You Have Been Warned
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Peace
Bro Ahmed, Sis Samia,
You both have good points and weak points. Generally you are both right.
Ahmed, good deeds wipe out bad deeds...
and Hell will also be freezing cold...
Take care
Noble
PS Let us not exagerate in our Deen like sunnists/shi'st/hadithists and christian priesthoods, Allah made the Deen easyPeace Noble
Can you please show me a verse where it says good deeds wipe bad deeds please?
btw we are not exagerateing our deen, we are trying to understand it using the Quran, so if anything I said that does not exist in the Quran, I apologose to all
salam
Salam
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Salam Ahmed
Apologies accepted
It is in Quran, I think around an ayat that talks about Salat. I will find it eventually. Look for the keyword yamhuha.
Btw look also for the surah Almuzzamil or Almuddathir, where you can see that the Prophet prayed more than the other Sahaba, even if some of them followed his lead, but Allah told them that they did not have to, so this is proof that in some cases the Prophet was asked to do more than the other muslims...
Take care Bro
PS My way of remembering the Quran is quite peculiar as I read it thousands of times, but never managed to learn it by heart, however I learnt a few surahs by heart such as Almulk, and Arrahman, and many small surahs... But usually when I remember that something was mentioned I am rarely wrong that it was mentioned, only the context and interpretation can be faulty...
PPS I suffer from a mental disorder that makes it for me hard to learn by heart at the moment -
Salam Ahmed
Apologies accepted )Peace bro
Cheers
It is in Quran, I think around an ayat that talks about Salat. I will find it eventually. Look for the keyword yamhuha.
I will be interested to see it bro, if it exists as you said, i will concede.
Btw look also for the surah Almuzzamil or Almuddathir, where you can see that the Prophet prayed more than the other Sahaba, even if some of them followed his lead, but Allah told them that they did not have to, so this is proof that in some cases the Prophet was asked to do more than the other muslims...
Please bro bring the verses that you think means the above so we discuss it here, take your time though, no rush
I say that most of the verses talking in singualr "Mukhatab" "Speech to someone" has to be taken by the believers as a message for them, otherwise the whole concept will fall in many locations, this Quran is actually for mankind NOT to the prophet explicitly, while it was delivered by him and that is a great honor on its own, as well while it was talking about the prophet a lot, the whole thing is directed to us, we can't be the judge and say this is suppose to be for the prophet and this is for us, if you will classify the prophet as a BELIEVER then all the orders to him "unless explicit to his personal affairs" must be taken by all other believers as being orders to them as well, even the things that were explicit to the prophet, the lessons in it must be taken by all other believers
Therefore I don't think Allah tells the prophet explicitly to humble himself in fear of Him, and for us to humble ourselves period., it makes no sense bro, in fact if we talk sense then the prophets are the least to FEAR Allah, because they are His chosen elite of the best of all humans and paradise for them is sort of gurranteed, they sure knew that as we know it now, in fact they even communicated with Allah.
PS My way of remembering the Quran is quite peculiar as I read it thousands of times, but never managed to learn it by heart, however I learnt a few surahs by heart such as Almulk, and Arrahman, and many small surahs... But usually when I remember that something was mentioned I am rarely wrong that it was mentioned, only the context and interpretation can be faulty...
PPS I suffer from a mental disorder that makes it for me hard to learn by heart at the moment (I actually memorise about 4 small suras only, however i read the whole Quran in Arabic about 30 times or about, many of these times were very slow indeed cross referencing, looking for info, trying to understand and even trying to find a contradiction, and this enabled me to remind many WORDS from it by heart, so when i need to find a verse i have to remember ONE WORD from that verse, and i type this in an arabic search engine and wola all verses appear, sometime i get hundreds of verses as a result of fewer letter in the word I'm searching for and this is great because it allows me to go through it all and pick the ones that are relevent and while doing so I keep adding to the words I memorise by heart, it feels great bro, that is why I have the stamina because I enjoy it
Take care
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Peace Bro Ahmed
I am very stubborn man, so I stand by what I said.
In the Quran Allah also said that the ones who fear Him the most are the Ulamahs (or ones endowed with knowledge), so there is a gradation... (yakhsha Allah min ibadihy alulamah)
Cheers Bro
PS I am glad you enjoy the process of tafaquh fi addeen, it is a sign of iman... -
Peace AB,
Peace Noble
Can you please show me a verse where it says good deeds wipe bad deeds please?
I think noble meant this verse... but I could be wrong.
- And you shall hold the salat at both ends of the daylight, and the near part of the night. The good deeds take away the bad. This is a reminder to those who remember.
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Peace AB,
Peace Noble
Can you please show me a verse where it says good deeds wipe bad deeds please?
