Qur'an is the number 1 authority ?
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Allah is the ONLY authority. Quran is Allah's word, so in a way yes.
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- What does the Authority of the Sunnah mean?
In Arabic, the wording is Hojjiyat As-Sunnah. This basically means that the Sunnah can be used as evidence in Shariah, and that Allah (swt) has ordered us to follow the Sunnah and avoid anything it has prohibited for us. In other words, this means that it is obligatory on every Muslim to believe in what the Sunnah tells us, and to act according to the Sunnah in all aspects of our life and ensure that we do not commit any actions that contradict the Sunnah.
The Sunnah and it's place in relation to the Holy Qur'an
The Sunnah can be divided into three parts
Confirming Sunnah. This is the part of the Sunnah that confirms what is in the Qur'an, and reinforces it.
Explanatory Sunnah. This part of the Sunnah explains the holy Qur'an and the various Shariah injunctions that come in the holy Qur'an. It includes four parts expanding on what is mentioned only briefly in the holy Qur'an, explaining difficult verses or issues, putting limits on general statements in the Qur'an and finally specifying generalities in the Qur'an.
Sunnah that brings new legislation. This part of the Sunnah is the one that brings new legislation, and new Shariah that is not in the holy Qur'an.
http//www.al-islami.com/islam/authority_of_sunnah.php
Abrogation is applicable to both sources of Islamic law the Qur'n and the Prophetic Sunna. A Qur'nic verse may abrogate another Qur'nic verse, and a Prophetic Sunna may likewise abrogate another Prophetic Sunna. The possibility of abrogation between these two sources, though, was a more contentious issue precipitated by the absence within a source of the appropriate abrogating (nsikh) or abrogated (manskh) material necessary to bring concordance between it and the Fiqh.
In Shfi''s source theory the possibility of abrogation between the Sunna and the Qur'n was vehemently denied
Arguing determinedly that any verbal discrepancies between the Qur'n and the reported sayings or reports of the practices of Muhammed- the Sunna of the Prophet- were merely illusory and could always be removed on the basis of a satisfactory understanding of the mechanism of revelation and the function of the prophet-figure, Shfi' set his face decidedly against any acceptance of the idea then current that in all such cases the Qur'n had abrogated the Sunna, or the Sunna the Qur'n.
This stance was a reaction to larger developments within Islamic jurisprudence, particularly the reformulation of the Fiqh away from early foreign or regional influences and toward more eminently Islamic bases such as the Qur'n. This assertion of Qur'nic primacy was accompanied by calls for an abandonment of the Sunna. Shfi''s insistence upon the impossibility of contradiction between Sunna and Qur'n can thus be seen as one component in this larger effort of rescuing the Sunna
He campaigned tirelessly to justify use of the Sunna as the second primary source alongside the Kur'n against those who would accord the hadth no role in the derivation of the shar'a on the argument that the degree of conflict in the hadth, the inadequacies of the guarantee against corruption, fraud or error afforded by the isnds rendered the hadth unfit for the sacred role of declaring the divine intent underlying the Kur'n's declarations.
Asked point-blank whether the Sunna could ever be abrogated by the Qur'n, Shfi' had bluntly replied that that could never happen. Were the Sunna to be abrogated by the Qur'n, the Prophet would immediately introduce a second sunna to indicate that his first sunna had been abrogated by his second sunna- in order to demonstrate that a thing can be abrogated only by its like (mithlihi) .
Later scholars, writing when the juridicial legitimacy of the Sunna could be taken for granted (thanks largely to Shfi''s efforts!), were less inclined to adopt his inflexible stance. To their minds the reality of this sort of inter-source abrogation was proven by several "indisputable" instances the changing of the qibla towards Mecca and away from Jerusalem, and the introduction of the penalty of stoning for adultery. The following passage from Qurtub (al-Jmi' li ahkm al-Qur'n) is representative in this regard
...the Qur'n may be naskhed by the Qur'n and the Sunna by the Sunna. The Qur'n may, in addition, be naskhed by the Sunna, as has occurred in the case of Q.2180, which was replaced by the Sunna ruling no wasiya in favor of an heir. Mlik admitted this principle, but Shfi' denied it, although the fuqah all admit, in the instance of the penalty for adultery, that the flogging element of Q.242 has been allowed to lapse in the case of those offenders who are condemned to death by stoning. There is no explanation for the abandonment of the flogging element other than that the penalty all now acknowledge is based on the Sunna, i.e. the practice of the Prophet.
