Correct nature of beings vs incorrect behaviour
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Peace be upon you Idolfree,
I'm not quite clear on what you're saying... I understand that We chose to take on the Trust before entering this world, but I don't see this as choosing the lives that we will lead on earth. Is a person born crippled because they chose to be that way before? To me this seems a lot like what Hindus preach when they talk about re-incarnation and Karma, I believe it is also what is used to uphold the Cast system. With this type of mentality it is easy to tell those in society that it's their fault they were born messed up... No one would help them. Perhaps, I simply misunderstood what you meant.Peace
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Salaam Idolfree,
Lastly, the God made us bear witness BEFORE THIS LIFE that There is no God but He, as well as the covenant of the prophets BEFORE this life.
Don't you think that you are stretching what happened to include everything else in our lives. I am afraid that one can interpret their personal biases in the book of the universe, including racial discrimination.
Your theory is very scary to me
Hussein
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Peace idolfree
Peace be upon you Elena,
the people who are in that imbalance, joined twins, blind people, hermaphrodites, are they to blame for their condition?
Yes, them and thier communities, but you have to keep in mind that this earthly life is but a PART of a longer event. We are all in the positions we are in based on what happenned before we got here.
Also, the things your parents did (drugs, lifestyle, eating habits) effect the childs outcome.
The key to understanding this is that EVERYTHING is interconnected, thats why we must protect against Drugs, homosexuality, etc and not just say "as long as they stay over there with that".
Idolfree, can you check this I've read in an introduction to a Bible and see if it fits with your words above, the underlined parts, and other things you say like the divine part of man, please?
It says that the sacred readings are an invaluable git from God that the man will never be able to thankful, raised to the supernatural order to the participation to the same divine nature and fallen from it because of the sin of our first parents, God wanted to redeem him raising him back to an even higher divine nature sending him progressively the revelations.
To me, your words "Yes, them and thier communities," and "everything is interconnected" remind me of the original sin concept, and the rest of the words of the introduction reminds me of the goal of human of recovering his peaceful/divine state you have explained many times.
And another question, have you studied the Sumerian civilization too?
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Peace be upon you Elena,
the people who are in that imbalance, joined twins, blind people, hermaphrodites, are they to blame for their condition?
Yes, them and thier communities, but you have to keep in mind that this earthly life is but a PART of a longer event. We are all in the positions we are in based on what happenned before we got here.
You are REALLY joking aren't you Kyle? shock
Regards,
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Peace be upon you,
I will put it this way, we CHOOSE everything that happens to us, We CHOSE these lives before we started "living" them. So when you have "Deja vu", you will know why, the story is has already been written, and we have selected which part we wanted to play in the story before getting here.Really? Where is your OBJECTIVE proof of that Kyle?
When you think of it from that perspective, that we selected the experiecnes we wanted to have before hand, it helps you to understand.
You have no OBJECITVE way of knowing this or do you?
If anyone has trouble with this understanding, I will point them to the verse where the God made mankind bear witness that He was one (before hand) and also when teh God took the covenant of the Prophets (before hand).
If a book claims this so - how do you know?
Does a mere claim make it so?Regards,
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Peace be upon you Idolfree,
I'm not quite clear on what you're saying... I understand that We chose to take on the Trust before entering this world, but I don't see this as choosing the lives that we will lead on earth. Is a person born crippled because they chose to be that way before? To me this seems a lot like what Hindus preach when they talk about re-incarnation and Karma, I believe it is also what is used to uphold the Cast system. With this type of mentality it is easy to tell those in society that it's their fault they were born messed up... No one would help them. Perhaps, I simply misunderstood what you meant.
PeaceThis is INDEED the Indian Karmic Philosophy and this has been used to uphold the racist CAST system in India. CAST system is a codification of racism in law. CAST system is APARTHEID sanctioned in the name of Divien by humans.
How sad. Instead of using a belief in a transcendent God to overcome prejuidices, it is being used to reinforce very human prejuidices against each other...
Regards,
Regards,
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Peace be upon you Elena,
the people who are in that imbalance, joined twins, blind people, hermaphrodites, are they to blame for their condition?
Yes, them and thier communities, but you have to keep in mind that this earthly life is but a PART of a longer event. We are all in the positions we are in based on what happenned before we got here.
