Is Quran anti- secular?
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PM Isnt Islam a religion? And if a muslim country follows muslim laws , wont it be religious legislation? whats devious in it?
Islam is a DEEN. A deen is something which a slave follows for his rabb/ilah. We are told that to serve Allah, we must follow his laws (12/40) and we must be our deen EXCLUSIVELY to him (39/3). You're not a muslim by going into the mosque and hitting your forehead on the floor 17 times a day. You become a muslim by orientating your qiblah towards masjid al-haraam, which is the establishment of God's huruumat in the world.
The 2nd option clearly indicated that every country in the world follow laws based on the religion of majority. Be it hindus, muslims, christians, jews, sikhs, buddhists etc..
If muslims are to follow Quranic laws for all people(muslims and non muslims) in the country, then its only fair to allow others to follow their religious laws in their countries, isnt it?Huh? If some guy came up to you and said 'my religion commands me to murder kids in order to please my lord Beelzebub', would you allow him to do this in your secular domain ?
Now, whats this supposed to mean? Cant u plain discuss with people without being judgemental?
I can use the same Quran and judge u. But I wont. Coz u r a fellow human being like me, and I respect u for that fact,and I respect the difference in our views as well. Cant u do that?Yes, PLEASE judge me using al-quraan. Everything I say, judge it with the book. Please do this. For once in your discourse, OPEN THE BOOK and show us where it supports your position. PLEASE.
Looks like I missed on Lotetree's confession that he is kufr. Can u enlighten us?
Lote-Tree doesn't believe in the divinity of the Quran nor its eternal laws. He's the only brave enough to admit and I respect him for it.
Let me give an example Say, u live in a country with hindu majority and they have hindu legislation, and if according to the legislation, the widows had to burnt alive along with their dead husbands(its a practice called sati that was practiced among hindus), would u be ok to follow it? Or would u prefer secular and just legislation not taking into consideration religious beliefs, and with personal freedom to practice one's religion?
Gosh, this is a FALSE dichotomy. All we have really are choices of LAWS
- Law of a 'secular democracy'
- Laws of various 'religious govts'
Both are LAWS.
We choose the one closer to al-quraan which is secular democracy. This doesn't make it perfect. Only what comes from al-quraan (for muslims) is perfect.
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Hi IDMkhizar,
So you dont believe in Quran Alone then according to me since you would probably believe 9128&129 belongs to Quran.
Yes, U can have ur opinions.
My relationship with God is my own, and doesnt have to fit into ur definitions or infact anyone else's definitions of What one should believe.
I would only believe in what I can understand as truth. Yes, u and all r free to do the same. -
My relationship with God is my own, and doesnt have to fit into ur definitions or infact anyone else's definitions of What one should believe.
I would only believe in what I can understand as truth. Yes, u and all r free to do the sameEspecially not the Quran's. Not once have you referred to it for your principles. That's your business of course only I find it strange that a 'peaceful MUSLIM' cannot backing from his own book.
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Hi Mquran,
My relationship with God is my own, and doesnt have to fit into ur definitions or infact anyone else's definitions of What one should believe.
I would only believe in what I can understand as truth. Yes, u and all r free to do the sameEspecially not the Quran's. Not once have you referred to it for your principles. That's your business of course only I find it strange that a 'peaceful MUSLIM' cannot backing from his own book.
I have quoted enough verses to u in discussions. And U have easily misinterpreted for ur benefit.
Here are some Quote that u need to really contemplate on, and I have quoted these to u umpteen times as well
4910 The Believers are but a single Brotherhood So make peace and reconciliation between your two (contending) brothers; and fear Allah, that ye may receive Mercy.
4911 O ye who believe! Let not some men among you laugh at others It may be that the (latter) are better than the (former) Nor let some women laugh at others It may be that the (latter are better than the (former) Nor defame nor be sarcastic to each other, nor call each other by (offensive) nicknames Ill-seeming is a name connoting wickedness, (to be used of one) after he has believed And those who do not desist are (indeed) doing wrong.
4913 O mankind! We created you from a single (pair) of a male and a female, and made you into nations and tribes, that ye may know each other (not that ye may despise (each other). Verily the most honoured of you in the sight of Allah is (he who is) the most righteous of you. And Allah has full knowledge and is well acquainted (with all things).
Peace!
And if u have nothing but lack of manners, to offer repeatedly, please dont bother to have discussions with me.
Peace!
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Yes, U can have ur opinions.
My relationship with God is my own, and doesnt have to fit into ur definitions or infact anyone else's definitions of What one should believe.
