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  4. This is more reasonable about 33:40

This is more reasonable about 33:40

Scheduled Pinned Locked Moved Questions/Comments on the Quran
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  • M Offline
    M Offline
    Man_of_Faith
    wrote on last edited by
    #5

    Peace,

    The 'khatam' word has had me thinking for hours and I still consider whether it really means the cancelation of something and if it cannot mean something like a 'ring' like in ring of prophets. It is traditionally also used to be referred to as a seal over their hearts in other parts of the recitation. It sounds like a lid or prevention of something and khatam ought by that logic mean also that in the matter of prophets it would mean that it is about a cancelation of prophets.

    I have also considered that the "heart" in question is of similitude for something else, but yet it seems to remain a prevention or stop of something.

    And like many other people have said it does not say that it is an end to rasools (messengers) unless of course all rasools are nabis (prophets).

    In English I think you can say that something is within the seal of prophets as that kind of group of people and perhaps the original Arabic implies a similar meaning.

    As indicated in at least one verse about invoking a curse about liars, the word nabi seems to mean to be in authority to make prophesies and I have understood to say something by he leave of God that will come true and not only receive external information. Hence a nabi could be one that has the authority to curse, for example, as long as the person does not violate the command of God. Surely it is difficult perhaps to understand. It may mean that some people were rasool but they were not nabi either because not blessed with the ability or they did not utilize the capability.

    About the Sunni and Shia conflict it was covenanted that God's promise did not include evil-doers. So anyone within the assembly following that covenant and doing good like given in the oath will be an imam for the people. It is nothing you choose to be but you are chosen by God. So much mischief and suffering in the Shia and Sunni conflict over one man's succession is pathetic to say the least.

    If just one of those nutjobs took their responsibility and took the assembly back to the command of God and the decree and judgment then it would prosper again, but they are too preoccupied by the conjecture around what was revealed in the past. And such behavior just feeds the animosity and hatred. A major prevention factor is the massive idolatry of the previous prophet and alleged successors in form of imams or caliphs.

    God bless you

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    • A Offline
      A Offline
      Armanaziz
      wrote on last edited by
      #6

      Salamun Alaikum.

      I don't see any benefit for general humankind of stating "Muhammad did not fathered any son and Muhammad is the seal of prophet'. Whether both statement is true or false it doesn't matter (who cares?)

      The arabic word "Aba" does not only mean biological father (unlike the word "walid" which specifically means biological father) - it can also mean any father-figure - even an ideological leader - for example in the sense of "father of nation".

      To me the statement "Muhammad is not father of any of you fellows, but rather a massenger of Allah and seal of prophets" has following important message

      1. Muhammad (pbh) is not meant to be father figure for any group or sect - neither shia, nor sunni - nor even the entire group who call themselves muslim, but rather...
      2. He was a messenger of Allah. Just like Allah is for everyone - Muhammad and his heritage is a common heritage for mankind (or even the universe)... and so is the message that he brought .... not only of a specific group or sect.
      3. And he also was the seal of prophets (but not necessarily seal of messengers or seal of inspiration or wahi). To me seal of prophets simply means after the book brought by Muhammad (i.e. Qur'an) there will be no "new" book (kitab) from near Allah.

      I don't know about general hummankind - but for me the verse is quite an eye-opener. I do care.

      May Allah guide us all to the straight route.

      Regards,
      Arman

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      • H Offline
        H Offline
        huruf
        wrote on last edited by
        #7

        The khatm for me is very important and I understand it not as an end or a closing, but rather as an endorsement of authenticity. Whatever is handed out as coming from God, as revelation, has to be in agreement with the revelation through Muhammad, that is the Qur'an, if it is, then it bears the seal of prophethood, if it doesn't, it is not.

        Since the Qur'an certifies that all peoples have had revelation (it is not restricted to Jews, christians and Muslims at all nor the Qur'an certifies them more than any other) but those revelations may come to us with no endorsement, the endorsement for them is that they are in agreement with the content of the Qur'an or not. Whatever of what comes to us as such revelation agrees with the Qur'a will be real prophethood, and what does not it is not.

