Translation of `Jinn`
-
Peace Ahmed,
I understand. The words are not a part of the person, so you can laugh at the words as long as they are "rubbish according to Ahmed". Do you laugh at your children when they speak incorrectly? How about when they draw you a picture for a special occasion - do you laugh at the drawings? Drawings are not a part of the person, right? How about when someone cooks you a meal that you don't like, do you laugh at the meal?
I'll remember this the next time someone comes to me seeking heartfelt advice. I'll laugh at them, and tell them not worry, it's the words I'm laughing at, not them.
A loophole indeed.
Peace,
Tay -
2130 Do the unbelievers not realize that the heaven and the earth used to be one solid mass that we exploded into existence? And from water we made all living things. Would they believe?
Awa lam yara allatheena kafaroo anna alssamawati waal-arda kanata ratqan fafataqnahuma wajaAAalna mina alma-i kulla shay-in hayyin afala yu/minoona
If you believe that "jinn" are living things then 2130 means they must be made of water. This is a bald fact. An inescapable reality.
Very good point !
Therefore a "jinn" is not a separate type of mythical being. It is merely an aspect of us.
Compare to...
2957 Every "nafs" will taste death, then to us you will be ultimately returned.
Kullu nafsin tha-iqatu almawti thumma ilayna turjaAAoona
Going with the false logic of the mythical jinn believers then this verse would prove that there is yet another type of 'being' called a "nafs".
The truth as we know in that case is that a "nafs" is within us. So is the "jinn".
Regards.
IMHO, the word jinn is used to describe a fiery (arrogant, proud...) mindset.
Iblis symbolically personalises this mindset.
And the word jinn is also used to refer to a class of human beings known to be proud/arrogant in a chiefdom system the chiefs/nobles.
Cf http//www.free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=4435.0Peace
-
Peace Ahmed,
Peace bro
I understand. The words are not a part of the person,
Good so why you suggested that laughing will be at the person not at the words that is not part of him?
Bro this is a professional job called Stand up Comedian, so why feel insulted?
I don?t know, does the people laugh at the stand up comedian or they laugh at what he/she says?, well if they laugh does the stand up comedian feels insulted?, I?d say no, because they were not laughing at him rather at what he said
so you can laugh at the words as long as they are "rubbish according to Ahmed".
Load of rubbish is an Australian term, however regardless of that when you face others with the truth the sequence may be as follow
- they feel hurt (the truth hurts as you know)
- then they can?t handle that truth
- they start arguing further and waste more time on loads of rubbish
Do you laugh at your children when they speak incorrectly?
Of course but my children are mature and don?t feel insulted
How about when they draw you a picture for a special occasion - do you laugh at the drawings?
If it is laughable I have to laugh, I?m not a hypocrite nor double faced, if my children work is s*** I will tell them that and if it is laughable I have to laugh and possibly they will laugh with me
Drawings are not a part of the person, right?
That?s right, and it can be really funny or stupid drawing, you know they are kids
How about when someone cooks you a meal that you don't like, do you laugh at the meal?
That is not funny to laugh but I will clearly tell them that the food is s***, in fact my son Nany is from Thailand, and their food really stinks man and I will always tell her that no way I will eat that s***, LOL, I think they use something called fish oil which I reckon the s*** smells better
I'll remember this the next time someone comes to me seeking heartfelt advice. I'll laugh at them, and tell them not worry, it's the words I'm laughing at, not them.
Cool, I?m glad I taught you somethin
A loophole indeed.
Peace,
TayFine, I?m professional in finding loopholes
Cheers
-
2130 Do the unbelievers not realize that the heaven and the earth used to be one solid mass that we exploded into existence? And from water we made all living things. Would they believe?
Awa lam yara allatheena kafaroo anna alssamawati waal-arda kanata ratqan fafataqnahuma wajaAAalna mina alma-i kulla shay-in hayyin afala yu/minoona
If you believe that "jinn" are living things then 2130 means they must be made of water. This is a bald fact. An inescapable reality.
Very good point !
Peace bro
why it is good I wonder?
under that flawed point then the Quran has a contradiction because the Quran said humans were created from soil, now the above says everything alive is created from water
please resolve the contradiction Oben has hatched with his flawed point
Salam
-
2130 Do the unbelievers not realize that the heaven and the earth used to be one solid mass that we exploded into existence? And from water we made all living things. Would they believe?
