Quran & Democracy: Are they compatible? by M. Asadi
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Civilization is a continuous evolving process
.False. Civilsations can also DEVOLVE. Try reading al-quraan for a change in place of Hegel, PM. When the 'ajl' of a society's triggered, the count begins to the hour of destruction.
And yes, people of those ages were less civilized than we are today and thats very understandable. Coz there was ignorance about life and all things around them. Ignorance reaps fear. Since they didnt understand how nature works, they feared nature and considered them as Gods and prayed to them to gain their favours, and sacrificed fellow humans to gain their favours, and did all sort of nonsense to prevent the Gods from getting angry with them.
Once again False. People of today may not worship stone idols so much, but they do worship thier idols. Movie stars, figures in high society. All of them command the devotion of the masses. Shirik is alive and well.
They didnt know women were not sex slaves.
For God's sake, just go to a London phone booth in Central or the West End. What do you think those women are??? There for the fun of it ? Poverty FORCED them into this. Why do you analyse so superficially, PM? Do you think slavery is defined by steel chains around your ankles?
They didnt know that men and women were equal.
Didn't they? Funnily, the only revert in Islam in al-quraan was a woman who lived in pre-muhammadan times. Queen of Sheba. So false yet again.
They didnt know gambling, killing, stealing were wrong.
And we do now? Is that why crimes still go on and now gambling is a NATIONAL INSTITUTION called the lottery?
Don't be so proud of living in these times, Peaceful Muslim. In some ways, our present society are worse than animals. Allah Himself says so.
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Well Mquran,
the only true follower of Quran,If there were two people and you were the second person, then yes because you reject al-quraan.
please enlighten me with a verse where Allah says democracy is wrong,
or showing compassion and tolerance towards righteous non believers is wrong?Excuse me, where did I say showing compassion towards ANYONE is wrong? Do you to resort to defemation now 'peacefulmuslim' ????
What is Democracy????
Democracy is LEGISTLATION ACCORDING TO THE VOTE OF THE MAJORITY.
Al-quraan commands legislation THE BOOK OF ALLAH.
So ipso facto, democracy is wrong.
And if u cant do that, please dont rant or Judge people.
u r no better than anyone else and only Allah judges. Allah has asked us to judge sins so that they can be punished. Allah doesnt tell u to judge ur fellow beings for no obvious reasons or show disrespect towards them.
Stop acting like u r the only one who understands and follows Quran.Only Allah judges ?
Allah commands you to AHKUM...i.e.. JUDGE!
but how ? With the book in truth ! Not with your own hawaa/desires. Majority of people don't bother about the path. So why do i need thier approval to legislate my life????? Can't you understand this deduction?
Democracy - HUMANS legislates
Al-islaam - Allah legislates.
And if u do read and understand Quran as u claim, u ought to know this
QuoteYes, so tell me where these verses ask you to SEEK LEGISLATIVE APPROVAL ?
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All I can sense here is arrogance, absurd comparisons and disrespect for fellow beings!
I dont wish to demean myself to those standards! -
All I can sense here is arrogance, absurd comparisons and disrespect for fellow beings!
I dont wish to demean myself to those standards!Of course, asking AL-QURAAN, which to you is a history book and not comparable to Montesqiu , Voltaire and Locke, is DEMEANING. Wonderful.
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Salaam,
Stop fighting please!!!!
Peace sis Majidah
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Peace,
And Quran is there to guide us and not spoon feed us about everything!
Why is it spoonfeeding to say that the quran provides us with the info we need on building a nation?
You do not say it is spoonfeeding when it provides one with the guidance necessary to one's advancement, but when it comes to matters in this transient world it's spoonfeeding?
Each nation is to have a rasool resulting in just decisions to be made with no wrong to the people, according to Allah .
They didnt know women were not sex slaves.
Doing something that's wrong does not mean that these people did not know it was wrong. Just like when you said it was against your better judgement to respond to mquran you did so anyways. These people too follow their ego and seek to satisfy it even if they know it is against better judgement.
They didnt know that men and women were equal.
I doubt is was that they did not know. Even in patriarcal societies there were men who felt women were their equals. In SE Asia some societies had women in the position that men had in other societies. Maintainers, head of household, owned property, and women took care of finances. Men would care and expand the properties of their sisters, etc, but had none of their own.
They didnt know gambling, killing, stealing were wrong.
I doubt this as well. For if this is the argument for savages and uncivilized people then we are they. Our society is rampant with gamblers, killers, and thieves. Can you deny this? Can you even deny that these things are a problem to this day?
Now we are not that ignorant, are we?
lol Your article seems like it had no research done. Those barbarians who the Romans often warred with were not without moral guidance. They just did not live like the Romans. Rome was quite civilized and possessed all the things needed in a civilization, such things as arts, agriculture, religion, etc. They also did things that were not altogether nice, such as those death matches and killings .
We understand certain things more than they did. We understand how nature works, dont we?
Of course our understanding is of greater renown because nowadays books are everywhere, we can get information with the click of a button. In those days only the elite were lucky enough to have such knowledge at their feet. They certainly understood how nature worked. Thier inventions were the groundwork for our own. Rome had sophisticated waterways and the city was pumped with millions of tons of water a day. That's why people there had water to drink and wash with daily.
so, how can u say people of that age and today are the same?
We all have the capacity to think and reason. We are thinking beings.
Joe
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Why is it spoonfeeding to say that the quran provides us with the info we need on building a nation?
You do not say it is spoonfeeding when it provides one with the guidance necessary to one's advancement, but when it comes to matters in this transient world it's spoonfeeding?
That's just it, Joe. I have no idea where he's getting all these notions from. What does it mean to 'guide' ? Does al-quraan provide you brownie points by reading it or something???
