95 Theses: 9.5 Theses to Follow the Quran Alone!
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These are some of the reasons why we follow the Quran as the only source of religious Law, and without any of the traditional Islamic secondary sources (such as Hadith, Sunnah, or Sharia Law)
#1) The Quran is Complete, fully detailed, and not missing anything
A) "The word of your Lord is complete, in truth and justice." (Quran 6115)
B) "Shall I seek other than God as a source of law, when He has revealed to you this fully detailed book?" (Quran 6114)
C) "...We did not leave anything out of this book..." (Quran 63
D) "...We have revealed to you this book to provide explanations for everything, and guidance, and mercy, and good news...." (Quran 1689)
#2) Muhammed was ordered to Preach with the Quran, not beside it.
A) "Preach with this (Quran) to those who reverence the summoning before their Lord?they have none beside Him as a Lord and Master, nor an intercessor?that they may attain salvation. (Quran 651)
B) "Say, 'Who's testimony is the Greatest?' Say, 'God bears witness between you and I that this Quran has been inspired to me, and to warn you with it and to whomever it reaches...'" (Quran 619)
C) "We are fully aware of everything they utter, while you have no power over them. Therefore, remind with this Quran, those who reverence My warnings. (Quran 5045)
D) "We revealed to you this scripture, truthfully, confirming previous scriptures, and superseding them. You shall rule among them in accordance with what God's has brought down, and do not follow their wishes if they differ from the truth that came to you..." (Quran 54
E) "Had he uttered any other teachings. We would have punished him; We would have cut his Aorta, and none of you could have helped him. Indeed, This (Quran) is a reminder for the righteous." (Quran 6944-4
#3) Obey God & Obey the Messenger means to Obey the Quran
A) "The Only duty of the messenger is to deliver the message." (Quran 599, 6412).
-Traditional Muslim Scholars assert that to Obey the messenger means to Obey his Sayings (Hadiths) and to follow his ways (Sunnah). However, the Quran states that The only duty of a messenger, including Muhammed, is to deliver the message. (i.e Muhammed was the mouthpiece of the message and not the initiator of the message itself).
B) The Question is, What was the message of Muhammed?
Throughout the Quran, we see that the message and revelation given to the Prophet Muhammed, is the Quran in itself (Quran 3531, 427, 619, 650-51 ), Thus
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If the Prophet and Messenger Muhammed was ordered to follow and preach with the Quran (Quran 650-51), and
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If the duty of a messenger is to deliver the message, Then, obeying the messenger, must mean to obey and follow his message, Which in this case, would be the Quran itself.
"Have they found other gods beside Him? Say, "Show me your proof. This is the message to my generation, consummating all previous messages." Indeed, most of them do not recognize the truth; this is why they are so hostile. (Quran 2124)
- Thus, Obeying the messenger In this case, would not not mean, as traditionally conceived and taught to be, to follow his every day of lifestyle, including how to eat, how to dress, go to the bathroom, what he said, this brings the next relative point
C) "Never would a human being whom God blessed with scripture and prophethood say to people, "Idolize me beside God." Instead, he would say, "Devote yourselves absolutely to your Lord alone," according to the scripture you preach and the teachings you learn." (Quran 379)
-The Prophet Muhammed could never have advocated the idolizing of himself, His simplified message according to the Quran, was to simply Advocate "the Worship of God Alone"; Such is the signature message of all of the previous messengers and prophets. (Quran 2125)
D) Traditional Muslim scholars assert that the "Wisdom" (Hikmah 4113), that was given to prophet Muhammed are contained in Hadiths. A look in the Quran however provides us the answer to exactly what was the wisdom given to the prophet Muhammed From 1722, to 1738 We see commandments and advice given, and then by the end in 1739, it states "This is just some of the wisdom inspired to you by your Lord..." (Quran 1739). Thus the Wisdom (Hikmah 4113) given to the prophet Muhammed is contained in the Quran itself.
