homosexuality, the way forward?
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Hello Damon, All,
There are some people here who keep repeating the notion that these people are born this way and that they cannot help but to be attracted to the same sex.
This is whats been said by millions of gay and lesbian people all around the world from various religious and cultural backgrounds, in their own personal testimonies. This view is further supported by researches by people like Kinsey, Shree Hite, Nancy Friday, Naomi Wolfe and many others.
Are millions of homosexuals lying to us in their personal testimonies? Are all homosexual liars? Shall we burn all the scientific research data that hints a biological basis for homosexuality?
But I can go along with Tay and say we can't be conclusive as to what causes homosexuality. But you have to accept that homosexuality is a fact of life, just as bi-sexaulity is also a fact of life so is trangenderism...so accept it and move on... The real debate should be if homosexual couples should be able to adopt children. I think thats the most important debate...
Regards,
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Chill! I don't have a problem with statistics. Just want to point out that any sexual intercourse, homo or hetero, extramarital or not, consensual or forced, can transmit STDs.
Khi- Salam. Y then do most ppl who engage in HS have acquired aids n the HIV virus. I know tht any uncontrolled sexual relationship can result in aids being tranferred. Thts y it ought 2 be organized n their ouigt 2 be a leagsl marriage contract be4 the couple goes into each other. Get it now?
Another nitpick AIDS is caused by the Human Immunodeficiency Virus, HIV, not homosexual behaviour. Sexual intercourse with an HIV carrier can transmit HIV, which then causes AIDS. AIDS itself don't directly kill, it destroys the immunity system. People that has AIDS usually die from other diseases that they got easily because of lack of immune defense.
Khi- I know aids is caused by the HIV virus. N this very virus is transmitted mostly coz of HS from one person 2 another. However it's not only aids but also other bacteria in the anus which get tranferred into the blood stream by this act of HS. As far as AIDS is concerned i know tht it doesnt kill ppl directly but destroys the immune system. Ur telling me nothing new.
Do understand that I am not pro-gay or anything. My stance on this issue is that I prefer they keep it to themselves instead of flaunting it in public in bad taste. God will deal with them.
Khi- Ic. Well i believe 415-16 talk abt punishment 4 HS so we ought 2 punish them n the best thing is tht we send them 2 exile.
Oh, and another thing, your source is Biblical... again. R u sure ur not a Xtian?
Khi- No but i often refer 2 Chrisians coz the Quran says
You will find that the worst enemies of the believers are the Jews and the idol worshipers. And you will find that the closest people in friendship to the believers are those who say, "We are Christian." This is because they have priests and monks among them, and they are not arrogant.
GOD Bless! -
Salaam Lote-Tree,all
you have to accept that homosexuality is a fact of life, just as bi-sexaulity is also a fact of life so is trangenderism...so accept it and move on... The real debate should be if homosexual couples should be able to adopt children. I think thats the most important debate...
I already have accepted that HS is a fact of life. I have no choice but to. That is not an issue at all for me. My issue is the agenda which seems to have been pushed earlier in this thread which is that GOD made them that way and that they do not choose to be that way. No offence and nothing personal, but you are one of those who was pushing that agenda in this thread. My challenge in my prior post is issued to you and any others here who wish to push that agenda. Also, it appears that your stance in this post is somewhat different from the stance you have taken earlier which is both pro-gay and that people like myself are homophobic because we do not accept HS relations as natural or righteous. My challenge still stands. Until that challenge is met, any argument that is set forth that says HS is normal and is not wrong is considered Null-and-Void in The Quran's eyes. I have also made a post much earlier in this thread which no one responded to at all. I am re-posting part of it because it somewhat fits in with my challenge and my position on this matter. It is below
The Arabic phrase innakum is all inclusive, but those who know the grammar rules of the Arabic language also know that innakum is used primarily to identify male-plural. There is a seperate pronoun used to identify female-plural. According to the rules of Arabic grammar, whenever a group is made up of male and female, the male-plural pronoun is used to refer to the group.