Awa lam yara allatheena kafaroo anna alssamawati waal-arda kanata ratqan fafataqnahuma wajaAAalna mina alma-i kulla shay-in hayyin afala yu/minoona
If you believe that "jinn" are living things then 2130 means they must be made of water. This is a bald fact. An inescapable reality.
Very good point !
Actually its a pretty moot point and a contradiction to bring about verse 2130 and cover it upon all other relevant verses pertaining to jinns that clearly mention these entities as "living creatures"
Jinns are created and worshipped as idols (6100).
Jinns and humans inspire fancy words to deceit each other (6112)
Jinns are companions to humans and claim multitudes of them (612
Jinns and humans both receive messengers and revelations and both bear witness (6130)
Jinns and humans are both communities and mislead each other (738, 4125, 4129, 461
Jinns and humans are committed to hell and both have GOD given senses (7179)
Jinns and humans are created and both of them judged (11119)
Jinns and humans are both challenged to produce a Quran like this (178
Jinns and humans were both soldiers and worked for Solomon (2717, 3412)
Jinns and humans predetermined to fill hell (3213)
Jinns realizing unforseen death (3414)
Jinns know that they are subservient (3715
Jinns listening to Quran (1629, 721)
Jinns and humans are both created to serve GOD (5156)
Jinns and humans cannot deny the marvels of nature in which they were created (5513)
Jinns and humans called for account (5531)
Jinns and humans challenged to penetrate outer limits without permission (5533)
Jinns and humans not questioned for their sins (5539)
Jinns and humans beautiful mates untouched (5556, 5570, 5574)
Jinns and humans thought of uttering lies about GOD (725)
Humans seeking power/support from jinns (726)
Seeking refuge from the evils of jinns and humans (1146)Jinns created from fire (1527, 5515)
Humans created from clay/mud (1526 and several others)
Iblis was a jinn (1850)
Adam was a human (359, 1761)By analyzing the above verses, I believe the jinns are species of mankind; living beings of fiery, tempestuous and volatile behaviour, often seen "hidden/unseen" under normal circumstances unless provoked or confronted and they live within their own voluptuous realm. Some verses above are contradictory and inconsistent with other verses within the Quran such as 5539.
-
under that flawed point then the Quran has a contradiction because the Quran said humans were created from soil, now the above says everything alive is created from water
please resolve the contradiction Oben has hatched with his flawed point
OMG! a contradiction in the quran!!!!!!!!!!!!
-
Hello All
I decided to bring on all the verses in the Quran that have the words ?Jinn?, ?Al Jinn? or ?Jan? or ?Jinnah?, therefore will be able to see if those who promote that loads of non sense about the Jinn as leaders of ordinary humans is really sensible
In them will be (Maidens), chaste, restraining their glances, whom no man or Jinn before them has touched;-
(56)
-> Why in 5556 Allah differentiated it between the Ins and Jinn regarding the Hour Ein? I mean do those leaders keep their leader status in paradise and those ordinary men stay as such in paradise?
Well I guess the promoters of this non sense need to click here Please click here mister smart
To be continued?..
-
under that flawed point then the Quran has a contradiction because the Quran said humans were created from soil, now the above says everything alive is created from water
please resolve the contradiction Oben has hatched with his flawed point
OMG! a contradiction in the quran!!!!!!!!!!!!
LOL
i didn't say there is bro, nice try, it's Oben flawed understanding that he is pushing that is constituting a clear cut contradiction that he needs to resolve
I guess he will come and say Haha you mix the soil with water but fire can't be mixed with water but let's see what he has to say
Cheers
-
14- He created man from sounding clay like unto pottery,
15- And He created the jinn of a flame of fire.(14)
(15)Now can anuyone of this non sense advocates prove to me that Saddam Hussain was created from a flame of fire and me was created from sounding clay like unto pottery?
I don?t really know how they are going to verify that they have to do it according to their 1736 flawed understanding, but at least me and Saddam are available for any scientific testings
I guess the promoters of this non sense need to continue to click here Please click here mister smart
To be continued?..