E) Traditional Muslim Scholars assert that God did not include all his sayings in the Quran, and that there are a category of Hadiths, called "Hadith Qudsi" (Holy Hadiths), which are God's direct words. Moreover, Traditional Muslim scholars also assert that Hadiths abrogate the Quran in some instances, and even more so, that the Quran is missing some verses, like the "Stoning verses" for the punishment of Adultery.
These assertions become fallacies when contrasted with what God has to say, that the Quran is rather perfect, complete, and not missing anything (Quran 638, 6114, 6115)F) Traditional Muslims assert that since the Quran mentions the prophet Muhammed as an "Excellent Example" (Quran 3321), then that means we should follow his examples, from his sayings (Hadiths), to his ways and means/lifestyle (Sunnah).
However, there are two counter arguments to this notion
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The wording here is "The Messenger of God", which again denotes the message of the messenger (i.e Quran). The messenger of God was an excellent example because he was following his message.
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Abraham and the believers with him were also deemed an "Excellent example" (604), but we don't see these scholars advocating to follow the way of Abraham, or his hypothetical sayings and ways/lifestyle (i.e Hadiths and Sunnah of Abraham). Abraham and Muhammed were good examples because of their devotion and worship of God, and God alone, as well as their Righteous character. Since God is the source of Righteousness (7456), then the important thing becomes to follow God's commandments to attain righteousness.
G) Traditional Muslim scholars also assert that "Obey the messenger" means to follow and obey his Hadiths (sayings) and follow his Sunnah (ways), that are actually attributed to him. As we've seen, this is not what we see in the Quran. What these scholars fail to mention is the fallibility of of Hadiths and Sunnah. They were compiled by men, "authenticated" by men, and added to the belief system of the Quran by superimposing them onto "obey the messenger". How could something fallible be from God? This bring me to the next point
#4) The Quran is Infallible; Hadiths & Sunnah are Not
A) "This Quran could not possibly be authored by other than God. It confirms all previous messages, and provides a fully detailed scripture in itself. It is infallible; for it comes from the Lord of the universe. (Quran 1037)
"God bears witness what He has revealed to you; He has revealed it with His knowledge. And the angels bear witness as well, but God suffices as witness. (Quran 4166)
"Say, 'If all the humans and all the jinns banded together in order to produce a Quran like this, they can never produce anything like it, no matter how much assistance they lent one another.'" (Quran 178
We Thus Have God's Assurance, and witness that he has revealed the Quran, and that it is infallible, and has withstood the test of time to being infallible. In short, this is not true of Hadiths and Sunnah.
B) God's Revelation will be Protected
"Absolutely, we have revealed The Reminder, and, absolutely, we will Protect it." (Quran 159)
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God has promised to protect his revelation, which is The Reminder to all of us. IF Hadiths and Sunnah Were part of God's revelation and reminder, then logically by 159, they would have been protected against falsehood. This is not the case however, because Hadiths and Sunnah are known to contain falsehood.
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Traditional Muslims ask in defiance, "How could you trust the Quran, and not trust Hadith, when both were passed down by the same people?". The simple answer to that Question is, If Hadith's were part of God's revelation, then they would have been protected just as God promised to protect his revelation in (Quran 159). God Himself was protecting the Quran, not "the same people". This would be why the Quran is still protected to this day, while Hadiths on the other hand, have been infiltrated with falsehood and their authenticity has thus came into question, so much so that there are categories of Hadiths based on there "authenticeness". How we trust something attributed to God, which contains doubt and questionable material? This brings the Next relative point
C) God's Revelation contains No Doubt
"This book contains no doubt" (Quran 22)
The Quran is doubtless (22), and undoubtedly is the word of God (1037). Hadiths however, are compiled and categorized into a handful of levels, but for simplicity, let's take 3 categories, They are the "Authenticated", the "Good", and the "Weak".
How could something from God contain questionable material? How could something from God contain Falsehood mixed with Truth? Truth, Falsehood, and Conjecture do not mix in the light of the Quran (Quran 1036).
