The Maldives and its Judiciary
-
Salam Munzir,
It is an encouraging approach, but my personal view is that if the law written out in the constitution is not dedicated to God alone then it is no different fron any other place/system - might as well just copy the US constitution since it has been tested and proven.
On th God alone movement in the Maldeves, the reason I ask is because I noticed lots of trafic to FM comes from there (for example, last month it was ranked # 9 with nearly 22,000 hits) - if there is an underground silent movement, which I believe is confirmed by the warning Bilal Philips gave, then such a groups should be targetting through print/media.
Would we be able to run an ad in local newspaper or magazine advertising FM?
-
Would we be able to run an ad in local newspaper or magazine advertising FM?
It would be dangerious. We could get arrested.
-
You need to study politics first, don?t favors free minds but you can advertise against free mind to attract attention. !
I don't need to study politics to understand the constitution.
-
Salam Munzir,
On th God alone movement in the Maldeves, the reason I ask is because I noticed lots of trafic to FM comes from there (for example, last month it was ranked # 9 with nearly 22,000 hits) - if there is an underground silent movement, which I believe is confirmed by the warning Bilal Philips gave, then such a groups should be targetting through print/media.
Would we be able to run an ad in local newspaper or magazine advertising FM?
I would say that 22000 hits is quite catchy. So we should start the movement out in the open just as a local sunna promoting Association by the name of SALAFI have started by bringing scholars such as Bilal Philips to lecture the public. However, I would say that this would be a difficult task since freedom of rights granted by the constitution states that the constitution guarantees fundamental rights and freedom to all persons, in a manner that is not contrary to any tenet of Islam. Now we are faced with the dilemma of tackling the actual issue we are addressing. How Islam should be defined, whether we have to base our belief on the Quran alone or whether we have to incorporate additional hadith/sunna etc. When the constitution talks about rights being granted if they are not contrary to any tenet of Islam and promotes sectarian beliefs as pointed out earlier by you, the path we have to tread would definitely be rough and tough.
I suggest Free-Minds members to give their opinions on how we should plan to move ahead in our effort to introduce the God Alone movement in the Maldives on a large scale since Maldives is a 100% Muslim country so far to my knowledge. I am prepared to take the lead over here. We need your support and help to counter the growing extremism over here as stated by the Human Rights Commissioner of the Maldives, parts of his press release given below for members atention
Quote/
"I don't think we can afford conflicts of opinion on religion in a small community like ours, or get into a situation such as in big countries like Pakistan or Afghanistan," he said, adding the HRCM was bringing the matter to public attention because it was a human rights issue as well."Among these issues, not sending girls to school is a very serious problem," he continued. "We are not just saying these things. We are saying this with proof and evidence. Not giving vaccinations to children is also a reality. Also, forcing girls to marry at a young age, this too is a reality. We have evidence of this."
At the press conference, Sheikh Ahmed Abdul Kareem, a member of the commission, said the rise of extremism was causing ?strife and social division?.
Kareem attributed the upsurge in extremism on the islands to an increase in the number of religious sermons by certain licensed preachers and religious scholars. Referring to Sheikh Ibrahim Fareed, he said the Islamic ministry believed the preacher had a ?dangerous? mentality.
?They believe that the former government was right to take action against him. He is still giving religious lectures on various islands. He does not accept anything the ministry says,? said Kareem.
He added the ministry had not taken any action against independent prayer groups such as the one that congregated at Dharumavanthu mosque on Fridays.
Although the mosque was authorised to hold Friday prayers, said Kareem, the independent prayer group would take the imam?s microphone from him.
But, speaking to Minivan News earlier this week, Sheikh Shaheem Ali Saeed, state minster of Islamic affairs, said the ministry had drafted a set of regulations to combat extremism in the country.
Shaheem said the regulations will come under the Religious Unity Act and will be enforced after about a month after consultation with the president.
The regulations will empower police to break up independent prayer groups.