In the instance of the change of qibla, a Sunna ruling was set aside in favor of a Qur'n ruling- there is no reference in the Qur'n to the Jerusalem direction of prayer.
Al-Ghazl employs the same three examples in his Mustasf.
One outcome of these disputations was the proposal of a mode of naskh known as naskh al-tilwa dna al-hukm ("abrogation of the wording but not ruling" in order to provide a Qur'nic nsikh, or abrogator, for Q.242 (see below).
http//en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Naskh_(tafsir)
So you can do the math. The Quran does not play any role in Sunni or even Shia Islam.
Shalom Aleikhom,
Well, that was kind of my point. If you are honest, how can you still say that Qur'an is the number one authority ??? I mean, I respect your right to believe that hadiths are divine and they can go against the Qur'an and must be followed even when Qur'an disagrees. But I dont respect you the moment you "Claim" that Al-Qur'an is your number one source.
I dont know why they promote this "No. 1 Source" lie, probably to sell Allah's ayaats ??? Don't know !! Many times I have seen scholars and muslims impressing Christian/hindu audience with Qur'an. The moment the individual converts to Islam, "Good Bye Qur'an" happens.
Peace
------------- Student of Allah -
Salam,
And thanks to you too Bigmo for the explanatory comment. May I use your (Bigmo and Servent of Allah) posts at other places? I want my sunni relatives to read them, I only was able to give them ayat from the Quran but they think I dont understand what Quran says, and their sunni scholars know better. I dont know any hadith, I became "Quranist" before I started to think about hadeeth so these posts can be usefull)
I will definitely check that forum Servent of Allah. By the way I think its called shalom aleykhim in Hebrew not shalom aleykhom) I dont have anything about you using that, but I cant help wondering why? is that for a particuler reason or just becouse you like it more so?
Peace!Shalom Aleikhom (its my dialect, so instead of khem, its pronouced khom),
Incase you have not noticed, i am "Student of Allah" not "Servant ...." )
You can use these posts, other forum posts, but please verify them first. ) I had lots of works on hadiths, misquoting Qur'an,etc... few of them can be found on my blog let me provide them below if it helps you
- "Authentic" Lies about Messenger of God 1 - Evolution of french kiss
2."Authentic" Lies about Messenger of God 2 - Which eye of dajjal is blind ?
3."Authentic" Lies about Messenger of God 3 - Stone to death for adultery ? - Do I need hadiths because the Qur'an lacks details and examples ?
- Misquoting God Take what the messenger gives you and abstain from what he forbids
- Prophecies by prophet Muhammad ?
Verify everything and feel free to ask us for any further help/support as I would feel free to ask you guys for help/support )
ohh... about Shalom Aleikhom.... well... Jesus kinda said something similar...God raised the dead for him, Moses kinda said something similar...God parted the Nile for him.... so....mmmm..hmm... I dont know.. you make up the conclusion. If you cant, just email Imam Bukhari ([email protected])...he is good at that )
Peace be on you
------------------------- Student of Allah
- "Authentic" Lies about Messenger of God 1 - Evolution of french kiss
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Allah is the ONLY authority. Quran is Allah's word, so in a way yes.
Shalom Aleikhom,
You simply read the title and ended up commenting...!!! ?
Peace
---------- Student of Allah -
Shalom Aleikhom,
You simply read the title and ended up commenting...!!! ?
Peace
---------- Student of AllahWell yeah, was pointing that out just in case.
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Many times I have seen scholars and muslims impressing Christian/hindu audience with Qur'an. The moment the individual converts to Islam, "Good Bye Qur'an" happens.
