Salat 3 or 5? Proving 5
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2.zohar (noon prayer )
3018 Yea, to him be praise, in the heavens and on earth; and in the late afternoon and when the day begins to decline.I to still see 5 prayers in the Quran.
But I see "in the late afternoon" as being the Asr/afternoon prayer because noon is the beginning of the afternoon not the later part,and I see"when the day begins to decline" as the noon/Zohar prayer,because around noon the sun begins its decline. -
Peace be upon you,
Verses 1778 and 11114 show us that there only two times being given, dawn and dusk, which are the times when teh Day and night MERGE, symbolic of meditation state where the conscious and subconscious merge, which is the optimal time to program your Nafs(spirit/mind).
Also, there is a verse regarding privacy which states three times, two of which are the salat times, dawn and dusk.
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After re reading some of the pro 5 salat times Im going back to it..Until I am proven 100% that there is only 3..I thought I had convinced myself but now Im not sure..even if it is just 3 salat times and night time being optional,theres nothing wrong with contact with the God/Allah...
Peace
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Hello bro
I guess you you should remove the last one, "The part of night one" becaise the verse clearly says that this salat at this tim e is "Nafelah" i.e. not compulsory
peace
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What does approaches mean?In my translation it says
?And establish the Prayer at the two ends of the day, and at the approaches of the night. Surley,good deeds will annul evil ones. This is a remembrance for the mindful.? (Surah 11114.)
Does approaches of the day mean the same as the near part ?
To me it doesnt make since to say establish salat at sunset( from the two ends of the day) and then say and at the approaches of the night if approaches of the night is also sunset..so it must be referring to a different time period,the one that falls somewhere from noon untill sunset(after noon in other words).
So like I have in the above post
Dawn(two ends),Noon/afternoon(approaches/the near part),and Sunset(two ends) times,with the night time salat being optional... -
Peace JHamza,
I can see you're trying to figure out all of this Salat stuff. Print out the following verses (all of the verses pertaining to the salat times) or go here to compare six different translations simultaneously http//www.submission.org/quran/webqt.php
2238, 1778, 2458, 11114
Sift through them, thinking hard about the nuances of the words used and the resulting possibilities they allow for. Divide them up into the different Salat times.
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Peace JHamza,
I can see you're trying to figure out all of this Salat stuff. Print out the following verses (all of the verses pertaining to the salat times) or go here to compare six different translations simultaneously http//www.submission.org/quran/webqt.php
2238, 1778, 2458, 11114
Sift through them, thinking hard about the nuances of the words used and the resulting possibilities they allow for. Divide them up into the different Salat times.
Peace Nazz,
Thanks for the link,I'll be sure to use it alot for my studies DTo me all versions seem to imply the early part of night for 11114..
Khalifa
You shall observe the Contact Prayers (Salat) at both ends of the day, and during the night. The righteous works wipe out the evil works. This is a reminder for those who would take heed.Yusuf Ali
And establish regular prayers at the two ends of the day and at the approaches of the night For those things, that are good remove those that are evil Be that the word of remembrance to those who remember (their Lord)Pickthal
Establish worship at the two ends of the day and in some watches of the night. Lo! good deeds annul ill-deeds. This is reminder for the mindful.Shakir
And keep up prayer in the two parts of the day and in the first hours of the night; surely good deeds take away evil deeds this is a reminder to the mindful.Sher Ali
And observe Prayer at the two ends of the day, and in some hours of the night. Surely, good works drive away evil ones. This is a reminder for those who would remember."Progressive Muslims"
And you shall hold the assembly at both ends of the daylight and the near part of the night. The good deeds take away the bad. This is a reminder to those who remember.Thanks again...
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I was beginning to see THREE Salat times,but Im seeing FIVE Times for Salat again...
Surah 11
114. And perform As-Sal?t (Iq?mat-as-Sal?t), at the two ends of the day and in some hours of the night.Verily, the good deeds remove the evil deeds. That is a reminder (an advice) for the mindful(those who accept advice).3 prayers hereTwo ends of the day(sunrise/sunset) and at night..
Surah 17
78. You shall observe the Salat when the sun declines from its highest point at noon, as it moves towards sunset. You shall also observe (the recitation of) the Quran at dawn. (Reciting) the Quran at dawn is witnessed..
79. And in some parts of the night offer the Salat with it (i.e. recite the Qur'an in the prayer), as an additional prayer for you . It may be that your Lord will raise you to a Station of Praise and Glory.The Dawn salat being mentioned again along with a mid-day/ salat in 1778..and the night salat that was referred to in 11114 is mentioned again as an additional one,but in 11114 it merely states for us to observe it as with the ones at the ends of the day...
Surah 2
238.Guard strictly ?Salaw?t, especially the middle Salat. And stand before Allah with obedience.A middle salat?From the above surahs I see 4 salat times Dawn,Midday,Sunset and Night,but we all know 4 doesn't have a Middle,so it must be referring to another Salat, I believe it is referring to the afternoon Salat as mentioned in 3018.