        That is what I understand by khatam a nabiyyin.

        As to fatherhood, it is obvious that the importance of Muhammad is his prophethood not any socil standing, and rijaal in that case is not so much a sex as social standing. He is not the father of any important people. Whether blood father or not is nto important, he is not heading or originating any dinasty.

        Salaam

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        • J Offline
          J Offline
          Jafar
          wrote on last edited by
          #8

          I don't know about general hummankind - but for me the verse is quite an eye-opener. I do care.

          May Allah guide us all to the straight route.

          Regards,
          Arman

          You care the details about Muhammad , in similar case as (many not all) Hindus care about Krishna's true color..

          You on the other hand obviously do not care what is Krishna's true color, or furthermore you might ask who the heck is Krishna?

          That's what's being meant by "Krishna's true color" and "Muhammad had son or not / last prophet or not" is something which has no importance to the general humankind. It's only important to Muhammadans and Krishnans.

          And if there's a verse in Ghita, which said "Krishna's true color is black".
          Certainly it raise a suspicion of 'forgery', as the debate of Krishna's true color appears later, some time after Krisha's death...

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          • M Offline
            M Offline
            Mazhar
            wrote on last edited by
            #9

            Know it that Muhammad is not the father of a single dead or alive Men-males of strengthen maturity of you people.
            But to put the record straight, Muhammad has become the Messenger of Allah the Exalted for you people.

            And Muhammad is the Authenticating Accomplisher of those who are declared Chosen, Dignified and Elevated Sincere Allegiants of Allah the Exalted.

            Be aware that Allah the Exalted is absolutely knowledgeable of all aspects of each and all that exists.

            Ma Negation Particle. http//haqeeqat.org.pk/English%20Tafsir%20e%20Haqeeqat/00.%20Tabweeb/00050.%20Kanoo%20Kaf%20Waw%20Noon/3.gif Verb Deficient; Perfect; third person; singular; masculine.
            Defective-Incomplete verbs are coined to affirm a subject's description being other than the description of its Masdar-Verbal Noun. Defective verbs are entered upon the subject and the predicate. It gives the nominative state to the first as its noun and it gives accusative state to the second as its predicate. When used for sentential abrogation, it signifies the meanings of "to become", where the predication of the sentence still holds true and continues to hold true.

            The Authenticating Accomplisher of those who are declared Chosen, Dignified and Exalted Sincere Allegiants of Allah the Exalted.

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            • J Offline
              J Offline
              JavaLatte
              wrote on last edited by
              #10

              Know it that Muhammad is not the father of a single dead or alive Men-males of strengthen maturity of you people.
              But to put the record straight, Muhammad has become the Messenger of Allah the Exalted for you people.

              And Muhammad is the Authenticating Accomplisher of those who are declared Chosen, Dignified and Elevated Sincere Allegiants of Allah the Exalted.

              Pardon me, brother Mazhar.

              Whether you are a Sunni?

              Salm.

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              • M Offline
                M Offline
                Mazhar
                wrote on last edited by
                #11

                Pardon me, brother Mazhar.

                Whether you are a Sunni?

                Salm.

                00

                No, my identity is Momin and Muslim, governed by the words of the Book, Grand Qur'aan. It is a discourse. Therein, you listen to two Speakers; Allah the Exalted and His elevated Messenger.

                Grand Qur'aan in 21st Century

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                • M Offline
                  M Offline
                  Man_of_Faith
                  wrote on last edited by
                  #12

                  Peace,

                  No. You listen to God alone as God decided what should come out from the mouth of Muhammad. Muhammad did not make anything from his own words or God would have fired him to the far side of the moon. Do not praise Muhammad for the information in your possession. He was a humble servant of God like everyone else.

                  The receiver of the recitation (Quran) was no more special than any other person in service of God.

