Correct nature of beings vs incorrect behaviour
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Peace be upon you Elena,
Please, Idolfree, I understand you are using the word 'perversion' as 'incorrect', 'turning into a wrong use', 'reversing the direction of something', without adding it any moral, ethical, connotation. I am right?
Yes
-Does, in your view, the 'correct nature of beings' emanate from the 'purpose'?
The correct nature of things emanates from the SOURCE, but the human being has the ability to CHANGE its nature, some changes happen with your anscestors and it carries down until you have children with birth defects, etc. Or the pollution of the environment, etc.
-What do you see about the behaviour of the sun in polar regions as incorrect?
I did not use that example wisely, there is no incorrect behavior of the Sun, but I was using that example to show imbalance. Imbalance is always at the EXTREMES, is what I was trying to convey. Sorry for the incorrect statement.
What is the cause of that 'incorrect/perverse' behaviour in the different examples you have posed?
Perverse behavior comes from humans, because we were given the TRUST to be khalifas of the earth. I gave a few examples above.
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Peace be upon you Elena,
the people who are in that imbalance, joined twins, blind people, hermaphrodites, are they to blame for their condition?
Yes, them and thier communities, but you have to keep in mind that this earthly life is but a PART of a longer event. We are all in the positions we are in based on what happenned before we got here.
Also, the things your parents did (drugs, lifestyle, eating habits) effect the childs outcome.
The key to understanding this is that EVERYTHING is interconnected, thats why we must protect against Drugs, homosexuality, etc and not just say "as long as they stay over there with that".
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Peace be upon you, idolfree,
Peace be upon you Elena,
Yes, them and thier communities, but you have to keep in mind that this earthly life is but a PART of a longer event. We are all in the positions we are in based on what happenned before we got here.Also, the things your parents did (drugs, lifestyle, eating habits) effect the childs outcome.
The key to understanding this is that EVERYTHING is interconnected, thats why we must protect against Drugs, homosexuality, etc and not just say "as long as they stay over there with that".
Therefore, they are not like that because they want to, but because their positions are based on what happened before, because of what their parents did, and because they were not protected.
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Peace be upon you,
I will put it this way, we CHOOSE everything that happens to us, We CHOSE these lives before we started "living" them. So when you have "Deja vu", you will know why, the story is has already been written, and we have selected which part we wanted to play in the story before getting here.
When you think of it from that perspective, that we selected the experiecnes we wanted to have before hand, it helps you to understand.
If anyone has trouble with this understanding, I will point them to the verse where the God made mankind bear witness that He was one (before hand) and also when teh God took the covenant of the Prophets (before hand).
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Salam Idolfree,
You said
I will put it this way, we CHOOSE everything that happens to us, We CHOSE these lives before we started "living" them. So when you have "Deja vu", you will know why, the story is has already been written, and we have selected which part we wanted to play in the story before getting here.
Where is your proof from the Qur'an
Hussein
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Peace be upon you Elena,
leading the discussion in that way, towards original oneness, previous lives, story already written, makes me impossible to fight against the intolerance that is what worries me about all of these subjects.
Give me an example of the difficulty you are having so we can reason it out and see if you agree or not.
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Peace be upon you Hussein,
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I will put it this way, we CHOOSE everything that happens to us, We CHOSE these lives before we started "living" them. So when you have "Deja vu", you will know why, the story is has already been written, and we have selected which part we wanted to play in the story before getting here.Where is your proof from the Qur'an
First, the word "quran" only means reading. It is the UNIVERSE(al kitaab) that must eventually be read, and everyone has witnessed "deja vu". Further, this reading tells us that life is based on cause and effect, you reap what YOU sow. Lastly, the God made us bear witness BEFORE THIS LIFE that There is no God but He, as well as the covenant of the prophets BEFORE this life. This is in the book you are calling "Quran". Let me know if you are not aware of the verses and I will provide them.
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Peace be upon you Idolfree,
I'm not quite clear on what you're saying... I understand that We chose to take on the Trust before entering this world, but I don't see this as choosing the lives that we will lead on earth. Is a person born crippled because they chose to be that way before? To me this seems a lot like what Hindus preach when they talk about re-incarnation and Karma, I believe it is also what is used to uphold the Cast system. With this type of mentality it is easy to tell those in society that it's their fault they were born messed up... No one would help them. Perhaps, I simply misunderstood what you meant.Peace
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Salaam Idolfree,
Lastly, the God made us bear witness BEFORE THIS LIFE that There is no God but He, as well as the covenant of the prophets BEFORE this life.
Don't you think that you are stretching what happened to include everything else in our lives. I am afraid that one can interpret their personal biases in the book of the universe, including racial discrimination.
Your theory is very scary to me
Hussein
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Peace idolfree
Peace be upon you Elena,
the people who are in that imbalance, joined twins, blind people, hermaphrodites, are they to blame for their condition?
Yes, them and thier communities, but you have to keep in mind that this earthly life is but a PART of a longer event. We are all in the positions we are in based on what happenned before we got here.
Also, the things your parents did (drugs, lifestyle, eating habits) effect the childs outcome.
The key to understanding this is that EVERYTHING is interconnected, thats why we must protect against Drugs, homosexuality, etc and not just say "as long as they stay over there with that".
Idolfree, can you check this I've read in an introduction to a Bible and see if it fits with your words above, the underlined parts, and other things you say like the divine part of man, please?
It says that the sacred readings are an invaluable git from God that the man will never be able to thankful, raised to the supernatural order to the participation to the same divine nature and fallen from it because of the sin of our first parents, God wanted to redeem him raising him back to an even higher divine nature sending him progressively the revelations.
To me, your words "Yes, them and thier communities," and "everything is interconnected" remind me of the original sin concept, and the rest of the words of the introduction reminds me of the goal of human of recovering his peaceful/divine state you have explained many times.
