Contradictions and inconsistencies in the quran?
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Peace zenje and savage carrot.
Savage carrot; You basically said nothing in your post.
Zenje; I am a very happy man my friend,im breaking free from the web of illusions... I see you avoided or couldnt answer the last two questions and resorted to immature attempts at humour. Your response to the question of whether people are insincere if they try but fail to get a consensus from the quran,which you answered yes they are insincere,shows the potential for idolisation of quran and inhumanity...Which im glad the rest of the forum is now aware of... And i suggest you think about what role peoples happiness(even those from outside your superior/arbitrary group.) plays in your religious interpretations/dogmas.( justified from allah,of course. .)
Peace all. -
You basically said nothing in your post.
You hurt me deeply -* -*
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peace Ab.
Peace mate
Ab your analysis from the so-called clear quran took a lot of space.
two questions here
- what space exactly?, your hard disk space? Or free-minds server space?
- What do you mean by the CLEAR quran?
You are even more unclear than the literal quran.
do you understand the literal Quran first?
I really doubt it
I will say that your analysis is also contradictory. If we can only do good or bad by allahs will,then humans have no free-will...
well, the real God is not like your man made weak god, the real God must keep an eye on the humans he created so they don?t destroy the earth, as well we have no free will regarding our existence, have you been asked before you are born to exist or not?
If you answer no, then where the hell is the free will you are talking about?
Well you lack what the real God is, the real God has forced us into existence and has forced us to take on the test, our free will is only regarding the tests
This makes judgement and punishment ridiculous..How can god punish us for what he has willed us to do?...
you don?t get it obviously, it seems your veil is very thick indeed. Allah does not force us to do things in the test, it is our free will that controls our actions, it is just a matter of allowing it or not, that is what the real God does, and if you want to kill someone and Allah does not allow it, you will still be held responsible for trying to kill someone
You people have not addressed the verses i highlighted,...which danish re-iterated?
the stratagy of clear cut enemy of Islam, I don?t fall in these trap mister, I responded to your first comment and I yet to read most of the comments in here, but I?m sure I will see a bunch of enemy of Islam ranting about contradictions and seeking discord between Muslims, , the fact of the matter is they are not seeking discord only, but seeking others to join them in hell, and my job is to try and tell the others to watch out using the literal Quran.
If your guidance-idol is so perfect please explain those verses i mentioned.
as I said mister, I don?t move to another subject until I finish the subject in hand, but as I said when I finish you off I will look at the other ignorant enemy of Islam unfounded comments
The fact is that if you take all of the quran literally and dont use your intelligence to apply it
of course I take the whole Quran literally unless specified otherwise by ant verse regarding that verse, this is as far as the intelligence required can go I don?t make assumption nor create illusions when it comes to the Quran, but I?m sure I still have a higher IQ than yours regarding the Quran
you will create contradictions in the text.
Haha, that is what the ignorant will try to say, like the free will silly argument you said earlier. Haha again, the Quran refutes you fair and square and at the same time supports what I say fair and square, the Quran told us zillions of times that
Allah does what He wants
Now for your man made god, I?m sure he does what you want, LOL, did you get it mister smart?
You made my point even clearer with your post,because you deny free-will in effect,
a clear cut lie, that is what most of my debaters do when I corner them using the Quran that they don?t understand from the first place, will did I ever denied the freewill in this life?
Now I didn?t I said Allah only allow it to happen or not, you have, all I said that Allah?s will is watching our will and ready to interfere anytime according to a divine knowledge and wisdom, you have no point mister smart and please don?t manipulate what I said
and like i said before that renders judgement day and punishment as meaningless. Thanks for that.
who you are thanking exactly, your god, me or the God of the quran?
And why to thank, were you worried or something?
In fact you rendered a load of verses contradictory..
why don?t you show us these verses and explain to us how it was rendered contradictory?
Every soul will be held in pledge for its deeds'?.
of course that is the freewill in the deeds
..Well not if they dont have free-will...
but they do have freewill regarding the deeds, can?t you see it or what?
Well I can see it in you, you used your freewill to reject the Quran, right mister smart?
If so, what is your point exactly?
The problem is mister smart that you can?t see, is this Allah will not allow you to accept the Quran unless He desires as such, LOL, that depends on how sincere you are, but so far I don?t think you are, but Allah knows better than me for sure.
