Taking off the Hijab
-
In regards to the original subject ... I never understood why hijab has to be an all-or-nothing issue. Once you decide to wear it, you can not take it off and vice versa. Why?
Obviously everyone's understanding of it varies, depending on how we interpret the verses in question, where we live etc. So why not experiment with different ways of covering until you find what suits you best?
peace
I did have shopkeepers and others that knew me ask if I had given up Islam or no longer muslim but when I assured them I was still as much a muslim they were fine. Many also agreed that it wasnt in Quran and was cultural. I did have one young girl in a clothes shop that was quite rude to me though. I went in and said Asalamu Alaikum as I always do and one replied and was interested if I was muslim. The other made a gesture that I wasnt covering my hair so I said its not in Quran, she insisted it was and refused to speak to me! The other was lovely and agreed its not and told her off. She was quite indignant though and muttered under her breath a lot
Here in Egypt 50-60 years ago women were not wearing hijab and were wearing mini skirts even! old movies show women with a scarf that is used only as decoration with huge flowers on them ;D Egypt was still a muslim country back then so I can only assume it was mass hypnosis that made them all decide this was now part of Islam ;D
-
Peace Ayisha
Not saying work was your sole purpose for taking hijab off but you still had to take it off.. it?s interesting, if it was me.. my family would tell me ?quit the job and God will guide you to a better place because you?re going through a jihad? bla bla bla.
I know in muslim countries it's more ?normal? to see girls wear hijab or not wear it or even take it off. the issue of being a muslim identity is less because majority are muslims.
People in Australia like 15 years ago wore hijab showing the legs, and some even short sleeve shirts, can you imagine today a hijabi in a skirt to her knee.. I remember my mother telling me to wear a dress that went just below my knee but I refused because I didn?t consider it proper and she was like ?but you?re young and it?s still modest? if only she thought the same thing today.
People?s ideologies have shifted, that?s part of societies fault by the way they uphold certain practices and get brainwashed. So I guess it?s upto us to make the changes we want and make a paradigm shift may God help us!
-
oh I do understand sir, I understand because our local veg man felt the need to touch me while I was fully covered and during Ramadan, I understand because the man who collects the rubbish felt the need to put his foot in the door and try to get inside, with his dick in his hand under his galabaya, also during Ramadan, I understand because the local butcher felt the need to grab me from behind while the Quran was playing on the tv in his shop, I fully understand that its MEN that have a problem and not me who needs to cover myself up, all these happened while in a MUSLIM country while I WAS wearing the hijab. >(
No way your kidding me lady.
http//gulfnews.com/news/gulf/uae/crime/private-quran-teacher-in-dubai-to-stand-trial-for-rape-1.602093
-
Isn't it funny FAR concocts this amazing verse in his head where Allah instructs women to cover their hair yet he misses where Allah tells him to lower his gaze? I find it a subject of particular hilarity. You stay there looking at the Ghost Princesses but don't you dare place or take away verses from Quran.
oh I do understand sir, I understand because our local veg man felt the need to touch me while I was fully covered and during Ramadan, I understand because the man who collects the rubbish felt the need to put his foot in the door and try to get inside, with his dick in his hand under his galabaya, also during Ramadan, I understand because the local butcher felt the need to grab me from behind while the Quran was playing on the tv in his shop, I fully understand that its MEN that have a problem and not me who needs to cover myself up, all these happened while in a MUSLIM country while I WAS wearing the hijab. >(
UGH! Seriously, one of the main reasons I put on the Hijab is because of disgusting men and their inability to control themselves!! Filthy excuses for men!
Since wearing Hijab I have been approached less, and less forcefully but still I get the odd perverted Salam and 'Brothers' initiating conversations under the guise of asking for the time and then requesting they can have my number so that we can be 'friends'. I live in London and I have the Police and Law at my disposal and I won't lie, plenty of good Muslim Brothers to defend me if need be.
I came across an Egyptian blogger a while ago, I'll try and find the link. She covered with Hijab and suffered Sexual harrasment in Egypt which she reported to the police only to be molested by them too! Astaghfirullah... The worst? She was 'felt up' while on Hajj, in Makkah.
Now to the Brothers in this thread, tell me do you think the problem lies with the Sisters who are doing their so-called duty? We are covering our hair to please Allah and that's not enough for you, some wear it to appear less attractive to all of you and yet you still harass us.
