The Search for Muhammad has Ended
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This research as he presents it consists of plagiarising old theories and copying other peoples works that have been around for decades, presenting them as his own research and presenting them as new discoveries.
Is it so?
Before you arrogantly accuse others with your usual venom and biggotry, and spew your legal vomit and political correctness in here, you should know that most of the "garbage" you read on these threads has been updated and put into a series of e-books. At the beginning of these e-books is a disclaimer page which clearly states that the books are simply compilations of what other researchers and academics have said regarding the issue, quoting articles, statements they made in seminars, passages from books (showing the reference at the end of each book), and that the compilers have not sought any material gain, nor do they hold any rights to the materials therein. In fact 90% of what is written can be downloaded for free off the net, albeit in Arabic, not in English. Therefore it is not the theory of Pazuzu, nor did Pazuzu ever, in any way shape and form, claim it as his own.
That's from a legal perspective. As for what you actually think of the research itself, and the credibility of the subject, this is something each individual reader will have to decide for himself. And in the end, your opinion and the soles of my shoes are about equal.
Have a nice day.
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@Pazuzu You are doing nothing wrong posting someone else's intellectual property on this forum. I'm free to state this is not your intellectual property which some of the active members in this thread seem to think. I'm free to state this theory is 30 years old and has been academically laughed at as a nationalist form of revisionism ever since. If you really want to prove Salibi was onto some objective truth, I suggest you take a shovel and start digging in Yemen. I would be most interested in those findings. So far, this post contains nothing new. It's the same PLO/fatah rewriting of history we know they used to discredit the Israeli claims to the territory.
One would think seeing the errors of shia and sunni sectarianism from the perspective of Quran alone, one would be so wise as to refrain from conflating political ambitions with Quranic interpretation. It has never led to any good.
Peace
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Here is a suggestion since you seem so concerned about the number of "BELIEVE(RS) in Pazuzus garbages", why don't you do a real statistic of that, not simply a wholesale appreciation which divests it of scientific value. A real scientific statistic founded also in an accurate definition of what is intended in the word "believe". Otherwise you sound like mere humbug, which is not really worthy of you.
If you are saying somebody believes in Pazuzus garbage might sound ofensive or insulting. If you give a proper technical definition of a "believer in Pazuzus garbage" would make more like your exigences when it comes to scientific stuff and bla, bla, bla...
Be up to your own level so you can admire you and ?who knows? "believe" in your garbage which you seem to think is way above Pazuzus garbage.
Salaam
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?No! ?Political ambitions? ?Oh no! My God, politcal ambitions. ?Oh, my God! Political ambitions.
?I am ever so shocked!
I have the impresion another two have joined Hadithete comic club in the forum. Everybosy here pushing politics and suddenly a culpprit has been found to brand as the great devil of political fraud in the forum.
I find your attitude disgusting, but nevertheless, comical. Keep the fun going.
And you keep silent on the Qur'an. Pazuzu has brought proofs from the Qur'an to bear his research, YOU pretentiously keep off it, because you have nothing to support your claims except bad, readings of the very work you judge, your ignorance and your own political bias, which of course you do no call bias, because you seemingly by divine decree are like the pope, infallible and giver of titles of good history and bad history and this and that.
You really impress me but not for good.
Salaam
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Well he believes in the official lame history, and invisible beings of superstition for jinn.
People also ought to take a look in old classical Arabic dictionaries regarding jinn. They may make interesting discoveries.
Salaam
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Here is a suggestion since you seem so concerned about the number of "BELIEVE(RS) in Pazuzus garbages", why don't you do a real statistic of that, not simply a wholesale appreciation which divests it of scientific value. A real scientific statistic founded also in an accurate definition of what is intended in the word "believe". Otherwise you sound like mere humbug, which is not really worthy of you.
To me history is not about belief. It's about archeological evidence. The truth is there have been zero archeological findings supporting this whole theory of Salibi. You keep referring to it as pazuzu's theory even though even he himself admits he has been doing nothing but regurgitating existing theory in a suspense style thriller format that clearly works for some. What's different from the original theory is that pazuzu's reiteration of it is not ashamed to try to hide the anti-zionist rethoric it belongs to. If you dislike people reacting to political tainted revisionism please do more effort in hiding or even better removing your political ambitions. Throughout the whole thread you will find him blaming the zionists for a conspiracy that stole muslims of their supposedly authentic history. If people don't care about scientific standards when researching history there is little I can change about that. They probably enjoy fairytales as well. Nothing wrong with that just dont be a poser and present it as hard science.
