Ramadhan: 30 days in 365 days ! not one consecutive month !
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Peace marie,
I think we witness the lunar month "ramadhan" at different time according to our geographic position.
What if 2 185 is recited to a people in the same locality say a town of 4000 people? Or, in a house hold of 4 to 5 recite together 2 185 ? It is still "whoever of you witness the month of ramadhan" isn't it ? We see each one has to wait for his days as determined by Allah, spread throughout the year.
drfazl
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Peace be upon you Doc,
You have really got me thinking about this "WITNESSING" part, it makes a lot of sense, I just cannot figure outthough how I KNOW FOR SURE if I am recieving inspiriation. There are times when I TRULY though I was, but turned out later that I was wrong. For example, when I first found the submission.org site, I thought I found it all, but that 19 fitna turned out to be just that, a fitna(trial).
I think you are very close, but I cannot figure out what is missing.
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Peace drfazl,
Peace marie,
I think we witness the lunar month "ramadhan" at different time according to our geographic position.
What if 2 185 is recited to a people in the same locality say a town of 4000 people? Or, in a house hold of 4 to 5 recite together 2 185 ? It is still "whoever of you witness the month of ramadhan" isn't it ? We see each one has to wait for his days as determined by Allah, spread throughout the year.
drfazl
I consider the month of ramadhan as a lunar month and the first retricted month and Allah explains how to witness for example the four restricted month in the same chapter.
The langage in the quran is precise, and Allah said whoever of you can observe the lunar month ie the lunar month of ramadhan, I consider it as an ordinary lunar month in which the quran was sent down as a guide in the past.
To witness the month doesn't mean to receive the revelation or to witness it.
The lunar month of ramdhan is a measurable period and not days spread throughout the year.Please look the context of all verses where the word "shahr" is used before inventing a new definition of the word "shahr".
The quran is the best dictionnary and is its best comment.
Allah knows best
Marie
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Peace brother Kyle,
Peace be upon you Doc,
You have really got me thinking about this "WITNESSING" part, it makes a lot of sense, I just cannot figure outthough how I KNOW FOR SURE if I am recieving inspiriation. There are times when I TRULY though I was, but turned out later that I was wrong. For example, when I first found the submission.org site, I thought I found it all, but that 19 fitna turned out to be just that, a fitna(trial).
Rashad Khalifa also claimed that he received alwahy roll ?
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Peace be upon you Marie,
Rashad Khalifa also claimed that he received alwahy
EXACTLY!! You stated very clearly the problem that was in my mind. Thank you.
Also, since my last post, I have read the post from Ayman regarding full moons. I am leaning in this direction now.
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hi idolfree
you said
You have really got me thinking about this "WITNESSING" part, it makes a lot of sense, I just cannot figure outthough how I KNOW FOR SURE if I am recieving inspiriation. There are times when I TRULY though I was, but turned out later that I was wrong. For example, when I first found the submission.org site, I thought I found it all, but that 19 fitna turned out to be just that, a fitna(trial).
i think this ayah will help
- We do not duplicate a revelation, or make it forgotten, unless We bring one which is like it or even greater. Did you not know that God is capable of all things?
i believe ramadhan is individualised. ever individual who ponders the quran will recieve a revelation. today u may understand the ayah a different way, u fast the next day, then afetr a while u understand it differently. we bring one which is like it or even greater. god reveals to you in parts so that he stregthens your heart
peace -
Peace be upon you Shariif,
i think this ayah will help
- We do not duplicate a revelation, or make it forgotten, unless We bring one which is like it or even greater. Did you not know that God is capable of all things?
Respectfully, that does not help me. Verse 2106 says "sign" not "revelation", and it means that the God's signs come continuously, so you might forget one, but there are a million more staring yo right in the face, so there will be no excuse for anyone to reject.
i believe ramadhan is individualised. ever individual who ponders the quran will recieve a revelation. today u may understand the ayah a different way, u fast the next day, then afetr a while u understand it differently. we bring one which is like it or even greater. god reveals to you in parts so that he stregthens your heart
That sounded good to me at first, but now I disagree, if I am "inspired" that 19 is a miracle sign, then I fast the next day, that was not really an inspiration from the God because it is NOT TRUE, therefore it was something from my own self.
