Shahr/month in the light of the quran
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peace Ayman, all,
Perhaps, an indirect argument is from verses such as 2217 where we know that there is big fighting during "al-shahr al-haram". We also know that the whole context of chapter 9 (or the very long chapter 8, since the "bism Allah" are the only seperators) is about fighting the idolaters who broke their treaty. 981 indicates that the time of a particularly big fight that the hypocites were fearful from was a hot time of the year.
I think the verse 981 is not decisive if the length of hot time = several months 4, 5, ...
(981) doesn't imply a specific period of extreme heat.
If the four restricted months correspond to the season of autumn in order to preserve wildlife in the northern hemisphere and the month of ramadhan is the first retricted month, I deduce that it could not be a month of exteme heat.
The season of automn could be a hot period..
What do you think about the chapter 106; we are told that Quraysh accomplish their journey in winter and summer; I deduce they don?t travel during the season of autumn which could correspond to the period of the four restricted month and where they receive "alhujjaj / Pilgrims" (919).
The word "shahr" doesn't mean "month".
The full-moon cycle is not the alone possibility (996)
- Initiator of morning and Maker of the night to reside in; and the sun and the moon for counting. Such is the measure of the Noble, the Knowledgeable.
I think that it refers to "ayyam ma3doodat". I don?t yet agree with the view that "ma3doodat" means "few". The word "3adad" simply means "count" and "ma3doodat" simply means "counted".
I consider "Few" as a consequence of the term "counted", If abstinence is decreed for us during a whole month or two months, We should read a month instead of "counted days" in the same way in 492.
In the same chapter, Allah explains us how to determin the four restricted months
- They ask you regarding the new moons, Say ?They are a timing mechanism for the people as well as for Alhajj.? And piety is not that you would enter a home from its back, but piety is whomever is righteous and come to the homes from their main doors. And be aware of God that you may succeed.
That is not how to determine the restricted full-moon cycles. The new-moons times the 7aj/bargain by telling us when it will END.
I don't agree, the new moon could indicate both the beginning and the end and which is the begenning of the following month.
Why do you say that the new moons CANNOT be witnessed by everybody?
There is a solution to every problem, if I cannot witness it and my neighbor can witness it, it is sufficient.
Thanks
Marie
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Peace Marie, all,
I think the verse 981 is not decisive if the length of hot time = several months 4, 5, ...
(981) doesn't imply a specific period of extreme heat.
If the four restricted months correspond to the season of autumn in order to preserve wildlife in the northern hemisphere and the month of ramadhan is the first retricted month, I deduce that it could not be a month of exteme heat.
The season of automn could be a hot period..
What do you think about the chapter 106; we are told that Quraysh accomplish their journey in winter and summer; I deduce they don?t travel during the season of autumn which could correspond to the period of the four restricted month and where they receive "alhujjaj / Pilgrims" (919).
Ancient Arabs used a 5 season system and sometimes even a 6 season system NOT 4 as we have nowadays.
In the 5 season system, they had a season called "qayz" between "sayf" (which was spring- early summer) and "karif". The time of intense heat ("ramadhan") would have fallen in "qayz" NOT "sayf".
The 6 season system split "kharif" into "rabi3 al-thani" (second spring = early fall) and "kharif" (late fall). In this system each season lasted two months.
The word "shahr" doesn't mean "month".
The full-moon cycle is not the alone possibility (996)
- Initiator of morning and Maker of the night to reside in; and the sun and the moon for counting. Such is the measure of the Noble, the Knowledgeable.
Right now, given all the evidence, the full-moon cycle the best available interpretation.
I consider "Few" as a consequence of the term "counted", If abstinence is decreed for us during a whole month or two months, We should read a month instead of "counted days" in the same way in 492.
I still have to think about this. Why can't 30 days be "counted"? Can't we count to 30?
492 speaks of fasting 2 full-moon cycles NOT 2 months.
