The concept of God
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Hello Ahmed,
Everything we see around us has been created by someone. The houses, cars, TV, radios etc. did not come into existence by themselves. Although we do not know the individuals who assembled them, we know for sure that human hands are behind their creation.
If any 'beings of outer space' ever see our space machines, they probably will marvel at the precise function of their intricate mechanical and electronic parts. If they observe the exact orbital path that these space crafts follow, will they think that these came into existence by themselves like the other celestial bodies, having no hand behind their creation and function?
Each human cell performs hundreds of thousands of complex chemical reactions every day for its proper function and exact reproduction. All tissues and organs in the body are regulated by biological laws set forth for them. The brain does not perform the function of heart and the heart does not perform the function of kidney. The complex and intimate relationships between the organs are precise and governed by fundamental laws. We may utilize these laws, already set forth for them, to our advantage, but in no way can we alter these fundamental laws.
We see the apparent lifeless seeds grow into plants with life. Again we see plants and animals, full with life, made into lifeless materials. We also observe the vast universe, its grand design, the superb organization, and its precise and flawless functions. Did all these come into existence and continue to exist by themselves? Basic human intelligence will tell us that there is a Creator who brought into existence each and everything around us and beyond. This is God, our Creator and the Creator of the universe.
A long article chap! And I see no one has responded. So for sake of an argument...the above is the age old ontological argument for proof of God...but they longer work Ahmed because we are unable to get of the system to know it for sure - what say you?
Regards,
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Hello Ahmed,
Hello mate
Everything we see around us has been created by someone. The houses, cars, TV, radios etc. did not come into existence by themselves. Although we do not know the individuals who assembled them, we know for sure that human hands are behind their creation.
If any 'beings of outer space' ever see our space machines, they probably will marvel at the precise function of their intricate mechanical and electronic parts. If they observe the exact orbital path that these space crafts follow, will they think that these came into existence by themselves like the other celestial bodies, having no hand behind their creation and function?
Each human cell performs hundreds of thousands of complex chemical reactions every day for its proper function and exact reproduction. All tissues and organs in the body are regulated by biological laws set forth for them. The brain does not perform the function of heart and the heart does not perform the function of kidney. The complex and intimate relationships between the organs are precise and governed by fundamental laws. We may utilize these laws, already set forth for them, to our advantage, but in no way can we alter these fundamental laws.
We see the apparent lifeless seeds grow into plants with life. Again we see plants and animals, full with life, made into lifeless materials. We also observe the vast universe, its grand design, the superb organization, and its precise and flawless functions. Did all these come into existence and continue to exist by themselves? Basic human intelligence will tell us that there is a Creator who brought into existence each and everything around us and beyond. This is God, our Creator and the Creator of the universe.
A long article chap!
yeh mate, I love reading the holy books and any toughts about it, so I thought I share it with you
And I see no one has responded.
true but my objective was not to debate it nor to cheer for it rather to show clear verses from 4 holy books that are well respected now days, and we can see clearly the similarity between all religions mentioned
So for sake of an argument...the above is the age old ontological argument for proof of God
sorry mate, I care less about the introuduction, what i care about is the verses posted from the Holy books, and it is about the concept of God, not to prove God existance, it is more to know what God is, i.e. His existance was already proven to the ones that will read it
...but they longer work Ahmed because we are unable to get of the system to know it for sure - what say you?
I say for the concept of God, they work great for me because I can see what makes great sense within, regarding knowing the system, i say which system
The system of the heaven and universe ran by Allah?
The system of obdience to Allah?
The system in how we deal with eachother?
or the system of being held accountable?
peace
Regards,
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SaLaM Ahmed
He has no limitation of ability.
If that is true, then why did it take God 6 days to build heaven and earth. Why not, "Be" and its done?
Salam Mate
Because He said so man
why i have to question this?
if He told me that he can make things happen on the fly and gave me many examples
and He also told me that He created the heaven and earth in 6 days or 6 periods
And finally He also told me numerous times that HE DOES WHAT HE WANTS
and I submitted to him
so why I have to question this?
unless I carry doubt in my heart
and for sure those with doubts were also mentioned in the Quran
I'm a submitter to Allah and I believe in the UNSEEN as per 23 and as requested by Him, period bro
peace be with you
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Peace,
It is a valid question. When you say God is all that and a bag of chips, it does makes one think why it took God 6 days to build heaven and earth. Can you answer this question?
God is outside the system. Time is irrelevant for God. The concept of time comes into play when it's relevant to us. The period of time it took is relevant/pertains to us rather than God. That must be the amount of time it took for everything to come together according to the laws by which the universe is designed. There is also a difference in time as it applies to us regarding different vantage points, especially regarding spacetime. These considerations are of importance while learning about the physics of our universe and the beautiful way it is designed. The reading is truly awesome in it's power to relay concepts. 'Be' is a process, not magic, futher emphasized by "be and it becomes/is becoming".
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SaLaM Ahmed
It is a valid question. When you say God is all that and a bag of chips, it does makes one think why it took God 6 days to build heaven and earth. Can you answer this question?
NO bro I'm sorry I can't, and I have to abide by 1736
(36)
I>E. when I don't have knowledge I should not argue, unless you consider this a descrepency in the Quran and consequently I will have to respond to it, but you have to convince me first that it is a descrepency beyonfg resonable doubt
peace be with you
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Peace Jaxal,
it does makes one think why it took God 6 days to build heaven and earth. Can you answer this question?
