If "Only Allah", then "Allah Alone" is our watchword
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of course i want to understand.
Do you mean;
God is sufficient for us=Gods system is sufficient for us (which does include the doctor), Yes?God has provided us with what we need and things to aspire to, gave us a brain
to solve problems, gave us differences to cover our needs from street cleaners
to presidents, from privates to generals, a job for everyone, This eco system
is interconnected. The rain the sun the soil the elelments the plants which
give off carbon monoxide all work in a repeative cycle, same for the ocean,
same for us, herbs, water, minerals etc., keep us healthy.O people, enlightenment has come to you herein from your Lord, and healing for anything that troubles your hearts, and guidance, and mercy for the believers.
Then eat from all the fruits, following the design of your Lord, precisely. From their bellies comes a drink of different colors, wherein there is healing for the people. This should be (sufficient) proof for people who reflect.
"And when I get sick, He heals me.
God is in contol
Peace
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I couldn't understand that , let me put it again
if Allah alone is sufficient for us, why then go to the doctor at all?To get killed; or to commit suicide on the part of the patients; or inducing the doctors to commit homicide! Finally our death will be at the hands of the doctors on their specialised death bed, in the ICU, under the care of bands of super specialists. If we believe Allah had directed us to the doctors, then, when we die there in the end - it is that Allah had lied and misguided us deliberately. And it is also that whenever we are ill with disease, we should not turn to Allah in prayer at all for Allah had already directed us to the systems of doctors to suffer the worst before death and hit the bucket financially too.
Here is Allah's system
And certainly We sent messengers to peoples before you; We seized them with illness and affliction in order that they might humble themselves before me.It is up to us to rehearse the ayats in our day to day life or to while them away reciting ritually.
Here is Allah's system
And if Allah should touch you with illness, there is no remover of it except Him. And if He touches you with wellness - then He is over all things Potent.Now the question is the choice between the doctors and the God who is potent? and who are impotents? Whose system will you submit and surrender to?
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Peace 357.
Again I agree with drfazl.
6102 Such is GOD your Lord, ( HE wants total submission from all HIS creatures, to HIM ALONE!) there is no god except HE ( HE has no partners, no wife/girlfriend, no son, no daughter etc?HE is Unique, everything else is HIS creation!) the Creator of all things. You shall serve/worship ( And follow/trust in) HIM ALONE. ( Do not rely on anyone else) HE is in control of all things.? ( Yesterday, today , tomorrow and forever!)
Peace.
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There was a man that suffered shipwreck, so he prayed to God to save him. A fishing boat came and wanted to pick him up, but the man refused saying that God will save him. A cargo vessel came to aid him, but he refused with the explanation that God would save him. The man drowned, and upon entering the afterlife he asked God why He didn't save him. God said "I sent you two boats to save you, but you refused my help... that's why you drowned."
The moral of the story, Allah works through natural laws and the creation... not through imagined magic and miracles. In my humble opinion, we know Allah when we can see Allahs signs and Life in this very world. If we make up a separate spiritual or religious world or dimension in order to cater for Allah, then we we have failed to see how Allah is The Living in THIS same world as we are functioning in. Allah and the unseen is not separate from us... it is just that we have to open up to be able to sense and appreciate it. Allah can open us up to see this, if we ask for it. It's all connected and one!
To get killed; or to commit suicide on the part of the patients; or inducing the doctors to commit homicide! Finally our death will be at the hands of the doctors on their specialised death bed, in the ICU, under the care of bands of super specialists. If we believe Allah had directed us to the doctors, then, when we die there in the end - it is that Allah had lied and misguided us deliberately. And it is also that whenever we are ill with disease, we should not turn to Allah in prayer at all for Allah had already directed us to the systems of doctors to suffer the worst before death and hit the bucket financially too.
Why should we think that taking part in this world is equal to not believing in Allah? Allah made this world for us to functioning in and to connect to "him" while living here. This place is the whole point! It is in THIS context we should remember Allah.
By the same logic, i.e. not going to the doctor in order to rely on Allah, then we must by necessity also deny the services of farmers, technicians and EVERYONE that can do some service for us. This means we'd have to grow our own food, produce our own fertilizer, dig our own wells, forge our own tools and learn everything all by ourselves.