I don't agree, the new moon could indicate both the beginning and the end and which is the begenning of the following month.
How do you know that the moon is new wihout having to keep track of the cycle? Remember, there are two crescents. With the full moon, you don't have to keep track of the cycle and it is obvious to everybody.
Why do you say that the new moons CANNOT be witnessed by everybody?
If they were witnessed by everybody, then why do people differ on the start of Ramadhan EVERY year?
There is a solution to every problem, if I cannot witness it and my neighbor can witness it, it is sufficient.
Then according to 2185 ONLY your neighbor should fast because you DIDN'T witness it.
Peace and all best wishes,
Ayman
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Peace brother Shuaib,
for those who are claiming that shahr doesn't mean month, i am just curious... then WHAT is a month actually called?? what was the nomenclature of the calendrical system, since clearly there was one present even before islam.
Please see the following "pre-quranic" Southern Arabic inscription
http//www.mnh.si.edu/epigraphy/e_pre-islamic/fig04_sabaean_img.htm
Please note line 3 where month is actually written as ("warkh") and NOT "shahr".
as far the question of what the beginning of the month is (full moon verses hilal)... i also agree that it makes much more sense to start the month with the sighting of the hilal. An argument was made that it is more accurate (since hilal occurs at both the beginning and the end of the month but full moon only once).. but in the desert, the sky does not just disappear for several consecutive days! at night, nothing is brighter and more obvious than the moon.
According to this only poeple in the desert should fast because only they can witness.
And if you can put yourself in their shoes, it makes much more sense to start the month with the NEW presence of the hilaal (a stark contrast, either there's a hilaal or there isn't)
If what you are saying is true then how come people differ EVERY year about when Ramadan starts?
They even differ in countries that are mostly deserts.
versus a full moon or NEAR full moon which is much tougher to discern, drawing a line and comparing the halves, 100% symmetric versus 90% symmetric.
It is easy to spot whether a circle is symmetric or not and everybody is able to see the full moon and not just people living in the desert.
that is too convoluted a system, and it would be much easier to just say either it's there (hilaal) or it's not there (new moon, i.e. invisible). and indeed all historical evidence points to that, and indeed there can be no obvious theory to describe what advantage there would be to flip-flop at some period in time.
What historical evidence? The God is telling ALL people REGARDLESS of what calendar system they use EXACTLY when to start the fast based on cosmic phenomena NOT based on some monthly calendar.
Which brings me to another question... is it just me, or are people on this forum being skeptical just for the sake of being skeptical??
It is not "just you". The majority of people think that way too.
For example, some claiming that the Quran should not be titled the Quran. Forget the fact that the Quran refers to itself as the Quran about 70 times..
It also refers to OTHER readings/"quran" in 1331 and 1788 so the word "quran" is not a name of only this honorable reading/"quran". Moreover, the word "quran" has a meaning and is not meaningless, hence it must be translated. Perhaps if people know the meaning they would READ it and understand it for themselves instead of hanging it on their walls and getting their clergy to read it and understand it for them.
but what difference does it make one way or the other?
Just because you can't see the difference, it doesn't mean that in TRUTH there is none.
It seems people are just trying to be skeptical and put out some wacky theory for really no gain other than attention or intellectual passtime. nothing can be gained from that kind of attitude.
I can't speak for everybody, but I know that I gained a lot of knowledge from those debates.
I hope you will too.
Peace and all best wishes,
Ayman
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Salaamun alaikum Ayman, Marie, Wakas and all,
Very fascinating discussion indeed. Thanks for this. I'd like to point out something if I may.
2/189 uses the word 'ahillat' which you seem to think the singular is 'hilaal'. Its using the second 'ha' (NOT the one after jim, like the 'halal' food 'ha').