Knowing this, when we read the passage in 781, it is either addressing a group of men or a group of men and women. How do we know which it is that it's addressing. This where 482 and 1736 come into play. Let's look at this verse again
"You come to men with desire INSTEAD of women; you are a TRANSGRESSING people."
Please do what The Quran exhorts us to do and Ponder/Reflect on what is being said in this verse. It is not hard to see. Why would Lut address both genders for approaching men with desire?? Why would he say Instead of women?? Why would he say that this behaviour makes them a Transgressing people??
If he was addressing women in this verse, then he would be calling the women transgressors for having the natural attraction towards the opposite sex.
If he was addressing both men and women in this verse, then he would be saying that men and women are to have an attraction to women only and not men at all. This would be the most illogical equation one can think of. How can anyone possibly work that one out?
The third, and only logical, understanding is that the use of the term innakum is in its primary use of male-plural. We don't need to be Arabic scholars to truly examine this verse. We need logic and common sense.
Salaam all.
GOD Alone/Quran Alone,
Damon. -
Hello Damon,
My issue is the agenda which seems to have been pushed earlier in this thread which is that GOD made them that way and that they do not choose to be that way.
It seems that you have ignored what I put to you previously. Here it is again
This is whats been said by millions of gay and lesbian people all around the world from various religious and cultural backgrounds, in their own personal testimonies. This view is further supported by researches by people like Kinsey, Shree Hite, Nancy Friday, Naomi Wolfe and many others.
Are millions of homosexuals lying to us in their personal testimonies? Are all homosexual liars? Shall we burn all the scientific research data that hints a biological basis for homosexuality?
I would like to have your answer on this - what this say about homosexuality? You are ignoring the reality that people are born this way!
No offence and nothing personal, but you are one of those who was pushing that agenda in this thread.
Do you think I am offended? I think you have real problem with this don't you? You can't accept possible biological basis for homosexuality because that would be God making a mistake!
What does your God-given "Reason" tells you about homosexuality from all the available scientific evidence and the testimony of millions of people?
What conclusion can any rational person draw from this?
It is not about scripture here. This is about scientific data and personal testimonies as evidence.
If I did have any agenda then it would be to make people think. To make people use their God-given reason to overcome their fears. Just like racism can be overcome by education, compassion and understanding so can our disgust and fears about homosexuality...
And I am not pro-gay. I am pro-tolerance. I am pro-compassion. I am pro-understanding.
There is nothing in ANY SCRIPTURE that approves homosexuality.
But we know that don't we?Again this is not about APPROVAL or ACCEPTANCE, this is about TOLERANCE, COMPASSION and UNDERSTANDING....
Regards,
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Salaams Tay, All
Peace Taj,
One of the telling experiences I had was with a good friend/co-worker. We had one of those conversations where we both let our guard down and we just talked. I asked him about his lifestyle, and he told me, "Tay, if I had one wish, it would be that I wasn't gay. I wish I was attracted to women. You have no idea how hard it is to be gay and black in this society."
Again, playing the victim part!
Do you claim to know what's in a person's heart? Are you qualified to pass judgement? Have you ever been gay?
Is HS a disease, or is it a disability? Is it natural or unnatural? Is it something that one can control? Ask any obese person "Why don't you lose weight?"
Wouldn't his answer be something like this
" If I had one wish, it would be that I wasn't obese. I wish I was not attracted to junk food. You have no idea how hard it is to be (fill the blank) in this society."
My point is Who is responsible for the HS thing? Or do you wish to blame it on God? -
Salaam all,
It seems that you have ignored what I put to you previously. Here it is again
Well Lote Tree you have ignored quite a few facts that I have posted in this thread so far. But I'll answer your questions first and hope that you are considerate enough to answer mine.
