A book about guidance from the All..........?
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Peace be upon you all,
However one cannot simply compile a book that resembles the quran in style and ideas and thereby denote it as coming from God.
We are told to trust that which was desended upon us and those before us. What do we say of books written before this "quran"? Are they from the God?
There is a weakness in mankind that keeps many of us looking to the past for all "God Like" activities. What is wrong with those of us in the present or future that the God will change Its way an no longer do what It did before?
(4034) And Joseph had come to you from before with the evidences, so you are still continuing in doubt/suspicion from what he came to you with it, until when he perished/died, you said 'God will never/not send from after him a messenger.' as/like that God misguides whom He is (a) waster/extravagator , doubtful/suspicious.
The God will ALWAYS deliver its message, no single book can contain it.
The Book called "Al Quran" is a fantastic guide, one of the best, but not the only means of guidance, rather book or other concept.
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Peace Idolfree1
We are told to trust that which was desended upon us and those before us. What do we say of books written before this "quran"? Are they from the God?
I never stated that the quran was the only book ever sent to man from God. We are told in the quran that there have been other messengers sending the message. I simply meant that writing a book and stating that it is from God is not acceptable. Every messenger knew he was a messenger from God. Every messenger was given support by God to ensure himself that he is not crazy and that indeed this is a message from his Creator to the people. So if I write a book today and it doesn't contradict the quran, it is at best a good book i wrote not a message God is giving to the society I'm living in.
The Book called "Al Quran" is a fantastic guide, one of the best, but not the only means of guidance, rather book or other concept.
I think the question was not whether there are other forms of guidance other than the quran but rather whether another book created to seem like the quran can be considered also a message from God. Dr. Phil's books and shows give decent guidance. He's never claimed he is God's messenger or that God gave him the message to mankind. There is a difference.
Peace -
DanishFirstly, in my understanding, no book in the history of mankind has ever come directly from GOD in its absolute form and shape. All 'spiritual' books are man's own reflections and perceptions of reality/nature and events taken place
His opinion, must be respected.
And certainly, there's not an iota of doubt that man or men of intelligence and wisdom can write a much better spiritual book than any historical one such as the Quran we have today.
Good exaggeration. Not one iota of doubt? And in the VERY FIRST try, Danish brings about - quite literally - a load of dung. God's sign ? I think so...
One can collect, compile, revamp and collate all gathered relevant information pertaining to OUR generation inclusive of current rightful laws, current truthful stories to reflect upon and current scientific evaluations, all put together in a book form for future generations to comprehend our current ways, means and stories of lives which would become their history. There are two major advantage that we have today, in order to compile such a book that would exercise no inconsistencies, contradictions, repetitions and overall presentation 1) computers and software, ; 2) verification of records (events/circumstances) to summarize its orientation naturally and realistically. One major drawback for future generation to understand our current spiritual book then, would be the same as we are experiencing with Quran today.
Al-quraan challenges you to do it (17/8 so what are you waiting for? Don't send us another load of dung, please.
Keeping in mind, that one doesn't need over 6000+ verses to bring about abundance of unnecessary repetitions (and that too in incomplete manner), which would entirely eliminate inconsistencies and contradictions to begin with and reducing worthless pages. The events, stories and laws must be kept coherent and not wither and thither from one chapter or a section thereof to another in a mish-mash fashion. The subject matter of laws and by-laws must reflect events/circumstances as examples within its own content and context; not that an event is written in a section of one chapter and the laws/by-laws deriving from that very event written somewhere else in another section of another chapter of no concern. I?m believe, great writers and thinkers of today can certainly encompass and accomplish this vision (perhaps they already have or on their way, who knows) in much less of a time today than 23+ years yesterday.
Of course it's not possible that it's because of YOUR limitations AQ seems a mish-mash to you, right? Come on, you've only made a HUNDRED AND EIGHTY DEGREE turn since the time you believed (and by the way, advocated pork based on popular consumption!).
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S2SDanish, you're coming from a standpoint that has denied the many ayat that specifically state that this book was not made up by any man. And since the book doesn't conform to your definition of a well-written novel, you've decided it can't be from God. I sense an air of arrogance...
Exactly right. Danish is intoxicated by the great titles he encounters. His favourite phrase 'both islamic and western scholars' is something he's very sensitive about (he absolutely refuses scrunity of the phrase). This is his unquestionable authority, his god and anything which fails this criteria isn't worthy. Having said all this, that's his choice and his right.