Again, I lean more towards Aymans understanding at this point.
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peace all
Regarding the new moon they ask They show not the month of ramadhan for ramadhan is not following the calendar months lunar or solar. Recite this and comprehend.
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They ask thee concerning the New Moons. Say They are but signs to mark fixed periods of time for mankind, and for Pilgrimage Haj.New moon has no value in quran as far as ramadhan is concerned, since ramadhan has nothing to do with the calendar months. Whoso of you witnesses the month ~~ thus 'Ramadhan ' is a word having hidden meanings ie., 2 185 is one of the mutashabihat ayats. Never go by the dictionary meanings !
drfazl
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Peace
Regarding wahi,
I do not understand why people think they shall not receive wahi ? Who told them that Wahi is not for man. Allah says he sends down wahi even to the earth and the bees. What makes you think that you and I won't receive the wahi? Rashad Khalifa lied on Allah and said he alone could receive the wahi while allah says otherwise. All those who seek refuge in HIM and ask only HIM for guidance ~ He Guides! This Guidance is Wahi. So you fast when you receive or witness the guidance from Him to show your gratitude.
Please ponder on wahi before reply. May Allah help us with His Wahi, the Guidance. As mumins we believe He Guides us; He alone can Guide us; We Worship Him alone ; We seek His Guidance alone! These verses are sura Al Fatiha isn't it ? Where do we then retract and where shall we stray away from siratun Mustaqeem ?
drfazl
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Follow rasul
Rasul folowed Allah's guidance alone ; if we are to follow rasul, like rasul showed you the way, follow the wahi, the guidance from Allah. Follow only what allah has sent down upon you, if you are a believer! Recite this in your heart
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Say "If I am astray, I only stray to the loss of my own soul but if I receive guidance, it is because of the inspiration of my Lord to me it is He Who hears all things, and is near."
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And when My servants ask you concerning Me, then surely I am very near; I answer the prayer of the suppliant when he calls on Me, so they should answer My call and believe in Me that they may walk in the right way.
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Thee do we worship, and Thine Guidance we seek.
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Guide us to the straight way,
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The Guidance of those (the rasuls and the prophets) on whom Thou hast bestowed Thy Grace.I am glad to speak more on wahi that every mumin shall have to believe in if they want to be in the Guidance without straying.
drfazl
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Salaam all,
There are some points that drfazl has mentioned here, that I'm in agreement with. If I'm wrong, anyone, please correct me.
Never go by the dictionary meanings !
Personally, I wouldn't say "never", but I would say that the dictionary/lexicon is 'limited' in my point of view, and probably poses as a trap. Sometimes, I feel we give up a 'higher understanding', from God, for a lower one from man. Kind of like Moses people when they were given 'manna and quails'...- And you said ?O Moses, we will not be patient to one type of food, so call for us your Lord that He may bring forth what the Earth grows of its beans, cucumbers, garlic, lentils, and onions.? He said ?Would you trade that which is lowly with that which is good?? Descend to Egypt, you will have in it what you have asked for. They were thus stricken with humiliation and disgrace, and they remained under God?s wrath for they were disbelieving in God?s signs, and killing the prophets with no justification; this is for what they have disobeyed and transgressed.
To continue on the same subject, I'd like to move on to wahi...
What makes you think that you and I won't receive the wahi?
I believe that we do. But not just anyone or anytime. We have to humbly seek, through the reading to receive it. An example is like how we read the same thing, over and over again... and one time, out of nowhere we understand . For the lack of a better word, I would equate this to an Epiphany;3
a. A sudden manifestation of the essence or meaning of something.
b. A comprehension or perception of reality by means of a sudden intuitive realization "I experienced an epiphany, a spiritual flash that would change the way I viewed myself" (Frank Maier).As we know, it is Allah who is the Teacher and it is HE who guides.
