Islamic Reform movement is transforming Turkey AND cartoon
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Peace Claurianta,
While you are waiting on a reply from EY,just thought I would inject my thoughts.. D
I see nothing wrong with asking for help from living beings,but if they are dead and buried they cannot be of any help,Only Allah can interced and answer prayers..Angels are merely messengers and submitters to Allah and can only do as they are told by Allah..so bypassing Allah and going directly to angels for help would be useless imo,and an act of placing partners with him....Once we ask Allah for help,then he can use angels in his act of helping us if he so choses..And as far as saints and prophets go,If I am correct they cannot hear our prayers in the first place because they are not gods,so it would be a waist of time to ask them anything...
PeaceFor instance, they pray for the intercession of the prophet or saints
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During Muhammad's time Meccan mushriks did not worship statues as claimed by fabricated hadith. They believed in intercession of angels and holy people.
I have a question about this point. Why is it that we cannot ask help of saints or angels or holy people - and I do mean ask for help and not worship as some do? If I am hungry, I will ask my fellow man for some food, so if I am in need of some spiritual favour, why may I not ask an angel or believing jinn for help, while realizing that ultimately my getting food or anything else is in the hand of God? Why not be allowed to work together with the rest of God's creation, seen or unseen?
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Peace Claurianta,
While you are waiting on a reply from EY,just thought I would inject my thoughts..
I see nothing wrong with asking for help from living beings,but if they are dead and buried they cannot be of any help,Only Allah can interced and answer prayers..Angels are merely messengers and submitters to Allah and can only do as they are told by Allah..so bypassing Allah and going directly to angels for help would be useless imo,and an act of placing partners with him....Once we ask Allah for help,then he can use angels in his act of helping us if he so choses..And as far as saints and prophets go,If I am correct they cannot hear our prayers in the first place because they are not gods,so it would be a waist of time to ask them anything...
PeaceWell, I suppose that leaves us with the believing jinn... who do have free will as far as I understand, so would it not make sense to work together with them as opposed to just ignore or demonize them?
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Well, I suppose that leaves us with the believing jinn... who do have free will as far as I understand, so would it not make sense to work together with them as opposed to just ignore or demonize them?
Aah the jinn,sorry cant be of any help there,as I am not to educated about them yet..but I seem to think that the same ...not to have partners with Allah...would still apply here..as we are to only go before Allah for our spiritual help...I would have to see what others and the Quran have to say about working with them to be able to give a better answer..but I wouldnt trust one being that some are evil and could mislead us.
Peace
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Aah the jinn,sorry cant be of any help there,as I am not to educated about them yet..but I seem to think that the same ...not to have partners with Allah...would still apply here..as we are to only go before Allah for our spiritual help...I would have to see what others and the Quran have to say about working with them to be able to give a better answer..
Peace
Could you point me to where in the Koran it says that we should ONLY go to God for spiritual help? My personal view (which may be erronous) is that we have to realise that God is our last resort and the ultimate provider, but just like we should help and seek help from our fellow human beings, we should also help and seek help from Gods other creations. No?
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Could you point me to where in the Koran it says that we should ONLY go to God for spiritual help? My personal view (which may be erronous) is that we have to realise that God is our last resort and the ultimate provider, but just like we should help and seek help from our fellow human beings, we should also help and seek help from Gods other creations. No?
I'll have to see if I can find what you ask,I cannot recall at the time if it specifically says that word for word,but it does say not to setup partners with Allah,and this would be doing that by asking others besides Allah for help in spiritual things...
Here are 2 surahs on the jinn1850 And We said to the Angels "Submit to Adam." So they all submitted except for Satan, he was of the Jinn, so he disobeyed the order of his Lord. "Will you take him and his progeny as allies besides Me, while they are your enemy?" Miserable for the wicked is the substitute!
6112 We have permitted the enemies of every prophet, human and Jinn devils, to inspire in each other with fancy words in order to deceive. Had your Lord willed, they would not have done it. You shall disregard them and their fabrications.
Here is one surah I came across about seeking only God
1336 And those to whom We have previously given the Scripture rejoice at what has been sent down to you, but there are some of the groups that reject parts of it. Say "I am only ordered to serve God and not join any partner with Him. To Him I pray and to Him is the return."
These may be of some help also
1753 And say to My servants to speak that which is best. The devil plants animosity between them. The devil was to mankind a clear enemy.
1754 Your Lord is fully aware of you, if He wishes He will have mercy on you, or if He wishes He will punish you. And We have not sent you as a guardian over them.
1755 And your Lord is fully aware of who is in the heavens and the Earth. And We have preferred some prophets over others, and We gave David the Psalms.
1756 Say "Call on those you have claimed besides Him. For they have no power to remove harm from you or shift it."So calling on others beside Allah is useless,no one can change or alter things for us by answering prayers,even if they could hear them.Only THE GOD has such powers...