                  God bless you

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                  • M Offline
                    M Offline
                    Mazhar
                    wrote on last edited by
                    #13

                    Peace,

                    No. You listen to God alone as God decided what should come out from the mouth of Muhammad. Muhammad did not make anything from his own words or God would have fired him to the far side of the moon. Do not praise Muhammad for the information in your possession. He was a humble servant of God like everyone else.

                    The receiver of the recitation (Quran) was no more special than any other person in service of God.

                    God bless you

                    The Cells in human body do not listen to God. They listen and go by what the Messenger RNA tells them and he tells them exactly what he was told by Allah the Exalted. That is the system devised by Allah the Exalted. You can listen Allah the Exalted only when you listen to His Messenger. Otherwise one is doomed.

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                    • M Offline
                      M Offline
                      Man_of_Faith
                      wrote on last edited by
                      #14

                      Peace,

                      So you have a mediator (god) between you and God?

                      Well I do not adhere to that kind of faith and I do not make any distinction between servants of God either and it is much singular in your sentences.

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                      • J Offline
                        J Offline
                        JavaLatte
                        wrote on last edited by
                        #15

                        The Cells in human body do not listen to God.

                        Why they don't listen to God?

                        From where you know about that?

                        Would you kindly explain?

                        You can listen Allah the Exalted only when you listen to His Messenger.

                        Bold How? You mean by listen to man-made hadiths such as the sahih collection of al-Bukhari?

                        Salm.

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                        • J Offline
                          J Offline
                          Jane
                          wrote on last edited by
                          #16

                          Therein, you listen to two Speakers; Allah the Exalted and His elevated Messenger.

                          Sorry, his 'elevated messenger'? And which one is this? There is no distinction between them.

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                          • M Offline
                            M Offline
                            Mazhar
                            wrote on last edited by
                            #17

                            Why they don't listen to God?

                            From where you know about that?

                            Would you kindly explain?

                            Bold How? You mean by listen to man-made hadiths such as the sahih collection of al-Bukhari?

                            Salm.

                            Just read about DNA, the code is transcribed upon the Messenger RNA whereafter it is translated.

                            No, not man-made hadith; but the best hadith the Grand Qur'aan, verbally and in wrriting conveyed by the elevated Messenger of Allah the Exalted. The source of guidance is but unitary, be it for a singular cell or for human being who has about hundred trillion cells in his body. There is only one star in the Sky that comes to the rescue of a man in bewilderment of clueless location to show him the direction . The guidance information code for aright course for sustaining life of a cell is encoded in the DNA. The guidance for humanity is encoded in the Grand Qur'aan the constitution for aright conduct and guarantor of sustained life.

                            If you can find time please read this segment on the link below Superb system of transcription and translation
                            The process for the near-accurate translation of Grand Qur'aan like DNA translation process.

                            The process for the near-accurate translation of Grand Qur'aan like DNA translation process

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                            • M Offline
                              M Offline
                              Mazhar
                              wrote on last edited by
                              #18

                              Peace,

                              So you have a mediator (god) between you and God?

                              Well I do not adhere to that kind of faith and I do not make any distinction between servants of God either and it is much singular in your sentences.

                              Yes, this is what Allah the Exalted has decided, not me. He the Exalted decided to have "mediator", He has not opted to talk to me directly. I am not like those irrational people who say why Allah the Exalted does not talk to us instead of the Messenger of Him.

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                              • M Offline
                                M Offline
                                Man_of_Faith
                                wrote on last edited by
                                #19

                                Peace,

                                Okay Mazhar. You can have your perceived command of god and I have mine. I do not serve Muhammad but God.

                                Why has God not opted to talk to you? Who taught you this?

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                                • M Offline
                                  M Offline
                                  Mazhar
                                  wrote on last edited by
                                  #20

                                  Peace,

                                  Okay Mazhar. You can have your perceived command of god and I have mine. I do not serve Muhammad but God.

                                  Why has God not opted to talk to you? Who taught you this?

