-=[ Correction/Modification to FM Translation of AlQuraan ]=-
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No it does not, IsaMuslim is right. It can also mean man and woman, not necessarily 2 men.
I agree wa-alladhni (ن is in masculine dual relative pronoun which means both gender.
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I found an interesting note supporting "two men" in the website of Joseph Islam
In verse 416, the Arabic word used is 'alladhani' which is a masculine dual pronoun. Albeit, this can refer to a mixed gender group (a male and a female), it most likely refers to two men in this context. This is supported by the context of the previous verse which refers to and addresses women (415). Furthermore, some assert the duality of verse 416 as a reference to 'two guilty parties' of 415. This is also implausible given the plural context of the guilty women in verse 415, the structure of the argument of the verse and the punishment instructed. Verse 416 is also very unlikely to be a reference to illicit heterosexual relationships as this matter is firmly dealt with in verse 242. Therefore, verse 416 with the use of the dual masculine pronoun is most likely a reference to two men which is primarily supported by context.
http//quransmessage.com/articles/homosexuality
But I don't know if his reasoning on the context excluding it is correct; I have read other interpretations on context, such as Edip Yuksel's, that fit perfectly if considering "alladhani" the two guilty parties of 415.
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But I don't know if his reasoning on the context excluding it is correct; I have read other interpretations on context, such as Edip Yuksel's, that fit perfectly if considering "alladhani" the two guilty parties of 415.
Salam this is what Edip Yuksel said about 415 & 16
415
The relative pronoun in this verse is allati, which refers to a group of women. It indicates an organized prostitution, which might pose a grave health problem for the society. In a society that accepted the jurisdiction of the Quran, if a woman is proven four times to be involved in promiscuous sexual activity, she is considered a hazard to the society and should be quarantined. Perhaps there is also an implication for our time, where genetic identification helps us to find the real father of a child. Our genes are made of various combinations of four acid molecules Adenine, Guanine, Cytosine, and Thiamine. These four molecules, which are made of four different elements, function as witnesses for the identity of individuals to which they belong. The Quran does not necessarily require the witness to be an eyewitness. For instance, we bear witness to the oneness of God via our intelligence. The witness mentioned in 1226 is not considered a witness because he was present during the alleged incident. That witness did not say, "I saw with my eyes." The human witness mentioned in that story is proposing the testimony of circumstantial evidence, and logical conclusions based on both inductive and deductive reasoning. In other words, the Quran accepts the testimony of reliable circumstantial evidence just as it accepts the testimony of a reliable eyewitness.
416
The relative pronoun is not marked; the male dual form allazani (both) includes the female partner. In this case, it appears that the illegal or extramarital sexual affair is monogamous. For the punishment of the adulterers, see 241.
You can check in http//quranix.org/4#15 for verification, click on the red numbers to see the translators notes.
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425And whoever of you cannot afford to marry the emancipated
female believers, then from those committed to by your oath
of the believing young women. And God is more aware of your
faith, some of you to each other. You shall marry them with
the permission of their parents, and give them their dowries in
kindness. To be emancipated (mu'antin)?not for illicit sex or taking lovers.
Once they are emancipated(u'inna), then any of them who comes with
an immorality shall have half of what is upon those already
emancipated of the punishment. This is for those who fear a
hardship from among you, but if you are patient it is better for
you. And God is Forgiver, Merciful.I think you cant use emancipate here, as the root means to protect or to guard.
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425And whoever of you cannot afford to marry the emancipated
female believers, then from those committed to by your oath
of the believing young women. And God is more aware of your
faith, some of you to each other. You shall marry them with
the permission of their parents, and give them their dowries in
kindness. To be emancipated (mu'antin)?not for illicit sex or taking lovers.
Once they are emancipated(u'inna), then any of them who comes with
an immorality shall have half of what is upon those already
emancipated of the punishment. This is for those who fear a
hardship from among you, but if you are patient it is better for
you. And God is Forgiver, Merciful.I think you cant use emancipate here, as the root means to protect or to guard.
