CONCLUSION OF THE SWINE DEBATE
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PBMRK's translation is wrong, because if was "undivided hoof", then the sheep and the oxen, as with the animals with claws, would have been haram, because sheep and oxen have hooves.
Khi- Salam. Sheep and oxen have hoofs but they are DIVIDED/SPLIT NOT undivided so even according to RKs translation theres no problem since sheep and oxen wont fall under that category.
What word in Al-Quran means...undivided hoof, where do you get this from? please post the ayat. A hoof is a hoof is hoof, undivided or not. Allah, did not make any such distinction in His Quran. Allah, for a fact, only uses the term thufr and it means claw, thus, pig, whether they have divided or undivided hooves, are not in the clawed category.
Do you know, by way of Al-Quran, what, if any, other animals, outside of those with claws, were made haram to the Jews? If so, please name them, thanks. If you don't know, then you cannot, per ayats 733, 1736, nd 16116, pass of your conjecture as Quranic truth and, that other animals were haram.
Khi- Now weve come to the point. My answer is, no, in the Quran i dont find anymore animal prohibitions for the Jews outside those of claws/unidivide hoofs.
STOP forging a lie against Allah and His Quran. Don't be a sneak. Thufr, does not mean undivided hoof, it means claw. Well, given that no other animals are mentioned in Al-Quran as being haram to the Jews before al-Quran, the the only species of animals that you do know where haram, are those with claws i.e. turkeys, chickens, lobsters, crabs, etc.
BUT does that mean there were no more??? Does the Quran really say that it contains all of the animal prohibitions towards the Jews? Does it make such a claim? I can assure you it does NOT, so your point is still NOT proven in any way. GOD Bless!
Your question can only lead to conjctures, because Al-Quran does not say and, per ayat 733, 1736, and 16116, you cannot say of Allah or His Deen of which you have no certitude, nor can make haram anything which Allah hasn't.
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Your question can only lead to conjctures, because Al-Quran does not say and, per ayat 733, 1736, and 16116, you cannot say of Allah or His Deen of which you have no certitude, nor can make haram anything which Allah hasn't.
Khi- Salam. No, the grammatical form of the phrase "lahmun khinzeer" makes it clear that the animal pig is mentioned, thus pig, the animal, had to be prohibited to the Jews along with clawed animals as in 6146.
Note 6146 does NOT say that those are the only animal prohibitions as you claim. My proof relies on the grammatical form. You place your argument on pure conjecture, which you accuse me of, by deducing WRONGLY from 6146 that it mentions all of the animal prohibitions to the Jews which it does NOT. GOD Bless!
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SaLaM
It's all foam; and this thread is appropriately called the conclusion of the swine debate.
If we know our PB/dhulqarnane, then there will be a new thread called "Conclusion of the "Conclusion of the swine debate"" rotfl rotfl
Jaxal wrote
I on occasion smoke weed.http//www.free-minds.org/forum/posting.php
Hmmm...from you posts, it is apparent that, it is more than occasionally. rotfl
Keep up the good work lol
rotfl rotfl rotfl rotfl rotfl rotfl did the truth hurt you ???? rotfl rotfl rotfl .
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Your question can only lead to conjctures, because Al-Quran does not say and, per ayat 733, 1736, and 16116, you cannot say of Allah or His Deen of which you have no certitude, nor can make haram anything which Allah hasn't.
My God, are you blind?? What, then, is the meaning of the folowing ayats;
733 Say the things that my Lord hath indeed made haram are shameful deeds, whether open or secret; sins and trespasses against truth or reason; assigning of partners to Allah, for which He hath given no authority; and saying things about Allah of which you have no knowledge.
1736 And do not pursue that of which you have no knowledge; for every act of hearing, or of seeing or of (feeling in) the heart will be enquired into (on the Day of Reckoning).
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The only thing that hurts me are my eyes when they fall upon your nonsensical scribblings. Does the truth you???? You, by your own admission, use a controlled/haram intoxicant, thus, you have zero credibility. People entertain your intoxicant induced foolishness, because you are a source of great comic relief...and that is the truth. rotfl
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The only thing that hurts me are my eyes when they fall upon your nonsensical scribblings. Does the truth you???? You, by your own admission, use a controlled/haram intoxicant, thus, you have zero credibility. People entertain your intoxicant induced foolishness, because you are a source of great comic relief...and that is the truth. rotfl
Now now... easy on the pork lol lol dont go all piggy on me rotfl rotfl rotfl rotfl
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An enemy of islam for sure lol
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and you go easy on the....weed. Btw, are you high now?
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This will be last post to you...seek professional help.
Peace.
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Peace be upon you all,
There is no arguing in the debate
When you lose your peace you lose.
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Your question can only lead to conjctures, because Al-Quran does not say and, per ayat 733, 1736, and 16116, you cannot say of Allah or His Deen of which you have no certitude, nor can make haram anything which Allah hasn't.
My God, are you blind?? What, then, is the meaning of the folowing ayats;
733 Say the things that my Lord hath indeed made haram are shameful deeds, whether open or secret; sins and trespasses against truth or reason; assigning of partners to Allah, for which He hath given no authority; and saying things about Allah of which you have no knowledge.
1736 And do not pursue that of which you have no knowledge; for every act of hearing, or of seeing or of (feeling in) the heart will be enquired into (on the Day of Reckoning).
Khi- Salam. the above is NOT my quote. GOD Bless!
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The only thing that hurts me are my eyes when they fall upon your nonsensical scribblings. Does the truth you???? You, by your own admission, use a controlled/haram intoxicant, thus, you have zero credibility. People entertain your intoxicant induced foolishness, because you are a source of great comic relief...and that is the truth. rotfl
Ad hominem.