This is whats been said by millions of gay and lesbian people all around the world from various religious and cultural backgrounds, in their own personal testimonies. This view is further supported by researches by people like Kinsey, Shree Hite, Nancy Friday, Naomi Wolfe and many others.
I'm well aware of of what is being said by gay people all over the world. I'm just as aware that millions of pedophiles and rapists echo the same nonsense in their own personal testimonies!! If it's a fact that HS are born that way, then it is also a fact that pedophiles and rapsists are born that way as well. Also, I'm not concerned with what Kinsey, Hite, Friday, Wolfe or any of the rest of them have to say. I am concerned with what GOD has to say. I also need to remind you that this remains no more than a theory of theirs. It has never been biologically nor scientifically substantiated. By continuing to post these people's names, YOU YOURSELF are ignoring the brilliant piece that Truth has posted by The Psychologist who treats this mental disorder.
Are millions of homosexuals lying to us in their personal testimonies?
Yes they are!! They have already lied to themselves when they claim that they are born that way and now they are lying to others when they repeat it publicly.
Shall we burn all the scientific research data that hints a biological basis for homosexuality?
Yes we should because of that key word Hint. As I said before this scientific research has never been scientifically validated. It remains a theory. You are ignoring the most important Criteria in this discussion...The Quran. This theory has absolutely no support whatsoever in The Quran. What The Quran says on this issue is far more important than what Wolfe, Friday or any of those other guys have to say about it.
You are ignoring the reality that people are born this way!
Actually my friend, you are ignoring the reality that this theory has no basis in The Quran. And yet, The Quran Itself totally condems this behaviour.
You can't accept possible biological basis for homosexuality because that would be God making a mistake!
Possible doesn't cut it my friend. Unless and Until scientific research can agree 100% for sure on this theory (Which I am certain will not happen) I'm afraid I am not moved by notions of possibility or hints possible basis. There is either concrete evidence or non-concrete evidence. Since this is only a theory (and I must add wishful thinking) it logically fits in the non-concrete basket.
What does your God-given "Reason" tells you about homosexuality from all the available scientific evidence and the testimony of millions of people?
I don't know if their is a need to answer this one since I have already addressed your scientific evidence and gay testimonies earlier.
It is not about scripture here. This is about scientific data and personal testimonies as evidence.
Well,well now. This is quite a quote. My friend, if it's not about scripture, then why are you muslim? Why claim to be a believer in GOD and scripture at all? GOD Himself let us know about our nature way before these scientists even stepped on the scene. Whenever science and GOD's designed nature clash, we have a choice to make as to which one is false and which one to believe. To help you with this decision, I have to remind you that GOD is the one fashioned and designed us, GOD is the only one who is infallible and only GOD knows all with no mistakes or misunderstandings.
If I did have any agenda then it would be to make people think. To make people use their God-given reason to overcome their fears.
Dude, why do you insist that I am homophobic and that I have homo fears. Fyi, I have a gay neighbor that I have conversations with all the time. My son and his grandson go the the same school. Whenever he and I arrive early to pick up our kids, he and I will stand there and conversate until the teachers bring the children downstairs from school. This is in public in front of hundreds of other people who too are their to pick up children. And he is obviously HS. He doesn't hide it at all. If I had any fears or phobias, I wouldn't be caught dead talking to him and walking to and from school with him.
There is nothing in ANY SCRIPTURE that approves homosexuality.
But we know that don't we?I gather from this statement that you have no interest in answering my personal challenge. What about the other part of my post that included my challenge? The part concerning the interpretation of 781?
Again this is not about APPROVAL or ACCEPTANCE, this is about TOLERANCE, COMPASSION and UNDERSTANDING....
As a sincere believer in The Quran, for me IT IS about APPROVAL and ACCEPTANCE!! That is the reason that scripture was revealed. To give us the knowledge of what it is that GOD accepts and approves of, and what He does not accept and approve of. It's as simple as that. Nothing spooky or complicated about it.