#5) God is Not the Author of Contradiction
A) "Why do they not study the Quran carefully? If it were from other than God, they would have found in it numerous contradictions. (Quran 482)
We see from this verse that God is not the author of contradiction. Thus, If something is from other than God, it would readily contain numerous contradictions. This is exactly the case we see in Hadiths.
Hadiths contain many contradictions. These Contradictions are with the Quran, and even with Hadith contradicting other Hadiths. Here are some good examples
B) One great example of contradiction in Hadiths, is in the so called "Most witnessed" category of Hadiths (thus more value and authenticity). One such is the so called Last Sermon of the Prophet Muhammed. It is by Hadiths themselves, supposedly is one of the most witness events, (witnessed by thousands of Muslims), yet if we look into Hadith Compilations, we find that there are actually three versions of this sermon cited in the Hadith books
-First version "I left for you what if you hold up to, you will never be misguided The Book of God and my Family?. (Al-Tirmidhi 6143; Muslim 44/4/2408; Ibn Hanbal 4/366; Darimi 23/1/3319) 2)
-Second version "I left for you what if you hold up to, you will never be misguided The Book of God and my Sunnah". (Muwatta Book 46.1.3)
-Third version "I left for you what if you hold up to, you will never be misguided, The Book of God"
(Sahih Muslim Book 7, Number 2803; Muslim 15/19/1218; Ibn Majah 25/84/3074; Abu Dawud 11/56/1905).
-Shia Muslims accept the first Version, while Sunni Muslims accept the Second Version. In the light of the Quran however, the third version would be more authentic, because it rightfully mentions the only infallible thing to follow; The Book of God.
The point here is that even with the most "authenticated" Hadiths, there is always room for doubt and falsehood to creep in. Thus How can we put trust in such questionable material and attributed?
C) Another Example of just how contradictory Hadiths are is that Hadiths contradict themselves by containing Hadiths banning the writings of Hadiths and of shunning of Hadiths. Here are are some "Authentic" Hadiths.
"Do not write down anything from me except the Quran. Whoever writes other than that should delete it" (Ahmed Ibn Hanbal, Vol. 1, page 171 also Sahih Muslim, Book 42, Number 7147)
Abu huraira said that the prophet said, "The 'Ummam' (nations/peoples) that preceded you have gone astray when they wrote books and upheld them besides God's scripture" (Ahmed Ibn Hanbal).
"Abu Huraira said The messenger of God came to us while we were writing his sayings and said "What is it you are writing?" we said "sayings (hadith) we hear from you messenger of God" he said, "A book other than God's book?" then Abu Huraira said, "so we gathered what we had written and burnt it all" (Taqyeed Al-Ilm, by Al-Khateeb Al-Baghdady) also (Oloom Al-Hadith, by Ibn Salah).
Hadith scholars Justified the writings of Hadiths by stating that Muhammed changed his view about writing the hadiths later on in his life. However, even from Hadiths themselves, we find the "Ban on Hadiths" Still enact, as the following hadith, was reported 30 years after the death of the Prophet, confirms that "the ban on Hadiths"
From Ibn Hanbal; Zayd Ibn Thabit (The Prophet's closest revelation writer) visited the Khalifa Mu'aawiyah (more than 30 years after the Prophet's death), and told him a story about the Prophet. Mu'aawiyah liked the story and ordered someone to write it down. But Zayd said. " The messenger of God ordered us never to write anything of his hadith".
#6) God Permits Lies to be attributed to Every Prophet & Messenger
A) The Quran confirms that for every prophet there will be enemies of human and jinn devils who will fabricate fancy sayings and attribute them to the same messengers & Prophets to deceive the people
"We have permitted the enemies of every prophet, human and jinn devils, to inspire to one another fancy sayings, in order to deceive. Had your Lord willed, they would not have done it. You shall disregard them and their fabrications." (Quran 6112).