Now every verse ordering us to pray,fast or do anything is null and void because we cant do it,as we have no free-will...
don?t BS me mister smart, can you post the verses and walk me through it, of course we have freewill regarding what you listed
Shouldnt allah just guide everybody if its only him that can guide?...
of course that?s what He does, the Quran told us as such, but only the ones who wants to be guided, not the hypnotised and yet arrogant ones
This makes allah unjust in your book.
well, bad luck to us, can we do anything about it?
He is a God , can?t you comprehend that?
So if He is unjust, again bad luck to us, we will just have our rectums barbecued in the hell fire, can we bloody do something about it?, I?m sure we can?t if it is the case. I will just cry and leave rebelling to you
Is god going to throw every unguided person in hell eternally,
of course, because this is what He said
even though he had/has the power to guide them?
of course,, but did they deserve to be guided?, that is the bloody question, and let me make it even harder for you, even if they deserve to be guided and He didn?t guide them, can they question Him?, of course not, because this is a God not a weak human
He told us He does what He wants, He even told us that He will put some people in the heaven for eternity unless He wants them out and same for the hell dwellers, He told us they will stay for eternity unless He wants them out, see, He does what He wants, that is something else He told us many times, and we can?t do anything about it, unless you have something in your bag ready to be used when you face that destiny?, but again I will rather cry and ask for mercy, be my guest to rebel with a God
Doesnt this also make him unjust?..
that?s how you see it while I see it quite the contrary, but even if my sighting is false and He is unjust, what can I do?, absolutely nothing, I was not asked to exist from the first place.
Which contradicts the verses about allah being just or merciful...
again, due to your veil and ignorance to what a God should be, that is what you will only see, I see God the most just. period
Im just happy that even though i do not respect the literal,unintelligent interpretations of a humans book(quran,by muhammed.) ,that i dont attribute injustice and dictatorship to god,but instead try to respect and follow the good that the god within guides me to do.
good luck with you man made god within you, LOL
now you called the Quran a human book, which is again unfounded and ignorant statement by a clear cut enemy of Allah, you retreat your utter BS or at least prove to me who is the human who write the Quran, now I need something that makes sense not you utter BS that your man made god is inspiring you
Peace all. ps;What makes you think you can slap me ab?
I can if you ask for it, LOL, I will pay for the ticket as well
Are you a tough guy over the net?
oh come on man, how I will slap you on the net?, I mean if you want me to wake you up by a couple of slaps, I will come to your country and will pay for the ticket, it is all about helping another lost human to find the true path to Allah, and I?m willing to do that if you want me too, I will take the chance and buy a few parts to my car from the UK, I always wanted to do that
You like,zenje and savage carrot
Thank you for putting me in the same category as zenje and savage, they are very nice members as far as I?m concerned
seem very immature and defensive.
now let me analyse the above
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we are immature ( well, what is your proofs mister smart?) I guess it might be that we are not following a man made god within us?, fine mister smart I?m immature
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we are defensive ( well, how come you are attacking our religion and uttering BS about the Quran and you want us not to be defensive?), man, your man made god is very funny indeed, I guess he inspired you to accuse us as such which is fine with me, I?m defensive, but if you want me offensive I can be, as long as you promise me that you will be a sport type of guy as well the admin will not ban me
..I hope you all wake up...
and follow you man made god?, BS, I?d rather go back to sleep
salam
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and follow you man made god?, BS, I?d rather go back to sleep
;D
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Peace ab. You are definately an amazingly individual...And thats not a compliment...You said nothing in your post,and ducked and dodged like your two comrades. I guess the people on the forum that are awake will see the unanswered questions and non-sense you guys have posted and make their own minds up. Like a 'wise man' said; 'some people think they have a direct link with god,but they have no link with humanity'.
I give you permission to try to come to my country and do what you will,but you take the consequences as well...Its easy to be tough on the net little man. D
Peace all...and you guys definately need some peace. ) -
It's times like these when I remember a poster called Lotetree. If you are reading Lote, you have an imposter here! He has no sense of humour either, at least you had some, however skewed it was. Come back and take your rightful place!
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Peace savage carrot and all. Yes,i like lote-tree... My sense of humour is used for appropriate situations sister. D I am afraid this is not one of them situations...yet. )
Are you implying your humour is any good? Well ill see if you can be humourus...all ive seen so far is sarcasm and pettiness...Dont they say sarcasm is the lowest form of wit? Take it easy. ) ) ) ) ) ) ) ) ) -
My sense of humour is used for appropriate situations sister. I am afraid this is not one of them situations...yet.