As for those who constantly CHALLENGE our revelations, they have incurred a retribution of painful humiliation.
One,
Damon. -
I already have accepted that HS is a fact of life. I have no choice but to. That is not an issue at all for me. My issue is the agenda which seems to have been pushed earlier in this thread which is that GOD made them that way and that they do not choose to be that way.
A friend of mine threw himself off of a 12 floor building because he did not want to live his life as a gay man. In his mind, the only CHOICE he had to counteract homosexuality was death. And no, there was nothing else wrong with him besides the fact that he had been gay since he was a child (there was always something a bit "feminine" with him) and hated not being able to live a life as a "normal" man.
Before you assert that something is a choice, reverse roles and ask yourself the same question. Since I cannot even see myself attracted to women, I am going to turn this question completely around If it was in God's System to be homosexual, could I choose to be attracted to women? Solely off of my own inclination, I could not choose to be attracted to a woman just as many of you brothers in this forum probably could not choose to be attracted to a man. Sexual attraction may not be a choice, but our behavior is. If I had to engage in a sexual, monogamous relationship with a woman to be in harmony with God's system, I think that I would have the strength to do it (with a real struggle, I may add), but I doubt my sexuality would change. But, as a muslim who follows the Qur'an alone, I constantly struggle to accept and make God's will my own so, in this case, I would strive to force my personal sexual preferences to take a backseat (which is my current reality with abstinence until marriage/monogamy). But everyone may not strive to have that type of relationship with the God.
The one thing that I am seeing from many people in here is the pushing of their own agendas and opinions at the expense of arrogantly asserting their perspectives as facts and, more disturbingly, attributing their opinion as God's will even though they have no knowledge of this being true I caution people from stating "God would do this" and "God wouldn't do that" because we have no concrete knowledge of this nor do we have concrete knowledge of what may be some causes of homosexuality in the first place. And if anyone asserts that I am a homo lover or whatever, you have missed the point of this post entirely.
Everyone...lets take a moment for humility and have a constructive convo, NOT endless argueing advocating our own agendas and perceptions borderlining blasphemy (and this goes for everyone regardless of where you stand on the "biological" issue.)
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Peace IdmKhizar,
If the only crime is the spreading of STD's, then the solution is quite simple protection.
Peace,
TayKhi- Salam. Id say it's best 2 send them 2 exile so tht they can form there own community n see how far they can get. But they dont want tht. They deliberately wanna be in society. Evil pulls the good 2 itself n never leaves it alone until action is taken. GOD Bless!
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A friend of mine threw himself off of a 12 floor building because he did not want to live his life as a gay man. In his mind, the only CHOICE he had to counteract homosexuality was death. And no, there was nothing else wrong with him besides the fact that he had been gay since he was a child (there was always something a bit "feminine" with him) and hated not being able to live a life as a "normal" man.
Khi- Salam. Y was death his only choice? He cld have taken a medical treatment in the hospital if he had a hormone problem. If everything was ok n the testosterone was working fine then it is utterly impossible tht he be attracted 2 males. He cld have also taken anti sex stimualtion drugs or have his testis removed through surgery be4 killing himself. I think tht guy was mentally sick int he technical sense which imo is coz tht person obeyed the devil rather than GOD.
Before you assert that something is a choice, reverse roles and ask yourself the same question. Since I cannot even see myself attracted to women, I am going to turn this question completely around If it was in God's System to be homosexual, could I choose to be attracted to women?
Khi- Yes u probably cld coz the devil has been given certain power of influence. The mind is cpable of a lot of things. I know this from personal experience.
Solely off of my own inclination, I could not choose to be attracted to a woman just as many of you brothers in this forum probably could not choose to be attracted to a man.
Khi- As i said the mind is capable of doing countless things.
Sexual attraction may not be a choice, but our behavior is. If I had to engage in a sexual, monogamous relationship with a woman to be in harmony with God's system, I think that I would have the strength to do it (with a real struggle, I may add), but I doubt my sexuality would change.
