What is God's role with Born Disabled?
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Peace,
Most of the time these people are fake. If the "patients" get well it is due to the placebo effect.
But on the other hand, there may be some serious practitioner, but they would be a clear minority in that case. A prayer healer can only help the patient get confidence in God, if the patient goes there with doubt in their heart the prayer will have no effect. You can of course pray for someone, but the person with the problem must have their own strong Faith in God.
I have no doubt though that God may send people as signs with "supernatural" abilities to heal etc, Jesus had just that, but I am sure not the guy-next-doors will get that ability, and they probably need to be very devoted servants of God.
God bless you
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Salaam justamuslim,
I completely agree with what you said. However, I would also suggest you to remain active on the site as a newbie like me needs more and more information that actually makes sense) from a person like you to strengthen beliefs.
Myself, I have found many articles written by hadith lovers and by the people who are against Quran alone movement in this site. That does not mean we have to follow all of them. do we? God has sent us clear guidance and given us wisdom to choose between good and bad. We can use those to decide what to follow and what not. reading all those crap does not mean we follow them too. We only follow that actually makes sense and are according God's message.
Peace
This website has become a medium for crusaders, saviors, messengers and such. I don't believe we have had a prophet - not yet. It has become not a place to discuss and share but for persons to minister bringing along their followers.
There is no way I would tell my friends or family that I am a member of this forum or invite anyone to check this website. I know what my friends and family would say questioning my sanity and why I am wasting my time with characters like drfazl.
As I am reading posts from years ago, many persons who contributed much seemed to have left or not active. I have gotten so much and this is a place where I have frequented during some lonely difficult times. And so, stillearning, my feelings are mixed as there is a part of me that wants to leave this site completely.
God says clearly there will always be persons like drfazl and the like. There are those who will use God's words to serve their purposes or positions. From reading the Koran, we know that satan's intent is to lead people astray. What best way to do that than using God's words. Satan has already mislead the vast majority of the Muslims with the hadith and it is only expected that satan will find more clever ways of misleading those who rejected hadiths with God's words. And those who listen to such nonsense not using their sense are responsible for their actions.
I have been asked by Sunnis if I belong to a cult and these same persons if they read this nonsense absurd claims and posts by drfazl would surely think God alone people are crazy. I know what my impression would have been if I read such absurdity years ago when I came to this website. And those who are lurking and seeking to learn about Islam based on Quran alone, I sure would hate for them to think that members here are all "wacko".
And so for now, stillearning, will stick around here much to satans disappointment.
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We do not need any monitory paid intercessor between us and GOD for communication of any kind. Otherwise, it?s nothing but a fraudulent trade in which the con artist intercessor is the winner and the gullible payer is for sure the loser.
Peace,
Khalil -
Peace kgwithnob,
That is in its clarity true. They should not charge any money to begin with, if they were seriously God's servants.
Someone with powers like Jesus would never ask for money anyway. Regarding prayer healing, it is best to trust your own Faith than relying on intercessors like you said. To ask someone for money to pray for them is fraudulent, is it not?
God bless you
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Peace.
Peace.
I seek to follow the God?s way from His guidance, the Quran in context of the Quran?s touch-time zone. That means the following are my present viewpoints
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I have not found any aya of the Quran on dua to ask Allah to help heal someone. If you find one, please share. My point is, true healing and cure is Allah?s business, seeking true cure is our business. Asking help directly from Allah through dua is in accordance to His Guidance.
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My view on miracle, whatever miracle (also known as aya as sign from the God) that has happened has been mentioned in the Quran, whether performed by prophets, and about whoever and whatever. In the context of the Quran?s touch-time zone, the only miracle we are witnessing is related to the Quran. If you find any aya which says about other miracles about anything other than the Quran we can witness in this Quran?s touch-time zone, please share.
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Supernatural stuff performed by people to affect the lives of other people in this Quran?s touch-time zone is possible, only as a trial, for those who choose to seek help from those things (magical knowledge) brought down by malayka in the history of mankind with the permission of Allah as mentioned in the Quran. In the present life, one can actually get the powers and abilities if they seek those things.
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My point is we need only Allah directly for help and protection through dua (all the pertinent and relevant ones to be said for the sake of our goodness (hasanah) in this life and the next can be obtained from the Quran).
To Allah I seek refuge from the whisperers of syaithan.
Zone.
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Aoa justamuslim
It has become not a place to discuss and share but for persons to minister bringing along their followers.
