The holy valley of Tawa
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You wear slippers so you don't damage your feet and to keep them as clean as possible.
LOL bro
can you please tell me how you can prove that we wear sandals to protect our feet, a verse form the Quran should be enough, thank you
When you take off the sandals, you do this when you enter a place where the ground must be kept clean and free from outside dirt.
well, we can p[erform salat while we are wearing sandals, so I donlt get your point exactly
Here Moses was asked to take off his sandals in the valley. So he's not entering a clean place where the outside dirt must be kept away.
LOL, thanks again bro for the laugh, so all the msajid are dirtytyt because we take oiff our shoes when we enter it, a new insight that is
God doesn't care about dirt as He is above that, all the cleanness codes inside the Quran are for us, not because "God likes cleanness", all has a reason. So here then comes the question If we take it literaly, why then has Moses to take off his sandals, where his feet were gonna be as dirty as his sandals? Not out of respect, as the respect of taking off your shoes is connected with that you respect the cleaness of a house/residence, so this taking off the sandals cannot be connected with respect.
bro iot will be silly of me to get involove into this, you take it as you want and I will take it as I explained
So for me, the only thing left is that taking off the sandals is used metaphorically, and refers to that he arrived at the end of his journey, and can enter the house of prophethood.
hehe, I will warn you using the Quran
"La Taddirbo Lellah Al Amathal"
which means, do not associate metaphores to Allah that He never said himeself
As for the valley AB mentiones, in the old days there were also more then ten mountain sinai. So refering to names given by people is not that trustworthy.
oh yeh I',m conspiring with the egyptian government to promote tourism to egypt
Oh yeah, AB welcome back...............
cheers, glad to be back
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Peace all
This idea that it is all a spiritual journey, adds a beautiful meaning to the message. I think it is in accordance with the quran. But I think the other words in the aya make this theory problematic.
How would you metaphorically understand a holy valley (el-wad el-mukkadas)?
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You wear slippers so you don't damage your feet and to keep them as clean as possible.
LOL bro
can you please tell me how you can prove that we wear sandals to protect our feet, a verse form the Quran should be enough, thank you
This is pure logic. Tell me then, why do you wear shoes?
When you take off the sandals, you do this when you enter a place where the ground must be kept clean and free from outside dirt.
well, we can perform salat while we are wearing sandals, so I donlt get your point exactly
What has this to do with salaat? This talks about any place. This is the house-rule almost everywhere on earth.
Here Moses was asked to take off his sandals in the valley. So he's not entering a clean place where the outside dirt must be kept away.
LOL, thanks again bro for the laugh, so all the msajid are dirtytyt because we take oiff our shoes when we enter it, a new insight that is
? I see you don't get the point. Why the need to take off sandals? People only take off shoes/sandals because they want to keep outside-dirt outside the place. Where is the need for that in an outside valley?
God doesn't care about dirt as He is above that, all the cleanness codes inside the Quran are for us, not because "God likes cleanness", all has a reason. So here then comes the question If we take it literaly, why then has Moses to take off his sandals, where his feet were gonna be as dirty as his sandals? Not out of respect, as the respect of taking off your shoes is connected with that you respect the cleaness of a house/residence, so this taking off the sandals cannot be connected with respect.
bro iot will be silly of me to get involove into this, you take it as you want and I will take it as I explained.
This is normal definition, things have a clear reason and taking off shoes/sandals have clear non-mysterious reasons.
So for me, the only thing left is that taking off the sandals is used metaphorically, and refers to that he arrived at the end of his journey, and can enter the house of prophethood.
hehe, I will warn you using the Quran
"La Taddirbo Lellah Al Amathal"
which means, do not associate metaphores to Allah that He never said himeself
Ok, then explain why did he take of his sandals in a valley? Where is the need for that?
As for the valley AB mentiones, in the old days there were also more then ten mountain sinai. So refering to names given by people is not that trustworthy.
oh yeh I',m conspiring with the egyptian government to promote tourism to egypt
No AB, this is normal and can be seen allover the world. Egypt just took over the valley-name from the old people. If the old peoples didn't name the valley themselves Tuwa is something to be disproven. There used to be more ten different Mount Sinai. One survived because of The Isrealy people were the only ones that had historical bond to the name. Their Mount Sinai is close to Jerusalem, while in the Bible story they were supposed to be still far away from Jerusalem. Same as calling the Dome of the Rock Al-aqsa. This has nothing with conspiring but with that the later people take the old name serious and don't question if the old people really meant that it was the real mount or valley...
Peace
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This is pure logic. Tell me then, why do you wear shoes?