Khi- If GOD planned tht 2 be then he wld have careted attraction btw similar partners. However this is not the law of nature even at the sub atomic level. Electrons attract protons which r opposite charges. However id like 2 mention one noteworthy pt here. Recedntly a Japanese scientist discovered tht when protons come into very close contact they instead of replling each other ATTRACT each other. Therefore they hold themselves 2gether in the nucleous. Ofcourse the neutrons also play a part but this was proved 2 be true. So applying this 2 humans maybe when we come very close 2 the same sex like sleeping close 2gether in the same bed we might ignore the sex of the person n start 2 feel some attraction. Maybe this is y when i isolated myself from the girls when i was a sunni n came 2 sit close 2 men i became attracted. This seems 2 make a lot of sense 2 me. Therefore perhaps many ppl say out of eypereince tht even male cousins shldnt sleep 2gether in one bed.
But, as a muslim who follows the Qur'an alone, I constantly struggle to accept and make God's will my own so, in this case, I would strive to force my personal sexual preferences to take a backseat (which is my current reality with abstinence until marriage/monogamy). But everyone may not strive to have that type of relationship with the God.
Khi- I believe tht 415-16 talk abt punishing HS couples n i believe the right punishment 4 them is exile.
The one thing that I am seeing from many people in here is the pushing of their own agendas and opinions at the expense of arrogantly asserting their perspectives as facts and, more disturbingly, attributing their opinion as God's will even though they have no knowledge of this being true I caution people from stating "God would do this" and "God wouldn't do that" because we have no concrete knowledge of this nor do we have concrete knowledge of what may be some causes of homosexuality in the first place. And if anyone asserts that I am a homo lover or whatever, you have missed the point of this post entirely.
Khi- I understood clearly from the Quran tht HS were strictly punished by GOD. The cities were tunred over n rocks showered on them. I believe theres a great lesson in there 4 us.
Everyone...lets take a moment for humility and have a constructive convo, NOT endless argueing advocating our own agendas and perceptions borderlining blasphemy (and this goes for everyone regardless of where you stand on the "biological" issue.)
Khi- I didnt. My views r n will GW always be based on the Quran Alone. GOD Bless!
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Salaam People,
A friend of mine threw himself off of a 12 floor building because he did not want to live his life as a gay man. In his mind, the only CHOICE he had to counteract homosexuality was death.
Please make careful note of what I put in bold in your quote. During the christmas season here in America, suicide rates go up substantially. In their minds they have no CHOICE but to commit suicide because they can't handle the stress of the extra workloads so that they can earn a christmas bonus and give their families a "Good Christmas". Others commit suicide because they cannot provide their families with a "Good Christmas". As Muslims, we all know that they choose to believe in and celebrate christmas. They choose to believe that Jesus' birthday is on Dec. 25 and that it is to be celebrated by putting up a big tree and fooling their children that a fat man in red breaks into their homes to leave lots of presents for them. They made a choice!! Some people are suffering because of this choice. I'm afraid it's the same thing for HS'.
And no, there was nothing else wrong with him besides the fact that he had been gay since he was a child (there was always something a bit "feminine" with him) and hated not being able to live a life as a "normal" man.
I too have seen this as I was growing up. As an adult I now realize that children are a product of their environments and upbringing. Just as it is my responsibilty as a parent to teach my children the difference between right and wrong, truth and falsehood, etc. It is also my responisibilty to teach them the difference between male and female and the proper ROLES each of them are meant to serve in GOD's overall plan and the proper BEHAVIOUR of each.
Sexual attraction may not be a choice, but our behavior is.