And another question, have you studied the Sumerian civilization too?
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Peace be upon you Elena,
the people who are in that imbalance, joined twins, blind people, hermaphrodites, are they to blame for their condition?
Yes, them and thier communities, but you have to keep in mind that this earthly life is but a PART of a longer event. We are all in the positions we are in based on what happenned before we got here.
You are REALLY joking aren't you Kyle? shock
Regards,
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Peace be upon you,
I will put it this way, we CHOOSE everything that happens to us, We CHOSE these lives before we started "living" them. So when you have "Deja vu", you will know why, the story is has already been written, and we have selected which part we wanted to play in the story before getting here.Really? Where is your OBJECTIVE proof of that Kyle?
When you think of it from that perspective, that we selected the experiecnes we wanted to have before hand, it helps you to understand.
You have no OBJECITVE way of knowing this or do you?
If anyone has trouble with this understanding, I will point them to the verse where the God made mankind bear witness that He was one (before hand) and also when teh God took the covenant of the Prophets (before hand).
If a book claims this so - how do you know?
Does a mere claim make it so?Regards,
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Peace be upon you Idolfree,
I'm not quite clear on what you're saying... I understand that We chose to take on the Trust before entering this world, but I don't see this as choosing the lives that we will lead on earth. Is a person born crippled because they chose to be that way before? To me this seems a lot like what Hindus preach when they talk about re-incarnation and Karma, I believe it is also what is used to uphold the Cast system. With this type of mentality it is easy to tell those in society that it's their fault they were born messed up... No one would help them. Perhaps, I simply misunderstood what you meant.
PeaceThis is INDEED the Indian Karmic Philosophy and this has been used to uphold the racist CAST system in India. CAST system is a codification of racism in law. CAST system is APARTHEID sanctioned in the name of Divien by humans.
How sad. Instead of using a belief in a transcendent God to overcome prejuidices, it is being used to reinforce very human prejuidices against each other...
Regards,
Regards,
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Peace be upon you Elena,
the people who are in that imbalance, joined twins, blind people, hermaphrodites, are they to blame for their condition?
Yes, them and thier communities, but you have to keep in mind that this earthly life is but a PART of a longer event. We are all in the positions we are in based on what happenned before we got here.
You are REALLY joking aren't you Kyle? shock
Regards,
Not the affected individual to be blamed, but the community !
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Salaam Idolfree,
Lastly, the God made us bear witness BEFORE THIS LIFE that There is no God but He, as well as the covenant of the prophets BEFORE this life.
Don't you think that you are stretching what happened to include everything else in our lives. I am afraid that one can interpret their personal biases in the book of the universe, including racial discrimination.
Your theory is very scary to me
It is scary!
Regards,
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Peace be upon you Elena,
Idolfree, can you check this I've read in an introduction to a Bible and see if it fits with your words above, the underlined parts, and other things you say like the divine part of man, please?
Sure
It says that the sacred readings are an invaluable git from God that the man will never be able to thankful, raised to the supernatural order to the participation to the same divine nature and fallen from it because of the sin of our first parents, God wanted to redeem him raising him back to an even higher divine nature sending him progressively the revelations.
To me, your words "Yes, them and thier communities," and "everything is interconnected" remind me of the original sin concept, and the rest of the words of the introduction reminds me of the goal of human of recovering his peaceful/divine state you have explained many times.
Yes, there is a link throughout generations, just like diseases are passed down. However, I do not agree that we are being punished for the sins of "adam and Eve". We are "adam and eve", or should I say adam and eve are within us (sebek and het heru). But we do get the effects of our ancestors because there is a connection biologically.
Basically, we are born with our external faculties up and running, so we listen to the whisper of "satan" (the emotional/sensual nature). That is the fall of adam and his wife. So we must all reclaim our PEACE and rise back to the Divine Nature Within.
And another question, have you studied the Sumerian civilization too?
Slightly. What do you have regarding it?
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Peace be upon you Lote Tree,
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the people who are in that imbalance, joined twins, blind people, hermaphrodites, are they to blame for their condition?Yes, them and thier communities, but you have to keep in mind that this earthly life is but a PART of a longer event. We are all in the positions we are in based on what happenned before we got here.
You are REALLY joking aren't you Kyle?
No, why do you think I am joking? Yuo dont think that if you are in a community of people who smoke crack, that the child that comes out of this wont be effected?
You dont think that a person who sits too close to the TV and does other hings to harm thier eyes and becomes blind is not responsible?
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Peace be upon you Lote Tree,
idolfree1 wrote
Peace be upon you,
I will put it this way, we CHOOSE everything that happens to us, We CHOSE these lives before we started "living" them. So when you have "Deja vu", you will know why, the story is has already been written, and we have selected which part we wanted to play in the story before getting here.Really? Where is your OBJECTIVE proof of that Kyle?
Everytime I have deja vu, how else do you explain that phenomena?
Also, I do not have objective proof for all of the answers of life, some things I am still working on, I hope you will allow me that flexibility to continue my studies without trying to raise me to some holy status. The goal is to bring everything to objective proof. At no time have I stated that I know everything. BUt I wil still offer my understanding that I have at that time.
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When you think of it from that perspective, that we selected the experiecnes we wanted to have before hand, it helps you to understand.You have no OBJECITVE way of knowing this or do you?
No.
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If anyone has trouble with this understanding, I will point them to the verse where the God made mankind bear witness that He was one (before hand) and also when teh God took the covenant of the Prophets (before hand).If a book claims this so - how do you know?
Does a mere claim make it so?No it doesnt, but my job is to listen to all views and follow the best view, the one closest to objective proof. I will be glad to listen to your view.