Peace
------------- Student of AllahExactly. It is a nice little bait-and-switch maneuver, and is the main reason why I don't say I am a muslim in the rare occastion that I talk to an "orthodox" muslim. I just rather not deal with the nonsense, and generally they are more apt to hear me out as an outsider questioning the authority of the sunna (because they think they can convert me). >D
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I just rather not deal with the nonsense, and generally they are more apt to hear me out as an outsider questioning the authority of the sunna (because they think they can convert me). >D
Yeah.. I used to think along that line as well.. during my days of Ignorance.. ))
Seeking conversion.. because "my imam" back then told me when I managed to convert a person, then I will get some share of his good deeds afterwards.. so it's a kind of MLM business perhaps.. rotfl rotflSalam / Peace
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Yeah.. I used to think along that line as well.. during my days of Ignorance.. )
Seeking conversion.. because "my imam" back then told me when I managed to convert a person, then I will get some share of his good deeds afterwards.. so it's a kind of MLM business perhaps.. rotfl rotflSalam / Peace
They really tell people that??! So if you get enough converts, you can pretty much do nothing and coast into paradise?!!? When I was a kid and we had Vacation Bible School, they always gave a prize for the kid who brought the most friends. Maybe they should have promised us merit like that! rotfl
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Salaam,
Maybe she has to say welcome to you
Ala Date Registered May 15, 2011, 035214 PM
SoA Date Registered May 27, 2011, 031321 AMShalom Aleikhom,
ignore ignore ignore ignore ignore
Anyways... lets me say... "Welcome Back" to Ala
Peace
----------- Student of Allah -
Shalom Aleikhom,
Well, that was kind of my point. If you are honest, how can you still say that Qur'an is the number one authority ??? I mean, I respect your right to believe that hadiths are divine and they can go against the Qur'an and must be followed even when Qur'an disagrees. But I dont respect you the moment you "Claim" that Al-Qur'an is your number one source.
I dont know why they promote this "No. 1 Source" lie, probably to sell Allah's ayaats ??? Don't know !! Many times I have seen scholars and muslims impressing Christian/hindu audience with Qur'an. The moment the individual converts to Islam, "Good Bye Qur'an" happens.
Peace
------------- Student of AllahGood point. Many people who converted to Islam through Quran did the mistake of going to the mosque and then getting "converted again" to Sunnism. A year or two later many left Islam because the rigitidity of the Sunnah.
The reason why they say Quran is number one source even if its a lie is to sell the Sunnah to the Muslim masses. Most Muslims think the Sunnah explains the Quran. They are not aware of exactly what role the Sunnah plays. Its all "Islam" for them.
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Yeah.. I used to think along that line as well.. during my days of Ignorance.. )
Seeking conversion.. because "my imam" back then told me when I managed to convert a person, then I will get some share of his good deeds afterwards.. so it's a kind of MLM business perhaps.. rotfl rotflSalam / Peace
Wow! My Imam is better, when I helped convert someone he said I was 100% getting Jannah, but no sex with hurs for me cause I am female, thats for the men .. but I will sure be purrrty...lol
When I converted it was Qur'an and then... Oh by the way.. you need to kill black dogs, drink camel pee and watch monkeys stone each other for adultery. Toto, I don't think we are in Kansas anymore
rotfl
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Wow! My Imam is better, when I helped convert someone he said I was 100% getting Jannah, but no sex with hurs for me cause I am female, thats for the men .. but I will sure be purrrty...lol
When I converted it was Qur'an and then... Oh by the way.. you need to kill black dogs, drink camel pee and watch monkeys stone each other for adultery. Toto, I don't think we are in Kansas anymore
rotfl
Shalom Aleikhom,
560 Say "Shall I inform you of worse than this as a punishment from God? Those whom God cursed and became angry at them, and He made from them apes and pigs and servants of evil. Those have a worse place and are more astray from the right path."
Sometime hadiths do help interpret the Qur'an I am afraid !! Borrowing jurisprudence from monkeys !! brickwall
Peace
-------------- Student of Allah -
They really tell people that??! So if you get enough converts, you can pretty much do nothing and coast into paradise?!!? When I was a kid and we had Vacation Bible School, they always gave a prize for the kid who brought the most friends. Maybe they should have promised us merit like that! rotfl
See how the sunni clerics are 'much smarter' (in BS).
The priest in your "Vacation Bible School" need to spend some $$$ for the prize.
While my Imam doesn't need to spend anything.. because "the reward shall come from Allah"...