I can't find any evidence that cannabis was forbidden to the Jews so by your standards it's fine for everyone.
PRIEST_BOKMEI / DHULQARNANE in a sentence...
"If it's good for the Jews, it's good for me."
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Your question can only lead to conjctures, because Al-Quran does not say and, per ayat 733, 1736, and 16116, you cannot say of Allah or His Deen of which you have no certitude, nor can make haram anything which Allah hasn't.
My God, are you blind?? What, then, is the meaning of the folowing ayats;
733 Say the things that my Lord hath indeed made haram are shameful deeds, whether open or secret; sins and trespasses against truth or reason; assigning of partners to Allah, for which He hath given no authority; and saying things about Allah of which you have no knowledge.
1736 And do not pursue that of which you have no knowledge; for every act of hearing, or of seeing or of (feeling in) the heart will be enquired into (on the Day of Reckoning).
Khi- Salam. the above is NOT my quote. GOD Bless!
mquran warned about this kind of behaviour in the thread discussing him.
S/he has so many identities on this board it's hard to keep up with who you're speaking to. I think that's against forum policy but hey, this individual seems to have a way of alternating between taking on the role of a victim and appealing to the authorities insincerely, and being a pest towards forum participators.
I think it's pointless getting into circular debates with her/him because they have a way of trying to bury all the essentials in meaningless foam that s/he generates through repetition.
Some final advice...
"A barking dog is irritating only as long as you choose to hear it."
Regards.
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The only thing that hurts me are my eyes when they fall upon your nonsensical scribblings. Does the truth you???? You, by your own admission, use a controlled/haram intoxicant, thus, you have zero credibility. People entertain your intoxicant induced foolishness, because you are a source of great comic relief...and that is the truth. rotfl
Ad hominem.
I can't find any evidence that cannabis was forbidden to the Jews so by your standards it's fine for everyone.
PRIEST_BOKMEI / DHULQARNANE in a sentence...
"If it's good for the Jews, it's good for me."
lol lol lol lol lol lol
lol lol lol lol lol lol
lol lol lol lol lol lol -
Some final advice..."A barking dog is irritating only as long as you choose to hear it."
Do not be so quick to be irritated by the barking dog. If one looks at the Tarot card--The FOOL/JESTER, there is a dog barking at the FOOL/JESTER, who is looking up at the sky, daydreaming and prancing about content and cuddlely in his reverie, all the while, completely oblivious to the fact that, his very next step will take him over a cliff. The dog barks in hope of warning his companion of the imminent danger which is only a heartbeat/step way. Allah honors the dog...perhaps you should do the same, however, the arrogant will have a great deal of difficulty following Allah's lead.
truth, contemplate the following image.
http//www.aquarionics.com/assets/attach/tests/fool.jpg
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Aidid Safar has also decided to translate lahma khinzeerin by contaminated meat.
(Aidid Safar) Indeed it is only prohibited on you the carrion and the blood and the contaminated meat and what has been legalised by way of - for other than God. Thus whoever is strained without malice and not being deliberate - surely there is no fault on him. Indeed God is forgiving - merciful.
cf http//aididsafar.com/translation.html
PS my rebuttal here
http//www.free-minds.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=4031&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=625#55205
http//www.free-minds.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=4031&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=625#55493 -
Aidid Safar has also decided to translate lahma khinzeerin by contaminated meat.
(Aidid Safar) Indeed it is only prohibited on you the carrion and the blood and the contaminated meat and what has been legalised by way of - for other than God. Thus whoever is strained without malice and not being deliberate - surely there is no fault on him. Indeed God is forgiving - merciful.
Yes, Aidid, being the rational and non-superstitious individual that he is, has come to the same conclusion that I and many others have as well that, khinzerin cannot and does not mean the specie of animal pig in Al-Quran.
In your "rebuttal" you simply wanted to toss out ayat 6146, but you can't. This ayat, as I have stated many times now, tells us what specie of animals Allah made haram to the Jews/POTB, those with claws. This ayat is so powerful in what it declares that, you cannot/will not work through your denial that, it totally excludes the pig, in that, as an animal, pigs don't have claws. This ayat PROVES three things conclusively
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The specie of animal pig CANNOT and is not represented in the haram animals to the Jews, as it doesn't possess claws.
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That the Jews LIED when they claim that Allah made the pig haram to them.
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In that, the pig was not made haram by Allah to the Jews/POTB, it was then halal. Humans cannot make anything haram that Allah has not.
There is NO rebutting the above three realities and staying within Al-Quran at the same time.
Now, in that, the specie of animal pig was not made haram to the Jews/POTB, it was halal, hence, at the time ayat 55 is being revealed the pig being halal was therefore halal to the those who were given Al-Quran. There is simply NO WAY out this sequence of events...none.
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I'm sorry PBM your bubblling makes no sense especially the Quran said that the pigs were forbidden on the Jew
would you like to see the proof? lol
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Yes, Aidid, being the rational and non-superstitious individual that he is, has come to the same conclusion that I and many others have as well that, khinzerin cannot and does not mean the specie of animal pig in Al-Quran.
I find it funny though that your mentors, you and aidid safar come to the same conclusion based on the stuff that your mentor started touting in the first place?!? I did some research and apparently this contaminated/diseased meat is first argued by your mentor and his wife and then spread over the net (OQS board as well)?!? Have you heard of this before they told it to you for the first time? I haven't read this through any other source. It's just very surprising to me.