I think noble meant this verse... but I could be wrong.
- And you shall hold the salat at both ends of the daylight, and the near part of the night. The good deeds take away the bad. This is a reminder to those who remember.
Thanks bro
I'm glad you are not stuborn
While 11.114 can be understood as such by some basing it that the Hasanat mentioned is general, I see it that only Salat will do that because that was the consequence of the order given to pray at the two ends of the night and part of the night, i really can't take it that good deeds will overwrite small bad deeds, for me 11.114 means ONLY SALAT will do that
Cheers Zenje
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Peace Bro Ahmed
I am very stubborn man, so I stand by what I said.
In the Quran Allah also said that the ones who fear Him the most are the Ulamahs (or ones endowed with knowledge), so there is a gradation... (yakhsha Allah min ibadihy alulamah)
Cheers Bro
PS I am glad you enjoy the process of tafaquh fi addeen, it is a sign of iman...Thank bro
can you please tell me what knowldge exactly the verse you mentioned is talking about?
Cheers
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Peace Bro Ahmed
It must be knowledge embedded within Deen as sanctioned by Allah...
SalamCheers bro
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Peace
I have now to reflect more on this, as you have entered a doubt in my mind, my beloved brotherI hope I don't lead you to hell though bro, however if I do, remember you can only blame yourself and not balme me
cheers
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Peace Bro
I trust in Allah's Mercy, as far as I do not indulge in idolatry, and I have repented from that, and hopefully stay like that until I die.
OK here it is I hope Salat is a good deed too, even if compulsory, and extra salat is definitely a good deed. A good deed is a good deed (as explained in the Quran). A bad deed is a bad deed (as explained in the Quran).
So my understanding is that the good deed of Salat wipes out bad deeds.
You are allowed to comment on this (just kidding) ... ;D
PS Of course there are restrictions, as specified about Kabair, Qassas, etc... -
Peace Bro
I trust in Allah's Mercy, as far as I do not indulge in idolatry, and I have repented from that, and hopefully stay like that until I die.
OK here it is I hope Salat is a good deed too, even if compulsory, and extra salat is definitely a good deed. A good deed is a good deed (as explained in the Quran). A bad deed is a bad deed (as explained in the Quran).
So my understanding is that the good deed of Salat wipes out bad deeds.
You are allowed to comment on this (just kidding) ... ;D
PS Of course there are restrictions, as specified about Kabair, Qissas, etc...Peace bro
Let me explain why I just can?t accept it logically that doing good deeds will overwrite some bad deeds, I also don't consider Salat a good deed because it is compulsory, the concept of trading good deeds with bad deeds sounds too human to me, I can accept that Allah will forgive the bad deeds as stated below
And (as to) those who do evil deeds, then repent after that and believe, your Lord after that is most surely Forgiving, Merciful.
(153)
-> See ? ?, ? And (as to) those who do evil deeds then repent after that and believe?, they must repent and BELIEVE for the bad deeds to be forgiven. It has nothing to do with good deeds. It makes no sense bro. in fact understanding it the trade way gives a virtual license to do bad deeds that can be dodged with many good deeds.
The above is said differently as follow
And He it is Who accepts repentance from His servants and pardons the evil deeds and He knows what you do;
(25)
-> Again, ? And He it is Who accepts repentance from His servants and pardons the evil deeds?, great sense, why Allah accept repentance?, not because I?m good with you, rather because I care about my Salat to Him, otherwise I have to be held accountable to my bad deeds and pay my dues because I don?t deserve His Afu, because I cared less about Salat that relates ONLY to Him, how He can forgive me if I cared less about Him doing my Salat and totally took Him out of the picture thinking that my good deeds are enough to secure this forgiveness that I will be in desperate need from Him alone?, it does not add up bro
The confusion here bro that the word ? ? does not have to mean ?Bad Deeds? only, IT WILL ONLY MEAN as such if we have verb to do before it, like in 7153 mentioned above, therefore if we don?t have verb to do in front of it, it can mean 2 things, ?doing bad deeds? or ?Misfortune caused by Allah?, let?s look at the following verse
And if We cause him to taste grace after some misfortune that had befallen him, he saith The ills have gone from me. Lo! he is exultant, boastful;
(10)
-> See bro ? The ills have gone from me?, see how it was said in Arabic ? ?, almost the same words as ? ? in 11114, this is a very strong argument against you bro, now we have the same words used to imply that ?the misfortune will go? sure by Allah, so in 11114 if we pray to Allah at the two ends of the night and part of the night which is Hasnaat, then He may remove the Sayaat on us, i.e. He won?t test us with more misfortune, this understanding can be seen in the following verse indeed
And We cut them up on the earth into parties, (some) of them being righteous and (others) of them falling short of that, and We tried them with blessings and misfortunes that they might turn.