Pity, I have yet to see any situations in which you have used any, or maybe you have and it fell flat?
Are you implying your humour is any good?
Unlike you I don't imply or allude.
Well ill see if you can be humourus...
From what I've seen of you, I'll only be 'humourus' if I agree with you. I don't want to hold out for that pat on the head you give to those lucky few!
all ive seen so far is sarcasm and pettiness...
One sees what they want, being somewhat of a relativist I'm sure you know this better than anyone.
Dont they say sarcasm is the lowest form of wit?
Do they? Don't believe all you hear about what 'they' say. It's bad for you.
Take it easy
I always do /
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Peace bro "AB",
Ive seen you using "A God" continuously in your above post to refer to the True GOD. I advise you not to do this. He is not a God. He is GOD, THE GOD, GOD of the heavens and the earth, Creator of me, you and everythiing that exists. So use the definite artcile "the" or all caps GOD. GOD Bless! -
Peace savage carrot. Before you go to sleep tonight i hope you reflect on your behaviour and find the truth within,if you want to... I will do that too...i will also decide for mine and your and everybodies peace whether its better not to respond to some of your posts...I mean is anything being achieved by this? A reasonable answer would be nice...
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Before you go to sleep tonight i hope you reflect on your behaviour and find the truth within,if you want to... I will do that too...i will also decide for mine and your and everybodies peace whether its better not to respond to some of your posts...I mean is anything being achieved by this? A reasonable answer would be nice...
Depends on what you call reasonable...respond or don't respond to me, I don't really mind either way. What I do care about is whether there is good substantial dialogue going on about 'perceived contradictions' in the quran. I have posted my comments on how the debate should be, refuted contradictions and discussed with some people on this thread as well. It's your 'peace' of mind and how you perceive things that might bother you so pleasant dreams
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Peace ab.
Salam mate
You are definately an amazingly individual..
Oh
Thank you
.And thats not a compliment...
Oh
Screw you
You said nothing in your post,
damn, I thought my two comments took a lot of space
which space first if you don?t? mind informing me?
and ducked and dodged
LOL
Now you know well that I?m a professional boxer, but you forgot to mention my punches
like your two comrades.
In my corner?
I guess the people on the forum that are awake will see the unanswered questions and non-sense you guys have posted and make their own minds up.
I guess that is the crowd watching the boxing match?
Well, can you please tell me the odds so far?
Wow man, you have created a whole boxing scene, now we need a nock out
Like a 'wise man' said; 'some people think they have a direct link with god,
and who is that wise man?, is it a random man? But can you prove that he is wise or he is also randomly wise?
I guess until you answer the above questions, it won?t be wise to follow that non existent wise man
but they have no link with humanity'.
again, we need proofs of that but first you need to tell us who is this wise man?
Is it you?
I give you permission to try to come to my country and do what you will,
now that was funny LOL, you gave me permission to come to your country, so you have connections in your country?, is Q Charles one of your connections?, and please don?t ask me what Q Charles means, I?m sure you know well
ok, I will tell them in the embassy that enquirer gave me permission to visit him, I hope this will make getting the visa much easier.
but you take the consequences as well...
of course, this is what I?m saying in my two comments, there is an action and a consequence and sure Allah is testing you using me and is testing me using you, LOL, therefore everyone of us will carry the consequences of their actions, remember we will be held hostages according to our actions, or did you forget that quick?, oh, sorry it seems I?m the one who forgot the veil on your eyes.
Its easy to be tough on the net little man.
strange, I found it much easier to be tough for real
Peace all...and you guys definately need some peace.
Salam, yes we need the peace in our sleep, please don?t wake us up with your repetitive rants and atheistic concepts that only leads to a secure corner in the hell fire and that is not going to be peaceful at all
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Peace bro "AB",
Ive seen you using "A God" continuously in your above post to refer to the True GOD. I advise you not to do this. He is not a God. He is GOD, THE GOD, GOD of the heavens and the earth, Creator of me, you and everythiing that exists. So use the definite artcile "the" or all caps GOD. GOD Bless!Thanks for your advice mate
but i was talking to an enemy of Allah and was using his language that is based on a man made god or a non existance of A GOD and when i use it in the context I never means the true God "Allah"
so please stop picking on these small things as Allah knows what i meant exactly
Salam
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Peace mate ;D ,
Thanks for your advice mate
but i was talking to an enemy of Allah and was using his language that is based on a man made god or a non existance of A GOD and when i use it in the context I never means the true God "Allah"
so please stop picking on these small things as Allah knows what i meant exactly
Salam
JK- Sorry for the misunderstanding. Actually these thoughts came into my mind "maybe bro AB means it in another way...hmmmmmm..concept of GOD very crucial and important hence must be clarified... Im sure he cannot be doing this deliberately..must be a language problem...(after my post was done).. oh maybe he wanted to show the false concept of a god from enquirers perpsective...damn post already done...maybe this is not true...so leave post for now and await reply...then apologize if necessary). Sorry bro. GOD Bless!