You keep blaming it on the women but if you all did your duty commanded by Allah (swt) there would be no need for Hijab.
-Rant Over-
baring her skin?
It's like almost non existent here, they might wear a dress or something but always with tights or stockings under
Yeah in my area of London you can just about get away with the North-African Hijab (showing the neck) but wearing a 3/4 length skirt with long boots is a BIG no-no. Even the showing of the neck is changing, many who wear that style have now opted to drape material round so the neck is covered. In my town there's a sort of Hijab uniform, you either go for the colourful Hijab, skinny jeans look (which is the majority) OR you're a 'ghost princess' and then a couple of Niqabis around. But to be honest around here the majority of the Brothers are decent, they don't look at ladies and they keep their beards )
In other areas, vast majority are Niqabis and if not Niqab, fully black with Abaya.
-
If you want to be fully covered then be fully covered. If you don't want to be fully covered, then don't be. But please don't come with this b@@@@@@t that it is non Islamic and you are more prone to be harassed whilst wearing the 'Hijab' then if you weren't thus using the excuse for not wearing 'hijab'.
How do you explain the following ayat and how do you recognize believing women?
3359 O Prophet! Tell thy wives and thy daughters, as well as all believing women, that they should draw over themselves some of their outer garments this will be more conducive to their being recognized and not annoyed. But God is indeed much- forgiving, a dispenser of grace!
What is an outer garment? Coat, shawl, jumper, shirt? What exactly is it and how is a believing woman recognized if both believing and non believing women are wearing the same outer garment? Come on ladies, please enlighten me.
Bear in mind that I have family members and extended family members that do wear hijab, jilbab, no hijab, no jilbab, skirts, trousers, are christian, jewish, muslim, are born into the deen, are reverts, have left the deen, cult followers, black, white and asian. So I do have a very round mix of different scenarios that I can relate to. So once again, please enlighten me.
Peace
-
But please don't come with this b@@@@@@t that it is non Islamic and you are more prone to be harassed whilst wearing the 'Hijab' then if you weren't thus using the excuse for not wearing 'hijab'.
Firstly, nobody needs an "excuse" for not wearing hijab / headscarf.
Secondly, the point was not that you get harassed more when wearing it (although that is sadly true in some cases), but that hijab does not prevent harassment, as is so often claimed.
-
Dear Leyna
But nothing is 100% harassment proof. Wearing 'hijab' is more effective on a ratio basis, as a deterant/preventative measure from harassment than wearing say a mini skirt or so, but this is only if one is defining harassment is a singular term. Harassment can be any unwelcome physical or verbal sexual advance designed to intimidate, harm, or belittle another person. Okay there are some men that get turned on with women in full 'hijab' but that is there sexual fantasy.
Unfortunately, yes men are the perpetrators of the harassment 99.9% of the time but men have also dictated terms to the women from day one whether it be directly or indirectly on what to wear, how to work, how to look, where to work and literally any other thing that they do. Wearing of 'hijab' is derived from the Quranic ayat 3359 and it should be for females to determine what that verse means to them because it is directed at them.
Peace
-
But nothing is 100% harassment proof. Wearing 'hijab' is more effective on a ratio basis, as a deterant/preventative measure from harassment than wearing say a mini skirt or so
I hate this comparison ... as if there is nothing between full hijab and miniskirt. There are a million ways to dress yourself properly without wearing either.
but this is only if one is defining harassment is a singular term. Harassment can be any unwelcome physical or verbal sexual advance designed to intimidate, harm, or belittle another person. Okay there are some men that get turned on with women in full 'hijab' but that is there sexual fantasy.
I know how harassment is defined, and I have experienced it personally. Have you? Are you seriously suggesting you know more about it than a woman?
Unfortunately, yes men are the perpetrators of the harassment 99.9% of the time but men have also dictated terms to the women from day one whether it be directly or indirectly on what to wear, how to work, how to look, where to work and literally any other thing that they do.
Exactly. And it's about time to end this.
Wearing of 'hijab' is derived from the Quranic ayat 3359 and it should be for females to determine what that verse means to them because it is directed at them.
I can see no command to cover my head anywhere in the Qur'an, but this discussion was not about the question whether hijab is an obligation or not, so we should not move away from the subject.