(16
-> Now I have another very strong argument against you bro, we read that Allah is ? We tried them with blessings and misfortunes?, and in Arabic ? ?, the same two words appeared in 11114, ? ?, so why not praying at the two ends of the night and part of it will earn those blessings from Allah that He will cause less misfortune to them in life?, I?m talking 11114 in here
See why I can?t take it that good deeds ?other than Salat, I don?t consider Salat good deed anyway? has nothing to do with bad deeds, only the blessings of Allah is the only factor in not holding us accountable to our bad deeds, and for us to deserve that blessings we need to pray the two ends of the night and part of it as stated in 11114
Time to go to work
Take care
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Peace Bro Ahmed
There are good deeds the human way, and Good Deeds fully and only to please Allah.
With Salat, extra Salats are Good Deeds.
If you are worshiping Allah you are doing a Good Deed to yourself, by following what you were created for.
Again we have a semantics problem between us...
Ultimately we want the same thing, Imanu BiLLah wa ijtinabi attaghut...
Look around you, people and animals need threats and motivation to do things.
Plus we do have to compensate against our bad deeds if we have hurt or wronged someone, and that means literally compensating or erasing a bad deed with a good one...
Maybe you do not feel comfortable with the idea of trade, but Allah says that the best trade for the Believer is the trade with Allah, through Good Deeds and following the Deen...
Salam
Noble -
Peace Bro Ahmed
There are good deeds the human way, and Good Deeds fully and only to please Allah.
With Salat, extra Salats are Good Deeds.
If you are worshiping Allah you are doing a Good Deed to yourself, by following what you were created for.
Again we have a semantics problem between us...
Ultimately we want the same thing, Imanu BiLLah wa ijtinabi attaghut...
Look around you, people and animals need threats and motivation to do things.
Plus we do have to compensate against our bad deeds if we have hurt or wronged someone, and that means literally compensating or erasing a bad deed with a good one...
Maybe you do not feel comfortable with the idea of trade, but Allah says that the best trade for the Believer is the trade with Allah, through Good Deeds and following the Deen...
Salam
NobleExactly you trade WITH Allah "not with other people" while you are a BELIEVER, now to be really successful in that trade and claim your loses back you need to show Allah that you worship Him sincerely then you will be entitled to Afu and forgivenss of the bad deeds
for example imagine the following two
- a believer who did 10 good deeds and 10 bad deeds
- a non beleiver who did the exact same 10 good deeds and 10 bad deed
I'm talking deeds to others in here NOT to the self
according to your understanding both should not be punished, and this is a huge conflict indeed
Cheers
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Dear Brother Ahmed
Why do you put in my mouth what I never uttered?
From the start I only refer to Muslims/Believers.
As for the unbelievers, they reap their material rewards in this life, and are denied paradise in the hereafter...
Bro be careful as you jump to conclusion too fast. I know (usually) what I am talking about, despite my many flaws and imperfections.
Again I repeat I was referring to those who believed....
Salam
Noble -
Peace Bro Ahmed
Your examples cannot work, people don't record their good deeds and bad deeds like on a spreadsheet.
As for a believer, he is not supposed to do any bad deed anyway.
But if he does, and Allah has not punished him yet, he has the chance to avert the punishment by repenting and doing good.
Salam
Noble -
Dear Brother Ahmed
Why do you put in my mouth what I never uttered?
From the start I only refer to Muslims/Believers.
As for the unbelievers, they reap their material rewards in this life, and are denied paradise in the hereafter...
Bro be careful as you jump to conclusion too fast. I know (usually) what I am talking about, despite my many flaws and imperfections.
Again I repeat I was referring to those who believed....
Salam
NoblePeace bro
did i put anything into yout mouth?, as far as I believe i didn't i said "According to your understanding " i never said you said such and such, you said good deeds will compensate bad deeds, now I said according to your understanding both should not be punished,
so now you confirmed that only believers desrve forgivenss right?, ok then we are talking that those who believe will be entitled to forgivness, i.e the good deeds has nothing to do with forgiving the bad deeds
Salam
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Salam Bro Ahmed
Still misunderstandings.
The non believers are not entitled any forgiveness, period.
Good deeds / bad deeds
As a believer you only get forgiven if you repent. If you do a good deed, you get rewarded, if you do a bad deed you get punished.
Good deeds bring you closer to Allah, bad deeds move you away from Allah.
Good deeds do not have to be material, a du'a can be a good deed, for instance istighfar make you avoid punishment.
I stand by what I said, Good deeds for the believer are his armour that protect him from punishment, however mindfullness and fear of Allah is greater...
What does Allah need from our punishment if it were not for our prayers (Quran)
Salam