I wear shoes because I learnt to wear shoes since I was born, now you tell me why many humans don?t wear shoes at all?
What has this to do with salaat? This talks about any place. This is the house-rule almost everywhere on earth.
Is the act of taking off the shoe as Moses were ordered when he entered the valley of Towa sounds like humans taking off their shoes when they enter the Masajid?
Sounds the same to me, I take it a matter of respect, how do you take it?
? I see you don't get the point. Why the need to take off sandals? People only take off shoes/sandals because they want to keep outside-dirt outside the place. Where is the need for that in an outside valley?
the valley is muqaddas and therefore it sounds to me as a matter of respect exactly like entering the masajid
This is normal definition, things have a clear reason and taking off shoes/sandals have clear non-mysterious reasons.
Well, a child will get it that it is a matter of respect
Ok, then explain why did he take of his sandals in a valley? Where is the need for that?
You dodged the strong argument against the likes of you who invent similitudes and associate then to Allah, again, have some sense please and fear the warning from Allah directed to you and the likes of you
74- Invent not similitudes for Allah for Allah knoweth, and ye know not.
75- Allah sets forth the Parable (of two men one) a slave under the dominion of another; He has no power of any sort; and (the other) a man on whom We have bestowed goodly favours from Ourselves, and he spends thereof (freely), privately and publicly are the two equal? (By no means praise be to Allah. But most of them understand not.
76- Allah sets forth (another) Parable of two men one of them dumb, with no power of any sort; a wearisome burden is he to his master; whichever way be directs him, he brings no good is such a man equal with one who commands Justice, and is on a Straight Way?
(74)
(75)
(76)-> Now do you have enough common sense to understand 1674-76 or you need a hand?
No AB, this is normal and can be seen allover the world. Egypt just took over the valley-name from the old people. If the old peoples didn't name the valley themselves Tuwa is something to be disproven. There used to be more ten different Mount Sinai. One survived because of The Isrealy people were the only ones that had historical bond to the name. Their Mount Sinai is close to Jerusalem, while in the Bible story they were supposed to be still far away from Jerusalem. Same as calling the Dome of the Rock Al-aqsa. This has nothing with conspiring but with that the later people take the old name serious and don't question if the old people really meant that it was the real mount or valley...
PeaceDamn bro, I don?t talk politics
Cheers
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Peace,
This is directly what i mean. You don't understand that taking of the shoes in a masjid has to do wth not taking dirt into the masjid or a house. The 'showing respect' is showing respect for not wanting to dirty up the floor where people put there fore-heads on the floor, so the respect is linked with hygene. Everything has a direct reason. And i advise you to investigate more what are the psychological reasons for terms as 'respect' and 'holy'. That a kids takes it as respect is because a kid doesn't look further then it's nose and doesn't think where the feeling of respect comes from. You tell me Why is taking of your shoes/sandals out of respect? And when is respect given and what is it's source and function? There are bases behind the term respect. And there as much people wearing sandals/shoes as not wearing shoes/sandals which a lot of times is also connected with social wealth.
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Peace,
This is directly what i mean. You don't understand that taking of the shoes in a masjid has to do wth not taking dirt into the masjid or a house. The 'showing respect' is showing respect for not wanting to dirty up the floor where people put there fore-heads on the floor, so the respect is linked with hygene. Everything has a direct reason. And i advise you to investigate more what are the psychological reasons for terms as 'respect' and 'holy'. That a kids takes it as respect is because a kid doesn't look further then it's nose and doesn't think where the feeling of respect comes from. You tell me Why is taking of your shoes/sandals out of respect? And when is respect given and what is it's source and function? There are bases behind the term respect. And there as much people wearing sandals/shoes as not wearing shoes/sandals which a lot of times is also connected with social wealth.
bro don't assume things and associate them to me as you do with the metaphores that you associate to Allah and He never said that it is a metaphore as as well warned you agaisnts such ignorant act , i never denied what you say regarding the dirty shoe, all I said it is a matter of respect to take the shoe in a mosque as well on the valley of Towa, but let me corner you then, how the hell you know the the foot is clean if you say the shoes must not be clean?, i need a scientific answer please
cheers
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Peace,
On what is this respect based? What are the reasons behind this respect? The respect people show by taking off shoes is based on respecting not to take outside dirt into the residence. Why would God demand a respect based on hygene? I believe all will agree that you take of your shoes so you don't take outside dirt into the house. Taking off your shoes/sandals refers to having reached your destination.