The very reason why people like you need to stick around
As I am reading posts from years ago, many persons who contributed much seemed to have left or not active. I have gotten so much and this is a place where I have frequented during some lonely difficult times. And so, stillearning, my feelings are mixed as there is a part of me that wants to leave this site completely.
Exactly the reason why I was attracted to this site many yrs ago. Unfortunately for me time is in short supply & also sad to see many of Quran believers leave this site.
God says clearly there will always be persons like drfazl and the like. There are those who will use God's words to serve their purposes or positions. From reading the Koran, we know that satan's intent is to lead people astray. What best way to do that than using God's words. Satan has already mislead the vast majority of the Muslims with the hadith and it is only expected that satan will find more clever ways of misleading those who rejected hadiths with God's words. And those who listen to such nonsense not using their sense are responsible for their actions.
I am afraid I have no polite word other than fraudsters (which is v polite compared to what I really think). CHARGING usd2000 & claiming to be doing God's work. Well anyone with an ounce of intelligence can make up their own mind.
Personally I consider it a criminal act and should be treated as such. Apart from fraudulently obtaining money, God knows how many cases of manslaughter these people are responsible a for. Sorry if I appear to be harsh. But I have seen the damage these people cause & hence the contempt.And so for now, stillearning, will stick around here much to satans disappointment.
Cool.
Aoa zone
Correct there is no aya.
Unfortunately I find it difficult (unlike yourself) to be polite to some the characters here
Regards
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...1) I have not found any aya of the Quran on dua to ask Allah to help heal someone. If you find one, please share. My point is, true healing and cure is Allah?s business, seeking true cure is our business. Asking help directly from Allah through dua is in accordance to His Guidance...
See 2186, 2286, 2762, for the start.
Peace,
Khalil -
Aoa
See 2186, 2286, 2762, for the start.
The aya refer to praying to the good lord, cannot see any evidence asking you ask someone else to pray on your behalf. Is God multilingual?
Regards
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Aoa
The aya refer to praying to the good lord, cannot see any evidence asking you ask someone else to pray on your behalf. Is God multilingual?
Regards
highlight is from me.
1st Try 3;159, 4;64, 7;151-155, 12;97-98, 14;41, 19;47, 40;7, 47;19, 48,11, 59;10, 63;5, 71;7-28
2nd What do you mean by, "Is God multilingual?"?
Peace,
Khalil -
Peace,
Of course you can pray for someone, but God is the grantor of all prayers and thus the doer. Praying for someone else can even be a bonus since you think of someone other than yourself.
God bless you
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Peace kgwithnob.
Thank you for sharing those ayats.
If there are any differences between us, it is because of my position on the notion that we can?t DUA TO ASK ALLAH TO HEAL SOMEONE FROM ILLNESS.
Not about asking FORGIVENESS FROM ALLAH FOR YOURSELF AND YOUR BELIEVING BROTHERS AND SISTERS. Not about asking FORGIVENESS FROM ALLAH for those who come to you to become believers or to the God?s way and ask you to seek Allah?s forgiveness from them.
Yes my position is clear in the sense we can ask forgiveness for ourselves and fellow believers especially when we are together in jihad for the cause of Allah and also those who come to us to repent and not to fight or against us anymore. In fact we can offer to them to ask forgiveness from Allah on their behalf should there stop fighting against us. To me the asking of forgiveness from Allah for others or on their behalf is precisely clear in context they are believers among us or they come to us to ask for forgiveness from the God, though they are actually hypocrites and only Allah knows.
My words in the previous post
- I have not found any aya of the Quran on dua to ask Allah to help heal someone. If you find one, please share. My point is, true healing and cure is Allah?s business, seeking true cure is our business. Asking help directly from Allah through dua is in accordance to His Guidance.
Just to highlight some of the verses
7128 (Noah said) My Lord, forgive me and my parents and whoever enters my house a believer and the believing men and believing women. And do not increase the wrongdoers except in destruction."4716-19
And among them are men who listen to thee, but in the end, when they go out from thee, they say to those who have received Knowledge, "What is it he said just then?" Such are men whose hearts Allah has sealed, and who follow their own lusts.But to those who receive Guidance, He increases them in Guidance, and bestows on them their Piety and Restraint.
Do they then only wait for the Hour,- that it should come on them of a sudden? But already have come some tokens thereof, and when it is on them, how can they benefit then by their admonition?