Peace
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Well he believes in the official lame history, and invisible beings of superstition for jinn.
People also ought to take a look in old classical Arabic dictionaries regarding jinn. They may make interesting discoveries.
Salaam
This made me laugh, reading this from the most famous linguistic revisionist on this forum.
Peace bro
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For those interested in some academic criticism on Salibi's work, here's a pointer from Corrie Block
http//i.imgur.com/94kN9f9.png
Peace
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Some more archeological evidence that is totally ignored by Salibi
http//i.imgur.com/kiSBcCd.png
Peace
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Armana letters
http//i.imgur.com/a1E1V0p.png
Peace
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@Pazuzu If you really want to prove Salibi was onto some objective truth, I suggest you take a shovel and start digging in Yemen. I would be most interested in those findings.
I suggest the same bravo
I sincerely hope, you can acquire the funding. Whenever you acquire one, you can bring leeman along, as he always 'whining' about the funding. You may also bring brother huruf or any of your supporter, as an journalist, to make documents on whatever your find by your own shovel in maqams kamal kalibi !
Peace.
here's pointer maybe you can find good quality one instead
https//preachrr.files.wordpress.com/2011/04/pick-shovel-cross.jpg -
Huruf is a sister!
Kakak huruf itu perempuan, lho. Jangan kaget yaa. D
Oya, selamat datang di forum ya, kak. )
Salaam.
oh ok my bad, then probably it may best to bring umbrella and skin protection cream, should sister huruf decide to come along on pazuzu expedition
Sama sama ya )
Salam
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Peace,
As bro Pazuzu wrote
There you go, brothers and sisters. You heard it from their own mouths. The scientific truth shows no mercy towards our traditional beliefs. The truth is sharp, and makes no comprimise for anyone. (The real serpent swallows up the illusion of the dancing ropes). The truth KILLS. If only the Hadithists would listen to Hertzog! But it must be hard?very hard?for those who have taken conjecture as the authority over the truth. And until they think again, ?until they swallow that red pill?they will linger in their delusions forever.
It is not surprising as MORONS EXITED THEN, EXITS NOW AND WILL EXIT IN THE FUTURE, they cannot accept the TRUTH. They are following their own assumption and conjectures without realizing that its nothing more but blatant Jewish lies!.
Bro Pazuzu not only quote Kamal Salibi, who is in fact an EXPERT in Middle Eastern History but many others such as Fadhel Al-Rubaye'e and Taha Hussain. These people are / were true historians. Let me quote Pazuzu'
Have you ever heard of Taha Hussain?
He was an Egyptian literary genius who wrote many books on history, folklore, and Arabian poetry. He was announced an apostate (kafir) by the mullahs of Al-Azhar university in Cairo. Do you know why? It is because he doubted the historicity of the current-day Maccah, or that Abraham was even in that region, and called for archeological excavations to be conducted to confirm the traditions.
Here is a photo of him
Taha Hussein (1889-1973)
He also wrote a highly controversial book (which I am now trying to get my hands on), in which he PROVED, beyond doubt, that the so-called ?Jahiliyya Poetry? is NOT pre-Islamic poetry at all. By examining the style of the verses and their contents, he concluded that it could not have been produced before the Quran. As a result, he ASSUMEDthat this type of poetry was in fact invented during the Abbasid Era and projected backwards onto a false time period, in order to invent legendary deeds and lineages for the Arabian tribes, which they could boast of in their poetry. In fact, there was an article posted here on FM (not sure if it was by brother Ayman or Layth), which also discusses the fact that Jahiliyyah poetry was not in fact pre-Islamic.
The proofs that Taha Hussein presented regarding the authenticity of his findings were so powerful, that the intellectually bankrupt "ulema" of Al-Azhar were placed in a corner, and could not refute him. So they resorted to their usual response insults and takfeer. Another late Egyptian scholar (I think it was Nasr Hamed Abu Zayd) made an allusion to how Taha Hussein pretty much "destroyed" the Azhar scholars.
But there is one thing Taha Hussein may not have noticed. A piece of the puzzle that slipped by him...