-
Dear Leyna
Please don't make sweeping statements that because one is a woman they know more about harassment than a man.
I know how harassment is defined, and I have experienced it personally. Have you? Are you seriously suggesting you know more about it than a woman?
Harassment is experienced by both sexes and it is not the exclusive right for women only!
Anyway, let's cut to the chase.
What does 3359 mean?
Like I said before, enlighten me on how believing women may be recognized when they are out in line with the above ayat?
Take your time.
Peace
-
2431 And tell the believing women to lower their gaze and to be mindful of their chastity, and not to display their charms beyond what may be apparent thereof; hence, let them draw their head-coverings over their bosoms. And let them not display their charms to any but their husbands, or their fathers, or their husbands? fathers, or their sons, or their husbands? Sons, or their brothers, or their brothers? sons, or their sisters? sons, or their womenfolk, or those whom they rightfully possess, or such male attendants as are beyond all sexual desire, or children that are as yet unaware of women?s nakedness; and let them not swing their legs so as to draw attention to their hidden charms And , O you believers - all of you - turn unto God in repentance, so that you might attain to a happy state!
I rest my case.
Peace
-
Please don't make sweeping statements that because one is a woman they know more about harassment than a man.
I know how harassment is defined, and I have experienced it personally. Have you? Are you seriously suggesting you know more about it than a woman?
Harassment is experienced by both sexes and it is not the exclusive right for women only!
A right? Lol.
I am not making sweeping statements, simply stating a fact. In Egypt, as I mentioned, more than 90% of the women get harassed regularly, to the extent that it has become a serious social problem. How many men do you think get harassed at the same time?
In recent years, during the Eid celebrations, crowds of young men have been harassing women to the extent that their clothes were torn off, they were groped etc. This happened in public with the police watching and doing nothing. Can you imagine the same thing the other way around -- crowds of young women hunting men down on the street like that?
And, yes, I am sure that most men can not really relate to what it feels like to get sexually harassed. You can tell this from the statements they make when discussing this issue. It is often downplayed, joked about, we're being told we should be happy about male attention and so on and so forth. This, to me, does not sound as if they have understood the problem and what it feels like to be subjected to leering, remarks, and groping, or any other sort of harassment.
-
I am not making sweeping statements, simply stating a fact. In Egypt, as I mentioned, sun to the extent that it has become a serious social problem. How many men do you think get harassed at the same time?
what ? you must be kidding, your source of these statistics ???????? .
by the way you said more than 90% which makes that there is no women married, plus other girls not interseted in guys and some are under control from their parents . more than 90% could be 91 92 93 94 95 96 97 98 99 100 and so on , which is impossible . sorry what you claimed is a tale based in L I E S.
-
Dear Leyna
Honestly, sweeping statements don't do you any justice. This is known as stereotyping.
How on earth can you state that only women understand harassment merely because they are more prone to harassment! Your comparative dictates that people from the Caucasian race cannot claim to understand racism because they have not experienced it as much as their non Caucasian counterparts, so this right is exclusive to the non Caucasians................. Please.
Secondly, Egypt does not represent the whole of the human race which by the way includes both men and women, neither does it represent the whole of Islam and neither is it the measuring yard stick for anything because most of your arguments are based on Egypt this and Egypt that.
Anyway, would be much obliged if you can answer the question to ayat 3359 please.
Peace
-
by the way you said more than 90% which makes that there is no women married, plus other girls not interseted in guys and some are under control from their parents .
I don't understand what you are trying to say here. Women get harassed regardless of whether they are married or not, "interested in guys" or not, and regardless of looks and age.
what ? you must be kidding, your source of these statistics ???????? .
Why should I be kidding? Are you a woman? Do you live in Egypt? No. So what makes you jump to the immediate reaction that I must be wrong or lying? Strange.
Studies have been conducted by the Egyptian Center for Women's rights
http//ecwronline.org/index.php?option=com_weblinks&catid=52&Itemid=110
I know you will now try to find fault with the study, claiming it didn't contain enough samples, or is not geographically diverse enough etc. pp. and you will try to make us believe that the problem does actually not exist, that it's only isolated incidents, being exaggerated by some feminists.
But fact is the problem exists, and it is serious, no matter how much you try to deny it. nope