Bold
Ha-Sad-Nun = To be guarded, be inaccessible/unapproachable, be chaste, be strongly fortified, difficult to access, be preserved, be protected (against attack), abstain from what is not lawful nor decorous, preserve or guard a thing in places inaccessible/unapproachable, make or render a thing inaccessible or unapproachable or difficult to access, make/render a thing unattainable by reason of its height, to fortify oneself.
husun n.m. (pl. of husn) 592
hassana vb. (2) pcple. pass. 5914
ahsana vb. (4)
perf. act. 2191, 6612
impf. act. 1248, 2180
impf. pass. 425
pcple. act. 424, 55
pcple. pass. f. 424, 425, 425, 425, 55, 55, 244, 2423tahassana vb. (5) n.vb. 2433
Lane's Lexicon, Volume 2, page 222, 223 ## http//ejtaal.net/aa/#q=7Sn
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Salam this is what Edip Yuksel said about 415 & 16
415
416
You can check in http//quranix.org/4#15 for verification, click on the red numbers to see the translators notes.
Salaam,
Thanks for the notes.
I believe he is right on the "prostitution", because otherwise, in my opinion, it would be difficult to explain "until God makes a way out for them" (a way to escape from the house? a way to get out of the situation sounds better), but I don't agree with the "quarantine" thing; to me it looks just like a command to a man to keep his wife or daughter at home, to avoid them continuing committing that lewdness.425And whoever of you cannot afford to marry the emancipated
female believers, then from those committed to by your oath
of the believing young women. And God is more aware of your
faith, some of you to each other. You shall marry them with
the permission of their parents, and give them their dowries in
kindness. To be emancipated (mu'antin)?not for illicit sex or taking lovers.
Once they are emancipated(u'inna), then any of them who comes with
an immorality shall have half of what is upon those already
emancipated of the punishment. This is for those who fear a
hardship from among you, but if you are patient it is better for
you. And God is Forgiver, Merciful.I think you cant use emancipate here, as the root means to protect or to guard.
Salaam,
I agree that sometimes Edip Yuksel completely changed certain words; that is why I never rely on a single translation and I use websites such as islamawakened.com -
Bismillahi I think it would be more accurate and appropriate to translate it to With God's name
http//haqeeqat.pk/02.%20Grammatical%20units/1.gif
These three words, a preposition, a common noun and a Proper Noun constitute the first grammatical unit . It comprises of a Prepositional Phrase + Possessive Phrase.
The first word comprising of a consonant and a vowel is Inseparable Preposition, meaning that it occurs prefixed with its object noun; in Arabic it is called . Prepositions render their object noun in genitive case. The preposition and its object noun constitute what is called a prepositional phrase, in Arabic grammar .
The prepositions used in the Divine Discourse help visually recognize the nouns, effortlessly. The preposition designates contiguity in its broadest sense. It has a wide range of uses including spatiotemporal, instrumental and manner adverbial. It is used for the following purposes
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For connectivity;
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For assistance; instrument
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For making a verb transitive;
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For an adverbial meaning;
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For accompaniment.
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For requital; and
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Extraneous; according to a rule for the negated predicate; also in interrogation.
The preposition is evidently for seeking assistance; This phrase in isolation literally means "recourse-beginning-activation-concomitance is with/by a name-code". Initiating a controlled process requires information. And the most fundamental fact about information is that it is itself preceded by the Prime Source Who is but the Living and holding Will. The Divine Discourse concatenates facts in perfect sequence and chronological order. Its first word vividly indicates at the outset about superb concatenation-consistence-contiguity and colligation in the contents of the Book in hand. This is the First scientific fact of the physical world. The creation and for created ones the initiation of the process of learning-knowledge is but the "code/name". The human memory and that of computer can save nothing without knowing or assigning a code/name to a thing-object-phenomenon.
http//haqeeqat.pk/1.BismilAllah.htm
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Salaam, I think this is a typo
Alteration instead of alternation.
Good detection.
Alteration refers to change in one thing. Alternation is the reciprocal succession of (normally two) things in time or place; the act of following and being followed by turns; alternate succession, performance, or occurrence; as, the alternation of day and night, cold and heat, summer and winter, hope and fear.
