We Koranist must save the Muslim youths in Western nations
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Peace,
You are completely right. This is exactly what the Wahabi's and Salafi's did. They portrayed Wahabism and Salafism as orthodox Sunni Islam. The same is true of the Shia, Khomeini ideology which came to be seen as Orthodox Shia Islam. They made you believe that this is how Islam was practiced since the time of the Prophet.
I have to admit I am guilty of propagating in a similar way. I preach Qur'an only Islam as if it is Islam. I make all my arguments based on the Qur'an and only the Qur'an. If I need more information on anything I consult the Qur'an, and if I require further insight I ask for help on these message boards or read the various articles related to the various issues discussed here.
When I speak to people that are not familiar with Islam, I explain Islam based on the Qur'an as well. However, if the discussion does get longer, I do mention that the vast majority of Muslims do not practice Islam based on the Qur'an. They often get confused when I say this, "what do you mean the vast majority of Muslims do not practice Islam based on the Qur'an?" I know... Ironic isint it.
Furthermore, I've also gotten a lot of support from "traditional conservative Muslims" when I debate people who are insulting Islam. I'll be given an argument like "Muslims have to stone their women to death" or some such nonsense. Of course the regular traditional people get all riled up and start barking, however I just ask the person making the argument to find a verse in the Qur'an that asks Muslims to stone anyone for any crime. To which they never have a reply. The traditional Muslims hearing this take heed, and ironically they go and try to find a verse that calls for stoning as a form of capital punishment as well, and naturally come back amazed and shocked that this integral part "shariah" law is not mentioned in the Qur'an.
The question of stoning adulterers is one of the best ways to get a traditional Muslim to begin questioning, and to come and see that the Qur'an does not ask you to grow a beard, does not force to cover your hair (or face), does not ask you to amputate hands for theft, beat your wife, and of course stone adulterers to death. If they believe that these things are non-Islamic, then we have made incredible progress.If they want to truly follow Islam based on the Qur'an, then I am glad to introduce them to that ideology as well, and all the amazing thought provoking things that come with it.
Nicely said.....what a brilliant explanation from a muslim stand point i mean a true muslim that follows the quran.
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Peace,
In the beginning I don't tell people that I reject the Hadith. I just tell them what the Qur'an says on specific matters without bringing up any hadith at all. After a few weeks, months, sometimes years, I let them into more of my ideological stances regarding various issues. My main concern is to get these Muslims to stop believing that amputations are "ok," that wife beating is ok, that stoning is ok, I use the Qur'an to prove to them that these practices are Un-Islamic according to the Qur'an. Most people accept these viewpoints if you paint it to them within the framework of the Qur'an. This is especially true considering that I've noticed a significant decline in Salafi influence. I just talk about what I talk about as if it were Islam and nothing but Islam.
In any case I'm content knowing that there are a growing number of Muslims that don't believe the head scarf is wajib, that amputations are "sharia", that stoning is "sharia", and that men are equal to 2 females. This is enough for me at the moment. There are so many things discussed on FreeMinds that would just overwhelm the average person that identifies as a Muslim, so the aforementioned progress is huge in my eyes.
But this may raise questions as to what is Islamic then? I have still not had anyone tell me what is the meaning of Islamic? And what are Islamic law? I see the usefullness of that but is it the right analysis? Anyways it seems you are successful as far as making people change some of their beliefs. But I think the issue is not only changing the common man's belief but creating a strong ideological framework where we can operate from. Usually the more religious ones are the activist and just saying in Islam there is no this or that I think its simplistic. But anyways it seems you got it going on pretty good and maybe I should try these tactics at least with the laymen.
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Peace Bigmo,
I agree with you completely Bigmo. Its not an excellent strategy for bringing people to the Qur'an only viewpoint exclusively and I am guilty of using the same tactics as the Salafi's.
But at the same time we have to understand that many of the people that identify as Muslims don't seem to have a problem with some of the things we take issue with, or never even thought about them at all. So, I think the best way is to start by telling people what the Qur'an says on some issues that the majority of Muslim Identifying peoples seem to have a consensus on then see what happens in their minds. If they decide to want to know more, Mashallah, thats great, but if they don't then we have to try again later.