How is this different from taking the help of doctors? Should I consider myself a disbeliever just because I went to the surgeon to take my appendix out... because I wasn't in the mood of dying a painful death and leaving a family behind in great trouble and sorrow? I don't think this has anything to do with whether the medical practitioners can sometimes destroy us due to their ignorance... so can other professionals too. The point is that we must rely on Allah and seek Allah's help AND accept the help that comes through situations. We live in a world. If we deny this then we don't understand Allah and our context.
Here is Allah's system
And certainly We sent messengers to peoples before you; We seized them with illness and affliction in order that they might humble themselves before me.It is up to us to rehearse the ayats in our day to day life or to while them away reciting ritually.
Here is Allah's system
And if Allah should touch you with illness, there is no remover of it except Him. And if He touches you with wellness - then He is over all things Potent.Now the question is the choice between the doctors and the God who is potent? and who are impotents? Whose system will you submit and surrender to?
Allah let's things happen as per our choices. If we seek Allah's help and blessings, we will get help and blessings. The problem is when we don't acknowledge/understand/see this reality for what it is. Allah is The Living. Allah is not a separate entitiy, separate from us and what happens. Allah is always present in all that happens. Allah cannot be separated away in ANY way. Thinking is Allah and of separation in the same thought means we haven't understood who reality is made up. Allah is potent, we and doctors are nothing without Allah. But doctors can help people by Allah's leave and permission... as a blessing to people. Allah has NOT ordained for us seclusion (isn't there an ayat about this in AQ somewhere?). (Note. I'm not saying we ARE Allah, I'm just saying that we must not think of Allah in terms of separation! If we do, we will be like all the religions)
I case I have misunderstood your points dr fazl, then please correct me. I was just sharing my ideas here. Peace!
Peace 357.
Again I agree with drfazl.
6102 Such is GOD your Lord, ( HE wants total submission from all HIS creatures, to HIM ALONE!) there is no god except HE ( HE has no partners, no wife/girlfriend, no son, no daughter etc?HE is Unique, everything else is HIS creation!) the Creator of all things. You shall serve/worship ( And follow/trust in) HIM ALONE. ( Do not rely on anyone else) HE is in control of all things.? ( Yesterday, today , tomorrow and forever!)
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What we need to ask ourselves, or rather what we need to ask Allah to make us understand, is what surrender and submission actually means. This is crucial.
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What does 'rely on' mean? We need to be sure about this. Do we trust in Allah by ignoring and avoiding his creation? Or do we rely on Allah and consciously accept 'his' blessings through the creations of this world?
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Ok, no offense here, I'm just spitting out a thought I had Let's not take this ayat to the extreme in that we totally disregard and disconnect from the actors of the world just because we don't rely on anything except Allah. It is like the sunnis who take the 'obey the messenger' as meaning to copy his actions in the toilet, his food preferences and all other irrelevant things. We misunderstand.
What we need to do is to realize that we can achieve NOTHING without Allah's leave. We cannot attribute our success in school to ourselves, we cannot attribute our relationship success to ourselves etc etc, because Allah gave us our brains and capacities for studying, out ability to learn reading. Allah gave us social competence so that we could get along in a relationship. EVERYTHING is thanks to Allah. But if I break a bone, then I will not be thankless to Allah by refusing the doctor who can set the bones in alignment so that the body then nicely can heal it as per Allah's system of life. Allah can act through doctors. What the doctors do to us, depends totally on what we as patients have to learn in life. What happens to us is between us and Allah. Our life and circumstances is OURS. We all have our own worlds and our job is to work our way back to Allah by increasing our understanding and vision of truth and reality.
So, actually I too agree with what dr fazl says, as a concept and idea, but I think we need to ponder how this idea should be expressed in practical life.
Peace dear friends!
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What we need to do is to realize that we can achieve NOTHING without Allah's leave. We cannot attribute our success in school to ourselves, we cannot attribute our relationship success to ourselves etc etc, because Allah gave us our brains and capacities for studying, out ability to learn reading. Allah gave us social competence so that we could get along in a relationship. EVERYTHING is thanks to Allah. But if I break a bone, then I will not be thankless to Allah by refusing the doctor who can set the bones in alignment so that the body then nicely can heal it as per Allah's system of life. Allah can act through doctors. What the doctors do to us, depends totally on what we as patients have to learn in life. What happens to us is between us and Allah. Our life and circumstances is OURS. We all have our own worlds and our job is to work our way back to Allah by increasing our understanding and vision of truth and reality.