You are REALLY joking aren't you Kyle? shock
Regards,
Not the affected individual to be blamed, but the community !
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Salaam Idolfree,
Lastly, the God made us bear witness BEFORE THIS LIFE that There is no God but He, as well as the covenant of the prophets BEFORE this life.
Don't you think that you are stretching what happened to include everything else in our lives. I am afraid that one can interpret their personal biases in the book of the universe, including racial discrimination.
Your theory is very scary to me
It is scary!
Regards,
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Peace be upon you Elena,
Idolfree, can you check this I've read in an introduction to a Bible and see if it fits with your words above, the underlined parts, and other things you say like the divine part of man, please?
Sure
It says that the sacred readings are an invaluable git from God that the man will never be able to thankful, raised to the supernatural order to the participation to the same divine nature and fallen from it because of the sin of our first parents, God wanted to redeem him raising him back to an even higher divine nature sending him progressively the revelations.
To me, your words "Yes, them and thier communities," and "everything is interconnected" remind me of the original sin concept, and the rest of the words of the introduction reminds me of the goal of human of recovering his peaceful/divine state you have explained many times.
Yes, there is a link throughout generations, just like diseases are passed down. However, I do not agree that we are being punished for the sins of "adam and Eve". We are "adam and eve", or should I say adam and eve are within us (sebek and het heru). But we do get the effects of our ancestors because there is a connection biologically.
Basically, we are born with our external faculties up and running, so we listen to the whisper of "satan" (the emotional/sensual nature). That is the fall of adam and his wife. So we must all reclaim our PEACE and rise back to the Divine Nature Within.
And another question, have you studied the Sumerian civilization too?
Slightly. What do you have regarding it?
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Peace be upon you Lote Tree,
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the people who are in that imbalance, joined twins, blind people, hermaphrodites, are they to blame for their condition?Yes, them and thier communities, but you have to keep in mind that this earthly life is but a PART of a longer event. We are all in the positions we are in based on what happenned before we got here.
You are REALLY joking aren't you Kyle?
No, why do you think I am joking? Yuo dont think that if you are in a community of people who smoke crack, that the child that comes out of this wont be effected?
You dont think that a person who sits too close to the TV and does other hings to harm thier eyes and becomes blind is not responsible?
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Peace be upon you Lote Tree,
idolfree1 wrote
Peace be upon you,
I will put it this way, we CHOOSE everything that happens to us, We CHOSE these lives before we started "living" them. So when you have "Deja vu", you will know why, the story is has already been written, and we have selected which part we wanted to play in the story before getting here.Really? Where is your OBJECTIVE proof of that Kyle?
Everytime I have deja vu, how else do you explain that phenomena?
Also, I do not have objective proof for all of the answers of life, some things I am still working on, I hope you will allow me that flexibility to continue my studies without trying to raise me to some holy status. The goal is to bring everything to objective proof. At no time have I stated that I know everything. BUt I wil still offer my understanding that I have at that time.
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When you think of it from that perspective, that we selected the experiecnes we wanted to have before hand, it helps you to understand.You have no OBJECITVE way of knowing this or do you?
No.
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If anyone has trouble with this understanding, I will point them to the verse where the God made mankind bear witness that He was one (before hand) and also when teh God took the covenant of the Prophets (before hand).If a book claims this so - how do you know?
Does a mere claim make it so?No it doesnt, but my job is to listen to all views and follow the best view, the one closest to objective proof. I will be glad to listen to your view.
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Peace be upon you,
The information I have been presenting is based on the teachings that the Hindus were given. How they are used should not be a reason to disregard them in total.
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Peace idol-free. I think some posters were shocked,because your post implied that disabled people or those born into poverty etc.. Were partly to blame for their situation. shock I think that needs clarifying. people rightly claimed that this implication could lead to a caste system or apartheid. shock
Peace all. -
Peace be upon you Lote Tree,
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the people who are in that imbalance, joined twins, blind people, hermaphrodites, are they to blame for their condition?Yes, them and thier communities, but you have to keep in mind that this earthly life is but a PART of a longer event. We are all in the positions we are in based on what happenned before we got here.
You are REALLY joking aren't you Kyle?
No, why do you think I am joking?