-
Well, what can I say, let?s look at this funny one
And throw down thy staff! But when he saw it writhing as it were a Jaan, he turned to flee headlong; (but it was said unto him) O Moses! Fear not! the emissaries fear not in My presence,
(10)
Now we have a serious problem, it seems when Moses threw his staff, it started to move like a Human leader yeah
Oh yeh great sense, "What The ....."
Please keep clicking here mister smart
To be continued?..
-
under that flawed point then the Quran has a contradiction because the Quran said humans were created from soil, now the above says everything alive is created from water
please resolve the contradiction Oben has hatched with his flawed point
OMG! a contradiction in the quran!!!!!!!!!!!!
O please don't be startled. There's plentiful at stake for people to snap at.yuck
-
Now it?s getting serious for those Muslims
12- And to Solomon (We made) the Wind (obedient) Its early morning (stride) was a month's (journey), and its evening (stride) was a month's (journey); and We made a Font of molten brass to flow for him; and there were Jinns that worked in front of him, by the leave of his Lord, and if any of them turned aside from our command, We made him taste of the Penalty of the Blazing Fire.
13- They worked for him as he desired, (making) arches, images, basons as large as reservoirs, and (cooking) cauldrons fixed (in their places) "Work ye, sons of David, with thanks! but few of My servants are grateful!"
14- Then, when We decreed (Solomon's) death, nothing showed them his death except a little worm of the earth, which kept (slowly) gnawing away at his staff so when he fell down, the Jinns saw plainly that if they had known the unseen, they would not have tarried in the humiliating Penalty (of their Task).
(12)
(13)
(14)-> So Allah has forced the human leaders ?The Jinns? to work for another human leader ?Solomon?, I suppose to be another Jinn ?wasn?t he a human leader??
-> Now this is funny why the humans leaders are professional in (making) arches, images, basons as large as reservoirs, and (cooking) cauldrons fixed (in their places), I thought most of them sits on their backs doing nothing but ripping off their people?
-> Finally, why Allah flags the human leaders that they can?t know the unseen? , the Jinns saw plainly that if they had known the unseen, they would not have tarried in the humiliating Penalty (of their Task)., yet I wonder why Allah was humiliating the human leaders for the sake of another human leader
-> I will get the rest of the story and we will all wonder why ?The Queen of Sheba?, was not humiliated as well along with the other human leaders?, in fact she was respected and honoured when she arrived to Solomon palace
It is about time to click here mister smart
To be continued?..
-
Here is another problem for them
39- Said an 'Ifrit, of the Jinns "I will bring it to thee before thou rise from thy council indeed I have full strength for the purpose, and may be trusted."
40- Said one who had knowledge of the Book "I will bring it to thee within the twinkling of an eye!" Then when (Solomon) saw it placed firmly before him, he said "This is by the Grace of my Lord!- to test me whether I am grateful or ungrateful! and if any is grateful, truly his gratitude is (a gain) for his own soul; but if any is ungrateful, truly my Lord is Free of all Needs, Supreme in Honour !"
(39)
(40)-> We read in 2739 ?Ifrit of the Jinns?, now the advocates of new illogical understanding need to explain to us what is ?Ifrit of the Jinn?? is it a title of the Human Leaders?, if they somehow mange to solve that, then they will be cornered with this one, why that Ifrit of the human leaders can bring the Queen of Sheba throne in a matter of seconds from miles away? ? Said an 'Ifrit, of the Jinns "I will bring it to thee before thou rise from thy council indeed I have full strength for the purpose, and may be trusted.?
-> And just to make it harder for those advocates, let me ask them this question whom verse 2740 is talking about?, is it another Ifrit of the human leader who will bring the throne in shorter time than the first Ifrit of the human leaders? If No, then whom is it? and regardless if No or Yes how that entity will being the throne ion shorter time than the first Ifrit of the Jinns ? Said one who had knowledge of the Book "I will bring it to thee within the twinkling of an eye!", , don?t ever dare anyone and say this is a metaphor, because the throne was brought for real ?Then when (Solomon) saw it placed firmly before him, , he said "This is by the Grace of my Lord!- to test me whether I am grateful or ungrateful! and if any is grateful, truly his gratitude is (a gain) for his own soul; but if any is ungrateful, truly my Lord is Free of all Needs, Supreme in Honour !?
If you are sick of clicking here, then Click here mister smart
To be continued?..