                                  Take note those elite and men of position of Muesh'ri'keen idol worshippers who do not know about revealed Book satirically said to people
                                  Why is it that Allah does not talk to us
                                  Or why a verbal passage not comes to us?"
                                  This resembles what the people before them had stated words of import comparable to their statement.
                                  Their hearts have become self-baffled-metaphorically synonymous to the hearts of earlier such people.
                                  We have certainly explicitly explained the Aa'ya'at Unitary Verbal Passages of Qur'aan for the people who pursue to attain self conviction-certainty. .

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                                  • M Offline
                                    M Offline
                                    Man_of_Faith
                                    wrote on last edited by
                                    #21

                                    And what exactly does this have to do with having faith in the guidance from God or not?

                                    These people obviously did not have faith in God and were not seeking out either. And mushriks do a bit like you and think they have to go through a mediator to become closer to God. Yours is a slightly more advanced form of idolatry if you excuse me for saying it.

                                    Anyway, it seems like your mind is made up regarding the matter so no use for us to discuss that any further.

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                                    • J Offline
                                      J Offline
                                      JavaLatte
                                      wrote on last edited by
                                      #22

                                      Just read about DNA, the code is transcribed upon the Messenger RNA whereafter it is translated.

                                      confused

                                      No, not man-made hadith; but the best hadith the Grand Qur'aan, verbally and in wrriting conveyed by the elevated Messenger of Allah the Exalted.

                                      Well, I'm glad you don't follow man-made hadiths.

                                      But, I wonder why you seem a bit "hard core" on something?

                                      The source of guidance is but unitary, be it for a singular cell or for human being who has about hundred trillion cells in his body. There is only one star in the Sky that comes to the rescue of a man in bewilderment of clueless location to show him the direction . The guidance information code for aright course for sustaining life of a cell is encoded in the DNA. The guidance for humanity is encoded in the Grand Qur'aan the constitution for aright conduct and guarantor of sustained life.

                                      One star? Is it the Qur'an what you mean?

                                      If you can find time please read this segment on the link below Superb system of transcription and translation
                                      The process for the near-accurate translation of Grand Qur'aan like DNA translation process.

                                      The process for the near-accurate translation of Grand Qur'aan like DNA translation process

                                      InshaAllah. Thank you for the link, brother.

                                      I've opened it. Is that your personal website?

                                      Salm.

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                                      • J Offline
                                        J Offline
                                        JavaLatte
                                        wrote on last edited by
                                        #23

                                        Yes, this is what Allah the Exalted has decided, not me. He the Exalted decided to have "mediator", He has not opted to talk to me directly. I am not like those irrational people who say why Allah the Exalted does not talk to us instead of the Messenger of Him.

                                        Brother, Allah does not talk directly to us now, but we can talk/call/invoke to Him directly without mediator.

                                        We indeed have to respect the messenger of Allah, but within reasonable boundaries. Our true Rescuer is Allah.

                                        Salm.

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                                        • M Offline
                                          M Offline
                                          Mazhar
                                          wrote on last edited by
                                          #24

                                          And what exactly does this have to do with having faith in the guidance from God or not?

                                          These people obviously did not have faith in God and were not seeking out either. And mushriks do a bit like you and think they have to go through a mediator to become closer to God. Yours is a slightly more advanced form of idolatry if you excuse me for saying it.

                                          Anyway, it seems like your mind is made up regarding the matter so no use for us to discuss that any further.

                                          You are forgetting a basic fact. Those Mushrekeen did believe in Allah as the creator of everything and administrator of everything. Their problem was only with the Messenger and his proclamation to believe only in Allah without ascribing associates.

                                          What you believe is nothing new.
                                          And nothing prevented people that they might believe/accept when the Guidance/Book of Allah had came to them except that they said to people, "Has Allah appointed a human being as Messenger?"

                                          Never forget Satan believes in Allah the Exalted and also fears Him. What will differentiate you from Satan?

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