The state minister said he had recently returned from a SAARC seminar on extremism. ?We are working an an international level as well as the national level to get rid of extremism, radicalism and terrorism,? he said.
He added the ministry had sought advice from professionals in counter-terrorism and there was international consensus now that military confrontations did not solve the problem.
?Look at what happened at Himandhoo. The former government went and attacked them and it did not solve anything,? he said, stressing that the ministry's policy was advising, counselling and disseminating accurate information about Islam.
In 2007, locals armed with home-made weapons clashed with police in riot gear searching for two suspects in the Sultan Park bombing. The same year footage shot in an illegal mosque on the island was found posted on an al-Qaeda website.
Shaheem said the ministry?s new approach involved talking to those with extremist religious views peacefully and resolving disputes through debate and negotiation. He added the strategy had already yielded results.
?Right now, apart from only four people, everyone else on Himandhoo prays at the island mosque,? he said. ?We want the Maldivian people to hate terrorism.?
But, said Kareem today, despite the ministry counselling and advising extremists, there have not been any signs of improvement. /Unquote
-
salam Munzir,
I would say that 22000 hits is quite catchy. So we should start the movement out in the open just as a local sunna promoting Association by the name of SALAFI have started by bringing scholars such as Bilal Philips to lecture the public. However, I would say that this would be a difficult task since freedom of rights granted by the constitution states that the constitution guarantees fundamental rights and freedom to all persons, in a manner that is not contrary to any tenet of Islam. Now we are faced with the dilemma of tackling the actual issue we are addressing. How Islam should be defined, whether we have to base our belief on the Quran alone or whether we have to incorporate additional hadith/sunna etc. When the constitution talks about rights being granted if they are not contrary to any tenet of Islam and promotes sectarian beliefs as pointed out earlier by you, the path we have to tread would definitely be rough and tough.
I suggest Free-Minds members to give their opinions on how we should plan to move ahead in our effort to introduce the God Alone movement in the Maldives on a large scale since Maldives is a 100% Muslim country so far to my knowledge. I am prepared to take the lead over here. We need your support and help to counter the growing extremism over here as stated by the Human Rights Commissioner of the Maldives, parts of his press release given below for members atention
You pose an interesting point that, as you pointed out, ends up with the question of the constitution and the contradiction it holds.
I do not know where to begin with this, but my gut feel is that it be confined to an underground movement at the start until it picks up such momentum that it can be made public.
-
So if a Christian or Jew wished to move there, they wouldn't be allowed to stay?
Yeah of course. But you won't get citizenship.
-
So if a Christian or Jew wished to move there, they wouldn't be allowed to stay?
Hi Rev, I see that my son is an ardent fan of yours, he speaks a lot about you and once saw him quite disappointed saying that you were not very happy with the forum.
You would be allowed to stay but you cannot practise any religion openly other than sunni Islam. Besides, as MUNZIR ALI said, to be a citizen you have to be a Muslim and even if the person is born from Maldivian parents, once you leave Islam you are no longer considered a Maldivian as per the constitution.
-
salam Munzir,
You pose an interesting point that, as you pointed out, ends up with the question of the constitution and the contradiction it holds.
I do not know where to begin with this, but my gut feel is that it be confined to an underground movement at the start until it picks up such momentum that it can be made public.
No matter what the constitition says we should start a movement. I have been speaking to my friends for very long. Some agree, some are scared, some say that 'sunna' is the legal ways of the prophet - and I hardly understand whether the prophet issued any legal injunctions on his own. Others say without sunna/hadith we wouldn't know the manasiks given to followers of Muhammad. It is the same set of questions we see everywhere. How do you do salat, zakat etc.
But I am sure that this movement is on the rise here in the Maldives. We have to make the site publicly known. I have been recommending the site to my friends for a long time now but all this is done in a secret manner. I do not know whether they follow the site or not but now that you've mentioned the hit count it's obvious that there is a large number visiting. Please let me know if the count increases so that we will know when to come out into the open.