What is a MORAL guidance, to use the democrats own words? Its a guidance w.r.t. BEHAVIOUR. Therefore, some behaviours are acceptable and some arent.
Al-quraan details al-ahkaam, God's universal laws. And until now, MONTHS after the discussion started, the democrats cant bring a single verse. Yet stillearning says democracy is the best system around. He cannot be an al-muslim because they submit to Allah whereas he submits to the majority of humans. I cant believe even that's not obvious.
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SaLaM stillearning and PM and everyone
If Quran is anti democratic then So, how are we to be governed?
For real. I think this is the most important question right now. IT has already been agreed that there is no rusol for this geenration. Perhaps Allah forgot? It is also agreed that there was no rusool for the last 1400 years. Perhaps Allah forgot? In any case, bottom line is we dont have a rusool. Now if we dont have a rusool and becoz Quran is anti democratic, how are we to be goverened?
By the way stillearning, I have shown how Quran advocates democracy a few pages ago. So dont let the barking al-dogs al-annoy you wink . This i for you too PM. If you feel that the al-barking al-dogs are annoying you, then just ignore him. there is nothing he has asked that hasnt already been answered.
By the way, i request those double posting to stop becoz its spamming the whole thread.
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Jaxal, Peacefulmuslim and Stillearning are actually MENTIONED in al-quraan
Hast thou not turned Thy vision to those who declare that they believe in the revelations that have come to thee and to those before thee? Their (real) wish is to resort together for judgment (in their disputes) to ASH-SHAITAAN, though they were ordered to reject him. But Satan's wish is to lead them astray far away (from the right).
When it is said to them "Come to what God hath revealed, and to the Apostle" Thou seest the Hypocrites avert their faces from thee in disgust
(4/60-61)God predicted thier kufr from the beginning ) Alhamdulillah.
And it's not 'a RUSUL' unless in your retard's english there's such a thing as 'a MESSENGERS'.. ) Stay another decade in the middle east, then maybe you can pick that up
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Jaxal, Peacefulmuslim and Stillearning are actually MENTIONED in al-quraan
Hast thou not turned Thy vision to those who declare that they believe in the revelations that have come to thee and to those before thee? Their (real) wish is to resort together for judgment (in their disputes) to ASH-SHAITAAN, though they were ordered to reject him. But Satan's wish is to lead them astray far away (from the right).
When it is said to them "Come to what God hath revealed, and to the Apostle" Thou seest the Hypocrites avert their faces from thee in disgust
(4/60-61)God predicted thier kufr from the beginning ) Alhamdulillah.
And it's not 'a RUSUL' unless in your retard's english there's such a thing as 'a MESSENGERS'.. ) Stay another decade in the middle east, then maybe you can pick that up
Did you speak like to your ex wife? is that why she left you? If you dont agree with what is being said then stfu. dont spew hatered from your mouth towards those who dont agree with you.
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I would like to know where in al quran do we have the right or are encouraged to call each other distasteful names? Please post the verse/s?
Are we encouraged to laugh at others in al quran? If people are calling to follow the quran, lets try to do it all the way and not be hypocrites ourselves?
I don't have a problem with people losing it occasionally, but there is a limit. -
What injustice has been done to someone here personally? This is a discussion about the quran, one's duty is to spread the message, if there is someone not getting it, will one stoop to insults?
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SC if there is someone not getting it, will one stoop to insults?
For not getting it? Definitely not. For behaving miscreantly, definitely so. Im all in favour of a peaceful discussion but some can't tell what that is. You disagreed with me in our PM discussion, did I lash out at you?
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For not getting it? Definitely not. For behaving miscreantly, definitely so. Im all in favour of a peaceful discussion but some can't tell what that is. You disagreed with me in our PM discussion, did I lash out at you?
Why would you lash out at me for disagreeing with you? When someone is not getting it you seem to insist that they do...and when they still don't agree...you call them unbelievers and hypocrites....what possible good can come of this? Leave them be if they don't agree, you can only be stronger instead of dirtying yourself with er, dirt.
By the way...which PM discussion are you alluding to? The one we had I did NOT disagree with you, I disagreed on something that happened on a thread, NOT via PM.
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Why would you lash out at me for disagreeing with you?
I wouldn't. Disagreement doesn't bother me in the least.
When someone is not getting it you seem to insist that they do
No. My insistence is upon an ordered dialogue which I do my best to implement personally.
you call them unbelievers and hypocrites....what possible good can come of this? Leave them be if they don't agree, you can only be stronger instead of dirtying yourself with er, dirt.
Sc, I dont label ppl things. I look to the book and see how thier behaviour is according to the book. The book is a functional book, its not there for our casual perusal instead of use in daily life. To me, 'kafir' , 'munafiq' and so forth are classifications and help me see the strategies of interaction. There's no point in reminding via the ayaat to a kafir, for example. This whole discussion faltered precisely because I was speaking to ppl who do not believe in the ayaat. That's why no matter how many times you quote it for them, they wont listen to you. Im sorry this has to be the case, but hey-ho, that's life.
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Salaam Sc,
I guess this is between Mq and Jaxal only.
But ,maybe they can discuss this somewhere else!?
Peace Sis Majidah
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SaLaM SC
When someone is not getting it you seem to insist that they do...and when they still don't agree...you call them unbelievers and hypocrites.
It usually that or al-kafir or al-sunni. rotfl rotfl rotfl
edit i agree sm. The admins can delete the posts if they wish.
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I guess this is between Mq and Jaxal only.
Im sorry this has to be the case, but hey-ho, that's life.
Er, okay then...I've started to have images of dwarves and pick axes singing Hey ho...one dwarf in particular comes to mind...Grumpy.