Know, therefore, that there is no god but Allah, and ask forgiveness for thy fault, and for the men and women who believe for Allah knows how ye move about and how ye dwell in your homes.4811 The Bedouins who were left behind will say to thee, 'We were occupied by our possessions and our families; so ask forgiveness for us!' They say with their tongues what is not in their hearts. Say 'Who can avail you aught against God, if He desires hurt for you, or desires profit for you? Nay, but God is ever aware of the things you do.
Zone
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Peace.
If there are any differences between us, it is because of my position on the notion that we can?t DUA TO ASK ALLAH TO HEAL SOMEONE FROM ILLNESS.
I wish to correct myself. THAT STATEMENT ABOVE IS WRONG. I don't find a verse from Allah about dua asking Allah to heal someone whether we know or don't.
My Lord, forgive me should I forget and in error.
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I am afraid I have no polite word other than fraudsters (which is v polite compared to what I really think). CHARGING usd2000 & claiming to be doing God's work. Well anyone with an ounce of intelligence can make up their own mind.
Personally I consider it a criminal act and should be treated as such. Apart from fraudulently obtaining money, God knows how many cases of manslaughter these people are responsible a for. Sorry if I appear to be harsh. But I have seen the damage these people cause & hence the contempt.I don't find calling and describing people for what they are is being impolite. And no you are not being harsh in speaking out. One of the characteristics of a momeen is when s/he sees or knows someone committing evil/crime, a momeen does not sit quiet, being neutral or passive or politically correct but instead will aim to bring justice upholding and establishing salat=code of conduct as described by God.
I am not bothered with these so called "faith healers" as their due is awaiting them. God has made it clear what will happen if you use the words of God for personal gain may it be monetary,fame or otherwise. However there are people who are so simple, innocent, lacking in knowledge or so desperate that they are taken advantage by such frauds. I feel obliged to not only expose these fraudsters but to hold them accountable. Just as doctors are liable, so should these so called faith healers be held accountable and be liable.
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Aoa zone
Correct there is no aya.
Unfortunately I find it difficult (unlike yourself) to be polite to some the characters herePeace stillearning and justamuslim.
Please be patient, though sometimes I find it hard too. For your information esp justamuslim, I have left this site (community) in the first year it started. I came back recently. Treat it as there is a test and there is something for us to discover. To me you have spoken the right things. Hope these are comforting words for both of you.
Zone.
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Peace,
Of course you can pray for someone, but God is the grantor of all prayers and thus the doer. Praying for someone else can even be a bonus since you think of someone other than yourself.
God bless you
Salam
"And be not faint-hearted in pursuit of the host; if you suffer pain, then surely they too suffer pain as you suffer pain, and you hope from Allah what they do not hope; and Allah is Knowing, Wise."
Abiding by Allah's order, prayerfully, we shall stand for Allah; they definitely suffer pain throughout their lives visiting doctors until they die a more painful death in the hospitals where they went seeking doctors' protection against the death to save their lives; and they say believing in Allah alone is like playing with death; and it is insane. For they consider such "insane-belief" will lower a mumin's honour and dignity before the rejecting people who would always be the majority people till the end of the world. We hope from Allah; while they do not. Be not faint-hearted in reaching out to them.
"Those who take others with Allah for guardians rather than the believers! What! They seek honor from them? Then surely unto Allah is all Honour."
Salam
drfazl -
Peace
617
And if God should touch thee with misfortune, there is none who could remove it but He; and if He should touch thee with good fortune - it is He who has the power to will anythiing (61 for He alone holds sway over His creatures, and He alone is truly wise, all-aware.
640
Say "Can you see yourselves invoking any but God when God's chastisement befalls you , or the Last Hour comes upon you? if you are men of truth! (641) Nay, but it is Him alone that you will invoke - whereupon He may, if He so wills, remove that which caused you to call unto Him; and you will have forgotten all that to which you ascribe divinity side by side with Him."
642
And, indeed, We sent Our messages unto people before thy time, and visited them with misfortune and hardship so that they might humble themselves (643) yet when the misfortune decreed by Us befell them, they did not humble themselves, but rather their hearts grew hard, for Satan had made all their doings seem goodly to them. (644) Then, when they had forgotten all that they had been told to take to heart, We threw open to them the gates of all things,33 until - even as they were rejoicing in what they had been granted - We suddenly took them to task and lo! they were broken in spirit;34 (645) and the last remnant of those folk who had been bent on evildoing was wiped out.35 For all praise is due to God, the Sustainer of all the worlds.646 Say "What do you think? If God should take away your hearing and your sight and seal your
hearts - what deity but God is there that could bring it all back to you?" Behold how many facets We give to Our messages - and yet they turn away in disdain!We are at the time when "the gates of all things have been open" and we are rejoicing , However; ask your doctor if he could return to you the hearing and the sight if God took it away, or if they could open the hearts that have been closed by God.