Last night, I noticed something
2/173 , 5/3 and other food prohibition verses uses the SECOND 'ha' in thier 'uhilla', quite unlike 2/187 (the made halal for u on night of the fast ' verse) which uses the first 'ha'
The 'uhilla' of 2/173, 5/3 are of THE SAME root as 2/189's 'ahillat', thereby throwing off 'halal' food labels worldwide (hehe).
Please comment on this.
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Peace brother mq,
Very fascinating discussion indeed. Thanks for this. I'd like to point out something if I may.
2/189 uses the word 'ahillat' which you seem to think the singular is 'hilaal'. Its using the second 'ha' (NOT the one after jim, like the 'halal' food 'ha').
Last night, I noticed something
2/173 , 5/3 and other food prohibition verses uses the SECOND 'ha' in thier 'uhilla', quite unlike 2/187 (the made halal for u on night of the fast ' verse) which uses the first 'ha'
The 'uhilla' of 2/173, 5/3 are of THE SAME root as 2/189's 'ahillat', thereby throwing off 'halal' food labels worldwide (hehe).
Please comment on this.
I think that "uhil" in 2173 and 53 means "offered (food)". In such case "ahila(t)", if derived from the same meaning would mean something like "(food) offerings". Although you make an interesting observation, especially given that the "7ajj"/bargain involves food donations, I don't think that "offerings" would make much sense in the context 2189 and "crescents" seems to fit better.
With all best wishes and peace,
Ayman
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Peace Ayman, all,
Hence, if you didn't keep track of the number of days and happen to go outside and notice a crescent, you will not know right away if it is the beginning or end of the cycle and you will have to wait until the next day to see if it disappeared or became larger.
This is incorrect. Depending on whether it is the beginning or end of a cycle, the moon crescent will be on different sides. If the cycle is ending, the crescent will be on the left side. If the cycle is beginning, the crescent will be on the right side.
I still believe it is easier to see the difference between no moon, and moon; like digital logic, either a '0' or '1'. Discerning symmetry in the moon seems more difficult.
I also agree with Shuaib's observation that in the desert, the moon is much more apparent. Also, let us not forget that living in the city, or even the suburbs, where we are surrounded by the presence of light (any light, even if it is not directly visible), will make a huge difference in how bright the sky appears.
One needs to only go camping in a remote area to realize how much of the night sky we ordinarily do not see.Lastly, I don't believe one can necessarily take the Quran out of its geography and try to apply it everywhere. I think we should understand this topic as a general idea of abstaining for a lunar cycle (or however many days one understands it as).
For instance, where I live (temperate rainforest), it is not uncommon to rain (or be heavily overcast with clouds) for one consecutive week, during which time the moon is not visible at all. Does that mean my fast should wait until the next lunar cycle when I can "visibly witness" the new moon (or full moon)?
What if by the time the next cycle comes around, it has again been raining for several days and I can't "visibly witness" the new moon (or full moon)?
Should I wait another month and hopefully it won't be raining the next time around?I think witnessing does not need to be a physical witnessing.
peace
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Salaamun alaikum Ayman,
I think that "uhil" in 2173 and 53 means "offered (food)". In such case "ahila(t)", if derived from the same meaning would mean something like "(food) offerings". Although you make an interesting observation, especially given that the "7ajj"/bargain involves food donations, I don't think that "offerings" would make much sense in the context 2189 and "crescents" seems to fit better
.Ok, so you interpret 'maa uhilla lighairillah bihi' as 'what is offered for other than Allah with it' ? I.e, meat which is gotten by uttering names of 'other gods' ?
I'm beginning to wonder this because 'halal meat' which we get isn't given free, its actually for the sake of profit, not Allah. (that's an irrelevant issue, btw)What is ur interpretation of al-hajj please ?
thanks
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Peace be upon you Ayman,
What can I say man, fantastic as usual!!!!
I cant tell you how excited I am right now! I am sitting here cathcing up on this thread and pumping my fist in the air like I am watching a football game!
We are so close to the answer!
