Skip to content
  • Categories
  • Recent
  • Users
Skins
  • Light
  • Brite
  • Cerulean
  • Cosmo
  • Flatly
  • Journal
  • Litera
  • Lumen
  • Lux
  • Materia
  • Minty
  • Morph
  • Pulse
  • Sandstone
  • Simplex
  • Sketchy
  • Spacelab
  • United
  • Yeti
  • Zephyr
  • Dark
  • Cyborg
  • Darkly
  • Quartz
  • Slate
  • Solar
  • Superhero
  • Vapor

  • Default (No Skin)
  • No Skin
Collapse
Free Minds Forum Icon
  1. Home
  2. General Issues / Questions
  3. Questions/Comments on the Quran
  4. Palavers about Qur'aan.

Palavers about Qur'aan.

Scheduled Pinned Locked Moved Questions/Comments on the Quran
170 Posts 5 Posters 864 Views
  • Oldest to Newest
  • Newest to Oldest
  • Most Votes
Reply
  • Reply as topic
Log in to reply
This topic has been deleted. Only users with topic management privileges can see it.
  • I Offline
    I Offline
    imrankhawaja
    wrote on last edited by
    #2

    nice post brother mazhar.

    God bless you

    1 Reply Last reply
    0
    • M Offline
      M Offline
      Mazhar
      wrote on last edited by
      #3

      nice post brother mazhar.

      God bless you

      Thanks, brother. Hope you saw other sub-topics on the link.

      1 Reply Last reply
      0
      • I Offline
        I Offline
        imrankhawaja
        wrote on last edited by
        #4

        Thanks, brother. Hope you saw other sub-topics on the link.

        yes brother i always try to find a time to read your sub articles ..
        i also read your urdu articles

        at start i was not aware about your language skills and excellent command in both verbal and spoken language
        mashAllah you are doing very good work for making us understand the scripture as per language rules with your knolwledge skills..

        once you post a video i also watch that .. (nice work)

        God bless you

        1 Reply Last reply
        0
        • N Offline
          N Offline
          Novice
          wrote on last edited by
          #5

          Another palaver about Qur?n is the widespread opinion, almost to the level of belief, that translating and comprehending Qur?n is a very difficult task. This conjectural and opinionated propaganda is so strong that perhaps almost more than ninety percent of believers never thought of learning the skill for self translating and comprehending the Qur?n. A fear has been generated that any attempt of self-interpreting Qur?n might astray the person. A belief has been created that for learning Qur?n the prerequisite is acquiring the knowledge of more than a dozen of disciplines.

          Salaam brother Mazhar

          I totally agree with you. Al-Quran is a guidance and anyone approaching it with a clean slate should get the message.

          Brother how do you translate 2127

          (

          1 Reply Last reply
          0
          • M Offline
            M Offline
            Mazhar
            wrote on last edited by
            #6

            Salaam brother Mazhar

            I totally agree with you. Al-Quran is a guidance and anyone approaching it with a clean slate should get the message.

            Brother how do you translate 2127

            (

            Salamun Alaika,

            And know when earlier Iebra'heim and Iesma'eile were busy raising the Foundations of the House , they prayed "Our Sustainer Lord! Kindly grace with Your acceptance this masonry service of us.

            The fact remains that You the Exalted are certainly the Ever Listener, eternally and absolutely the Knowledgeable. [2127

            This is part of Frame-41 of Chapter 2 comprising of Ayah 124 to 129. It is a Narrative, which relates to real life events.

            Why they used the ? What is its relevance in the scene? They are requesting for the acceptance/acknowledgement of their service. Only such works are appreciated that are done sincerely and diligently exactly in accordance with the given instructions.

            They were doing the assigned job sincerely and meticulously. The House they raised is still the best structure ever built. A masterpiece of golden mean.

            Frame412124-129

            1 Reply Last reply
            0
            • M Offline
              M Offline
              Mazhar
              wrote on last edited by
              #7

              Brother Novice;

              Please read how Qur'aan is rendered facilitative for comprehending and getting self enlightened.