I believe that this is a very intelligent view. However, notice that you also admit that their behaviour is a choice that they make. The predatory behaviour of rapists, serial killers and pedophiles are also choices. If you still insist that the attraction of HS's is NOT a choice, then the attraction that pedophiles have for children is also not a choice. We cannot continue to pursue these double standards like this. What makes people tolerate one and not the other is that one is among consenting adults where as the other is total violation of peoples rights and safety. Either way, we cannot continue to straddle the fence. Pedophiles have an obvious attraction for children as opposed to adults JUST AS HS's have an obvious attraction for the same sex as opposed to the opposite sex.
The one thing that I am seeing from many people in here is the pushing of their own agendas and opinions at the expense of arrogantly asserting their perspectives as facts and, more disturbingly, attributing their opinion as God's will even though they have no knowledge of this being true
As a Very Firm believer in The Quran, I feel as though that my view on this matter is true according to GOD and according to The Quran!! Either we believe in it wholeheartedly or we don't believe in it at all. We cannot believe some parts and disbelieve others. This again would be straddling the fence.
I caution people from stating "God would do this" and "God wouldn't do that" because we have no concrete knowledge of this
He created seven universes in layers. YOU DO NOT SEE ANY IMPERFECTION IN THE CREATION BY THE MOST GRACIOUS. Keep looking; DO YOU SEE ANY FLAW?
Look again and again; your eyes will come back stumped and CONQUERED.
I repeat...GOD is flawless and perfect. He does not make mistakes. Hs's assert that GOD made a mistake when He gave them life in their particular genders.
The right way is clear from the wrong way.
One.
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Salaam Khizar, All
Peace IdmKhizar,
If the only crime is the spreading of STD's, then the solution is quite simple protection.
Peace,
TayKhi- Salam. Id say it's best 2 send them 2 exile so tht they can form there own community n see how far they can get. But they dont want tht. They deliberately wanna be in society. Evil pulls the good 2 itself n never leaves it alone until action is taken. GOD Bless!
Exactly. And I said the same thing on page 3 of this thread. The HS people are taking advantage of the normal society and they have no plans to leave it.
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Peace Damon and all,
Either we believe in it wholeheartedly or we don't believe in it at all. We cannot believe some parts and disbelieve others. This again would be straddling the fence.
Well said
What does your God-given "Reason" tells you about homosexuality from all the available scientific evidence and the testimony of millions of people?
I found it interesting that "reason" is put together with "scientific evidence", like 2 peas in a pod. Why not "quran"? Or even more so... why not just the God-given "Reason"? It is interesting to note that we will trust what the scientists tell us, more than God's message. And millions of people?... Here come the numbers again, it seems they so affect our "reasoning". After all, 1 Billion people can't be wrong... can they? roll
Peace
- They took their Priests and Monks to be patrons besides God, and the Messiah son of Mary, while they were only commanded to serve One god, there is no god but He, be He glorified for what they set up
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I'm well aware of of what is being said by gay people all over the world. I'm just as aware that millions of pedophiles and rapists echo the same nonsense in their own personal testimonies!!
This is nonsensical argument. Vast majority of Paedophilia is result of childhood abuse. Rape - you think this about Sex is it? No. Rape is about powerplay and also of hatred. Hatred is learned behaviour...
Also, I'm not concerned with what Kinsey, Hite, Friday, Wolfe or any of the rest of them have to say.
Off course not, that will be educative for you and surely you are not interested in that!
I am concerned with what GOD has to say.
This is the Hadithist argument. As a hadithist would have said "I am not interested in anything else but Sahih hadiths of the Prophet and in following his traditions regardless what my reason tells me to do...
By continuing to post these people's names, YOU YOURSELF are ignoring the brilliant piece that Truth has posted by The Psychologist who treats this mental disorder.
Scientific truth is based on consensus. No way is Truth's article as far as I know have reached a consensus.
Yes they are!! They have already lied to themselves when they claim that they are born that way and now they are lying to others when they repeat it publicly.
What! millions of people are lying about homosexuality? Really?
Then this must be one of the most lied about thing in the history of the world, for all time!Actually my friend, you are ignoring the reality that this theory has no basis in The Quran. And yet, The Quran Itself totally condems this behaviour.