Hence- 5 prayers-(1) Fajr 11114 & 1778; (2) Zuhr 1778; (3) The Middle Salat/Asr 2238; (4) Maghrib 11114; (5) Isha 11114 & 1779.
DAWN(Fajr)-NOON(Zuhr)-MIDDLE/AFTERNOON(Asr)-SUNSET(Maghrib)-NIGHT(Isha).
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This is exactly the problem I went through when figuring out how many salat there are. There are many different translations, and mixing them gives rise to several possibilites for the number of salat. ?
Ya gotta use a system of elimination, that works regardless of the translations used. You really need to be working with the analyses of the Arabic nuances associated with the words of these verses.
Also, 1779 does not indicate a seperate salat. It is merely suggesting extra meditation on the salat you've already carried out, or possibly just meditation in general.
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Also, 1779 does not indicate a seperate salat. It is merely suggesting extra meditation on the salat you've already carried out, or possibly just meditation in general.
Yeah it can be looked at that way I suppose,but if you compare it to 11114 which mentions a night time salat period,you could conclude then that 1779 is referring to the same period of Salat..
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Hmmm, given that all the salat times are specifically referred to using the word "salat", I think it might be drawing a long bow...
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And perform As-Sal?t (Iq?mat-as-Sal?t), at the two ends of the day and in some hours of the night . Verily, the good deeds remove the evil deeds. That is a reminder for the mindful.
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And in some parts of the night (also) offer the Sal?t with it(reciting the Quran), as an additional prayer (Tahajjud additional prayer Naw?fil) for you. It may be that your Lord will raise you to a station of praise and glory!).
Both Surahs use the word Salat and 1779 even explains that the during salat we are to offer an additional prayer along with reading the Quran...
(Note to SelfSalat means a religious act of communication between man and the God/Allah,which can be meditation,reading the Quran and Prayer.1778-79 uses both salat and Nawafil to explain that these salat times are for both praying and reciting the Quran during our Salat)
Seems to be saying at night offer the Salat as an additional prayer..Thats clear enough for me..
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G'day JHamza,
Have you read this article?
http//www.free-minds.org/articles/quranic/salat_edip.htm"You shall observe the contact prayers at both ends of the daylight, that is, during the adjacent hours of the night. . . " (11114)
Traditional translators and commentators consider the last clause "zulfan minal layl" of this verse as a seperate prayer indicating to the "night" prayer. However, we consider that clause not as an addition but as an explanation of the previous ambigious clause; it explains the temporal direction of the ends of the day. The limits of "Nahar" (daylight) is marked by two distinct points sunrise and sunset. In other words, two prayers should be observed not just after sunrise and before senset, but before sunrise and after sunset.
I especially liked the use of the comparison with the bible;
"As for me, I will call upon God; and the Lord shall save me. Evening, and morning, and at noon, will I pray, and cry aloud and he shall hear my voice." (Psalms 5516-17) (PS crying aloud apparently means praying with passion).
"Now when Daniel knew that the writing was signed, he went into his house; and his windows being open in his chamber toward Jerusalem, he kneeled upon his knees three times a day, and prayed, and gave thanks before his God, as he did afortime." (Daniel 610)
Cheers
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G'day JHamza,
Have you read this article?
http//www.free-minds.org/articles/quranic/salat_edip.htm"You shall observe the contact prayers at both ends of the daylight, that is, during the adjacent hours of the night. . . " (11114)
Traditional translators and commentators consider the last clause "zulfan minal layl" of this verse as a seperate prayer indicating to the "night" prayer. However, we consider that clause not as an addition but as an explanation of the previous ambigious clause; it explains the temporal direction of the ends of the day. The limits of "Nahar" (daylight) is marked by two distinct points sunrise and sunset. In other words, two prayers should be observed not just after sunrise and before senset, but before sunrise and after sunset.
I especially liked the use of the comparison with the bible;
"As for me, I will call upon God; and the Lord shall save me. Evening, and morning, and at noon, will I pray, and cry aloud and he shall hear my voice." (Psalms 5516-17) (PS crying aloud apparently means praying with passion).
"Now when Daniel knew that the writing was signed, he went into his house; and his windows being open in his chamber toward Jerusalem, he kneeled upon his knees three times a day, and prayed, and gave thanks before his God, as he did afortime." (Daniel 610)
Cheers
Good Morning nazz,
No I seemed to have missed that article..I will read it and get back with you..Oh BTW, that quote you give sounds very resonable,I need to read the entire article...
Yeah I recall those Biblical Verses...Thanks again for the link...
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From what I've read in two translations of 20130 we are commanded to do salaat at dawn, noon, afternoon, evening, and night. Notice that this ayat does not say the night prayer is voluntary. I recall a voluntary night meditation mentioned in the Koran though.
Does anyone here have to do salaat while at work? How does that go?