"This is to let the minds of those who do not believe in the Hereafter listen to such fabrications, and accept them, and thus expose their real convictions. (Quran 6113)
Thus God allows lies and fabrications to be attributed to messengers and prophets and leaves these lies and fabrications as a test.
Look what comes right after 6112-113
"Shall I seek other than God as a source of law, when He has revealed to you this fully detailed book? Those who received the scripture recognize that it has been revealed from your Lord, truthfully. You shall not harbor any doubt." (Quran 6114)
"The word of your Lord is complete, in truth and justice. Nothing shall abrogate His words. He is the Hearer, the Omniscient." (Quran 6115)
B) On the day of Judgment, The prophet will say
"The messenger said (on the day of Judment), "My Lord, my people have forsaken this Quran." (Quran 2530)
- The Word used in 2530, is "Forsaken' (Arabic Mahjoorah). Thus by Judgment day, many people will have forsaken the Quran. The word forsaken implies that they have took something else besides it.
Look what comes after 2530
"We thus set up against every prophet enemies from among the guilty. Your Lord suffices as a guide, and as master." (Quran 2531)This goes back to the "Enemies" of every prophet, inspiring fallce fancy words of 6112-113. Thus, 2530 gives us a glimpse that people will be following the many fancy words falsified and attributed to the prophet. This Brings the next point
#7) God revealed only One Hadith (Narration), and not 600,000+ Hadiths
A) Throughout the Quran, God speaks of only one singular revelation, which is the Quran. The amount of Hadiths present today is more than the Quran itself.
"God has revealed the best Hadith; a book that is consistent, wherein there is reiteration. The skins of those who reverence their Lord cringe therefrom, then their skins and their hearts soften up for God's message. Such is God's guidance; He bestows it upon whomever He wills. As for those sent astray by God, nothing can guide them." (Quran 3923)
"These are God's revelations that we recite to you, truthfully. In which Hadith (Narration) other than God and His revelations do they believe?" (Quran 456)
"Do you have another scripture in which you learn from?" (Quran 6837)
"In which Hadith (Narration), other than this, do they believe?" (Quran 7750)
"Among the people, there are those who uphold baseless Hadiths, and divert others from the path of God without knowledge, and takes it in vain. These will incur a shameful retribution." (Quran 316)
B) Which is better One consistent source or many disputing sources?
"We have cited for the people from every kind of example in this Quran that they may take heed; An Arabic Quran, without any ambiguity, that they may be righteous. God cites the example of a man who deals with disputing partners , compared to a man who deals with only one consistent source . Are they the same? Praise be to God; most of them do not know!" (Quran 37 27-29).
There is only One Sunnah (System), and that is the Sunnah of God.
A) Traditional Muslim Scholars assert that the Prophet's Sunnah "Ways" should be followed. However, No where in the Quran does it ever speak of Anyone having a "Sunnah", except God himself. In the Quran, there is no Sunnah, but the Sunnah of God Himself (Quran 3362, 3543, 4823).
God is the one with the power and He is the only ruler and Law giver; No one else share in his Kingship, nor does he have any partners ruling besides Himself (Quran 1826).