So, actually I too agree with what dr fazl says, as a concept and idea, but I think we need to ponder how this idea should be expressed in practical life.
Peace dear friends!
Peace dear friend
May I add one exception, 4164;........... And Allah spoke to Moses with speech.
ALLAAH does not talk/help us directly. It has been always through His agents.
4165 messengers as bringers of good tidings and warners so that mankind will have no argument against Allah after the messengers. And ever is Allah Exalted in Might and Wise.Peace
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May I add one exception, 4164;........... And Allah spoke to Moses with speech.
Salaam!
I wonder what ' speech' means here. Did some vocal cords and oral cavity materialize in the surrounding nature to allow for audible speech to come forth, or did he hear spoken words in his head. I could imagine that he heard audible speech in his mind... but I would not think that the speech was audible in the air around him.
But that's just me.All the best!
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Salaam!
I wonder what ' speech' means here. Did some vocal cords and oral cavity materialize in the surrounding nature to allow for audible speech to come forth, or did he hear spoken words in his head. I could imagine that he heard audible speech in his mind... but I would not think that the speech was audible in the air around him.
But that's just me.All the best!
salaam
Exactly, that is for us to find out from al-kitaab insha allaah.
All the best to you insha allaah
peace -
There was a man that suffered shipwreck, so he prayed to God to save him. A fishing boat came and wanted to pick him up, but the man refused saying that God will save him. A cargo vessel came to aid him, but he refused with the explanation that God would save him. The man drowned, and upon entering the afterlife he asked God why He didn't save him. God said "I sent you two boats to save you, but you refused my help... that's why you drowned."
The moral of the story, Allah works through natural laws and the creation... not through imagined magic and miracles.
Peace dear friends!
If Allah works through natural laws of creation, can you describe the laws of creation? And the nature's Laws? And then also explain based on such Laws, how when prophet Musa was pushed close to the sea, it cleaved into two mountainous parts with a dry land in between for Musa and the believers to cross across?
"Allah is Needless, Absolute."
"All He has to say to a thing is 'BE' and it is!" Only Allah knows what His creation is
"And naught is what man is given of the wisdom."The scientists narration of laws and creation of nature are just Big-bangs which they would themselves negate soon after they theorise their ideas and concepts.
Salam
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Peace,
You were both right.
God intervenes according to His will, one time it can be like zulf's story and another time through a clear miracle. We must keep all our senses open, God's help can be through another human being, as well as minor manipulations of the physical world we live in. Most of the time God's help is subtle, but can be extensive as in the case when God opened the Sea for Moses. That was to be a prominent sign of God's might.
Nothing is impossible to God, He controls every atom of the world.
God bless you
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Peace Zulf
We must also ponder the " Shipwreck" allegory?
Is that from man or from God?
God will never break His promise.
Also, according to laws of physics, can someone exlplain the Resurrection?
God is the One who created you. He is the One who provides for you. He is the One who puts you to death. He is the One who resurrects you. Can any of your idols do any of these things? Be He glorified. He is much too exalted to have any partners.
May be someone else will come along, after I die , offering to resurrect me and I will not recognise the sign, hence I will not be resurrected also?
Peace
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What we need to do is to realize that we can achieve NOTHING without Allah's leave. We cannot attribute our success in school to ourselves, we cannot attribute our relationship success to ourselves etc etc, because Allah gave us our brains and capacities for studying, out ability to learn reading. Allah gave us social competence so that we could get along in a relationship. EVERYTHING is thanks to Allah.
Peace dear friends!
Regarding studies and education they have to keep improving, innovating and inventing until the world ends. The knowledge thus is forever justifiably substandard; but Allah is Most Wise, All-Knowing, Absolute, Astute, Creator, Sustainer, Bringer of Death from the living; and the living from the dead. And here is the word of Allah All that you possess, your efforts including your knowledge will be in vain. And what is with Allah will be lasting. Allah gave us the knowledge only to know clearly that our knowledge is insufficient, ignorant and thus it is 'semi' at any point of time.
You go to the doctors; they diagnose you to be suffering from terminal cancer and their ignorant medical super speciality says you will die in 3 months. We know now they are not the ones who shall possess the wisdom of bringing the life from the dead. We shun these ignorants and turn to God, the Most Able, Wise.
