how to verify The Quran - and how to make a plane - and fly
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peace all,
So I was on a plane today, and a child happened to be sitting in front of me, and she was enjoying the flight, and asking her mum some questions, and that got me thinking about what I'd reply.
I thought about how the plane was made by people who use reason, science, logic, i.e. by people who think. And then I thought The Quran is for people who think. So, that made me think how do those who think verify their findings? Well, for the people who think and build the plane, they discover truths, about chemistry, physics etc and apply what they find, and their verification is proven when the plane flies. Then I thought that's the same way The Quran is verified. You discover its truths, about life, growth, happiness etc and apply them, and the verification is given when its effect is exactly as described in The Quran.
Of course, extracting and applying truths is one thing, but true striving is another, and if you strive hard enough, you're bound to fly. Just ask the Wright brothers.
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Do you have examples of 'You discover its truths, about life, growth, happiness etc and apply them, and the verification is given when its effect is exactly as described in The Quran.' Or is it just a feeling?
I certainly feel the same about the Bible. I have yet to find something in the Koran that is better than the Bible or to put it your way Is there a truth you have discovered in life that is in the Koran but not in the Bible?
That would be interesting to know.
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Do you have examples of 'You discover its truths, about life, growth, happiness etc and apply them, and the verification is given when its effect is exactly as described in The Quran.' Or is it just a feeling?
I certainly feel the same about the Bible. I have yet to find something in the Koran that is better than the Bible or to put it your way Is there a truth you have discovered in life that is in the Koran but not in the Bible?
That would be interesting to know.
http//www.youtube.com/user/faro0485#p/f/2/UJhPaSXVrKI
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if u feel like the bible guides u and helps u lead a righteous life then why not follow it...i have been reading the bible as well, and sure it has good values in it..but i always say the same thing abt quran that u said abt bible..the quran guides me completely.i feel good when i read someparts of the bible and i try to apply them in my life, but i dont learn anything foreign in the bible..all the moral values given in it hv already been in the quran.so now its a matter of wat ur comfortable with following and what ur heart tells u to follow. however i feel as i read more of the bible that its not as perfect, lovey dovey and peaceful as christians make it out to be.i havent completed my studies so am not in a position to accept or deny it as the truth on the whole, but i do accept some parts of it as the truth and think other parts hv been grossly misunderstood by centuries of tradition and extrapolated interpretations, as is the case with almost evry religion.
peace -
Do you have examples of 'You discover its truths, about life, growth, happiness etc and apply them, and the verification is given when its effect is exactly as described in The Quran.' Or is it just a feeling?
I certainly feel the same about the Bible. I have yet to find something in the Koran that is better than the Bible or to put it your way Is there a truth you have discovered in life that is in the Koran but not in the Bible?
That would be interesting to know.
I find it interesting you ask me for examples, yet you imply you have read The Quran.
Here is one for you. Chapter 107.
- Have you seen/considered him who is denying in/with the system/obligation?
- It is the one who mistreats/repels the orphan,
- And does not encourage the feeding of the poor/needy.
- So woe to the ones who go/turn towards,
- But of their bond are unaware/heedless.
- They only want to be seen,
- And withold the far-reaching deeds.
In other words, you can determine those who are sincere/genuine, by observing superficial display, compared to deeds that go beyond the surface. A universal truth.
FAR, in purity of thought or inquisitive questioning, I often see a glimpse of a pure soul, or our core. Children's minds are often great for that.
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peace all,
So I was on a plane today, and a child happened to be sitting in front of me, and she was enjoying the flight, and asking her mum some questions, and that got me thinking about what I'd reply.Salaam Wakas. I love those moments...when you are party to something that makes you think & gives you ! It's one of the joys in life the way moments of clarity or interesting thoughts come when you don't expect them.
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peace all,
So I was on a plane today, and a child happened to be sitting in front of me, and she was enjoying the flight, and asking her mum some questions, and that got me thinking about what I'd reply.
Preparation for parenthood is always cool, better late than never and all... P
I agree with you, I've had similar observations but with different triggers...it's interesting how that comes about.
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Preparation for parenthood is always cool, better late than never and all... P
I agree with you, I've had similar observations but with different triggers...it's interesting how that comes about.