Because you say being born as conjoined twin is the fault of the conjoined twins. This is nonsense Kyle.
Yuo dont think that if you are in a community of people who smoke crack, that the child that comes out of this wont be effected?
But the child was born blameless. It is not fault of the child that his or her mother took crack cocaine. The child is innocent.
You dont think that a person who sits too close to the TV and does other hings to harm thier eyes and becomes blind is not responsible?
This is self-inflicted and nothing to do with being born-blind. There is no way you can blame a conjoined twin for being born as a conjoined twin.
Regards,
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Peace be upon you Lote Tree,
idolfree1 wrote
Peace be upon you,
I will put it this way, we CHOOSE everything that happens to us, We CHOSE these lives before we started "living" them. So when you have "Deja vu", you will know why, the story is has already been written, and we have selected which part we wanted to play in the story before getting here.Really? Where is your OBJECTIVE proof of that Kyle?
Everytime I have deja vu, how else do you explain that phenomena?
This is not OBJECTIVE proof. This is your subjective experience and you are using that to prove your point above and blame the blameles child that is born as a conjoined twins.
Also, I do not have objective proof for all of the answers of life, some things I am still working on, I hope you will allow me that flexibility to continue my studies without trying to raise me to some holy status.
That is fine Kyle. And I am not stopping you in anyway nor am I raising you on to a holy status. But when you speak like you have the OBJECTIVE proof of CHOOSING our lives before we are born and use it to blame a child that is born as a conjoined twin then we must question it.
The goal is to bring everything to objective proof. At no time have I stated that I know everything. BUt I wil still offer my understanding that I have at that time.
That is fine. But to say being born conjoined twins is their own fault is not wise Kyle because you have no OBJECTIVE proof of that and using your Deja Vu subjective experience to prove your point is not correct.
Regards,
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Peace be upon you Lote Tree,
Because you say being born as conjoined twin is the fault of the conjoined twins. This is nonsense Kyle.
Yes, that would be nonsense if that is what I said. However this is not what I said.
Let me take you back to Elena's question so I can calrify this for you.
We were talking about IMBALANCE
Elena
the people who are in that imbalance, joined twins, blind people, hermaphrodites, are they to blame for their condition?My answer was YES, Them AND thier communities...
Meaning, for some of the imbalances, the person is responsible, for others it is the community.
For example, homosexuality, child molesters, murderers, etc are IMBALANCES that the person is to blame, the there are others that the community/ancestors are to blame.
I hope this clears up the confusion.
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Peace Kyle,
You have only focused on IMBALANCE, but the sentence of Elena is about the people who are in that imbalance, and it further gives examples of who those people are. How can you blame the conjoined twins and on the basis of what OBJECTIVE PROOF? If X can be proved OBJECTIVELY, then someone else could confirm X based on that OBJECTIVE PROOF. What is your OBJECTIVE PROOF?
You may ignore me, if you choose to.
Anwar AzimPeace be upon you Lote Tree,
Because you say being born as conjoined twin is the fault of the conjoined twins. This is nonsense Kyle.
Yes, that would be nonsense if that is what I said. However this is not what I said.
Let me take you back to Elena's question so I can calrify this for you.
We were talking about IMBALANCE
Elena
the people who are in that imbalance, joined twins, blind people, hermaphrodites, are they to blame for their condition?My answer was YES, Them AND thier communities...
Meaning, for some of the imbalances, the person is responsible, for others it is the community.
For example, homosexuality, child molesters, murderers, etc are IMBALANCES that the person is to blame, the there are others that the community/ancestors are to blame.
I hope this clears up the confusion.
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Peace Kyle,
You have only focused on IMBALANCE, but the sentence of Elena is about the people who are in that imbalance, and it further gives examples of who those people are.That is what I understood the sentence meant orginally.
Perhaps Elena can clear this up....
Regards,
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Perhaps Elena can clear this up....
I was asking about the three examples idolfree had given, but I can understand he could refer to others too because he had also said 'and many others'
A LAW has already effected them from the culture they were born into../.. Just like joined twins and the like, you cant expect them to be able to follow the same physical disciplines as a healthy human. Likewise, hermaphrodites are SIGNS of incorrect behavior, as are all perversions, like blindness, and many others.