-
2130 Do the unbelievers not realize that the heaven and the earth used to be one solid mass that we exploded into existence? And from water we made all living things. Would they believe?
Awa lam yara allatheena kafaroo anna alssamawati waal-arda kanata ratqan fafataqnahuma wajaAAalna mina alma-i kulla shay-in hayyin afala yu/minoona
If you believe that "jinn" are living things then 2130 means they must be made of water. This is a bald fact. An inescapable reality.
Very good point !
Peace,
Despite the exchanges above, I wanted to raise this to drive home the point that "jinn" are not mysterious invisible mythical beings.
1527 does not give license to create a new kind of unseen type of being.
The fact that ALL (kulli shay) LIVING (hay) things are made of water does not contradict our being made from clay - because it does not say ONLY from clay.
The point is that all things that LIVE and are MADE are from water - or contain water as part of their makeup.
The real contradictions are when people themselves CREATE a new type of being they call a "jinn" despite the fact that the reading mentions many instances of INTERACTION between these alleged separate creatures and those who believe in these invisible mythical "jinn" cannot demonstrate any such INTERACTION given their viewpoint.
The truth can only be that human and jinn are within the one and the same thing - and that in some cases the 'jinn' describes a hidden inner quality of humans and in others it describes a quality of humans as we don't perceive easily (foreign people, distinguished people etc).
2130 leaves no room for a new mythical invisible being type. If it lives and is made (note that God "lives" but is not made) then it must be from water. A fact which is fully supported by science.
Regards.
-
peace ahmed
Actually it's only JM that's advocating the 'human leaders' argument ( to my knowledge ) most others believe jinns to be allegorical for the hidden/dark side of man.
Are our primal urges innate or result of the choices we make?
I believe in the choices we make. I believe in accountability. And I choose not to blame that on a hidden/evil side.
-
Peace Oben,
But let's leave these analogies and examine our common reference point for evidence. I believe the following verse puts to rest any doubt and in one stroke demolishes all the past belief that there are mythical beings that traditionalist imaginations have created.
2130 Do the unbelievers not realize that the heaven and the earth used to be one solid mass that we exploded into existence? And from water we made all living things. Would they believe?
Awa lam yara allatheena kafaroo anna alssamawati waal-arda kanata ratqan fafataqnahuma wajaAAalna mina alma-i kulla shay-in hayyin afala yu/minoona
If you believe that "jinn" are living things then 2130 means they must be made of water. This is a bald fact. An inescapable reality.
Therefore a "jinn" is not a separate type of mythical being. It is merely an aspect of us.
Thank you for your excellent observation. This is such an eye opener.
I had noticed that there is no mention in the great reading of "jinn" going to heaven while they are mentioned as going to hell. I have discussed this in the following article
http//www.free-minds.org/articles/history/ayman2.htm
Your amazing observation reminded me of another passage 7216. It seems from the passage that the heaven of "jinn"/fantasies is that they would be given water. As you noted, water is connected to life. So perhaps the good "jinn"/fantasies would become living beings.
I would be very much interested in your thoughts about the above article.
Peace,
Ayman
-
peace ahmed
Peace bro
Actually it's only JM that's advocating the 'human leaders' argument ( to my knowledge ) most others believe jinns to be allegorical for the hidden/dark side of man.
well, it can be directed to the others as well, it is directed to those non sense advocates
Are our primal urges innate or result of the choices we make?
I don't really care about the poll
I believe in the choices we make. I believe in accountability. And I choose not to blame that on a hidden/evil side.
Nice try, you can't blame it on the Jinn, the Quran told you that, or you donlt know that?
-
peace Ahmed,
by posting all those verses above you have proven that your literal understandings don't make any sense.
well at least show the others some resepect and explain to them why?
but hey, who said the Jinn as I understand it, is the lieteral understanding?, haha, thanks for the laugh
it is you and the likes of you who are trying hard to make it literal by saying it means the hidden
please look in the mirror before you accuse others wrongly
Saddam IS NOT made of smokeless fire.
Prove it
-
Peace Oben, All,
As jm and Ayman expressed, excellent point in 2130. Further, you stated
The fact that ALL (kulli shay) LIVING (hay) things are made of water does not contradict our being made from clay - because it does not say ONLY from clay.
Just an observation clay/soil are understood to contain water/moisture.
Peace,
Tay