These days I see God in everything. Before when I was an atheist I constantly watched life and said it was meaningless (kidding myself but boy atheism is depressing) but now I see meaning in everything. Don't you think that the way we love a child is exactly how God loves us? I think one can discover more and more about God from observing the world, relationships, science, etc.
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peace all,
So I was on a plane today, and a child happened to be sitting in front of me, and she was enjoying the flight, and asking her mum some questions, and that got me thinking about what I'd reply.
I am sometimes put in a situation whare I have to see the world through the eyes of a child. My God, what a beautiful place it is. But then, we seem to be stifling a child's mind by ignoring or skimming over their questions and views.
I am that little bit wiser just by being around children.
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Of course, extracting and applying truths is one thing, but true striving is another, and if you strive hard enough, you're bound to fly. Just ask the Wright brothers.
Beautifully put. I think the most important is the application of Qur'anic teachings. Extensive knowledge without real implementation is useless, and does little benefit to anyone.
@ Wootah I guess for myself, I find Qur'an much more appealing than the Bible. By reading it, I don't just feel closer to God, but I feel the need to become a better person. I feel the urge to be closer to other people, and ultimately become closer to God. Qur'an has taught me that servitude to God, is servitude to mankind and God's creations. It's not merely loving and praising God, and being detached from worldly life. It is about being active, and striving to develop mankind.
Anyway, one thing that really strikes me about the Qur'an is freeing the slaves. Many times the Qur'an encourages the believers to free the slaves. It is one big thing, that many people do not think about. When they think of righteous deeds, they think of giving money to charity and volunteering. I am not saying it's wrong or insufficient. But somewhere out there, so many people are being enslaved. Many children and women are being trafficked, sold into child labor and prostitution. Sadly, not many people think of these people, as they see that giving money to the poor is the way to go, it's the standard way of performing righteous deeds. The Qur'an tells me that The Ascent is about freeing the slaves, providing food to the needy, believing and constantly striving and reminding each others to do righteous deeds. Hence God willing, I can free at least one slave during my time on earth.
I am not sure of your purpose of bringing up the Bible VS the Qur'an topic? I think it is rather unnecessary. Personally, I do not find any problem if people find guidance in the Bible, and become better people themselves. In every scripture, there is much wisdom that can be gained, as long as you apply critical thinking and open mind. I acknowledge that the Bible contains some truth, and really I will be happy if Christians live by what the Bible teaches. That is to show compassion, forgiveness and give charity. The only major thing that I cannot accept from the Bible (or rather, people's interpretation of Biblical verses) is the concept of Trinity. I will be content if Christians (and others from other belief systems) implement their beliefs, peacefully. I don't know about you though. Would you only be content if other people adopt the label Christians?
@ Rraza I agree with you. Great minds think alike
Preparation for parenthood is always cool, better late than never and all...
Way to go, Nadia! Often times you manage to change serious topic into a joking thing hahaha
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These days I see God in everything. Before when I was an atheist I constantly watched life and said it was meaningless (kidding myself but boy atheism is depressing) but now I see meaning in everything. Don't you think that the way we love a child is exactly how God loves us? I think one can discover more and more about God from observing the world, relationships, science, etc.
Wouldn't atheism be rather liberating, at least that's what atheists say. I agree with you that observation is a big part of discovery 4153 We will show them Our signs in the horizons, and within themselves, until it becomes clear to them that this is the truth. Is it not enough that your Lord is witness over all things?Way to go, Nadia! Often times you manage to change serious topic into a joking thing hahaha
Just tryin' to help a brother out in his questing and all angel -
Peace,
Wakas wrote
Then I thought that's the same way The Quran is verified. You discover its truths, about life, growth, happiness etc and apply them, and the verification is given when its effect is exactly as described in The Quran.
An interesting verse relating to this is 1098. What are your thoughts?
Imraan
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I am not sure of your purpose of bringing up the Bible VS the Qur'an topic?
I just read the thread and respond from my angle. There is nothing in the Koran (to my knowledge) that contains more than previous revelations. I mean if I read a maths text book for grade 4 I expect the book for grade 5 to have more information. So I wonder.
Can a Muslim learn about Allah from the world or from the Koran only? It's something I am still trying to work out.
