Is Quran anti- secular?
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ZOMGGG!!!!!!
What is this im hearing from you idmkhizar?? God cannot protect its own Quran? You didnt seem to have a problem in beleive that when i said Quran is altered and changed? wink
Khi- Salam. GOD did protect His Quran by the code-19 mathematical patterns. I wonder what you mean now. The Quran didnt change at all. People tried to change it and GOD showed through one of His messegers RK that it aint possible. He may have shown it before also, who knows, but we dont know and its not important. Whts important is what we have now. GOD Bless!
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SaLaM idmkhizar
So you are saying that the Quran is EXACTLY the same as it was revealed 1400 years ago? Nothing added... nothing taken out... nothing changed?
Khi- Salam. Yep. People did try to change it ofcourse but they failed as code-19 has shown. And now please dont ask how come then people were allowed to change it. Its simple GOD promised to preserve the Quran, yes thus this is a law. Now we all know that a law cannot be proven to exist UNLESS SOMEONE TRIES TO BREAK IT. Get me? For example if i make a law that you cannot leave a room and you stay in that room forever then nobody would ever know that such a rule existed. But if you try to get out, then my guards throw you back in, then wed know the rule exists. Same is with the promise of them Quran. The people tried to put false verses in the Quran but GOD through the mathematical code showed that this aint possible and they are thrown back out. GOD Bless!
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SaLaM idmkhizar
So you dont beleive that a goat ate a page out of the Quran? Or the shias's claim that a surah has been taken out. Or the Ahmadis claim that the Quran has been altered? You are saying that the Quran is EXACTLY the same as it was revaled 1400 years ago?
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SaLaM idmkhizar
So you dont beleive that a goat ate a page out of the Quran? Or the shias's claim that a surah has been taken out. Or the Ahmadis claim that the Quran has been altered? You are saying that the Quran is EXACTLY the same as it was revaled 1400 years ago?
Khi- Salam. I neither believe in the goat junk nor the shias neither the ahmadis claims. GOD Bless!
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SaLaM idmkhizar
Here is the link
How Authentic Is The Quran.
Refute the evidence if you can. Mquran has already embaressed himself on this thread.
Khi- Salam. The problem is mquran doesnt believe in code-19 miracle so it may well be that his arguments will fail. This only further strengthens my point. Without code-19 you cannot prove the Quran, not in this time period. We dont know what the future holds but right now code-19 is the access or as bro Bahman would say the GPS GOD cerated for us to get access to the Quran. GOD Bless!
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Salaam KGB
Forum has turned into a complete mess with shameless people who believe that the Qur'anic Laws are corrupt and do not hesitate with shamless claims Qur'anic Laws would be very much different if the revelation was in present time.
The level of intelligence of these idiots can be determined by the questions like speed of driving, computer hacking. They have no intelligence and no knowledge of the message.
Have you been bullied or are you being bullied now. Please dont keep suffering like this as there are good counsellor out there who can help you. (
Salaam jaxal
What harm have monkeys inflicted upon you that you have to be so rude them wink wink
Salaam PM
Please continue to keep your cool. D
regards
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Looks like I missed on Lotetree's confession that he is kufr. Can u enlighten us?
I never confessed to a such thing!
I don't label myself with anything.
I am just a human being. And if anyone has a problem with that and want to put a label on me then it is their problem. I won't go to the Moderators and complain and threaten to quit from this forum!But I will not label people so easily. I take all individuals as human beings. And if these humans beings want to believe that the world is flat and is supported on the back of giant turtle or that their scripture gives them a "high" conceptual adventure then I will not label them as "kufr" or "blinkered"...
So for everyones information this is a summary of my position, this was response to nehdia's thread, if any one one to look it up...
http//www.free-minds.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=4039&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0
This being the case, I no longer feel the need to bind myself to the dictates of any one scripture, or any scripture at all.
I am impressed with your insight into the connections between the worlds religions. I have myself being arguing on this forum that "transcendence" is the key to human spirituality, and the reality that many have called "God", "Allah", "Nirvana", "Tao", "Brahman-Atman" are derived from the human experience of "transcendence". All scripture is therefore is an interpretation in limited human language of a "transcendent" reality that lies beyond reason and language. This has also been the insight of the Great Seers, Sages, Prophets, Mystics and Meditators. But it has been hard to make others see this connection that you have made on your own.
I have also argued that "God" is not an OBJECTIVE fact but has always been a SUBJECTIVE experience of the individual. Even Prophet Muhammad did not rise up to highest heavens for the revelations but rather he descended to the very core of his soul in a "meditative-trance" to meet his "maker". Therefore "Revelation" is an event that happens in each individual soul and therefore every individual is capable of having an experience like the Prophets. This experience is had via meditation.
