Wife beating in islam? The Quran strikes back
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4.34 when it speaks about nushhuz is not ddrssing the husband nor is it speaking aobut wivs, it is speaking about women and in the plural, they may be married they may be not married and it ties with 4.15.
In both aya where it speaks of nushuz ther is a fear in one case, 4.34, in the community of believers, i the second case on the part of he wife. The first ce is a matter social matter and the second, for the moment, at least, a private matter. In 4.34 is the matter of the welfare of those women who may find themselves driven ito nushuz, and in the secod is the virtue of private man who may be tempted into nushuz. Nothig is done in both case. There is fear that something may be done, therefore i both cases it is a mattr of preventing it happen. In the first case it is a social action, in the second a private action by a wife.
4.129 Why should this aya refer to several wives, it doe snnot say so, it is speaking again of nisaa', ot your wives but the nisaa of the group to which it is addressed, and it is telling men to behave themselves, for instance no swaying their behaviour in favour of one they like more as against anothr one for whim they have ill feelings, that they must be wives is pure invention, It is also talking about breaking, so one may want to punish the "bad one" by giving undue favours to th "good one". Some men tend to do that. the multiples wives is pure imagination. as is pure imagination that it is about wives that it is talking in 4.34.
There is this glitch in many maleminds that anything that the Qur'an says about womenn must revolve arounnd men, about the wants of men, the needs of men, the wishes of men. Well that is all i the mens mind, not in the Qur'an. When the Qur'an means wives it makes it clear that it is referred to wives, and when it uses the generic plural addressing the believers or the naas it is also clear that it is ot addressing the males but the whole community. "Your women, are the women of the whole community. Also the women of the women, not the wives of anybody.
I know nobody is going to take any notice of this except to show that it is not grue, but still I say it just in case feel like renewing the malecast mind and open up a little. In fact inn doesnt kill, it does ntokill neither males nor females.
Salaam
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peace t11,
I'm disappointed by your reply. Please read what I write carefully.
Re 2) and 3)
I never said a response makes it a two way dialogue, but it is also not a one way monologue. You chose your words poorly - not only is your claim of a one way monologue refuted by any dictionary but also by you contradicting yourself when you admitted a response can be given.
In any case, you seem to think since w3z is used no dialogue between husband/wife can take place. Not only is this incorrect, it is also illogical/impractical.Example
Husband advises/admonishes/preaches to his wife (let's call the content of what he said 'X'
Wife replies can you clarify what you mean by this part of X?
Husband I cannot enter into a dialogue with you, t11's interpretation does not allow for that.
Wife But I'm not sure what you mean so how can I obey that part?
Husband No dialogue.Your position is impractical/illogical.
And you will note, the husband fulfilled the recommendation of advising.
Perhaps you can let us know if, in your view, the husband is banned from having a discussion with his wife? ;Dt11's illogical reasoning
amending of article proves contradictionSide note saying its a contradiction in bold and caps does not make it a contradiction either. ;D
In 4129 it is described as a deviation. It is not something obvious/blatant/proven or a crime etc. The implication is the husband has deviated somewhat and should do the right thing in settling the matter. I also discuss the subjectivity/relativity of this in the article.
And the understanding of "cite them" does not require 434 and 4128 to be equivalent in every way, or even similar (although they are similar). My point is what step comes after deadlock and before arbiters/authority getting involved. The answer is obvious authority notification.
With regard to the other discriminations you claimed, perhaps you can tell us (since you confidently claim they are discriminations) what are the arguments for/against. Let us see what thought you have put into such claims.
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Re this post
What do you mean by "CITE THEM". Do you mean refer them to the court? or tell someone about their misbehavior?. Your argument is that (which i understood from your article) how would authority know that there is a rift in relation between husband and wife. The only way is if someone tell them. Husband or wife or any other close family member would inform the court. Am i correct?
Also, in your view "NUSHOOZ" mean cheating with husband?.
Please re-read www.Quran434.com as your questions are answered there.
To understand what "cite them" means simply read 434-35.
435 connects to 434 with the Arabic "wa" / and, and in 435 the authority is clearly involved. Thus, the obvious question to ask is how did they end up getting involved? Who told them? Quran seems to have missed this step out...... or did it?
The logical (and perhaps only) step after deadlock and before authority involvement is notifying the authority of the situation, hence the last step given to the husband is "cite them".
The exact same thing happens in 581-4. A perfect match, as explained in the article.Re nushuz
"uprising" (Arabic nushuz, root Nun-Shiin-Zay) is the literal meaning and in context means rising up (above relationship/marital limits)...
...if we take these factors into account, it suggests unseen "disloyalty/infidelity/ill-conduct/rebellion" in some way. -
Peace Wakas,
Thanks for your reply. It makes perfect sense. I would like to write your article in URDU in a simple form as yours is in English and only helpful for those you can understand English language. Also, it is quite dense and I have read your article many times to grasp your opinion but still i asked a stupid question. Don't take me wrong, i love your article.
I don't know if you can understand or read URDU but before putting on the different forms i would like to send you first article in Urdu so that you can read (it depends if you can read and speak Urdu) if i understood your opinion correctly. Is that possible if i have your email address? and of course i will mention your website. It is basically not translation of your article but writing in a simpler form as i understood after reading your article.
I have written articles on different topics on Quran but they are all in Urdu. In Pakistan, people are not very educated and mass majority cant fully understand English, especially the one written in your article. That is the reason i would like to write it in a simpler form to spread this message to others, so that more people can benefit from it.
Lastly, if i say "CITE THEM" in URDU it would be "In ki nishandahi karo" am i correct?
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Peace Wakas,
Thanks for your reply. It makes perfect sense. I would like to write your article in URDU in a simple form as yours is in English and only helpful for those you can understand English language. Also, it is quite dense and I have read your article many times to grasp your opinion but still i asked a stupid question. Don't take me wrong, i love your article.
I don't know if you can understand or read URDU but before putting on the different forms i would like to send you first article in Urdu so that you can read (it depends if you can read and speak Urdu) if i understood your opinion correctly. Is that possible if i have your email address? and of course i will mention your website. It is basically not translation of your article but writing in a simpler form as i understood after reading your article.
I have written articles on different topics on Quran but they are all in Urdu. In Pakistan, people are not very educated and mass majority cant fully understand English, especially the one written in your article. That is the reason i would like to write it in a simpler form to spread this message to others, so that more people can benefit from it.
Lastly, if i say "CITE THEM" in URDU it would be "In ki nishandahi karo" am i correct?
Better to give a synopsis of what you have understood before putting it in Urdu. That will help Wakas and others to see what have you perceived from the article.
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Mazhar,
English is not my first language and i openly admit that i can't speak and write fluently. Even i have been living and working in England since 2004. I can write better in Urdu as compared to in English. Therefore, i requested that if i can write up in my own words and present it to Wakas. If he would be happy then i will publish it on Facebook and spread this message. Please understand my limitation in this matter. Could you translate CITE THEM in Urdu please if you don't mind?
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Aqua's website (http//www.quranverse434.com/) is down. I can't get in it now. Can anyone contact brother/sister Aqua about this?
Otherwise we can see it in Internet Archive https//web.archive.org/web/20190124211540/http//quranverse434.com/
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Ah no worries dear brother.
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The website is back up
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Ah excellent dear brother.
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