Actually, I landed in free-minds once I started probing the Submission.org site.
-
once you leave Islam you are no longer considered a Maldivian as per the constitution.
The constitution sucks big time. brickwall
-
Hi Rev, I see that my son is an ardent fan of yours, he speaks a lot about you and once saw him quite disappointed saying that you were not very happy with the forum.
You would be allowed to stay but you cannot practise any religion openly other than sunni Islam. Besides, as MUNZIR ALI said, to be a citizen you have to be a Muslim and even if the person is born from Maldivian parents, once you leave Islam you are no longer considered a Maldivian as per the constitution.
Thank you for that. You have a very intelligent son.
So even a citizen can lose his citizenship? Interesting.
-
You have a very intelligent son.
Thanks ;D
-
Peace
Be warned that you might be stepping on thin ice and any movement can be harmful as you will be the minority. Things do not change over night and may take a long time. I am just recalling from memory the Egyptian Quranist that have been arrested for simular reasons. But God willing you may warn the people in the best possible way of their contradictions to the Quran's teachings.
Also consider this, if the government feel Free-Minds a problem to their states interest then it could be banned in that country.Peace
Hope
-
Peace
Also consider this, if the government feel Free-Minds a problem to their states interest then it could be banned in that country.
Peace
Hope
Good point!
-
So even a citizen can lose his citizenship? Interesting.
Yeah the consitution states as follows
-
(a) The following persons are citizens of the Maldives
-
citizens of the Maldives at the commencement of this Constitution;
-
children born to a citizen of the Maldives; and
-
foreigners who, in accordance with the law, become citizens of the Maldives.
(b) No citizen of the Maldives may be deprived of citizenship.
(c) Any person who wishes to relinquish his citizenship may do so in accordance with law.
(d) Despite the provisions of article (a) a non-Muslim may not become a citizen of the Maldives. -
(a) The religion of the State of the Maldives is Islam. Islam shall be the one of the basis of all the laws of the Maldives
(b) No law contrary to any tenet of Islam shall be enacted in the Maldives
-
-
Yeah the consitution states as follows
-
(a) The following persons are citizens of the Maldives
-
citizens of the Maldives at the commencement of this Constitution;
-
children born to a citizen of the Maldives; and
-
foreigners who, in accordance with the law, become citizens of the Maldives.
(b) No citizen of the Maldives may be deprived of citizenship.
(c) Any person who wishes to relinquish his citizenship may do so in accordance with law.
(d) Despite the provisions of article (a) a non-Muslim may not become a citizen of the Maldives. -
(a) The religion of the State of the Maldives is Islam. Islam shall be the one of the basis of all the laws of the Maldives
(b) No law contrary to any tenet of Islam shall be enacted in the Maldives
If they strip citizenship from someone born there because they change religion, are they not going against article 9(b)?
-
-
Yeah the consitution states as follows
-
(a) The following persons are citizens of the Maldives
-
citizens of the Maldives at the commencement of this Constitution;
-
children born to a citizen of the Maldives; and
-
foreigners who, in accordance with the law, become citizens of the Maldives.
(b) No citizen of the Maldives may be deprived of citizenship.
(c) Any person who wishes to relinquish his citizenship may do so in accordance with law.
(d) Despite the provisions of article (a) a non-Muslim may not become a citizen of the Maldives. -
(a) The religion of the State of the Maldives is Islam. Islam shall be the one of the basis of all the laws of the Maldives
(b) No law contrary to any tenet of Islam shall be enacted in the Maldives
Good thing is, the maldives does not follow all the sunni sharia laws. For example it does not follow "cutting of hands"
-
-
If they strip citizenship from someone born there because they change religion, are they not going against article 9(b)?
That is an exeption
-
(a) The religion of the State of the Maldives is Islam. Islam shall be the one of the basis of all the laws of the Maldives
(b) No law contrary to any tenet of Islam shall be enacted in the Maldives
-