Can someone teach me how to put pictures into my posts. I have some intersting things to share regarding ancient Kemetic(egyptian) teachigs and the moon (when the time is right).
I need time to reflect on this all, I hope I can add something soon.
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Peace be upon you MQ,
Could you please elaborate more on what you are explaining. I am lost and want to be able to think it over with everyone else.
Thanks Bro.
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Peace Shuaib,
Which brings me to another question... is it just me, or are people on this forum being skeptical just for the sake of being skeptical?? For example, some claiming that the Quran should not be titled the Quran. Forget the fact that the Quran refers to itself as the Quran about 70 times.. but what difference does it make one way or the other? It seems people are just trying to be skeptical and put out some wacky theory for really no gain other than attention or intellectual passtime. nothing can be gained from that kind of attitude.
Nobody knows about people's intentions, except Allah of course!
But then let them do what they like, really. Personally, I find it stimulating to read new thoughts even if they were proven wrong later!Taj
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Salaam David,
You are right in what you mentioned earlier, and most certainly so in your last sentence
I think witnessing does not need to be a physical witnessing.
The problem is in the translation. The Arabic verb Shahida/Yashhadu cannot always be translated as " to witness". It could mean "to admit" as in , for example. It could mean "to testify" as in . It could mean " to agree" as in . Or "to argue" or "to question" as in ?and so on
In the case of it certainly is much more than just what meets the eye.
If we want to translate "to witness" into Arabic then the translation would be Shahida/Yashhadu
But to translate the Arabic into English then the possibilities are much broader.Taj
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Salaam Kyle,
Good to see you, bro
Basically, Im saying, the word used in 2/189 for 'new moons' (ahillat) is the SAME word used in 5/3 when talking about food 'sacrificed' or 'offered' (uHILLA) for the sake of other than Allah.
Ironically, this word 'sacrificed' (uhilla) DOES NOT use the same 'h' as the word 'halal' which uses a different 'h'. This makes the word different entirely.
hope that helps, Kyle.
peace
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Peace be upon you,
I disagree, to WITNESS is to SEE something with your eyes and therefore you KNOW it. All of the above examples imply JUST THAT.
You make a big mistake to think otherwise. Even the ancients taugh the same. They used the symbolizm of the right eye of Ausar(Osirus).
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Salams Ayman,
Please see the following "pre-quranic" Southern Arabic inscription
http//www.mnh.si.edu/epigraphy/e_pre-islamic/fig04_sabaean_img.htm
Please note line 3 where month is actually written as ("warkh") and NOT "shahr".
That was a really fascinating weblink that you posted! I actually get very interested in ancient aspects of civilization. Anyway, I'm sure you didn't really mean Arabic. The transliteration certainly sounds like Arabic or a semetic language but the inscription itself is in some other ancient script, not Phonecian and I dont think it's Aramaic. ??? Any ideas??
Anyway, if you check an Arab lexicon under wa-ra-kha, it's quite obvious that it was not used in Arabic to mean month. So we're back to square one, if shahr does not mean month then what does?
shuaib wrote
as far the question of what the beginning of the month is (full moon verses hilal)... i also agree that it makes much more sense to start the month with the sighting of the hilal. An argument was made that it is more accurate (since hilal occurs at both the beginning and the end of the month but full moon only once).. but in the desert, the sky does not just disappear for several consecutive days! at night, nothing is brighter and more obvious than the moon.According to this only poeple in the desert should fast because only they can witness.
I'm sure you really didn't mean that and were just playing devil's advocate. But my point was that Arabic obviously came from ARABIA, which happened to be a desert. So when we examine the language, it's best to keep that context in mind, though the conclusions are WIDELY applicable once you determine a meaning of the Arabic words.
If what you are saying is true then how come people differ EVERY year about when Ramadan starts?
They even differ in countries that are mostly deserts.