Verbal noun is also of Form-VIII. Its Root also has the primary signification
That it signifies the coming or happening of a thing after another thing rising and holding the position and status that was once held by the other one - alternation; secondly it is contra. of past referring future; and thirdly it signifies change.
Root http//haqeeqat.pk/roots/(410).htm
And He the Exalted causes emergence of life in matter and causes death to alive.
And the alternation of the Night and the Day is for Him the Exalted to manage.
Is it for reason that you do not ponder?use intellect to differentiate?
2378-80
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Good detection.
Alteration refers to change in one thing. Alternation is the reciprocal succession of (normally two) things in time or place; the act of following and being followed by turns; alternate succession, performance, or occurrence; as, the alternation of day and night, cold and heat, summer and winter, hope and fear.
Verbal noun is also of Form-VIII. Its Root also has the primary signification
That it signifies the coming or happening of a thing after another thing rising and holding the position and status that was once held by the other one - alternation; secondly it is contra. of past referring future; and thirdly it signifies change.
Root http//haqeeqat.pk/roots/(410).htm
And He the Exalted causes emergence of life in matter and causes death to alive.
And the alternation of the Night and the Day is for Him the Exalted to manage.
Is it for reason that you do not ponder?use intellect to differentiate?
2378-80
Thanks for completing
I noticed it randomly.I want also to share a thought on nafs.
I think that, since its primary meaning is "soul", before translating it to "person" we should then consider if another meaning is possible in that context.
For exampleThey did not teach anyone until they would say "We are a test, so do not lose faith!" Thus they teach what can separate between a person and his mate; but they cannot harm anyone except with the permission of God.
2102
What if God meant another thing here?
This piece of the verse is usually understood to mean that they learnt how to separate a man and his wife, but what if what they learnt was to divide any living being from its mate?O people, be aware of your Lord who has created you from one person and He created from it its mate and sent forth from it many men and many women; and be aware of God whom you ask about, and the relatives. God is Watcher over you.
41
And He is the One who initiated you from one person; with a place for stability and development. We have explained the signs to a people who understand.
698
These verses are understood by sectarians to mean that Eve came from the rib of Adam... This translation does the same as most of the traditional translations.
But the verses could also mean that we were initiated from one living being, like a living cell, and from it God made its mate (by dividing the cell).Correct me if I am wrong in anything, since I don't speak arabic.
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Salam/Peace dear brother IsaMuslim. It's best of you check and study the root word of Nafs
Nun-Fa-Siin ( ) = was or became high in estimation, of high account or excellent, highly prized/precious/valuable and therefore desired with much emulation or much request, desired, it became loved or highly esteemed, console, cheer, envy.
Was or became avaricious/tenacious/niggardly of it because of its being in high estimation or excellent, little to much good.
Brought forth (e.g. gave birth to a child), menstruated, blood.
Clear away grief/anxiety/sorrow, ease/relieve, delay.
Breath, gust, drew breath, sigh, spoke long (due to regular intake of breath), become extended/long/increased, ability.
Soul/spirit, the vital principle, intellect/reason/mind, inner desire or feeling, knowledge, pride, self-magnification, a state where there is ample scope for action, 'willingly' when used as adverb, nafs - soul of discrimination (mental) and ruh - soul of breath (physical), oneself/itself, whole, essential constituent, reality, sometimes ghayb and nafs are synonymous, a person/being/individual, quantity, man, life, soul + body, life-blood, body, contention/thought/face/substance, heart, stomach, gulp, drought.
Brother or co-partner in faith/religion/relationship.
Wide space, distance, width.
Greatness, nobility, glory, scarcity, absoluteness, unseen, hidden reality which is beyond human perception, intention, requital, punishment.