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If a few people got together and wrote a book on guidance e.t.c. could be in a poetic lingo or not, could/would the book be considered from God.
If I wrote a book about relativity, pretty good math and thought experiments and all, would that book be considered from Einstein?
Peace,
Mohamed~ -
Br. mquran said
Al-quraan challenges you to do it (17/8 so what are you waiting for? Don't send us another load of dung, please.
of course no one can produce the Al-quraan /The call/ proclamation/ conveyance/ recital/ reading , i mean its like elvis in action or einsteins producing - simerlarly our blessed prophet in this case , this was something coming to him naturaly.
Don't you think it just means that other people cannot produce books or copy them and they can never produce the likeness of it just as no one can be elvis or einstein - so "NO ONE CAN HAVE THE RECITAL OF THE PROPHET - THE (NATURAL) FLOW"
Somethings are natural to some AND others can produce but never the likeness - its a gift -God gives some people.
to have it flow in a poetic way and so many examples after examples and naturally too.
God Bless.
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of course no one can produce the Al-quraan /The call/ proclamation/ conveyance/ recital/ reading , i mean its like elvis in action or einsteins producing - simerlarly our blessed prophet in this case , this was something coming to him naturaly.
Don't you think it just means that other people cannot produce books or copy them and they can never produce the likeness of it just as no one can be elvis or einstein - so "NO ONE CAN HAVE THE RECITAL OF THE PROPHET - THE (NATURAL) FLOW"
Somethings are natural to some AND others can produce but never the likeness - its a gift -God gives some people.
to have it flow in a poetic way and so many examples after examples and naturally too.Al-quraan talks about itself in itself. It calls itself 'guidance to humankind', 'a clarification of everything' etc etc. So when it says you cannot produce a like thereof, it's not talking about the Prophet flowing or singing. Indeed, it never talks about the 'first descent' anyway. That's between the Prophet and God, totally irrelevant to us.
The challenge is for someone to produce a discourse which talks about the human being, the ultimacies of the human being like AQ does. This is something philosophers do and no, I haven't seen anything come close to AQ in the matter. When a human writes a book about humanity, you can tell the difference. But of course, its only my opinion...
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of course no one can produce the Al-quraan /The call/ proclamation/ conveyance/ recital/ reading , i mean its like elvis in action or einsteins producing - simerlarly our blessed prophet in this case , this was something coming to him naturaly.
Don't you think it just means that other people cannot produce books or copy them and they can never produce the likeness of it just as no one can be elvis or einstein - so "NO ONE CAN HAVE THE RECITAL OF THE PROPHET - THE (NATURAL) FLOW"
Somethings are natural to some AND others can produce but never the likeness - its a gift -God gives some people.
to have it flow in a poetic way and so many examples after examples and naturally too.Al-quraan talks about itself in itself. It calls itself 'guidance to humankind', 'a clarification of everything' etc etc. So when it says you cannot produce a like thereof, it's not talking about the Prophet flowing or singing. Indeed, it never talks about the 'first descent' anyway. That's between the Prophet and God, totally irrelevant to us.
The challenge is for someone to produce a discourse which talks about the human being, the ultimacies of the human being like AQ does. This is something philosophers do and no, I haven't seen anything come close to AQ in the matter. When a human writes a book about humanity, you can tell the difference. But of course, its only my opinion...
of course i meant the material/discourse of the recital (but not the physical book - i think)
As Allah is the producer of the recital - i think ,it simply was recited by the nabi , he wasn't making it up or anything as these copy cats are trying to do that is make something similer.
The melody or the poetry and the material was composed - i think by Allah.
Again when we selct the best i think it is with Allah's help as the ayah said So another book can be written but depends on how much or in what way Allah will take it.
even , to me, a telephone book or a dictionary are with guidance from the all-mighty.
All knowledge is guidance from Allah.
Salaams.
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Peace bro Mohamed,
I posted on another thread, but welcome back, it's been a long time and it's good to see you posting!
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Peace simple and all. Im on holiday at the moment. I will respond to your post when im free.....If im banned in the meantimes by mods/admins,then contact me on my e-mail......Any body else who wants to discuss or contact me,feel free to do so.....
Happy truth hunting......... bravo handshake muscle -
Peace
Why would you be banned? Difference of opinion is accepted here, no worries enq.The whole karma thing is just for fun