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Peace,
On what is this respect based? What are the reasons behind this respect? The respect people show by taking off shoes is based on respecting not to take outside dirt into the residence. Why would God demand a respect based on hygene? I believe all will agree that you take of your shoes so you don't take outside dirt into the house. Taking off your shoes/sandals refers to having reached your destination.
bro, before i go to bed, remember this, it is you who is not happy with what Allah said to Moses then you made up a metaphore and associated it to Allah while He never suggested that, how blind you are man, anyway bro this is called kufr
good night
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Peace,
Not happy? No, i'm trying to understand it. This is called gaining knowledge. Answer my questions then. Sleep well...
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Peace,
Not happy? No, i'm trying to understand it. This is called gaining knowledge. Answer my questions then. Sleep well...
fine, gain the knoweldge you want but in the process don't associate lias to Allah, Allah described those who associate metaohores to Him while He never said so, as liars and I'm certain this applies to you. i understand that you don't do it delibertly rather ignorantly
cheers
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Peace,
You have your right on your opinion. And i can see you ignore certain factors. Sleep well...
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Peace
The idea of taking off shoes out of a sign of respect is cultural. For example, here in the U.S. nobody takes off their shoes when they enter someone's house. The home owners don't even take off their shoes. In fact, when I ask someone to please take off their shoes before proceeding to enter my home, they look at me funny. So I think you're taking this coming from the culture you were raised in. When God commands Moses to take off his sandals, I believe it is directly linked with the word holy in the same aya. And dirt by the way is not bad. If we don't have water to wash ourselves we can use dirt for ablution.
Also, if we are to take the translation idolfree1 gave us for the word tuwa as wrapped within, perhaps it is symbolic to take off something. We wear clothes and shoes as a sort of crutch. To cover ourselves, to appear taller, shorter, thinner, fatter, muscular. Perhaps it has the connotation of "Come as you are". Moses felt inadequate in speech and seemed to have low self-esteem. He even told his Creator , "NO i can't do it! i need my brother he can speak better!" Perhaps it was a way to show you are accepted with any imperfection you may have. His hand turned white without any imperfection also ties into that explanation - that God will perfect him if any imperfections should arise. Again this is just my opinion. Most likely it has more of a link with the word holy than anything else.
I still didn't get an explanation to my question by the way. If it was just a spiritual journey why mention a valley?
Peace all -
A valley is between to high points, and is hidden between those points, but i also still need to understand more. And also 'holy' is determined by the viewer. For a christian, a statue of jesus is holy, for a Muslim it is not. So holy is also determined by the view point.
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Peace bro arnold
I like the connotation of the valley you mentioned. It shows alot of symbolism. My question to you then is why can't God with all His infinite wisdom, create stories with layer upon layer of meaning? Could it be that the holy valley is both physical and at the same time symbolic, while also being allegorical to parallel his spiritual journey? I tend to believe that things mentioned in the quran have more than one explanation. For the simple person, it will convey a message and for a deep introspector, it would have a deeper meaning but still along the same lines.
As for the term holy, I agree with you. What is holy to one may not be holy to another. But given that neither a Christian nor a Muslim said that line, and that it was God that stated it, I believe the valley is objectively holy. Whether we believe in it or not it will remian holy.
Peace all -
Peace,
Yes, i have the same view on the Quran, that it has multiple layers and that verses can mean multiple things. As for the 'holy' in this verse. I believe it was called holy because of what was gonna happen there, so for that moment it was holy for the whole humanity.
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Peace
As for the 'holy' in this verse. I believe it was called holy because of what was gonna happen there, so for that moment it was holy for the whole humanity.
I agree. Good explanation
Peace -
Salaams all,
Using quranic dictionary by Omar
Naala = a metaphorical expression for making the heart vacant from care for family and property. The shoes signify the relations with family and the community.
And remember he ran away after taking a life, so essentially two things where keeping him away from his people
2012
Verily I am your Lord make yourself detached from responsibility and from compensation due for life the sacred both. -
Peace Simple
I never heard of this definition. The dictionary i used only shows that it means sandal or a leather sole. the root form of the word is nun ayn lam if that helps
Peace all -
Peace,
You have your right on your opinion. And i can see you ignore certain factors. Sleep well...
Salam
I'm glad that my opinion is nothing but the literal meaning of the Quran, at least on the JD when I'm questioned about my ego, i will have a strong argument and as you know Allah is 100% Just, my argument is simply Allah didn't say it is a metaphore like He has done with many other metaphores He mentioned in the Quran, as well Allah has warned me of the followings
- To say about Allah things that He never said about Himself (4035)
- To associate metaphores to Allah that He never mentioned Himself (1674)
see how strong my defence will be
on the other hand, I can see you on the JD red faced and very embarassed indeed
therefore you need to respond to at least 1674 before i listen to your non sense regarding the lies you say about Allah
cheers