Because He chose to take His 'time'. ) Again, "days" is a metaphor, since "DAYS" weren't quite in existence.There's a vegetable soup that I make once in a while. It can take me 15 minutes to make it... but I choose to take about 6 (no pun intended) hours... tastes much better when I put love and time into it. yes
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SaLaM SC and Ahmed and zenje
SC
'Be' is a process, not magic, futher emphasized by "be and it becomes/is becoming".
So say for example God was going to create a chair and a planet with a self sustaining ecological system. God says 'Be' for it to be done. Are you saying, that the planet will take longer to be created than the chair? While chair is a simple in its size and shape, the planet is a whole different story? Or are you saying that it will take time for the rocks to come together and the water to form and the plants to grow and all that.
Why cant it just just be 'Be' and its done?
Ahmed
NO bro I'm sorry I can't, and I have to abide by 1736
Thats ok brother, i was just thinking out loud.
zenje
Because He chose to take His 'time'.
Why would there be the need for God to take time? God is all knowing. God is perfect. Its not like God will make a mistake and then correct it. Hence why the time delay. Or its not like God didnt like where the mountain was placed or where the jungle was growing and God deicded to move that around. Infact i dont think God cares where the mountains are and the ocean is and the jungle grows. So why the time taken? Doing what?
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Jaxal
Time is a creature, don't think nro that it will apply on the one He created it
for example, if Allah can know the future, then Time does not apply on Him
so how come you we use something for messuring time "rotation of planets around stars etc, etc" and apply on Him?
why not the 6 days are reresenting 6 periods of very long time "from our perspective, the rotation of earth around the sun" as a preperation for our existance according to Allah plan that He wanted to look like nature to us "not like magic and things just appears in front of our eyes", and sure it did with someone like Darwin
you see when we start talking about the UNSEEN we will end up with many possibilties that can be exploited by the devil
you have to know that believing in the UNSEEN is one hell of a hrd thing to achieve
peace bro
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SaLaM Ahmed
WEll brother, this is what im thinking. Lets forget that days exist. or years or seconds or minutes. Lets forget all of that. God uses the number 6. 6 of something took place before the earth and heaven was created. 6 what? Even leaving that aside, why did it take 6 of anything for God to create earth and heaven. ALL GOD HAD TO DO WAS SAY 'BE' and its done. Becoz Its God! I hope you understand what im trying to say.
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SaLaM Ahmed
WEll brother, this is what im thinking. Lets forget that days exist. or years or seconds or minutes. Lets forget all of that. God uses the number 6. 6 of something took place before the earth and heaven was created. 6 what? Even leaving that aside, why did it take 6 of anything for God to create earth and heaven. ALL GOD HAD TO DO WAS SAY 'BE' and its done. Becoz Its God! I hope you understand what im trying to say.
yes bro He did say let the universe and earth to be and with that order the process has started "iy took no time for Him" but it took 6 periods of our time as explained to us by Him
I don't think Days apply on Allah, i firmly believe that 6 days means 6 periods of our time
remember bro the verse says
"Inma Amrona An Naqool Lahu Kon Fa Yakoon"
you see "Fa Yakoon" means a future icnident that is continuing to happen, a continuty of verb to be "Fa Yakoon", the verse never said it will happen on the spot, rather the process of to be has started and can not be stopped unless Allah wish so
peace bro
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Peace Jaxal,
Why cant it just just be 'Be' and its done?
I already explained why, and if that didn't penetrate, the only way I can think of driving the point home further would be with a railroad spike.
So say for example God was going to create a chair and a planet with a self sustaining ecological system. God says 'Be' for it to be done. Are you saying, that the planet will take longer to be created than the chair? While chair is a simple in its size and shape, the planet is a whole different story? Or are you saying that it will take time for the rocks to come together and the water to form and the plants to grow and all that.
What do you think? Do you think the chair would be floating in the depths of space and then plonk itself on the planet when it comes into being? There is a system of doing things, it starts from the basics and builds up to the more complex and in the case of the universe...what we know now regarding it's design, it's more complicated than we thought possible and yet that is the basic stuff upon which the universe is built...to put it in simple terms...when God asks us the rhetorical question in 7927, and what we know today...it is truly remarkable.
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Deleted due to not wanting to debate God being man.
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Eh, right you are...not canadian are you?
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A long article chap!
yeh mate, I love reading the holy books and any toughts about it, so I thought I share it with you
Very nice of you -)
And I see no one has responded.
true but my objective was not to debate it nor to cheer for it rather to show clear verses from 4 holy books that are well respected now days, and we can see clearly the similarity between all religions mentioned
Really? Is that why you have ended with a summary to say Quranic God is more tenable? wink
I say for the concept of God, they work great for me because I can see what makes great sense within, regarding knowing the system, i say which system
There is no need to proceed with this since your intention was not to debate... and thats fair enough... -)
Though one can easily comment on your summary on the "Concept of God" wink
But I see now you got a debate now going -)
Regards,
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A long article chap!
yeh mate, I love reading the holy books and any toughts about it, so I thought I share it with you
Very nice of you -)
And I see no one has responded.
true but my objective was not to debate it nor to cheer for it rather to show clear verses from 4 holy books that are well respected now days, and we can see clearly the similarity between all religions mentioned
Really? Is that why you have ended with a summary to say Quranic God is more tenable? wink
I say for the concept of God, they work great for me because I can see what makes great sense within, regarding knowing the system, i say which system
There is no need to proceed with this since your intention was not to debate... and thats fair enough... -)
Though one can easily comment on your summary on the "Concept of God" wink
But I see now you got a debate now going -)
Regards,
Ok mate
but you didn't debate you justy came and said it was used by date logic or somethin similar, so how you expect me that I debate it then,
i don't think with every generation we need to revise the ideas about God, I reckon since Adam humans should have known what God exactly is
peace