Well I didn't say that no one would differ. Nowadays Muslims can differ about the smallest things. But usually these days, they don't differ in a single region in the Arab countries, they differ from country to country. And obviously atmospheric conditions play a big role, and the visibility curves of the hilaal play a big role too (see moonsighting.com).
Believe me though, even if we called the full moon the beginning, Muslims would find a way to fight about it. But in this day and age it reallyis irrelevant since we can actually CALCULATE which day the hilaal AND the full moon will be with remarkable accuracy (whether we can see it or not).
It is easy to spot whether a circle is symmetric or not and everybody is able to see the full moon and not just people living in the desert.
Well it's great if you can tell if something is 100% symmetric of 95% symmetric, but that tends to be beyond most people's capabilities. And if someone doubts you, you're going to take a picture of the moon bisect it perfectly in half, overlap it etc to prove it to them. With hilaal, either it's there... or it's not there. Simple.
What historical evidence? The God is telling ALL people REGARDLESS of what calendar system they use EXACTLY when to start the fast based on cosmic phenomena NOT based on some monthly calendar.
Historical evidence means history, i.e. what has been recorded by people since the Prophet's time. You can just blatantly dismiss history without providing SOME reason for why history gives a different story than you give. If the Quran TRULY wanted the months to start by the full-moon, then obviously the Prophet would have done that. Now what motivation would Muslims have to change that to the hilaal?? How why and when did this happen?
It also refers to OTHER readings/"quran" in 1331 and 1788 so the word "quran" is not a name of only this honorable reading/"quran". Moreover, the word "quran" has a meaning and is not meaningless, hence it must be translated. Perhaps if people know the meaning they would READ it and understand it for themselves instead of hanging it on their walls and getting their clergy to read it and understand it for them.
I won't respond to this since the verses you mentioned clearly are not supporting your view. One only needs to look it up to see that.
But I will say the word "Quran" HAS meaning, and the meaning is best preserved by using the Arabic. I will post more on this in the future in a new topic.
Anyway, I'm also not sure what your bottom line is. Where is all this leading? Why the new interpretations and claims that shahr does not mean month? What's the catch?
wassalam
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Peace be upon you Shuiab,
if shahr does not mean month then what does?
Who cares D Clear your mind or pre concieved ideas FIRST, then you won't go into this reading LOOKING for something, but instead, open to recieve what is there.
The word "jumah" means "ASSEMBLY", but later was given to the day Friday to make thier "sabbath" look legitamate. So do we have to go around now looking for the real word for "friday"?
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Salam Idolfree,
I disagree with you saying that to witness must be to see with your own eyes.
Then what about ashhadu an lah ilaha ilalah.
I witness that there is no god except GOD. Here witness is used, but none sees GOD, except may be with their hearts.
What do you think ?
Elke
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Peace be upon you Elke,
I disagree with you saying that to witness must be to see with your own eyes.
Then what about ashhadu an lah ilaha ilalah.
I witness that there is no god except GOD. Here witness is used, but none sees GOD, except may be with their hearts.
What do you think ?
That depends on what you consider a "God" to be.
To me, the God is ALL THINGS, which includes the seen and unseen worlds. SO since we can see part of the WHOLE, we can witness that there is no God but the God. That is why there is no mate and therefore can be no son, because the God is ALL THINGS, and the physical side manifests from the UNSEEN side.
We can never compare the God to anything because we can never understand fully the UNSEEN side, but we can witness the physical side.
we can never look at an aboject and say "That is god" because we cannot see the UNSEEN side of things.
The physical creation is like thoughts in the Mind of the god, just as we have thougts in our Minds. One of Shakespeares "thoughts" becomes a character in a book, but the character cannnot say "I am shakespeare", yet the charater is a thought in Skakespeares Mind.
Is there ANY other instance of "Shahada (witnessing)" that seems to contradict my position? Please provide it.