I would only believe in what I can understand as truth. Yes, u and all r free to do the same.Khi- Salam. Ok no prblem but i wonder why your taking that risk and not study code-19 throughly. Why take a risk in not believing in a sign of GOD. Thats what im suggesting you to study it. Its upto you now. Btw PM are you male or female? GOD Bless!
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Forum has turned into a complete mess with shameless people who believe that the Qur'anic Laws are corrupt and do not hesitate with shamless claims Qur'anic Laws would be very much different if the revelation was in present time.
The level of intelligence of these idiots can be determined by the questions like speed of driving, computer hacking. They have no intelligence and no knowledge of the message.
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SaLaM PM and idmkhizar
And U have easily misinterpreted for ur benefit.
This is waht happens when you try to discuss with monkeys. And believe me, its a pun towards monkeys.
Ok no prblem but i wonder why your taking that risk and not study code-19 throughly.
Is studing code 19 , in any way , shape or form , neccessary towards my salvation?
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Peace be upon you,
Last but not least without code-19 the Quran cannot be proven thus your being bent on following Quranic laws is based simply on your heart's feeling rather than rationality.
Amazing logic, too bad for those before Rashad Khalifa ?
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SaLaM PM and idmkhizar
And U have easily misinterpreted for ur benefit.
This is waht happens when you try to discuss with monkeys. And believe me, its a pun towards monkeys.
Ok no prblem but i wonder why your taking that risk and not study code-19 throughly.
Is studing code 19 , in any way , shape or form , neccessary towards my salvation?
Khi- Salam. Yep or else ud be taking 9128&129 as part of the Quran resulting in believing hadith besides Quran and hence disobeying GOD's commandment in the Quran not to take hadith besides it. But you would also miss the chance of witnessing one of GOD's greatest signs and which honest person would wanna miss that. Its awesome if you witness it. GOD Bless!
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SaLaM idmkhizar
Hey i thought God was supposed to protect the Quran wink
Khi- Salam. Ok so according to you GOD should become visible and protect the Quran or how should it be? You see there are means which GOD uses to do something, mostly natural means. It is GOD who designed the mathematical system and thereby has protected the Quran. GOD Bless!
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Amazing logic, too bad for those before Rashad Khalifa ?
Khi- Salam. Here i always tell people that we dont know what was before that and so the important thing is what we have/see now. But we dont know what signs GOD may have sent to believers,if any, before RK. Then it is also possible that GOD has calculated that no one would be a real believer from 19 years after the Prophet till 1974(just another possibility). So why discuss the past. Important is whats there infront of us now in this time, not what was before that. Those are just silly excuses in order to take people away from GOD's signs of which there could well come more in the future. GOD Bless!
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ZOMGGG!!!!!!
What is this im hearing from you idmkhizar?? God cannot protect its own Quran? You didnt seem to have a problem in beleive that when i said Quran is altered and changed? wink
Khi- Salam. GOD did protect His Quran by the code-19 mathematical patterns. I wonder what you mean now. The Quran didnt change at all. People tried to change it and GOD showed through one of His messegers RK that it aint possible. He may have shown it before also, who knows, but we dont know and its not important. Whts important is what we have now. GOD Bless!
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SaLaM idmkhizar
So you are saying that the Quran is EXACTLY the same as it was revealed 1400 years ago? Nothing added... nothing taken out... nothing changed?
Khi- Salam. Yep. People did try to change it ofcourse but they failed as code-19 has shown. And now please dont ask how come then people were allowed to change it. Its simple GOD promised to preserve the Quran, yes thus this is a law. Now we all know that a law cannot be proven to exist UNLESS SOMEONE TRIES TO BREAK IT. Get me? For example if i make a law that you cannot leave a room and you stay in that room forever then nobody would ever know that such a rule existed. But if you try to get out, then my guards throw you back in, then wed know the rule exists. Same is with the promise of them Quran. The people tried to put false verses in the Quran but GOD through the mathematical code showed that this aint possible and they are thrown back out. GOD Bless!
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SaLaM idmkhizar
So you dont beleive that a goat ate a page out of the Quran? Or the shias's claim that a surah has been taken out. Or the Ahmadis claim that the Quran has been altered? You are saying that the Quran is EXACTLY the same as it was revaled 1400 years ago?
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SaLaM idmkhizar
So you dont beleive that a goat ate a page out of the Quran? Or the shias's claim that a surah has been taken out. Or the Ahmadis claim that the Quran has been altered? You are saying that the Quran is EXACTLY the same as it was revaled 1400 years ago?
Khi- Salam. I neither believe in the goat junk nor the shias neither the ahmadis claims. GOD Bless!