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Zenje; I am a very happy man my friend
Good for you! You keep saying it but... -\I see you avoided or couldnt answer the last two questions and resorted to immature attempts at humour.
Which ones?... If my god loves people or something?... you actually thought that warranted an answer? please. )
Your response to the question of whether people are insincere if they try but fail to get a consensus from the quran,which you answered yes they are insincere,shows the potential for idolisation of quran and inhumanity...
Are these new words that you learnt?... you use them like their new and totally out of context. Can you use the word 'inhumane ' in a sentence children?Which im glad the rest of the forum is now aware of... And i suggest you think about what role peoples happiness(even those from outside your superior/arbitrary group.) plays in your religious interpretations/dogmas.( justified from allah,of course. .)
There you go with your judgements again, man you have ego and a half... and that's not an attept at humor, since you have to look out for it and it seems to give you some trouble finding it.It's funny you mentioned that though, I was thinking the same thing just yesterday. I'm really glad these numerous posts from you and some others are bringing out the true colors in you. I have never pretended to be anything else. You on the other hand, started out with a nice and, dare I say it, tolerant position... but now?... Dr. Jekyll is gone for good, your hatred for quran and all those who follow it is blooming quite nicely. Why the pretense in the beginning, I wonder? Ah well, keep going my friend, maybe you'll reveal some more. I love it! ;D
Peace to those who follow the guidance.
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Peace brothers and sisters,
Look at these posts enquirer used to write at the beginning.
this is my first post after a year of reading at this site. i applaud the efforts of the people on this site and thier positive contribution to understanding our obligations.
Ah.. humble beginnings. '(I have been reading the dialogue on free-minds for about a year now. I too struggled with the understanding of salat,masjid al-haram,hajj etc. But after extensive patient research these topics are now much,much clearer. I feel very satisfied that several forum members have similiar conclusions even though we are from diverse backgrounds.
What a nice guy!Peace ahmedbaghat. I agree there are many acceptable and unacceptable behaviours in the quran. A basic principle is that the prohibited is what is not beneficial/healthy for mankind and the permitted is what is beneficial/healthy for mankind. (quran;7157).
What's this?.. enquirer agreeing with AB?!...about prohibitions?!...in quran?!Peace ahmedbaghat and idol-free. your understanding of the angels speech ,ahmedbaghat is one i agree with.
We need a fainting emoticon.I think the heading 'contradictions and inconsistencies' is perfect! ;D Maybe 'Exposed', would have been more fitting.
Good Night and Good Luck
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Peace
Hope this helps... I'm copying out the explanation from my trusty Qur'an (translated and explained by Muhammed Asad) Regarding 478 and 479...
There is no contradiction between this statement and the preceding statement that "all is from God". In the world view of the Qur'an, God is the ultimte source of all happening consequently, all good that comes to man and all evil that befalls him flows, in the last resort from God's will. However, not everything that man regards as evil fortune is really, in it's final effect, evil, - for it may well be that you hate a thing the while it is good for you, and it may well be that you love a thing while it is bad for you and God knows, whereas you do not know. (2216) Thus many an apparent evil may sometimes be no more than a trial and a God Willed means of spiritual growth through suffering, and need not necessarily be the result of a wrong choice or wrong deed on the part of the person thus afflicted. Itis therefore obvious that the evil, or evil fortune of which this verse speaks has a restricted connotation, in as much as it refers to evil in the moral sense of the word that is to say, to suffering resulting from the actions or the behaviour of the person concerned, and this in accordance with the natural law of cause and affect which God has decreed for all his creation, and which the Qur'an describes as the way of God (sunnat Allah) For all such suffering, man has only himself to blame, since "God does not wrong anyone by as much as an atom's weight" (440)
Hope that helps
Peace -
Peace 99percentcow (?)
Welcome to the forum. )Thanks )