nafs n.f. (pl. anfus and nufus) 29, 244, 248, 248, 254, 254, 257, 272, 284, 285, 287, 290, 2102, 2109, 2110, 2123, 2123, 2130, 2155, 2187, 2207, 2223, 2228, 2231, 2233, 2234, 2234, 2235, 2235, 2240, 2265, 2272, 2281, 2284, 2286, 325, 328, 330, 330, 361, 361, 369, 393, 3117, 3117, 3135, 3145, 3154, 3154, 3161, 3164, 3165, 3168, 3178, 3185, 3186, 41, 44, 429, 449, 463, 464, 465, 466, 479, 484, 495, 495, 497, 4107, 4110, 4111, 4113, 4128, 4135, 525, 530, 532, 532, 545, 552, 570, 580, 5105, 5116, 5116, 612, 612, 620, 624, 626, 654, 670, 693, 698, 6104, 6123, 6130, 6130, 6151, 6152, 6158, 6164, 79, 723, 737, 742, 753, 7160, 7172, 7177, 7188, 7189, 7192, 7197, 7205, 853, 872, 917, 920, 935, 936, 941, 942, 944, 955, 970, 981, 985, 988, 9111, 9118, 9120, 9120, 9128, 1015, 1023, 1030, 1044, 1049, 1054, 10100, 10108, 1121, 1131, 11101, 11105, 1218, 1223, 1226, 1230, 1232, 1251, 1251, 1253, 1254, 1268, 1277, 1283, 1311, 1316, 1333, 1342, 1422, 1445, 1451, 167, 1628, 1633, 1672, 1689, 16111, 16111, 16111, 16118, 177, 1714, 1715, 1725, 1733, 186, 1828, 1835, 1851, 1874, 1874, 2015, 2040, 2041, 2067, 2096, 2135, 2143, 2147, 2164, 21102, 2362, 23103, 246, 2412, 2461, 2461, 253, 2521, 2568, 263, 2714, 2740, 2744, 2792, 2816, 2819, 2833, 296, 2940, 2957, 308, 309, 3021, 3028, 3028, 3044, 3112, 3128, 3134, 3134, 3213, 3217, 3227, 336, 3337, 3350, 3419, 3450, 358, 3518, 3532, 3636, 3654, 37113, 396, 3915, 3941, 3942, 3953, 3956, 3970, 4010, 4017, 4131, 4146, 4153, 4211, 4245, 4371, 4515, 4522, 4738, 4810, 4911, 4915, 5016, 5021, 5121, 5323, 5332, 5714, 5722, 588, 599, 599, 5918, 5919, 6111, 6311, 6416, 6416, 651, 657, 666, 7320, 7438, 752, 7514, 7940, 817, 8114, 825, 8219, 8219, 864, 8927, 917tanaffasa vb. (5) perf. act. 8118
tanafasa vb. (6)
impf. act. 8326
pcple. act. 8326Lane's Lexicon, Volume 8, pages 80, 81, 82, 83 ## http//ejtaal.net/aa/#q=nfs
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Salam/Peace dear brother IsaMuslim. It's best of you check and study the root word of Nafs
Nun-Fa-Siin ( س = was or became high in estimation, of high account or excellent, highly prized/precious/valuable and therefore desired with much emulation or much request, desired, it became loved or highly esteemed, console, cheer, envy.
Was or became avaricious/tenacious/niggardly of it because of its being in high estimation or excellent, little to much good.
Brought forth (e.g. gave birth to a child), menstruated, blood.
Clear away grief/anxiety/sorrow, ease/relieve, delay.
Breath, gust, drew breath, sigh, spoke long (due to regular intake of breath), become extended/long/increased, ability.
Soul/spirit, the vital principle, intellect/reason/mind, inner desire or feeling, knowledge, pride, self-magnification, a state where there is ample scope for action, 'willingly' when used as adverb, nafs - soul of discrimination (mental) and ruh - soul of breath (physical), oneself/itself, whole, essential constituent, reality, sometimes ghayb and nafs are synonymous, a person/being/individual, quantity, man, life, soul + body, life-blood, body, contention/thought/face/substance, heart, stomach, gulp, drought.
Brother or co-partner in faith/religion/relationship.
Wide space, distance, width.