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Peace be upon you MQ,
Good to see you, bro
Good to see you as well bro D
Basically, Im saying, the word used in 2/189 for 'new moons' (ahillat) is the SAME word used in 5/3 when talking about food 'sacrificed' or 'offered' (uHILLA) for the sake of other than Allah.
So which verse do you think uses the wrong translation?
Ironically, this word 'sacrificed' (uhilla) DOES NOT use the same 'h' as the word 'halal' which uses a different 'h'. This makes the word different entirely.
hope that helps, Kyle.
I get lost when you start talking about "halal", is this a derivative of "uhilla"?
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Salaam Shuaib,
That was a really fascinating weblink that you posted! I actually get very interested in ancient aspects of civilization. Anyway, I'm sure you didn't really mean Arabic. The transliteration certainly sounds like Arabic or a semetic language but the inscription itself is in some other ancient script, not Phonecian and I dont think it's Aramaic. ??? Any ideas??
The inscription is definitely in a Southern Arabic dialect but it is in a kind of Arabic script called Arabic Musnad script (as opposed to the newer connected Arabic Kufic script we use today). Kufic Arabic script only became more popular than Musnad Arabic script in the late 6-7th century AD.
Script is not "language". It is merely symbols/fonts. It is vocabulary and grammar that define language. Hence, you were able to make out most of the transliteration where the Kufic script is used in place of the Musnad script.
Just to give you an example, the expression "shahr ramadan alathi unzila fihi alkitab" can be considered Arabic despite that it uses characters from the completely unrelated language of English that is even non-semitic. Hence, an English speaker would not be able to understand it at all, but an Arabic speaker who only knows about the equivalent characters would.
Anyway, if you check an Arab lexicon under wa-ra-kha, it's quite obvious that it was not used in Arabic to mean month. So we're back to square one, if shahr does not mean month then what does?
If you check Al-Mo7it Arabic Lexicon, you will find that it does give the meaning of wa-ra-kha as "specifying of date" ("7adad tarikh"). In fact, given that the Arabic word for date, "tarikh", is clearly related to "warkh" but bears no relation whatsoever to "shahr" and if one has no preconceived opinions, then based on etymology, "warkh" is more likely to mean "month" than "shahr". Moreover, the inscription doesn't leave room for you or I to guess what "warkh" means. It is clearly used to mean "month" in the inscription and hence the name of a month is given right after it. So I already answered your question but you are just being argumentative.
What we are after here is not how you or a modern Arab understands a certain word. What we are after is how a "pre-quranic" Arab would have understood it. The best evidence available is the internal evidence from the great reading. The archeological evidence simply confirms what I had already found out based on the great reading.
I'm sure you really didn't mean that and were just playing devil's advocate. But my point was that Arabic obviously came from ARABIA, which happened to be a desert. So when we examine the language, it's best to keep that context in mind, though the conclusions are WIDELY applicable once you determine a meaning of the Arabic words.
You are merely speculating. There is nothing in the verse that says or alludes to anything about being in the desert in order to witness "al-shahr".
If what you are saying is true then how come people differ EVERY year about when Ramadan starts?
They even differ in countries that are mostly deserts.
Well I didn't say that no one would differ. Nowadays Muslims can differ about the smallest things. But usually these days, they don't differ in a single region in the Arab countries, they differ from country to country. And obviously atmospheric conditions play a big role, and the visibility curves of the hilaal play a big role too (see moonsighting.com).
Now you are refuting your own earlier argument that the new-moon is easy to spot.
Believe me though, even if we called the full moon the beginning, Muslims would find a way to fight about it. But in this day and age it reallyis irrelevant since we can actually CALCULATE which day the hilaal AND the full moon will be with remarkable accuracy (whether we can see it or not).
But I don't believe you and please don't take it personally and instead bring evidence instead of speculation. If the full-moon was the marker then EVERYBODY would see it and no one would have to rely on the Mullahs to tell us when the fasting period begins.