Allah created nature; and He is The God of all nature. God taught man, he is superior to all created things. Thus while man himself is a super natural one by the leave of God, can you just get a glimpse of an imagination as to who God, Allah, The Almighty is! Should He work through nature which by The Truth is inferior even to man? Allah directly deals with man communicating to Him. And man shall act above nature i.e. super naturally by His leave which He promises to His bondsmen.
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Peace Zulf
God is the One who created you. He is the One who provides for you. He is the One who puts you to death. He is the One who resurrects you. Can any of your idols do any of these things? Be He glorified. He is much too exalted to have any partners.
Peace
Can any of your idols The men, the matters and the material knowledge
What a watchword the above is! Those are the words that lifts and levitates us up from the idol worshiping that pulls us down with their gravitational theories.
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We must also ponder the " Shipwreck" allegory?
Those who wish may ponder it. The moral was to not be blind to Allah's blessings and help in everyday situations.
Is that from man or from God?
You mean those specific words? They are my words, relating a story I heard, so it's not God's direct word if anyone wonders.
God will never break His promise.
True
Also, according to laws of physics, can someone exlplain the Resurrection?
I don't know. I don't think so. At least I cannot.
God is the One who created you. He is the One who provides for you. He is the One who puts you to death. He is the One who resurrects you. Can any of your idols do any of these things? Be He glorified. He is much too exalted to have any partners.
May be someone else will come along, after I die , offering to resurrect me and I will not recognise the sign, hence I will not be resurrected also?
?? What ?
Peace bro
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Regarding studies and education they have to keep improving, innovating and inventing until the world ends. The knowledge thus is forever justifiably substandard; but Allah is Most Wise, All-Knowing, Absolute, Astute, Creator, Sustainer, Bringer of Death from the living; and the living from the dead. And here is the word of Allah All that you possess, your efforts including your knowledge will be in vain. And what is with Allah will be lasting. Allah gave us the knowledge only to know clearly that our knowledge is insufficient, ignorant and thus it is 'semi' at any point of time.
True, I believe so too
You go to the doctors; they diagnose you to be suffering from terminal cancer and their ignorant medical super speciality says you will die in 3 months. We know now they are not the ones who shall possess the wisdom of bringing the life from the dead. We shun these ignorants and turn to God, the Most Able, Wise.
Yes, the medical professionals are often very ignorant, and they very often take no heed of God. They often work by guessing. Of course, they can achieve nothing that Allah has not approved. If they are able to change something in the body that results in the body healing itself, it is all the same Allah blessing and power doing this.
Allah created nature; and He is The God of all nature. God taught man, he is superior to all created things. Thus while man himself is a super natural one by the leave of God, can you just get a glimpse of an imagination as to who God, Allah, The Almighty is! Should He work through nature which by The Truth is inferior even to man? Allah directly deals with man communicating to Him. And man shall act above nature i.e. super naturally by His leave which He promises to His bondsmen.
I think like this All of creation is real, and so it is natural. I cannot see why any of Allah's creation would be unnatural, or more than natural. I guess it depends on what we define 'natural' and 'nature' as. Perhaps 'that which natural scientists agree exists'.
In any case, nature, creation, is all we have... that's what we can comprehend to some extent. We cannot comprehend anything beyond Creation. That's why we cannot comprehend Allah.
How can we say that man in superior to nature? Man is part of nature, bound by the same laws like anything else. In addition we have free will and so on, but we are still bound by the laws of nature and creation. Had we been superior to nature, we would be have been able to change it's laws. We cannot. Perhaps we think we can rule nature and all other creatures, but man in over confident and arrogant, as described in the quran, and evident through history.I agree that Allah can communicate with anyone as per "his" leave.
All is law, Allah's law. If there is something that seems to be supernatural or above nature, it is so just because we don't understand Allah's laws fully. Some people e.g. would reject things such as acupuncture, qigong, reiki and auras as pseudoscience and fantasies. Anything real, whether people in general are able to sense or comprehend how it works or not, is still real. It follows law. If things won't follow law, they'd be irrational. Personally I don't think of Allah or "his" creation as irrational. It is only that some things we understand, and some things we don't.
Again I think it is a matter of definitions.
In any case... all praise to Allah
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Can any of your idols The men, the matters and the material knowledge
What a watchword the above is! Those are the words that lifts and levitates us up from the idol worshiping that pulls us down with their gravitational theories.
This is interesting. What make 'men, matters and knowledge' into idols?