"Such was God's Sunnah (System) for those who have passed on before. You will find that there is no substitute for God's Sunnah (System)." (Quran 3362)
"They resorted to arrogance on earth, and evil scheming, and the evil schemes only backfire on those who scheme them. Should they then expect anything but the fate of those who did the same things in the past? You will find that God's Sunnah (System) is Unchangeable; you will find that God's Sunnah (System) is Unalterable." (Quran 3543)
#9) God's Religion was Perfected the very same day of verse (53), not 200+ years later
A) Traditional Muslim scholars assert that the Hadith and Sunnah complete the religion of God, and without them, the Quran is invalid. However, when we look into the Quran, we see that the God has perfected his religion (Quran 53). God thus didn't need any Hadith compilers (like Bukhari or Muslim), who most of which came 200+ years later, after the death of the Prophet. God didn't need Hadith's to explain or complete his already perfect, fully detailed, fully explained, and complete Book (Quran 638, 6114, 6115, 752, 1689, 3927)
"... Today, I have completed your religion, perfected My blessing upon you, and I have decreed Submission To God (Islam) as the religion for you... (Quran 53)
"The word of your Lord is complete, in truth and justice..." (Quran 6115)
"...We have revealed to you this book to provide explanations for everything, and guidance, and mercy, and good news...." (Quran 1689)
Thus God perfected his religion that day. He did not need any Hadith compilers or scholars to provide commentaries or explanations to "top off" and perfect his already perfect Religion. This brings up the next relative point
B) Following anything else besides God is tantamount to Idol Worship
"Do they have idols who decree laws for them religious laws never authorized by God? If it were not for the predetermined decision, they would have been judged immediately. Indeed, the transgressors have incurred a painful retribution. (Quran 4221)
"You shall all follow what has been brought down to you from your Lord and do not follow any allies besides Him. Rarely do you remember." (Quran 72-3)
"They have set up their religious leaders and scholars as lords, besides God. Others deified the Messiah, son of Mary, When they were all commanded to worship only one god; There is no god except He. Be He glorified, high above having any partners." (Quran 931)
"We have cited for the people from every kind of example in this Quran that they may take heed; An Arabic Quran, without any ambiguity, that they may be righteous. God cites the example of a man who deals with disputing partners , compared to a man who deals with only one consistent source . Are they the same? Praise be to God; most of them do not know!" (Quran 37 27-29)
C) On the day of Judgment, The prophet will say
"The messenger said (on the day of Judgement), "My Lord, my people have forsaken this Quran." (Quran 2530)
"...Your Lord suffices as a guide, and a master." (Quran 2531)"These are God's revelations that we recite to you, truthfully. In which Hadith (Narration) other than God and His revelations do they believe in?" (Quran 456)
#9.5) Ponder and Ask yourself!
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Is the Quran good enough for you? or do you need Hadith, Sunnah, Ahlul Bayt, Imams, Scholars, Shiekhs, Saints etc. to explain it (See Quran 638, 6114, 6115, 73, 752, 931, 1689, 3927) ?
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Is the Quran not perfect, fully detailed, fully explained, and complete Book? (See Quran 638, 6114, 6115, 752, 1689,3927)
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Which Hadith after God and His verses do you believe in? (See Quran 456, 7750)
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Do you have another scripture besides the Quran in which you learn from? (See Quran 6837)
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Is God not the only Law-Giver? or does Muhammed/Ahlul Bayt/Ali rule besides him? (See Quran 1826, 4221, 6944-4
Your answers to all of these should be advocating God and his scripture alone (The Quran), otherwise if your answer is God + Quran + Hadith + Sunnah + Ahlul Bayt + Imams + Ali + ...... then that would be tantamount to Idol worship (See Quran 4221, 73, 931, 614
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These are some of the reasons why we follow the Quran as the only source of religious Law, and without any of the traditional Islamic secondary sources (such as Hadith, Sunnah, or Sharia Law)
#1) The Quran is Complete, fully detailed, and not missing anything
A) "The word of your Lord is complete, in truth and justice." (Quran 6115)
B) "Shall I seek other than God as a source of law, when He has revealed to you this fully detailed book?" (Quran 6114)
C) "...We did not leave anything out of this book..." (Quran 63
D) "...We have revealed to you this book to provide explanations for everything, and guidance, and mercy, and good news...." (Quran 1689)
Firstly, there is no religion of Islam . . and therefore, there is no religious law.
There is only way of life (deen), meaning . . . the rule should cover all aspects of our life.
Secondly, it is ridiculous to say that the Quran is fully detailed and not missing anything. It is so obvious that the Quran does not cover every aspect of our life. Further and if the Quran is fully detailed, then we need to delete the following verses from the Quran since there is no need for us to ask help from Allah for guidance . . . It is so since the Quran is complete, fully detailed, and not missing anything.
