."
I can only say, "Sorry!"
By God, I stand.
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Peace,
It was a reference from one of the Gospel testimonials of the New Testament. They are among the few sources of the Bible I consider least corrupted. To be honest, a servant of God should not ask for any wage when they do something by he hand of God.
That is also stated in Quran.
God bless you