Let me say this in slowly again. NO SCRIPTURE ACCEPTS HOMOSEXUALITY. We have agreed on this!
Possible doesn't cut it my friend. Unless and Until scientific research can agree 100% for sure on this theory (Which I am certain will not happen) I'm afraid I am not moved by notions of possibility or hints possible basis. There is either concrete evidence or non-concrete evidence. Since this is only a theory (and I must add wishful thinking) it logically fits in the non-concrete basket.
Scientist can only make conclusion from the available data. Scientific Truth is not absolute and no scientist can claim absolute truth. So I am sure you have nothing to fear on 100% certainty of scientific truth.
Well,well now. This is quite a quote. My friend, if it's not about scripture, then why are you muslim? Why claim to be a believer in GOD and scripture at all?
It depends how you define Muslim. But I am positive that your definition is not something I can agree with because you have shown yourself to be a zelous puritan when it comes to Scripture and God. Instead of using Scripture as a GUIDE to understanding God, it has become for you ABSOLUTE TRUTH, and this Absolute Truth has become for you an obstacle to your intellectual and spiritual progress.
I only persisted with my questionings because this is supposed to be A FREE MINDS FORUM but obiviously I was wrong on this matter. In future I shall limit my questions to less provocative stance. I am sorry I have upset you on this issue. But it was nothing personal Damon. It is just debate and you have made your position very clear to me. There is no point in me continuting this debate with so with due respect to you I bow out from this topic...
Just one last thing before I go. If SCRIPTURE undermines my human compassion for another human being, then I would rather go with my compassion and let God decide on my fate...
Regards,
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Peace Taj,
You asked,
Who is responsible for the HS thing? Or do you wish to blame it on God?
You are deflecting the questions I asked. You are passing judgement on them when you have no idea what it is like to walk in their shoes. Do you claim to know what is in their hearts? Yes or No?
Do you know what it is like to be gay?
Do you know what it is like to be black in America?It's easy for you to sit there and say someone is playing the victim. I would reflect on statements like that before passing them into cyberspace.
I choose not to pass this judgement because I wasn't blessed with the sort of insight that apparently you and others are blessed with. I leave their judgement to the only true judge.
May peace be upon you,
Tay -
Peace IdmKhizar,
You stated,
Id say it's best 2 send them 2 exile so tht they can form there own community n see how far they can get.
Great idea. A few questions though?
Where would this exile be?
Shall we include the autistic and the children with multiple sclerosis, crack addictions, and general disabilities in this camp, or should we set up another camp for each group that we are ostracizing?
Maybe we should have an obesity camp too.
And who decides which person is curable and which is not?
Who decides what point a person should reach before being allowed to re-enter society?
Do we need a special police force to infiltrate people's homes to make sure they are having sex with the opposite gender?
What do we do about masturbation? Should there be rules in place to make sure that people are masturbating to the right fantasies?Thanks,
Tay -
Phew!!!!
Looks like kebab monster sparked of a huge one! and has only posted a few threads whereas you lot have been having a 'royal rumble' (WWF wrestling where 30 men fight with each other) about it!
Calm down, put away you bold coloured capitals! It is not for us to judge people about what they do as regards to their sexual orientation, the clarification of this matter has not come into our society yet, when the people see that it is a clear wrong (that is if it is, I am not assuming it is, I am not taking any sides here!) then you can name-call and diss em!
But imho, i don't think people understand whether this is right or wrong, how can the Almighty punish people who did not understand that they were sinning, if there are signs that this is clearly wrong, show us proper statistics and hard evidence against this practice not silly arguments about how you feel and because you are attracted to the opposite sex, so should everybody. When something is clearly wrong, evil grows out of it, we should be able to see the consequences of 'sins'.
Peace, people, I just want peace, don't have a go on me, I don't want to take part in this Royal rumble!
Nural