It is not the history of the Jahiliyya Poetry that was hijacked. No. The "pre-Islamic" poets that they taught us about in school, like Zuheir Bin Abi Salmah, Tarafa, Umru' al-Qays, and others, were not inventions by the Abbasids. They actually lived around 400-500 AD. What Taha Hussein failed to grasp, is that it is the QURAN that has been hijacked and its history projected forward in time, thus creating the delusion that Jahiliyyah poetry was pre-Islamic.
So basically, Taha Hussein (along with Ayman or Layth) were 100% correct in his assessment regarding Jahiliyya Poetry, only the conclusion he reached was wrong, because he had the preconceived notion that the Quran was revealed around 600 AD.
Fadhel Al-Rubaye'e quote
Dr.Fadel al-Rubaie denied any relationship of any kind between the Torah and Palestine, stressing that the names, places and events that came in the Torah are Yemeni names and locations, and some still exist even today.
He denies strongly that Joshua Ben-Nun had crossed the Jordan River to Jericho, and inscriptions and figures available indicate that Joshua Ben-Nun actually travelled to the land of Yemen.
This was all said in a lecture given by Dr Rubaie on Tuesday evening in the Jordanian Writers Association Forum moderated by Dr Hisham Ghassib.
..Al-Rubaie in his lecture spoke of the need to re-correct the region's history, and on top of that the history of Palestine, which requires corrections to the historical narrative promoted by Orientalists that are based in their stories of the Torah that they read misleadingly. He stressed that Jerusalem is not Jerusalem, and Jews have no trace in the Palestinian territories, and if there is housing in Palestine from the Jews it is from the sons of the Arab tribes that migrated from Arabian Peninsula.
...Israel want to revive the Hebrew language, originally a Greek dialect.
The lecture included a heavy presence of intellectuals and other interested members.
Al Akhbar interviewed him last year and he said?Give me one example in which old Jerusalem is mentioned in the Torah.? He notes that the city used to be called Ilia not Jerusalem. Therefore, there is no narrative text on Jerusalem prior to the Islamic conquest.
In the entire Tanach, which mentions Jerusalem about 700 times, Josephus, the Christian scriptures and Not to mention the Dead Sea Scrolls, are full of lies!
The Torah, according to what al-Rubai has documented, refers to old Jerusalem as located in Yemen and not in Palestine. He explains, ?This is what the Assyrian and Babylonian inscriptions have proven, for they refer to nine enslavement campaigns that took place in Yemen, not Palestine.? But why have historical narratives documented that the Babylonian enslavement incident as having occurred in Palestine?
Al-Rubai, who authored The Truth Behind the Babylonian Enslavement, says, ?The reason lies in the monopoly over this tragic story, which was later used in the Holocaust narrative as a continuation of the historical persecution of the Jews, thus reinforcing their role as historical victims. All we need to do is to go back to the history of al-Tabari, which clearly mentions that Nebuchadnezzar?s invasion was of Yemen and not Palestine.?
Based on these controversial revelations, al-Rubai solidly concludes in his thesis that Judaism is an old Arabic religion, and the Torah is a Yemeni "book". He also concludes that old Jerusalem is not present-day Jerusalem. It is located in Yemen and not Asir, as the late intellectual Kamal al-Salibi concluded in his book The Bible Came from Arabia.
Al-Rubai says, ?I am not under the illusion that these ideas will prevail soon, given the presence of an enormous media power that dominates the historical narrative. It is enough to seek the documentation of our history from a critical perspective, away from the Orientalist lie. Perhaps what Edward Said has accomplished in that regard has shaken this perception to a great extent.?
Yes, this is the state of Arab intellectualism. The Jews are so powerful that they have managed to retroactively change history itself in order to profit from the Holocaust!
Peace
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Since someone mentioned the Amarna Letters and decided to superimpose his version of the "translation" thereof, I will point out that two can play this game.
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The word "PHARAOH" does not appear anywhere on these tablets as designative of the Egyptian kings.
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The word "Khapiru" which they slober over, does not point to the Israelites. In the context of the letters, it simply means "outlaws" or "nomads".