As for myself I have not progressed enough in my meditation to "confirm" any of this "trascendence" yet. But I have so far achieved a "sense" of "infinte space" and "unity" within myself in my meditation sessions. I would like to believe, however, I am on the right track and perhaps one day it may lead to enlightenement. I will just have to remain patient, courageous and dedicated and continue to cultivate and nurture compassion for my fellow human beings and for myself too.
I am glad that your spiritual transformation have helped you to deal with your sexuality and the abuse. My spiritual transformation has allowed me to connect with humanity regardless of their religious beliefs as opposed to connecting myself to a certain scripture or set of beliefs. I now celeberate the best of humanity and also come to terms with worst of humanity through understanding. But I have not reached the end yet. I am still learning, I am still continuing with my spiritual journey but I am glad that I have met another traveller on this lonely spiritual path
Regards,
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SaLaM stillearning and idmkhizar
stillearning
I guess in the world KGB lives, there is no speeding or computer hacking... what is that? Neverland? D
idmkhizar
I will be waiting for your refutation on that post. Lets continue the discussion there. Ok? )
Khi- Salam- What refutation? They dont believe in code-19, thats it, all the other arguments are useless and have been repeated over and over again. GOD Bless!
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Salaamun alaikum Khi,
Khi- Salam. So then you probably believe in 9128&129 as part of Quran which would make you a non Quran Aloner acording to me.
Dude, there's the following camps
- submitters
- yuksel's neo-submitters
- toluislam
- neo-toluislam by shabbir ahmed
- layth's camp
all claiming to be 'quranic'. I dont believe in any of thier methods. What do you think your opinion does to me ?
As long as Im in concordance with al-quraan, that's all i care about.
2ndly did you study each and every point carefully before conclusing such or just skimmed through it and then a person came up pointing out some "errors" to you and you said "thts it, its nonsese"?
In the summer of 1999, the debate went on for months. At one point, 250 mails were sent in a DAY. But at the end, the 19er Arch-priestess Aisha Musa couldn't answer the questions. That sealed the issue for me.
If the latter is the case i advise you to be more careful.Study each and every point with care. Thats all i can say. In a post "to ming lo..." i mentioned some important websites which i advise you should consider.
Thanks. I know the arguments and i've answered them , with due respect.
Last but not least without code-19 the Quran cannot be proven thus your being bent on following Quranic laws is based simply on your heart's feeling rather than rationality. GOD Bless!
Pal, GOD HIMSELF didn't postulate your reasoning. Check these 2 out
EVEN IF We had sent unto thee a written parchment, so that they could touch it with their hands, the Unbelievers would have been sure to say "This is nothing but obvious magic (6/7)
EVEN IF We opened out to them a gate from heaven, and they were to continue (all day) ascending therein,They would only say "Our eyes have been intoxicated Nay, we have been bewitched by sorcery." (15/14-15)
So God's telling us, EVEN IF he showed this, they wouldn't believe. So this is the best objective evidence he can give yet people won't believe. So please, don't set up conditions about how to believe in al-quraan when Allah already set it up for you.
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Forum has turned into a complete mess with shameless people who believe that the Qur'anic Laws are corrupt and do not hesitate with shamless claims Qur'anic Laws would be very much different if the revelation was in present time.
Brother KGB, think of it like this Is al-quraan from Allah and did it tell us without qualification to judge with it? If our answer is 'yes' sincerely (unlike most ppl on this thread), then how can it be different if al-quraan descended today? Its only because these democrats are intoxicated with modernity not knowing Allah said about following the vain desires. Sadly, there's nothing we can do except deliver the message.
The level of intelligence of these idiots can be determined by the questions like speed of driving, computer hacking. They have no intelligence and no knowledge of the message.
More importantly, they dont WANT to know it. Seeing just how many times the modernists quote the ayaat is enough for me to see thier sincerety. Al-quraan have us flexibility of how we carry out His Commands, but His Commands are constant.
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Khi- Salam. The problem is mquran doesnt believe in code-19 miracle so it may well be that his arguments will fail. This only further strengthens my point. Without code-19 you cannot prove the Quran, not in this time period. We dont know what the future holds but right now code-19 is the access or as bro Bahman would say the GPS GOD cerated for us to get access to the Quran. GOD Bless!
Khizar, you seem like a sincere chap unlike some people. You know the ayaat which is your signature. THAT'S the key to understanding the authenticity and conceptual power of al-quraan. Al-quraan is the ETERNAL PROPHECY of humankind. Humankind cannot operate outside its laws, THATS the grip of Allah. That's all I have to say to you. Peace.
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I never confessed to a such thing!
I don't label myself with anything.
I am just a human being. And if anyone has a problem with that and want to put a label on me then it is their problem. I won't go to the Moderators and complain and threaten to quit from this forum!Simple question to LoteTree (he avoided my precise syntax for a reason)
Do you believe al-quraan is God's eternal system for humankind?
Yes or no?
If answer is no, that's kufr to the Quran.