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There is nothing in the Koran (to my knowledge) that contains more than previous revelations. I mean if I read a maths text book for grade 4 I expect the book for grade 5 to have more information. So I wonder.
well God doesnt change his mind, so its natural that the core message and values are constant throughout. quran does however negate jesus being God or the Son of God, so if u dont believe in trinity, i guess that puts you in the fold of the believers according to quran.
Can a Muslim learn about Allah from the world or from the Koran only? It's something I am still trying to work out.
why seperate the CReator from His creation? id say both is the ideal combination. Maybe the purpose of science and nature is for humans to eventually recognise Him.
Then I thought that's the same way The Quran is verified. You discover its truths, about life, growth, happiness etc and apply them, and the verification is given when its effect is exactly as described in The Quran.
excellent way to verify the truth..put it in practise bravo
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Anyway, one thing that really strikes me about the Qur'an is freeing the slaves. Many times the Qur'an encourages the believers to free the slaves. It is one big thing, that many people do not think about. When they think of righteous deeds, they think of giving money to charity and volunteering. I am not saying it's wrong or insufficient. But somewhere out there, so many people are being enslaved. Many children and women are being trafficked, sold into child labor and prostitution. Sadly, not many people think of these people, as they see that giving money to the poor is the way to go, it's the standard way of performing righteous deeds. The Qur'an tells me that The Ascent is about freeing the slaves, providing food to the needy, believing and constantly striving and reminding each others to do righteous deeds. Hence God willing, I can free at least one slave during my time on earth.
Peace BornAgain, all.
I agree with you. And I would add these things islam is not a religion, it is a system, a way of life. A system is not just about giving money to charity, or even freeing slaves. There are more than thousands of tasks in our deen. Therefore people can contribute to the society in plenty of ways. A relgion is about a couple of duties each people should do in a lifetime. A deen is about radical reform. A deen is something that should be established. When people understand the difference between religion and deen, they will se the true power of deen.
Islam is a Revolutionary force. Its about world peace, reforms, education, fighting injustice, fighting corruption, freedom, Independence and many other things. If many muslims cooperate with eachother, they can create a social revolution on a global level.
It is important to give money to the needy. It is important to give food to the needy. But it is more important to teach people to how make money, or offer them a job. If they work, they will become independent, and then they will get their own money and they will buy their own food.
When it comes to slavery, I have written some questions that people should ask themselves.
- What is a slave? Are there only some types of slavery? Is there any free nation on earth today?
- When someone has the state as his/her provider, can he/she also be considered a slave?
- What is the cause of slavery? Is slavery the cause of slavery? Or is slavery the symptom?
- How can a person free a slave? What types of methods can a person use?
- Is someone focusing on the cause when they free a slave? Or are they focusing on the symptom?
- If a slave wants to free a slave, doesn't he or she first have to be free themselves?
- Does it only exists physical slaves, or are there mental slaves as well?
I know the answers to all these questions. The reason I am asking these thoughtprovoking questions is to let people reflect upon them and find their own answers."The universe is governed by law, not by chance." So if we focus on cause and effect, we can understand how slavery can be eliminated.
I want to share a great article with you. I think it might interest you. The article is about the difference between religion and deen
http//www.aboutquran.com/Islam.htm
What are your opinions about the article? It would be interesting to hear your opinions about it. I hope other members also would read the article.
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...There is nothing in the Koran (to my knowledge) that contains more than previous revelations...
Dear Wootah,
I believe your Christianity needs a little bit of polishing. I suggest that you contact Rev. John at the link below. He can be a lot of help to you finding your straight path.
Peace,
Khalilhttp//www.christianunitarian.org/index
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Dear Wootah,
I believe your Christianity needs a little bit of polishing. I suggest that you contact Rev. John at the link below. He can be a lot of help to you finding your straight path.
Peace,
Khalilhttp//www.christianunitarian.org/index
Hehe I'm not sure Rev john is the best person to talk to about Christianity. I wonder though, if he reads this, how much from each scripture does he teach from?
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BornAgain, did you read the article i shared with you in the post below?
http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9601485.msg265762#msg265762
If you have read the article, what are your opinion about the article?