How many times this year have you personally seen the new-moon?
Please answer honestly.
It is easy to spot whether a circle is symmetric or not and everybody is able to see the full moon and not just people living in the desert.
Well it's great if you can tell if something is 100% symmetric of 95% symmetric, but that tends to be beyond most people's capabilities. And if someone doubts you, you're going to take a picture of the moon bisect it perfectly in half, overlap it etc to prove it to them. With hilaal, either it's there... or it's not there. Simple.
Firstly, unless someone is severely myopic, humans can naturally and easily see symmetry. They naturally appreciate symmetry and even tend to associate symmetry with beauty.
Secondly, your argument for a 95% or even 90% hypothetical symmetry is false because it will never happen. From half-moon to full moon is only 7 days so the MOST you will ever get is 85% symmetry the night before or the night after the full-moon. Again, unless someone has severe vision problems or is just not paying attention, they would be able to make out the full-moon.
What historical evidence? The God is telling ALL people REGARDLESS of what calendar system they use EXACTLY when to start the fast based on cosmic phenomena NOT based on some monthly calendar.
Historical evidence means history, i.e. what has been recorded by people since the Prophet's time.
History is the subjective point of view of the historian. Hence, even today in the information age people differ about the history of the last fifty years in the Middle East. Just go read Western and Arab history books of the last fifty years of the Arab-Israeli conflict and see how much they differ. Now, you tell us that you know for sure the history of the Middle East many centuries ago!
There are many FALSEHOODS that have been recorded by people before, during, and after all prophets' times. Take Hadiths for example. The first recorded Hadith manuscript, the Sa7ifa of Hammam predates the first manuscript of the great reading. According to your criteria, we should all have faith in Hadiths more than in the great reading.
You can just blatantly dismiss history without providing SOME reason for why history gives a different story than you give.
I did provide evidence from the great reading and physical archeological evidence. What evidence other than hearsay can you provide?
According to history "shahr" means "month" and Abraha's objective was this alleged important place called Maka(t) where he was defeated. Just look at the archeological evidence in the inscription that you were interested in and see how the archeological evidence gives a totally different view than history.
If the Quran TRULY wanted the months to start by the full-moon, then obviously the Prophet would have done that. Now what motivation would Muslims have to change that to the hilaal?? How why and when did this happen?
According to evidence from the great reading, archeological evidence, and even Arabic dictionaries such as "Lisan Al-3arab", the word "shahr" would have been most likely understood by a "pre-quranic" Arab to mean "full-moon". Hence, the prophet would have understood it as "full-moon" and would have applied it accordingly.
Moreover, even according to the history books that you appeal to, the present so-called Islamic calendar system was only established during the time of Khalifa Umar Ibn-ElKhattab. Hence, even the staunchest Hadiths and historians followers are forced to admit that all his life, the prophet fasted in the time of heat/"ramadhan".
It also refers to OTHER readings/"quran" in 1331 and 1788 so the word "quran" is not a name of only this honorable reading/"quran". Moreover, the word "quran" has a meaning and is not meaningless, hence it must be translated. Perhaps if people know the meaning they would READ it and understand it for themselves instead of hanging it on their walls and getting their clergy to read it and understand it for them.
I won't respond to this since the verses you mentioned clearly are not supporting your view. One only needs to look it up to see that.
In other words, you don't have any valid argument.
But I will say the word "Quran" HAS meaning, and the meaning is best preserved by using the Arabic. I will post more on this in the future in a new topic.
If you really know the meaning, then please translate it instead of giving excuses.
Anyway, I'm also not sure what your bottom line is. Where is all this leading? Why the new interpretations and claims that shahr does not mean month? What's the catch?
The bottom line is finding the truth. The catch is that we will not find it if we start from preconceptions. Please try to stop being "caught" in your preconceptions and just look at the evidence without any preconceived conclusions.
With all best wishes and salaam,
Ayman