Let's see what Egyptian archeologist, Ashraf Ezzat, who examined the Amarna Letters, says regarding the Zionist corruption of history in general
https//ashraf62.wordpress.com/
And regarding the Amarna tablets is particular
https//ashraf62.wordpress.com/tag/amarna-letters/
You should bear in mind that Mr. Ezat updated the information found on the site in his recently published book
http//www.amazon.com/Egypt-knew-Pharaohs-nor-Israelites-ebook/dp/B00U8VK8JE/ref=sr_1_sc_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1430288411&sr=1-1-spell&keywords=Ashraf+Ezat
More to come soon, especially on the matter of the Hyksos and the so-called "Canaanites"
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Pazuzu is too kind answering two people who show too much slobness, even to take the trouble of going through the very writings they criticise and therefore have been doing nothing but bubbling hot air. The Amarna tablets indeed, which are routine amongst Pazuzus writings detractors, when in fact it is worthless for the purpose, have bene discussed already in this forum more than once.
As to their advice to Pazuzu and me and others to go and dig, they could have better used it for themselves and they do not have to go to Yemen to dig anything, they just had to dig a little in these very forums.
But they are either to vain or too lazy to let that stop them from posing their "knowledgeability". They must think the rest of us are idiots who need caretakers full of themselves mouthing big words as if we just came from the bush and were not used to such exquisite stuff, when in fact they what they offer is the very common run of the mill appearance of pretenders to something they are far grom being, parading knowledge and that kind of thing. One is too old to be impressed by such a childish act. I think anybody is too old to be taken by such plumpness.
Salaam
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Also these two "knowledgeable" critics have been consistently ignoring the main point in this question and the reason why it is being dealt with in these forums, to wit, whether orientalist and hadithist "history"jat the text of the Qur'an or not.
Obvioulsy they do not match it. They contradict it consistently. So history or not history, The orientalist and hadithist versions should be outright rejected by those who trust the Qur'an to tell always the truth.
Several times I have pointed that out, and for all their recommendations to goodness and faithfulness to poor conventional history, they have not touched the Qur'aan. It is much nicer when the Qur'aan just keeps beeing a meek servant to the bloated idiocy of waters parting in the middle of the sea, full Holywoodwise and so much "truth" as we are used to be fed by the sacred history "everybody knows it".
Salaam
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Dr Ashraf Ezat is a doctor in medicine lmao. These are the kind of experts you are referring to? No surprises there. Keep the propaganda coming brickwall
@Huruf if you want to see hollywood, Ashraf Ezat is pure hollywood. This man is a politically motivated moviemaker and doesn't have any degrees in history. There are zero peer reviews of his work. Because he is rightfully not even considered a peer. He's a doctor in medicine with wild fantasies about history who enjoys making movies of his fiction. It's typical of pazuzu's style to project people like that as qualified doctors at universities without even mentioning their field of expertise. Pazuzu calling him an archaeologist is an outright lie. Not the first one and I'm sure it wont be the last of his lies.
According to my house doctor israel was in belgium. Check this evidence!
https//www.google.be/maps/place/Nazareth/@50.9408933,3.7252597,12z/data=!4m2!3m1!1s0x47c36d346bd85ccb0xb9a7c868c273024b
Some of you really need to look up the word negationism and understand what it means.
As in any academic discipline, historians submit their papers for peer review, however, instead of submitting their work to the challenges of a peer review, revisionists rewrite history to support an agenda, often political, and use many techniques and rhetorical fallacies to obtain the desired results. In doing so, the revisionists therefore engages in deceiving their audience into believing manipulated information
Disinformation? Check
Denial? Check
Relativization and trivialization? CheckPeace
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?Oh, my, a doctor in medicine! ?How wicked! Whereas dr. runninglike zebras is a doctor in everything particularly on Pazuzus works. A miraculous dr. yhat without reading anything knows everything? ?How does a dr. in medicine attempt to match dr. runninglkikezebras wits and hipoknowledge in everything. The only thing dr. runninglikezebras fear seesm to be the Qur'an.
Salaam
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Huruf,
I'm not pretending to know everything. I'm pointing out none of the experts pazuzu cites from submit peer reviews or are even considered peers. Others cited by pazuzu who do submit peer reviews can't show one positive peer review. This is important to be able to maintain standards of quality and credibility. Without peer reviews, one can fantasize and sell it as fact.
Peer review is the evaluation of work by one or more people of similar competence to the producers of the work (peers). It constitutes a form of self-regulation by qualified members of a profession within the relevant field. Peer review methods are employed to maintain standards of quality, improve performance, and provide credibility. In academia peer review is often used to determine an academic paper's suitability for publication. Peer review can be categorized by the type of activity and by the field or profession in which the activity occurs, e.g., medical peer review.
I would appreciate if you stop the immature slandering of my person. It's not appreciated.
Peace