(thus they can keep all the donation from 'new converts' to themselves.)
rotfl rotfl -
Salam!
Incase you have not noticed, i am "Student of Allah" not "Servant ...." )
Sorry)
You can use these posts, other forum posts, but please verify them first. ) I had lots of works on hadiths, misquoting Qur'an,etc... few of them can be found on my blog let me provide them below if it helps you
As I mentioned before I dont have knowledge in hadeeth, so think I can trust your hadeeth quoting and comparisons. God says in 496 "You, you those who believed, if a debaucher came to you with news/information, so seek clarification/explanation that (E) you strike/hit a nation with ignorance/foolishness, so you become/become in the morning on what you made/did regretful/remorseful"
From what you write I understand you are not a debaucher)ohh... about Shalom Aleikhom.... well... Jesus kinda said something similar...God raised the dead for him, Moses kinda said something similar...God parted the Nile for him.... so....mmmm..hmm... I dont know.. you make up the conclusion. If you cant, just email Imam Bukhari ([email protected])...he is good at that )
Didn?t Jesus talk Arameic? Ofcourse you may use any greeting you want but frankly I cant see what opening the see and raising the dead have to do with any greeting, maybe you dont mean that. This is not an argument just telling that your point didint make any sense to me, but its ok, we dont have to debate greetings, as long as they are peacefull
Peace!
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Shalom Aleikhom,
As I mentioned before I dont have knowledge in hadeeth, so think I can trust your hadeeth quoting and comparisons. God says in 496 "You, you those who believed, if a debaucher came to you with news/information, so seek clarification/explanation that (E) you strike/hit a nation with ignorance/foolishness, so you become/become in the morning on what you made/did regretful/remorseful"
From what you write I understand you are not a debaucher)I do not consider myself as evil. But I am a human being, so can make mistakes. If you try to verify my works, its good for both of us. Learning experience for both of us.
Didn?t Jesus talk Arameic? Ofcourse you may use any greeting you want but frankly I cant see what opening the see and raising the dead have to do with any greeting, maybe you dont mean that. This is not an argument just telling that your point didint make any sense to me, but its ok, we dont have to debate greetings, as long as they are peacefull
Well, it doesnt make sense. I know that, thats why I asked you to contact Bukhari ) He is good at making sh*t up. Senseless things like
".....Then the Almighty will come to them in a shape other than the one which they saw the first time, and He will say, 'I am your Lord,' and they will say, 'You are not our Lord.' And none will speak to Him then but the Prophets, and then it will be said to them, 'Do you know any sign by which you can recognize Him?' They will say. 'The Shin,' and so Allah will then uncover His Shin whereupon every believer will prostrate before Him ..."
So you can probably guess by now why I asked you to contact him . This dude has some wild imaginations.... no matter how baseless my SHALOM ALEIKHOM reasoning was, this dude will help you add to the story and fabricate a conclusion.
Peace
--------- Student of Allah -
author=Student of Allah link=topic=9603481.msg292751#msg292751 date=1328442883
I do not consider myself as evil. But I am a human being, so can make mistakes. If you try to verify my works, its good for both of us. Learning experience for both of us.
Im just being honest, we are being bombarded with information from everywhere and its so hard to verify everything. You read the news and trust the sources and talk to your friends about the news you red as if you were there and seen them by your self. Of course I see your point, and I will try to verify your hadiths, I understand its your duty to remind everyone to verify information, Im just being honest
Well, it doesnt make sense. I know that, thats why I asked you to contact Bukhari He is good at making sh*t up. Senseless things like
".....Then the Almighty will come to them in a shape other than the one which they saw the first time, and He will say, 'I am your Lord,' and they will say, 'You are not our Lord.' And none will speak to Him then but the Prophets, and then it will be said to them, 'Do you know any sign by which you can recognize Him?' They will say. 'The Shin,' and so Allah will then uncover His Shin whereupon every believer will prostrate before Him ..."
So you can probably guess by now why I asked you to contact him . This dude has some wild imaginations.... no matter how baseless my SHALOM ALEIKHOM reasoning was, this dude will help you add to the story and fabricate a conclusion.
CRAZY HADITH! >
Its hard to understand written jokes -[ But it was a good onePeace!