Greatness, nobility, glory, scarcity, absoluteness, unseen, hidden reality which is beyond human perception, intention, requital, punishment.
nafs n.f. (pl. anfus and nufus) 29, 244, 248, 248, 254, 254, 257, 272, 284, 285, 287, 290, 2102, 2109, 2110, 2123, 2123, 2130, 2155, 2187, 2207, 2223, 2228, 2231, 2233, 2234, 2234, 2235, 2235, 2240, 2265, 2272, 2281, 2284, 2286, 325, 328, 330, 330, 361, 361, 369, 393, 3117, 3117, 3135, 3145, 3154, 3154, 3161, 3164, 3165, 3168, 3178, 3185, 3186, 41, 44, 429, 449, 463, 464, 465, 466, 479, 484, 495, 495, 497, 4107, 4110, 4111, 4113, 4128, 4135, 525, 530, 532, 532, 545, 552, 570, 580, 5105, 5116, 5116, 612, 612, 620, 624, 626, 654, 670, 693, 698, 6104, 6123, 6130, 6130, 6151, 6152, 6158, 6164, 79, 723, 737, 742, 753, 7160, 7172, 7177, 7188, 7189, 7192, 7197, 7205, 853, 872, 917, 920, 935, 936, 941, 942, 944, 955, 970, 981, 985, 988, 9111, 9118, 9120, 9120, 9128, 1015, 1023, 1030, 1044, 1049, 1054, 10100, 10108, 1121, 1131, 11101, 11105, 1218, 1223, 1226, 1230, 1232, 1251, 1251, 1253, 1254, 1268, 1277, 1283, 1311, 1316, 1333, 1342, 1422, 1445, 1451, 167, 1628, 1633, 1672, 1689, 16111, 16111, 16111, 16118, 177, 1714, 1715, 1725, 1733, 186, 1828, 1835, 1851, 1874, 1874, 2015, 2040, 2041, 2067, 2096, 2135, 2143, 2147, 2164, 21102, 2362, 23103, 246, 2412, 2461, 2461, 253, 2521, 2568, 263, 2714, 2740, 2744, 2792, 2816, 2819, 2833, 296, 2940, 2957, 308, 309, 3021, 3028, 3028, 3044, 3112, 3128, 3134, 3134, 3213, 3217, 3227, 336, 3337, 3350, 3419, 3450, 358, 3518, 3532, 3636, 3654, 37113, 396, 3915, 3941, 3942, 3953, 3956, 3970, 4010, 4017, 4131, 4146, 4153, 4211, 4245, 4371, 4515, 4522, 4738, 4810, 4911, 4915, 5016, 5021, 5121, 5323, 5332, 5714, 5722, 588, 599, 599, 5918, 5919, 6111, 6311, 6416, 6416, 651, 657, 666, 7320, 7438, 752, 7514, 7940, 817, 8114, 825, 8219, 8219, 864, 8927, 917tanaffasa vb. (5) perf. act. 8118
tanafasa vb. (6)
impf. act. 8326
pcple. act. 8326Lane's Lexicon, Volume 8, pages 80, 81, 82, 83 ## http//ejtaal.net/aa/#q=nfs
Salam brother,
Sorry for replying only today.I see that the meaning of "Soul", which also carries the meaning of "life" is in the lexicon.
Also we have the followingQur'an 3185
Every soul will taste death
It is not only every person that will die, but every living being (animals, plants, ...).
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It is not only every person that will die, but every living being (animals, plants, ...).
Yes and they will return to Allah/God (SWTAY)
20111
WaAAanati alwujoohu lilhayyialqayyoomi waqad khaba man hamala thulman
And the faces shall be humbled for the Eternal, the Living. And whoever carried wickedness with him has failed.5526
Kullu man AAalayha fanin
Everyone upon it will fade away.5527
Wayabqa wajhu rabbika thooaljalali waal-ikrami
And the face of your Lord will remain; One with Majesty and Honor.4065
Huwa alhayyu la ilahailla huwa faodAAoohu mukhliseena lahu alddeenaalhamdu lillahi rabbi alAAalameena
He is the Living; there is no god except He. So call on Him while devoting the system to Him. Praise be to God, Lord of the worlds.2135
Kullu nafsin tha-iqatu almawtiwanablookum bialshsharri waalkhayri fitnatanwa-ilayna turjaAAoona
Every soul will taste death. And We burden you with evil and good as a test, and it is TO US THAT YOU WILL RETURN.2957
Kullu nafsin tha-iqatu almawti thummailayna turjaAAoona
Every soul will taste death, then TO US YOU WILL BE RETURNEDRa-Jiim-Ayn = to return, turn back, turn off, (blame) upon any one, come back, repeat, answer, bring answer, be brought back. raji'un - one who returns. murji'un - return, termination. taraja'a (vb. 6) -to return to one another.