              Qur?n is rendered facilitative for comprehension

              By organizing it in encyclopaedic format

              ....
              Qur'an is thus exalted encyclopaedia of information about all that exists, the past, present, and the future, relevant to the needs of humanity and what he ought to know.

              ...
              What feature can earn the title of great for an encyclopaedia? Is it alphabetical arrangement of concepts? Certainly not from academic point of view and learning process. Alphabetical arrangement is only for ease of reference. The best encyclopaedia is that which is organized as ladder for progression in cognitive and intellectual leaps.


              Every bit of information and knowledge renders a person intellectually uplifted. And this intellectual ascension towards peak can be but progressive. What type of encyclopaedia is Qur?n can be understood by the word that names its division; it is http//haqeeqat.pk/English%20Tafsir%20e%20Haqeeqat/00.Tabweeb%20Part%202/102.%20Suratin%20Seen%20Waw%20Ra/2.gif

              The Speech of Allah the Exalted begins from Ayah 1 of Chapter 2. The speech ending in Chapter 114 has only 908 Frames.

              I hope it is clear in what sense I am using the word "Frame". Each subsequent Frame can be conveniently understood and reflected upon by recalling - referring to earlier Frame on a particular subject. This is the reading methodology advocated within the Book

              http//haqeeqat.pk/FacilitativeByEncyclopaedicFormat.htm

              1 Reply Last reply
              0
              • N Offline
                N Offline
                Novice
                wrote on last edited by
                #8

                And know when earlier Iebra'heim and Iesma'eile were busy raising the Foundations of the House , they prayed "Our Sustainer Lord! Kindly grace with Your acceptance this masonry service of us.

                Wa Salamun alaika

                (

                Brother Mazhar where is translated in your above translation.

                Novice

                1 Reply Last reply
                0
                • M Offline
                  M Offline
                  Mazhar
                  wrote on last edited by
                  #9

                  Wa Salamun alaika

                  (

                  Brother Mazhar where is translated in your above translation.

                  Novice

                  Min signifies a sub-set of a set; on going work is done subset by subset not all at once.

                  "Foundations of the House" has translation of Min in it.

                  English "of" is used to indicate a part of something that is normally considered as a whole

                  1 Reply Last reply
                  0
                  • N Offline
                    N Offline
                    Novice
                    wrote on last edited by
                    #10

                    Min signifies a sub-set of a set; on going work is done subset by subset not all at once.

                    "Foundations of the House" has translation of Min in it.

                    English "of" is used to indicate a part of something that is normally considered as a whole

                    Brother Mazhar

                    Is there a difference between

                    and

                    purely linguistically without satisfying a story in the background.

                    1 Reply Last reply
                    0
                    • N Offline
                      N Offline
                      Novice
                      wrote on last edited by
                      #11

                      English "of" is used to indicate a part of something that is normally considered as a whole

                      Do we use English "of" for possession case as well or not? Sorry to bother you but really want to know the difference.

                      1 Reply Last reply
                      0
                      • M Offline
                        M Offline
                        Mazhar
                        wrote on last edited by
                        #12

                        Brother Mazhar

                        Is there a difference between

                        and

                        purely linguistically without satisfying a story in the background.

                        The latter is no sentence since is not valid phrase.

                        1 Reply Last reply
                        0
                        • M Offline
                          M Offline
                          Mazhar
                          wrote on last edited by
                          #13

                          Do we use English "of" for possession case as well or not? Sorry to bother you but really want to know the difference.

                          Dear no botheration. Naive questions also help me. I had translated the Ayah just considering the words, their morphology and syntax. But I did not "watch" the scene of on going activity. Visualizing the scene helps better rendition in the target text.

                          The writing style of Qur'aan is imagery, a figure of speech, which employs words to create mental images in the mind of the reader. It makes the reader feel as if he is present in the very moment, right between the lines. Words that do not stimulate imagination are just symbols sprinkled on a blank piece of paper. Images and emotions are recreated by using vivid descriptions and comparisons with the help of sound words.