15 It is You we worship and You we ask for help.
16 Guide us to the straight pathTherefore, I believe the i'qtiqad that we don't need other references are the ideology of absolute sectarianism.
peace
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Firstly, there is no religion of Islam . . and therefore, there is no religious law.
There is only way of life, meaning . . . the rule should cover all aspects of our life.
Secondly, it is ridiculous to say that the Quran is fully detailed and not missing anything. It is so obvious that the Quran does not cover every aspect of our life. If the Quran is fully detailed, then we need to delete the following verses from the Quran since there is no need for us to ask help from Allah for guidance . . . It is so since the Quran is complete, fully detailed, and not missing anything.
15 It is You we worship and You we ask for help.
16 Guide us to the straight pathTherefore I believe the i'qtiqad that we don't need other reference is an absolute sectarianism.
peace
Islam is a deen that is a way of life and not just a religion is an old saying and true. However - It already contains elements of religion and law.
Quran is more like a blueprint somewhat akin to genes rather than a detailed plan- all that is needed is there. What is left - is the raw material - as the book keeps saying . . . it is guidance .
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Islam is a deen that is a way of life and not just a religion is an old saying and true. However - It already contains elements of religion and law.
Quran is more like a blueprint somewhat akin to genes rather than a detailed plan- all that is needed is there. What is left - is the raw material - as the book keeps saying . . . it is guidance .
Religion disregard the elements of justice in humanity, and therefore it can never be Islam.
And whoever seeks a "dnan" (ا other than Islam
it will NEVER be accepted of him
and in the Hereafter he will be one of the losers
(385)I agree that the Quran is more like a blueprint. The Quran is the Constitution (foundation, 3.7) and the manual for us to seek for further guidance from Allah. It is in this sense that it is perfectly in detail . . ie, as a foundation. Therefore, the Quran is not perfectly in detail to cover all aspects of our life and we need other references to find out what could be considered as justly balanced to the society.
| Human Constitution
The Foundation | | Allah's Constitution
The Foundation| | |
| Not perfectly in detail | | Perfectly in detail
| | |
| http//ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/51jSY39UF5L.SY300.jpg | | http//news.antiwar.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/09/quran.jpg
| | |
| 40,627 statutory laws from this constitution? | | How many laws? Statutory Laws? Subsidiary Laws? etc
| | | How many people read?
| Hundred thousands of subsidiary laws, regulations and codes | |
| millions of rules, policies and procedures from all institutions | | and now.. the message is only do good deeds? Quran Alone?
| covering almost all aspect of human activities | | absolute separation? absolute secularism?
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"Religion is an organized collection of beliefs, cultural systems, and world views that relate humanity to an order of existence."
"Religion - the belief in and worship of a superhuman controlling power, especially a personal God or gods."
These are definition of a religion and that is all. So - by them Islam is a religion. Also - the problem is if you declare Islam as not being a religion and those with evil intention that declare Islam to be a political entity then have more firepower to target Muslims.
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I agree that the Quran is more like a blueprint. The Quran is the Constitution (foundation, 3.7) and the manual for us to seek for further guidance from Allah. It is in this sense that it is perfectly in detail . . ie, as a foundation. Therefore, the Quran is not perfectly in detail to cover all aspects of our life and we need other references to find out what could be considered as justly balanced to the society.
Yes it is important to be clear what we mean. The quran can be detailed as well as not detailed depending on what we mean with 'detailed'. I agree with you on the above.
The crux of the matter when talking about the quran being detailed or not is actually about the quran being perfect or not as it is. If we don't think it is perfect, perhaps we don't consider it being inspired and shaped by the Creator at all (like atheists), or perhaps we believe it is incomplete and that SPECIFIC, ADDITIONAL texts are required to complete it (like e.g. sunnis believe).
