Use of 2nd person masculine singular in Arabic: can it be a generic reference?
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I agree that 1689 refers to Muhammad for the following reason the context forces that interpretation.
However, we also read in the Quran "sabbih bi hamdi rabbika..." and "'aqim al-salaata...", these 2 phrases also use the 2nd pers. sing. masc. (as a pronoun and imperative respectively). Surely, these commands are not exclusive to Muhammad.
Subject Pronoun is visible and is exclusively for second person masculine singular. Similarly the addresse is made known in the sentence "sabbih bi hamdi rabbika..." exclusively for second person masculine singular.
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I will try to convey my understanding as simply as I possibly can.
@SAbboushi
On the paper were the wordsIf you are referring to Q.2145 where it says ?And even if thou shouldst bring to those who have been given the Book?? you need to first read the context in order to get a sense of what is being conveyed.
In Q.2144 the subject of the discourse is ?ka? (2nd Per/M/Sing). Therefore, in 2145 the verb used there (ataita) must agree with the subject, be conjugated accordingly and must stay in the same tense. (See Dictionary of the Holy Quran, p..
As you read further in Q. 2145, the discourse reverts back to the initial subject of the discourse using the ?ka? (2nd Per/M/Sing). In reading the ayats in context, you are able to discern who is speaking and who is being spoken to.
Looking at these two ayats in context, alot can be discussed in these two ayats, however, simply put, The God is the addressor and the messenger is the addressee.
It is not necessary to be a "competent Arabic grammarian" to understand this Message. The God said "And certainly We have made the Quran easy to remember, but is there any one who will mind?" Q.5417
As a female with English as my first language, reading Q.2145, (if that is the ayat you are referring to when you made reference to regarding giving a female a piece of paper) I would say that this particular situation expressed in that ayat has nothing to do with me.
This particular situation was germane to the messenger during his time and whatever was going on. The God has made us privy to this information. Everything in The Reading does not pertain to us today. We are given glimpses of situations that occurred during the time of the messenger that have no bearing on us today except for the fact that we might derive some benefit and/or lesson from reading it.
This is a basic rule of grammar in any language...the subject must match the verb...for example, "He has" or "They have." You cannot say "He have" or "They has."
@uq same rules of grammar apply to your statement "sabbih bi hamdi rabbika..." and "'aqim al-salaata..." the ?ka? is the subject of the discourse and the subsequent verb must conjugate accordingly.
I do not believe I made the statement that ?ka? was exclusive to the messenger, and if I conveyed that message, I apologize, that was not my intent. I concur with Mazhar on the point that ?Ka? is only exclusive to it being 2nd Per/M/Sing.
You referenced comparing "English Law" and Quranic usage, (how The God uses His Words). There is no comparison with something created such as English Law and The Reading authored by The Creator of All Things. The God said "The Originator of the heavens and the earth. He has made for you pairs from among yourselves, and pairs of the cattle, too, multiplying you thereby. Nothing is like Him; and He is The Hearing, The Seeing." Q.4211
Would you possibly want to re-think that statement?
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@uq Thank you for clearing up my misunderstanding. Also, please excuse my typo, it should have read Dictionary of the Holy Quran, p.8
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Some of us have very busy lives...but not too busy to stop and discuss our Creator. I always have time for that! Your welcome.
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http//haqeeqat.org.pk/English%20Tafsir%20e%20Haqeeqat/00.Tabweeb%20Part%202/101.Aatu%20Alif%20Ta%20Ya/127.gif
Verb Perfect; Second person; singular; masculine; ; Subject pronoun, nominative state; - Verbal noun. (1)1088(2)3350=2
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Verb Perfect; Second person; singular; masculine; Subject pronoun, in nominative state; - Verbal noun. (1)2145=1
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The Pronoun specifies only an identified and specific person. It never never includes other than one masculine person.
Dictionary-Word Analysis
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"And The God will establish the truth by His Words, though the guilty be averse." (Q.1082)
"For them is good news in this world's life and in the Hereafter. There is no changing the words of The God. That is the
Mighty Achievement." (Q.1064) -
As I ponder this "2nd person masculine singular" grammar in the Reading, I understand it to pose a problem for some muslims who believe that the prophet guides. When I read Q.2272 and 2856-57, the problems I understand they are confronted with is when you look at Q. 2272, The addressor is Allah and the addressee is the messenger. The God says to the messenger, "Their guidance is not your duty, but Allah guides..." and "sufficient is thy Lord as a Guide and a Helper." (Q.2531) and Allah doesn't need an "assistant" or "helper" to convey His Message. Also, in 2856-57, Allah says to the messenger in ayat 56 that he can't guide those whom he loves (who were right there with him), so how is he capable of guiding us today? Also, in ayat 57, Allah gives us a glimpse of what the people at that time said, "...if we follow the guidance with you..." Here we see that the messenger had to follow the guidance that was sent down also, therefore a follower cannot be an innovator and their argument of the validity of their hadith fails.
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A Guide is the one who is in possession of the road map to destination. He guides only with the help of the Road Map-the Book revealed and communicated to him.
...and what exactly are you inferring?
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...and what exactly are you inferring?
...and what exactly are you inferring?
The Book is the guide, in time and space and not other conjectural stories attributed to the Guide.