                          The verbal sentence shows to my imagination an on going activity. Gradually raising something from a base reference point. What was he raising plural noun. It means the boundaries that demarcate the sitting area. This is the sub-part of a building. It is perceived as a whole but it has its own sub-parts - its four sides and layers rising from the first layer laid some distance beneath the surface of the Earth.

                          The commencement of structuring the building - the House is the First layer of foundation. The starting point of is the First layer of foundation stones.

                          Prepositional phrase relates to the circumstantial clause. The preposition signifies the local and temporal point of departure, the point at which act or state has commenced.

                          The sentence is so beautifully structured that I can visualize the exact moment they prayed.

                          1 Reply Last reply
                          0
                          • N Offline
                            N Offline
                            Novice
                            wrote on last edited by
                            #14

                            The latter is no sentence since is not valid phrase.

                            Brother you have done a lot of work as is evident from your web site. You know Arabic very well as you have explained Arabic grammar in your web site as well as in your posts. Please educate me about and

                            Your opinion is that is not valid phrase. Is it not and ?

                            is mansub because of the verb

                            There are many examples of and in the Quran e.g.

                            In this verse is mansub because of the verb but is a valid and phrase.

                            Thanks for your time brother.

                            Novice

                            1 Reply Last reply
                            0
                            • M Offline
                              M Offline
                              Mazhar
                              wrote on last edited by
                              #15

                              Brother you have done a lot of work as is evident from your web site. You know Arabic very well as you have explained Arabic grammar in your web site as well as in your posts. Please educate me about and

                              Your opinion is that is not valid phrase. Is it not and ?

                              is mansub because of the verb

                              There are many examples of and in the Quran e.g.

                              In this verse is mansub because of the verb but is a valid and phrase.

                              Thanks for your time brother.

                              Novice

                              /

                              Possessive/Relative Phrase-"the Construct"

                              We are familiar with the Possessives in English like "my, their, etc" and possessive clitic "-'s". in Arabic represents primarily the association of one Noun with another Noun.

                              Annexed, attached, or possessed And second Noun is termed as "Annexer", or "Possessor"

                              • The noun that is possessed comes first, and is called meaning "additive", "attached", "annexed", "appendix"; [this noun is always indefinite, and without nunation -Tanwin)

                              ** The noun that is the possessor comes second/after, and is called ;

                              *** The first and the second noun worry about their own gender and plurality.

                              **** If the second noun is definite, the first noun derives its definiteness from the second noun.

                              ***** Since the first noun derives its definiteness from the second definite noun, therefore, in possessive phrase the first noun will never have definite article and nor "nunation/ .

                              ****** The that is the suffix for duality and masculine sound plurality will also drop.

                              ******* The first noun, whatever its grammatical state may be, which is determined by external factors, it will always render the second noun in the genitive case.

                              We can learn and determine the prepositional, possessive and adjectival phrases, just by carefully focusing on the written pattern of the words of the sentence, whether or not we have those words/nouns in our vocabulary and understand their meanings. A little concentrated effort with couple of sentences is the requisite where after, Insha-Allah our brain will automatically parse the sentence for us simultaneously while reading from the Grand Qur'aan. Remember and believe in Allah's word that it is easy to retain in memory and distinctly comprehend.

                              Your opinion is that is not valid phrase. Is it not and ?

                              You can now understand why it is not a valid phrase.

                              1 Reply Last reply
                              0
                              • M Offline
                                M Offline
                                Mazhar
                                wrote on last edited by
                                #16

                                In this verse is mansub because of the verb but is a valid and phrase.

                                It is Adjectival Phrase (not possessive phrase visual sign first noun is definite and in possessive phrase first noun is NEVER definite).

                                In Arabic, a true adjective is a subordinate word indicating a meaning in its principle. The important points to memorize

                                (a) In Arabic, the noun comes first. The one being described must come first; it is called and also -the one who is described-portrayed. In the above Adjectival Phrase is the -the one who is described-portrayed adjectivally.

                                (b) The adjective follows the Noun. The description must come second; it is called /adjective. It indicates a meaning in its principle without exception meaning without restrictions, like that of time or other restrictions. It functions as qualitative portrayal of the mentioned noun. Adjective's meaning is not for itself, rather its meaning is found in the noun which it modifies. Most often it is a derivative.