But I can say this, in the 9 years I have been propagating at the Masjid I attend, I have seen a large difference in peoples attitudes. I'm not the only one there with a Qur'an only viewpoint; there are hundreds now. Its gotten to the point where some of the Imams I talk with say that this is the path forward for Islam and some Imams are actually stressing the importance of the Qur'an over the hadith now at Jum'uah. However, its going to be some time before there is a re-evaluation of Salat, Hajj, and other things that we talk about here. I think its important that we go back to the Masjids and ensure that our viewpoints are heard, after all we are just asking them to view Islam through the Qur'an and nothing more.
Also, for many people that identify as Muslims, Islam is just a part of their cultural identity. So its not just an interpretation of Islam that your arguing against, its also their culture that your questioning. Unfortunately, this has been one of the greatest hurdles to overcome for me, I've actually had more success with Salafi's than with the "cultural Muslims."
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Interesting discussion in Umar Lee's blog about how second generation Muslims in the West are having an identity crisis. With the mosques controlled by Sunnis many hang around elsewhere where no knowledge of religion is there. Unlike Muslim countries these people can not learn anything about religion from family and school and society. They have to go to mosques where hardline Sunnis hang around. Many opt to just never go to mosques because of that and are confused. They are vulnerable and they look at the internet to learn about Islam. We must do more to save these kids before they really get lost and become atheist or something. What you think?
Anyways this is the blog discussion
http//umarlee.com/2009/02/16/perspective-digital-divide-online-persona-and-reverse-hijrah/#commentsPeace,
Respectfully.I have come to the conclusion that talking and asking questions and establishing dialogue, is the logical way to find the Straight path, if God wills. I?ve been talking to several sunnis over the past two years but i now strongly think that they may be lost forever, unless God guides them. Why? Because they do not interact with non-sunnis.
Therefore, we must interact with others more.
Glory be to our God.
Peace. -
Salafism is stronger than ever. I cant wait for the emergence of alternative energy so Saudi Arabia will be back to its desert way fighting over a well and not having enough money to build 'evil' mosques throughout the world.
And do you think if it wasn't for the rise of fudamentalism we would have a market? In fact many of us would not be here if it wasn't for Salafism and how it made us feel that something ain't right here. So the more it spreads the more salafi burn outs and the more liberals feeling the need to look for alternative explanations. In fact the printing press and the distribution of the hadith material and its availability with people like Ayaan Ali, Wafa Sultan and Robert Spencer is helping Koranism rise.
But I think what Sarat said about how the Islamic identity and its intertwining with people's culture is a hard stumbling block is very important for us to consider. It means forget about old people living in rural community who see Islam like its a tribal custom and a national lifestyle. But I enjoyed some of her observation. I can see how each one of us have a different experience depending on the kinds of people we interact with.
I am a net guy, I believe the more information is spread around in the net the more it will trickle down to society.
But there is one thing I wnat to share.
In an interview on TV, former Sudanese de facto leader and Islamist ideologue but now turned reformist, Hassan Al Turabi, said that he found that going directly to the masses with small literature requires a lot of work as people rarely read and are not too easy to change. He said that as a criticism about his Islamist movement. He said that a better way was to right detailed books with lots of information and arguments and insights that intellectuals read and then these intellectuals trickle it down to society. This is something I have been thinking of. Its lucky that most intellectuals are big time internet users. And I think thats how the debate about the Israel Lobby in America burst open, it was through the net as Walt and Mearsheimer also observed. The traditional forced generally are controlling the traditional media outlets such as mosques and recently newspapers and libraries and TV and radio.
But I wonder why Turabi said that. Some people say never trust what he says. But I think it was an important observation as he was active from the 50s but like many Islamist he targeted students and used catchy slogans but he seems to think it ruined the Islamist agenda. Some say he ruined it with his hypocrysy and greed.