Mohammad Sal'lallaa'hoalaih'wa'salam pronounced "And this Qur'aan has been communicated to me so that I admonish/awaken you the living people with this and to admonish/ awaken the one whom this Qur'aan reached". ;
All time Admonisher
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I agree the Book is the guide. The God told the messenger to say "...and this Quran has been revealed to me that with IT I may warn you and whomever it reaches..." (Q.619)
As far as the messenger "permanently and perpetually" a warner/awakener, The God says, "And Muhammadun is but a messenger - messengers have already passed away before him. If then he dies or is killed, will you turn back upon your heels?..." (Q.3143) Therefore, we dont need the messenger anymore once he has delivered The Message.
Also, The God says, "A command from Us - truly We are ever sending messengers -" (Q.445)
The Messenger was the last of the prophets, but The God is "...ever sending messengers." "A mercy from thy Lord - truly He is the Hearing, the Knowing." (Q. 445-6)
Who do you understand are the messengers that The God is "ever sending"?
Mohammad Sal'lallaa'hoalaih'wa'salam
If the Book is the Guide, where in the Book are we told to say this? In the Book, (Q.383)
"Say We believe in Allah and that which is revealed to us, and that whic was revealed to Abraham and Isshmael and Issac and Jacob and the tribes, and that which was given to Moses and Jesus and to the prophets from their Lord; we make no distinction between any of them, and to Him we submit."
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Also, The God says, "A command from Us - truly We are ever sending messengers -" (Q.445)
The Messenger was the last of the prophets, but The God is "...ever sending messengers." "A mercy from thy Lord - truly He is the Hearing, the Knowing." (Q. 445-6)
No fault of yours to have the perception that you have mentioned.
The translator seems to have little bothered to first peep into some grammar book to know what does a deficient verb mean. Nor he seems to have bothered to first know the structure of the sentences in three worded last part Ayah. Nor he seems to have remembered or taken care the context and the reference to which the Ayah relates.
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Given your knowledge of "deficient verbs" "sentence structure" and "context and the reference to which the ayat relates"...what is your understanding of what this ayat is saying?
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Given your knowledge of "deficient verbs" "sentence structure" and "context and the reference to which the ayat relates"...what is your understanding of what this ayat is saying?
Deficient verb "kana" denotes a past transanction, act done in the past, not continuous action in the present and future as suggested in the translation quoted by you "A command from Us - truly We are ever sending messengers -" (Q.445)
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Deficient verb "kana" denotes a past transanction, act done in the past, not continuous action in the present and future as suggested in the translation quoted by you "A command from Us - truly We are ever sending messengers -" (Q.445)
Let me make sure I am understanding what you are implying...
Is it your understanding that since "kana" denotes past transaction, done in the past and not continous in the present and future then in Q.445, The God SENT messengers in the past and is not sending messengers continuous in the present and future?
If this is not what you mean, could you please clearly explain the meaning of Q.445?
I would appreciate you providing a more precise translation since it seems that it is your understanding that "the translator seems to have little bothered to first peep into some grammar book to know what does a deficient verb mean. Nor he seems to have bothered to first know the structure of the sentences in three worded last part Ayah. Nor he seems to have remembered or taken care the context and the reference to which the Ayah relates."
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It comprises of Verb Like Particle suffixed with its Subject Pronoun, First Person Plural/Sovereign Singular-this refers to the Speaker, Allah the Exalted. Verb-Like Particle emphasizes the certainty of the following predicate about its subject.
This sentence is the predicate of Verb like particle.
is deficient PERFECT verb suffixed with First Person plural pronoun, in nominative state, as subject noun of deficient verb.
Active Participle Indefinite; sound plural; masculine; accusative; ; - Verbal Noun. This is the predicate of Deficient Verb. It denotes the one who causes the communication/sending something, person, message, book.
The above signifies and portrays, "It is a fact that We were the Communicator/Sender in the entire time-line."
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The above signifies and portrays, "It is a fact that We were the Communicator/Sender in the entire time-line."
Thank you for your response. Let me be clearly on what you are conveying
Are you saying that given the verb, sentence structure, etc., in Q.445, you understand that a more precise translation of this ayat is "It is a fact that We were the Communicator/Sender in the entire time-line."
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Thank you for your response. Let me be clearly on what you are conveying
Are you saying that given the verb, sentence structure, etc., in Q.445, you understand that a more precise translation of this ayat is "It is a fact that We were the Communicator/Sender in the entire time-line."
Yes.
is also in the end of 2845. See there how they translate, except Yusuf Ali who erred.
Sahih International But We produced generations , and prolonged was their duration. And you were not a resident among the people of Madyan, reciting to them Our verses, but We were senders .
Pickthall But We brought forth generations, and their lives dragged on for them. And thou wast not a dweller in Midian, reciting unto them Our revelations, but We kept sending (messengers to men).
Yusuf Ali But We raised up (new) generations, and long were the ages that passed over them; but thou wast not a dweller among the people of Madyan, rehearsing Our Signs to them; but it is We Who send messengers (with inspiration).
Shakir But We raised up generations, then life became prolonged to them; and you were not dwelling among the people of Madyan, reciting to them Our communications, but We were the senders.
Muhammad Sarwar But We raised many generations after Moses and they lived for many years. You did not dwell with the people of Midian reciting Our revelations to them, but We had certainly sent Messengers to them.
Mohsin Khan But We created generations , and long were the ages that passed over them. And you (O Muhammad SAW) were not a dweller among the people of Madyan (Midian), reciting Our Verses to them. But it is We Who kept sending (Messengers).
Arberry but We raised up generations, and long their lives continued. Neither wast thou a dweller among the Midianites, reciting to them Our signs; but We were sending Messengers.