drfazl you should go forth on earth walking into every town and village looking for the sick, and help them achieve peace and believe in God alone, but don't take anything from them except the food they provide you with, and no more than a full belly enough to get to the next village, then God you will have a great reward for you in heaven. And help the sick and dying accept God's will, because God's will shall be accepted joyfully.
peace may God increased our wisdom
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Peace wrkmmn,
The last part sounded like the orders Jesus gave to his disciples -)
God bless you
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Wrkmmn talks lots of ayats but his final command or advise has no relevance or reference to any of those ayats. What a way to read and cite! Refer from Quran and preach from bible!
About the alms in kind, and in service, and in cash
"And of them there are those who blame you with respect to the alms; so if they are given from it they are pleased, and if they are not given from it, lo! they are full of rage."
I can only say, "Sorry!"
By God, I stand.
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Peace,
It was a reference from one of the Gospel testimonials of the New Testament. They are among the few sources of the Bible I consider least corrupted. To be honest, a servant of God should not ask for any wage when they do something by he hand of God.
That is also stated in Quran.
God bless you
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Peace,
Man of Faith.You are probably referring to all the many number of ayats from Sura Hud, where the messengers when they deliver the message of God saying to their brethren "Believe in God alone, and there is no God besides Allah; and I am but a plain warner; and I am not asking any wages for delivering this." We are to follow the messengers and we shall not speak of what we do not do. And I sure do that. I am just saying what i had been witnessing in my practice. And I cannot speak of Quran until an ayat is well informed to me and completed on me with proof and signs." Up to this, it is most personal between me and Allah.
Now, after 40 years of personal reading, reciting, reflecting and as a result the inherent and automatic rehearsal of Quran without the aid of any single person; and even the reversal and undoing of all the sunni knowledge that my parents had taught me sending me to madrasas. Following this zakath, purification, Allah made it easy for me to throw away my shirky livelihood, using the methodologies of all man made medicines and all the man made religious practices in general.
This was my zakath. Allah helped me abandon my livelihood as the parents, patients, people and relatives abandoned me, even as my religious heads excommunicated me until I became single and it is Allah made me feel comfortable in the entire world, with except me, and Allah and His entire universe. No sadness, worries and grief touched me when I was put to test without money. That was my zakath, when I stopped my deplorable earnings as a doctor practicing MM. There is another way of Zakath, first earn in whatever way and then launder it through zakath. But with me I was made to fight in the cause of Allah with my life and money prior to gaining back my livelihood absolutely from Him, the Provider.
"And why do you not spend in the cause of Allah while to Allah belongs the heritage of the heavens and the earth? Not equal among you are those who spent before the conquest and fought and those who did so after it. Those are greater in degree than they who spent afterwards and fought. But to all Allah has promised the good for both. And Allah , with what you do, is Acquainted."
Whatever I do is not of my own accord but by the impulse of the liveliness of Quran. Whoever wants to launder their money through zakath, Allah expands their hearts to spend their wealth and property for which He promises heavens in both the worlds. Those who reject Allah and His way and hold on to their money and wealth, to impress the other rejecters Allah says
"And let not their wealth and their children impress you. Allah only intends to punish them through them in this world and that their souls should depart at death while they are disbelievers."
And of course, by Allah, I do not ask for wages to deliver the messages of Quran to the people. All my travels are by flight and the best auditoriums, my stay in 5 star hotels are my own expenses and I do not expect from the people who comes to listen to this message, close to 600 to 750 people every week. Even while I was deprived of all the money 20 years earlier, I was traveling in the third class train, with very difficult accommodation, with a very thin gathering of 10 or 15 people in the big auditorium - all expenses were borne by me with whatever Allah had left with me. Again this was not felt tough by me at any point of time. I was only thinking of when Allah's help would come; and I know and always believed, Allah's help is near. This ayat conducted me in this regard.
"Who spend during ease and hardship and who restrain anger and who pardon the people - and Allah loves the doers of good"
From this light of Quran I see the 'old or new', no testament is good enough.
Regarding the fees part of it
"Take, from their wealth a charity by which you purify them and cause them increase, and invoke Allah 's blessings upon them. Indeed, your invocations are reassurance for them. And Allah is Hearing and Knowing."
Peace
Man of Faith.drfazl