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Aah the jinn,sorry cant be of any help there,as I am not to educated about them yet..but I seem to think that the same ...not to have partners with Allah...would still apply here..as we are to only go before Allah for our spiritual help...I would have to see what others and the Quran have to say about working with them to be able to give a better answer..
Peace
Could you point me to where in the Koran it says that we should ONLY go to God for spiritual help? My personal view (which may be erronous) is that we have to realise that God is our last resort and the ultimate provider, but just like we should help and seek help from our fellow human beings, we should also help and seek help from Gods other creations. No?
Peace bro
the Quran was clear, the prophet had another role in addition to delivering the Quran, He has to explain to us what we will differ in, this is what the Quran says not me neither the sunni
peace
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Peace everyone,
Ive suggested it before im doing it again that instead of making an animated movie of "Muhammad and his life", which would perhaps only provoke the Hislamics more and bring no real benefits, we should make a 3d animated movie of how finally the supressed Quran Alone Muslims set themnselves free from the Hislamics and form their own country which i hypothetially term as "Quranistan". Bro Arnoldyasin and myself thought the name of the movie to be "The Rising" so as to attract people. I suggest it to be a 3 hr movie, dividing it into three parts. In the first part it should mention how supressed the Quran Aloners are and how they finally manage to get free. The 2nd part should involve the setup of "Quranistan" and its laws based on Quran Alone. Finally in the third part the implemenatation of those laws and how they work. That i think would be best. In this way everyone will know how secure and happy a life could be ina country ruled by people who follow the Quran Alone. GOD Bless! -
The only unforgivable sin, according the Quran is the sin of associating other powers/idols to God.
I would change it to "associating partners/idols with God".
Also, its a shame you seem to continually promote 19.org within your monotheist work. This is your decision of course, but it has and will continue to lead to a lack of wider support.
Wakas
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he Hislamics and form their own country which i hypothetially term as "Quranistan"
Interesting name. Sounds too much like Pakistan though. We had this project in our american gov't class in which we had to create our own country and government. I called mine Verusterra (land of truth). Another name i thought of was Pacisterra (land of peace).
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Good article EY, I wish I have read it before posting another thread about the cartoons. I have been reading alot about the WW1 and the Young Turks. What do you think about them? Do we need samesort of people/movement to get rid of the mullas etc etc now?
Dear bmbmm
Yes, indeed, we need a better group than Young Turks. Though he is idolized by a group and demonized by another, Ataturk was a monotheist who prepared Turkey for the message of the Quran alone.
I read a posting by your regarding discrimination in employment. Please send me a private email to [email protected] about your whereabouts. I might help you finding some contacts in your area.
Peace,
Edip -
Also, its a shame you seem to continually promote 19.org within your monotheist work. This is your decision of course, but it has and will continue to lead to a lack of wider support.
i second that .
salam.I second that too.
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The only unforgivable sin, according the Quran is the sin of associating other powers/idols to God.
I would change it to "associating partners/idols with God".
Also, its a shame you seem to continually promote 19.org within your monotheist work. This is your decision of course, but it has and will continue to lead to a lack of wider support.
Wakas
Thanks for the suggestion. As for the wider support, I think we could get a wider support if we follow the teaching of the Sunni sect. The number 19, as the fulfillment of a Quranic prophecy is a test to distinguish those who choose to progress from those who choose to regress. The appreciative monotheists never seek a wider support in exchange with hiding the truth.
Peace,
Edip -
The number 19, as the fulfillment of a Quranic prophecy is a test to distinguish those who choose to progress from those who choose to regress. The appreciative monotheists never seek a wider support in exchange with hiding the truth.
No-one is asking you to hide the truth, simply stick with promotion of 'al quran' ('the reading'), not 'al quran' + other stuff. Simple.
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Edip,
My two cents for what is worth... I think the first thing the turkish quran only muslims should do is to recognise the genocide against the armenians and ask for forgiveness and worked on a compensation. The rest will come automatically.
Regards
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"They were hugging me and taking pictures with me in the lobbies and restaurants of the Grand National Congress. They even asked me to meet their leader, the Prime Minister of Turkey, my former friend and comrade, but I rejected. I said that I only meet him if he asks to meet me, since I do not want him to perceive me one of those flatters dancing around him."
Sir, although I truly respect your beliefs and wish the best for you and your movement, your plainly obvious arrogance, heir of superiority, and fragile ego supported by casual name dropping and alleged experiences of a grand return from exile, although appealing in your mind, wins you no respect in my boat. If I am completely wrong and your experiences are sound and honest, then I apologize, but from my perspective, you could greatly benefit and aid the legitimization your movement by toning down your rhetoric.
DCS
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Interesting. To make you feel confortable should I lie about my past and present relationships and impact in Turkish society? Perhaps, you do not expect a person like me spending his time in these forums. But, if you ask to Turkish people you will find out that I am a muslim.
Forget about exeggeration, I have not told you the whole story. If there is arrogance somewhere, it might be on your side without knowing me a bit, you self-righteously accuse me of being arrogant.
Peace,
Edip