Obviously, saying that the quran is complete and fully detailed doesn't mean it covers all aspects of life... how could anything ever do that? I think some people misunderstand 'fully detailed'. 'Fully detailed and complete' just means that it is not flawed and lacking some pieces that must be supplied by other SPECIFIC texts.
Peace!
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Peace,
The Quran is indeed fully detailed, complete as per Allah. The question then becomes, "how so is the Quran complete?
Well, for one thing one can quickly ascertain that it is not a complete cookbook, or mechanics manual.
The Quran is fully detailed and complete with everything you need for salvation!God bless
peace
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Firstly, there is no religion of Islam . . and therefore, there is no religious law
DYN ( | spelled dn) means
Judgment
e.g. (ywm -dyn) = Judgment DayReligion (see 53; 6159; 319; 373; 2256; etc)
e.g. {6159} "Those who have divided their religion and become sects, ..." (... ا -
DYN ( | spelled dn) means
Judgment
e.g. (ywm -dyn) = Judgment DayReligion (see 53; 6159; 319; 373; 2256; etc)
e.g. {6159} "Those who have divided their religion and become sects, ..." (... اDeen is just an Arabic word for religion. This 'muslims' guy is playing dumb.
But the religion mentioned in the Qur'an is not an organized religion with clerical body etc. -
Peace,
That it means judgement is very interesting for the context of The Book. It means you have God's judgement, or at least try to do as God wants in terms of fair judgement, when you follow Him. This thing about upholding justice is echoed throughout the whole book. It is the problem in a grand majority of cases in The Book and where God destroys entire communities. They had no balance and committed mainly evil.
Could possibly be that deen does not connote to religion at all but to follow God's sound judgement. All pieces of the puzzle comes together now.
The word religion connotes to something you have put your reliance upon, mainly used for spiritual talk. It is not wrong to say the religion of God which means that you have put your Faith in Him. Problem is that it has not particularly any special name. Names are likely exclusively inventions by man. Muslim is a descriptive title. You ought to be able to use English completely in connection to God's religion and thus something similar could be used to describe yourself but it tends to cause people to regard you as a new sect. The Submitters is an example of that even if the English word used is not too bad.
I find it okay to say "I believe in God" and I try my best to stay by His side and I follow His judgement.
God bless you
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Salaam all
Myself see the word "dyn" as system not religion, since the word "religion" refer to manmade creeds.
For @ TheQuranAloneRevolution, we muslims support "believe/iman to Quran only".
Now what is your understanding of iman/believe in that circumstances?
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Religion is "madhab" and "deen" is a way of life . . .
Religion is the opposite of Deen and it is sectarianism . .
On the other hand, Islam is about attitude (for peaceful living, living justly) and attitude does not need religion
It is in every human beings . . regardless of religions etc.
It is funny to imagine God has a religion (faulty of generalization, sectarianism) and opposing the elements of justice in humanity . .
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Among Muslims, the word deen has come to mean religion, and when Muslims say Islam is a religion and a way of life, it is just fancy words to say that their religion is the best one. People cannot really grasp the idea of deen being an attitude. Of course, everyone would agree that deen is also an attitude, but that's often just lip service. The reason is that you cannot have deen being an attitude as well as a dogmatic set of beliefs i.e. a religion. These are two entirely different things. Religion cannot tolerate deen/attitude, because deen won't agree to submitting to the rigid and unnatural tenets of religion. Therefore religious people, who strongly adhere to a religion, cannot accept deen/attitude... because it is too different from religion.
Peace
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Also another point to #3) "Obey the messenger" means "Obey the message"
"Follow the messenger, the gentile prophet (Muhammad), whom they find written in their Torah and Gospel.* He exhorts them to be righteous, enjoins them from evil, allows for them all good food, and prohibits that which is bad, and unloads the burdens and the shackles imposed upon them. Those who believe in him, respect him, support him, and follow the light that came with him are the successful ones." ( Quran 7157) -
Among Muslims, the word deen has come to mean religion, and when Muslims say Islam is a religion and a way of life, it is just fancy words to say that their religion is the best one. People cannot really grasp the idea of deen being an attitude. Of course, everyone would agree that deen is also an attitude, but that's often just lip service. The reason is that you cannot have deen being an attitude as well as a dogmatic set of beliefs i.e. a religion. These are two entirely different things. Religion cannot tolerate deen/attitude, because deen won't agree to submitting to the rigid and unnatural tenets of religion. Therefore religious people, who strongly adhere to a religion, cannot accept deen/attitude... because it is too different from religion.