2558
Watawakkal AAala alhayyi allatheela yamootu wasabbih bihamdihi wakafabihi bithunoobi AAibadihi khabeeran
And put your trust in the Eternal Who does not die, and glorify His praise. It is enough for Him that He is expert in the sins of His servants. -
Salam/Peace everyone. I found a verse that i have noticed something.
5147 والسماء بنيناها باييد وانا لموسعون
Waalssamaa banaynahabi-aydin wa-inna lamoosiAAoona
And the heaven We constructed with resources, and We are expanding it.Now i checked the root for curiosity and i found this
Waw-Siin-Ayn = to be ample, take in, comprehend, embrace.
Wasi'a (prf. 3rd. m. sing.) Extended; Comprehended.
Wasi'at (prf 3rd. p. f sing.) Embraces.
Wasi'ta (prf 2nd. p. m. sing.) Thou comprehended.
Sa'atun (v. n.) Abundance; Amplitude; Bounty.
Waasi'un (act. pic. m. sing.) Bountiful; All-Pervading.
Al-Waasi'un one of the names of God.
Wasi'atun (act. pic. f. sing.) wide, spacious.
Muus'i (ap-der. m. sing. vb. IV) maker of the vast extant.
Wus'un (n.) capacity, scope.wasi'a vb. (1) perf. act. 2255, 680, 789, 7156, 2098, 407
n.vb. (1) 2247, 4100, 4130, 2422, 657, 657
n.vb. (2) 2233, 2286, 6152, 742, 2362
pcple. act. 2115, 2247, 2261, 2268, 373, 497, 4130, 554, 6147, 2432, 2956, 3910, 5332awsa'a vb. (4) pcple. act. 2236, 5147
Lane's Lexicon, Volume 8, pages 306, 307 ## http//ejtaal.net/aa/#q=ws3
The Arabic word lamûsi
ûna has a emphatic lām prefix & the word mûsiûna grammar's form is masculine plural form IV active nominative noun.I dont know if this is a mistranslation or not but someone with good Arabic knowledge can help me with this?
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Salam,
3952-53 needs correction.
3952 is missing something.3952
Do they not realize that God spreads the provision for whoever He chooses, and withholds? In that are signs for a people who believeIs the underlined correct in 3953?
3953
Say ?O My servants who transgressed against themselves, do not
despair of the mercy of God. For God forgives all sins. He is the
Forgiver, the Merciful.?Salam
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I wonder why we as muslims still use proper names such as moses, gabriel, pharaoh and so on.
Isn?t it clear from Quran that their names are Musa, Jibril and Firawn?
Please stop using names taken from other than Quran itself, especially from the books that had been twisted and edited by men.
May ALLAH forgive us.
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I depends on where you are with whom you are talking.
In an englishspeaking Forum it is ok to use Moses to stick with this example as this is whats the englishname is .When you know that you are debatting with a jew it is ok to use Moshe due to respect if you know they are muslims then Musa.
Dont think that People Twisted the names
My view
peace
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i dont think they are English name. they are taken from Old Testament (OT).
Since the current book of Old Testament has contradictions injected by human led by the devil itself, we should not consider it as a holy book. we should not take any information from it to add up or complete any information we got from Quran under any circumstances, since Quran already state that it is complete. no extra information regarding road of salvation is required.
those names from OT are causing us heavy problems due to
- that is the way they can smuggle the non existing character of Jesus to become Nabi Isa, so that many of us think Nabi Isa is Jesus and vice versa.
- that is the way they smuggle the idea of false long timeline of prophets from Nabi Nuh to Nabi Muhammad by changing the name of Nabi Yakub to Israel, so that we will think that Bani Israil is the descendant of Nabi Yakub.
i dont know if there are more evil agenda other than these 2, but these are already bad enough.
please stop using extra-quranic information when we talk about Quran.