                                (c) We observed that the ending of both the Noun- and the Adjective- are in accusative case. It is thus obvious that the grammatical case of the Noun is determined by external factors and the case of Adjective will always match it. This is important visible sign to visually recognize Adjectival Phrase.

                                (d) Unlike Possessive Phrase, both the Nouns are visibly definite. The Noun and Adjective must correspond in definiteness. Both should either be definite or indefinite.

                                (e) Both nouns should match in plurality; singular, dual, or plural.

                                (f) Both should match in gender.

                                1 Reply Last reply
                                0
                                • M Offline
                                  M Offline
                                  Mazhar
                                  wrote on last edited by
                                  #17

                                  Sometime back when my throat was ok I had recorded preliminary lessons for self learning the skill for translation but these were in Urdu. For visually recognizing words and phrases

                                  https//www.youtube.com/channel/UCsZ1_1dGz4Rb-ilhLo5u-Vg/videos

                                  1 Reply Last reply
                                  0
                                  • M Offline
                                    M Offline
                                    Mazhar
                                    wrote on last edited by
                                    #18

                                    Why do you insert words within brackets not there in the original Arabic?

                                    There's no . It's annoying to read something not given mention of, and nowhere does it say you need to say that phrase every time you mention anyone's name, not even those prophets.

                                    And your translation is bad

                                    How do you make "Wa Esmail Rabbana" into "they prayed"? is the name of Ismail, a person. There's no logic in the translation and I remember it from the sectarians, it doesn't make sense.

                                    Pay attention to that his name is used as a word in the end of the sentence, which is quite interesting considered the linguistic meaning of his name. Listen or hearken is the meaning of it.

                                    And what's the stupid building, why would some building be used in Pagan manner to symbolize the assembly of Abraham?

                                    is based on which means clear or manifest, the is a suffix. It means the mentioned word is manifestly or clearly as such (i.e. of clarity &#1578.

                                    So no, there's no silly house mentioned in there.

                                    Please translate the sentence what you perceive from it.

                                    1 Reply Last reply
                                    0
                                    • N Offline
                                      N Offline
                                      Novice
                                      wrote on last edited by
                                      #19

                                      Thank you Mazhar for the refreshing rules for . Now my point was why you have translated as "foundations of the house" when it is not . I understand it as " the foundations from the house".

                                      Min signifies a sub-set of a set; on going work is done subset by subset not all at once.

                                      "Foundations of the House" has translation of Min in it.

                                      English "of" is used to indicate a part of something that is normally considered as a whole

                                      I believe that every word in the Quran is specific and wisely chosen. When "Min" is used it should be translated as "Min" and not as "Of". May be I am missing something.

                                      1 Reply Last reply
                                      0
                                      • M Offline
                                        M Offline
                                        Mazhar
                                        wrote on last edited by
                                        #20

                                        Thank you Mazhar for the refreshing rules for . Now my point was why you have translated as "foundations of the house" when it is not . I understand it as " the foundations from the house".

                                        I believe that every word in the Quran is specific and wisely chosen. When "Min" is used it should be translated as "Min" and not as "Of". May be I am missing something.

                                        Pl read reply 12.

                                        Better read it here
                                        Ayah 2124-129

                                        1 Reply Last reply
                                        0
                                        • N Offline
                                          N Offline
                                          Novice
                                          wrote on last edited by
                                          #21

                                          Dear no botheration. Naive questions also help me. I had translated the Ayah just considering the words, their morphology and syntax. But I did not "watch" the scene of on going activity. Visualizing the scene helps better rendition in the target text.

                                          The word is "MIn" and the phrase is . Does it mean "from the house" or "of the house"?

                                          1 Reply Last reply
                                          0
                                          Reply
                                          • Reply as topic
                                          Log in to reply
                                          • Oldest to Newest
                                          • Newest to Oldest
                                          • Most Votes


                                          • Login

                                          • Don't have an account? Register

                                          • Login or register to search.
                                          • First post
                                            Last post
                                          0
                                          • Categories
                                          • Recent
                                          • Users