Peace
Zulf - with respect - you are talking guff...
People cannot really grasp the idea of deen being an attitude.
I have never come across any meaning of the word "attitude" that can make sense here.
I think "Muslims" English is poor - hence he is not able to express exactly what he is thinking. So
Religion cannot tolerate deen/attitude, because deen won't agree to submitting to the rigid and unnatural tenets of religion. Therefore religious people, who strongly adhere to a religion, cannot accept deen/attitude... because it is too different from religion.
This makes no sense.
The basic meaning of the word "Deen" is to "Submit, follow". Why don't you look it up?
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Religion is "madhab" and "deen" is a way of life . . .
Religion is the opposite of Deen and it is sectarianism . .
On the other hand, Islam is about attitude (for peaceful living, living justly) and attitude does not need religion
It is in every human beings . . regardless of religions etc.
It is funny to imagine God has a religion (faulty of generalization, sectarianism) and opposing the elements of justice in humanity . .
Religion is the opposite of Deen and it is sectarianism . .
No it isn't. Religion simply means believing in deity and/or submission to a particular faith. This is about what "deen" means too.
"Muslims" - you tend to throw such tin-pot theories out - when you are challenged you become really nasty. Now - stay calm and back your thinking up - from the Quran by using language and logic.
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Salaam all
Myself see the word "dyn" as system not religion, since the word "religion" refer to manmade creeds.
For @ TheQuranAloneRevolution, we muslims support "believe/iman to Quran only".
Now what is your understanding of iman/believe in that circumstances?
Dear - I often find you tend not to know what you are talking about. Take this
Myself see the word "dyn" as system not religion, since the word "religion" refer to manmade creeds.
In other words - both words are synonymous . . . why don't you use a dictionary and look both words up. It might surprise you! Try laying off making things up.
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I unable to find this statement as "reasoning" . . it is simply a "statement without reason" (opinion).
Statement with reasoning = argument and is still opinion. However the above is factual - based on dictionary.
Religion
"1. the belief in and worship of a superhuman controlling power, especially a personal God or gods."
"2. a particular system of faith and worship."
Also
"Religion is an organized collection of beliefs, cultural systems, and world views that relate humanity to an order of existence."
Deen - look up dictionary - Lane's Lexicon
Having said the above . . . it is YOUR views that are being challenged - so where is your er . . . "reasoning"?
It is the job of the claimant to provide the evidence for his claims
Burden of Proof - regarding your claim is upon you
http//rationalwiki.org/wiki/Burden_of_proof
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However the above is factual - based on dictionary.
That's what I said . . it is not reason . . and it is factual for religion (madhab), not for way of life (deen).
Religion
"1. the belief in and worship of a superhuman controlling power, especially a personal God or gods."
"2. a particular system of faith and worship."
In Islam . . we don't worship Allah . .
but we serve our whole life for Allah because we are servants.
Say, "Indeed, my prayer, my rites of sacrifice, my living and my dying are for Allah , Lord of the worlds. (6.162)
There is no worshipping in Islam.
Further . . one can be a Muslim even with "0" faith in Allah (4914-17) . . it is so since "submission" is about obedience, not about belief.
and . . Muhammad can be a non Muslim, despite he is a True Believer (6121)
This is reasoning . .
and where is your reason and proof to counter the above verses ?
ie. (4914-17) and (6121)
http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9606111.msg344772#msg344772
http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9606111.msg344801#msg344801
quote . . .
back your thinking up - from the Quran by using language and logic.