Peace.
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Peace be upon you Doc,
I do have faith that we all recieve "wahi", but I cannot know for sure , at that time, wether what I recieved was "wahi" or not until I try to nourish that "wahi". If I bring forth good fruit, only then will I know.
So I disagree that we can know one day that we recieved "wahi" in order to abstain the next.
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marie
Rashad Khalifa also claimed that he received alwahy roll ?
What about Allah saying that you will receive Allah's Guidance; No Guidance is Guidance but Allah's; Allah Guides those who He Wishes; and so on... Receivng The Guidance from Allah if not Alwahy, then what could it be ? Wonder!
drfazl
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drfazl,
Rashad Khalifa also claimed that he received alwahy roll ?
What about Allah saying that you will receive Allah's Guidance; No Guidance is Guidance but Allah's; Allah Guides those who He Wishes; and so on... Receivng The Guidance from Allah if not Alwahy, then what could it be ? Wonder!
Peace be upon you Doc,
You have really got me thinking about this "WITNESSING" part, it makes a lot of sense, I just cannot figure outthough how I KNOW FOR SURE if I am recieving inspiriation. There are times when I TRULY though I was, but turned out later that I was wrong. For example, when I first found the submission.org site, I thought I found it all, but that 19 fitna turned out to be just that, a fitna(trial).
Peace be upon you Marie,
Rashad Khalifa also claimed that he received alwahy
EXACTLY!! You stated very clearly the problem that was in my mind. Thank you.
I think brother Kyle (idolfree) gets what I mean. There is two kinds of alwahy (inspiration) the divine inspiration and the false inspiration which is originated from our imaginary
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Peace be upon you Doctor,
Is there false inspiration? It is otherwise called delusion.
Whatever name we give to it, the question remains, how does one know that the "information" that comes in is Inspiration or Delusion?
There are far too many times when I had something "come to me", but later, through the process of debating, was proven to be false.
Further, how much inspiration do we get before we fast? What I mean is, do we have to understand a whole concept or just part of it before we fast according to your understanding?
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Peace
Inspiration is only for the Believers; those who Believe in Allah's Grant of Wisdom which alone shall help us live in this world free from worry or fear.
Inspiration or wahy is the unfailing Wisdom, an abstract reality that propels us through our Wishes and Commands Be and It Is! Be free from fear and worries and It Is! The journey shall Witness all Laws of (knowledge on) Physics are just a myth, a kids' stuff and a fairy tale. The Wahy or Wisdom shall come to you as the Sign from Allah which when descends upon you, you will see your ascent towards Wisdom is certain. This is day one of Ramadhan. Like this Allah promises a minimum of 30 Signs (ayats) from Him each year. Do not equate with or weigh human knowledge over Allah's Wisdom!
May Allah Bless Us with Wisdom which shall ditch human 'knowledge'!
drfazl
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In the case of those who say that month only equals the full moon, what about the passage in chpt. 2 that says that 1 day of missed fast can be compensated for feeding 1 person.
Later on in the Koran in chpt. 58 it is stated that the compensation for missing 2 months worth of fasting is to feed 60 people.
I think this means that the Koran obviously equates 2 months with 60 days, and 1 month with 30 days.
Also what did the Arabs who followed Roman and Persian months call them. I'm sure they called them shahr/ash-hur also.
But it seems that the Koran thinks that a month is 30 days, and two months is 60 days.
Godbless,
Anwar -
I have been pondering the idea of Ramadan being 30 days, not 30 days in a row, as the person who started this thread was pointing to.
If the Quran refers to Ramadan as the month the Quran was revealed, does it only mean the first time it was related or started?
If the Quran was given to Muhammad over many years , wouldn't it make sense that it would have been revealed in every month ?
I like what the original poster said about fasting after one has received a revelation.
After one has received enlightenment, a new understanding, etc., then fast the next day.
A few days ago I completed the traditional Ramadan fasting, but it is done more as an obligation, or duty. So now I am trying to find a new understanding of Ramadan and fasting.
I would welcome discussions on this.