I'd like to get to know your ideas better, to prevent any misunderstanding on my part.Peace brother
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All good things happen from Allah alone but all bad things befall us only from what our own hands have wrought. Our planning for the future, our activities and work are based essentially upon the limited knowledge we have experienced through our physical sensations and upon our abilities based on it and put in our efforts with brute tolerance. With all these rudimentary efforts we set our eyes upon ultimately the money, our only goal.
There is another ability within every individual, 'the power of the soul' in the heart of hearts by which we wish for or mindfully and prayerfully reflect upon every subjective feeling placed in it as the 'need of the hour'. For example, the need of the hour is that we shall not suffer from any evil whatsoever from diseases to poverty; nor suffer from servitude; nor ourselves becoming aggressive and atrocious against the common man. There are these subjective warnings in our hearts that we shall not lie; backbite; dishonor the word given to; nor suspect; nor be proud; never rejoice over what you have gained materially; nor shall you grieve over what have lost from you; never fear nor worry for by all odds your savior is God.
He created for us the heavens and the earth and made them subservient to us so that we perch upon the Arsh, by His Leave. Until such time you gain it, He rules the roost; He blesses us just not the skies and the earth but His word is that He would make us inherit even the heavens of the world after! To be a believer of this order - we cannot believe in the knowledge of the physical sensations, experiences, explorations of the objective celestial bodies; and shun from our hearts the men, matters and materials as our needs.
God has created us as individuals looking up to Him with gratitude, in every breath of us. It is mandatory on us for us to believe and live as an individual and return unto Him on the hour determined for us, all alone, in the way He created us. If Allah alone is our creator, He alone is the nourisher, the sustainer, the savior, the enricher and the designer of our future - then only Allah and none else besides Him. This is the life of 'no - association - to - God'. These are the believers, the victorious in this world and in the world after.
.Beautiful!
Some remarks We may rejoice of material gains, as long as we do so by praising and thanking Allah and knowing fully that the same material gains are worthless in the real sense. But money can be a blessing from Allah in e.g. that it may buy us more free time in which we may develop ourselves and our connection with Allah further.
Evil, what is evil? Evil, I believe is something that takes us away from Allah. Therefore, disease and poverty may act as blessings, if we can turn those things into something, like wake up calls, that brings us closer to Allah.
Salaam!
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Shun the Jama'at if we fear 'The Day of Judgement'
Allah created us singly and we have to lead our lives by the Guidance within and each shall live as a discrete individual and then we are to return unto him singly in the way we were created and delivered into this universal noumenon. We will be questioned and judged individually and not as groups or jama'ats, the individuals of which are dependent on each other. The individuals belong to any group with their collective living feel independent of God himself. This is crime enough to be thrown into hell en masse. We cease to be an element of any group or member of a band of collective people, say, Jama'ats.
.Beautiful and very thought-worthy. People often hide behind groups, forgetting reality. Indeed, we are totally alone in this world, responsible for only ourselves... but many of us forget that we are actually responsible for ourselves. People love to blame things on anything except themselves.
Peace!
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I think like this All of creation is real, and so it is natural. I cannot see why any of Allah's creation would be unnatural, or more than natural. I guess it depends on what we define 'natural' and 'nature' as. Perhaps 'that which natural scientists agree exists'.
All nature is the same by creation in that when God intends a thing to be all that He says to it is 'Be' and it is! What is natural now is
God creates what He intends
As Creator He never stops creating
And He never copies His own creation
And thus no creation is the same as the other though they might seem alikeWhat we know is our knowledge, limited;
What we do not know is what is beyond our comprehension
'Nature' is what we know of-
'Natural' is the unending process of creation we know not.In any case, nature, creation, is all we have... that's what we can comprehend to some extent. We cannot comprehend anything beyond Creation. That's why we cannot comprehend Allah.
We know there is 'mind' in us though we cannot comprehend as to where it is; likewise we know for sure there is God with us, though we are not able to comprehend where He is; yet God is All-Knowing and makes us know for sure there is God and admoinshes us 'Be mindful of God!' Knowing and accepting what is beyond our comprehension is the 'natural' starting point of the Wisdom of Allah, dawning upon us.
How can we say that man in superior to nature? Man is part of nature, bound by the same laws like anything else. In addition we have free will and so on, but we are still bound by the laws of nature and creation. Had we been superior to nature, we would have been able to change it's laws. We cannot. Perhaps we think we can rule nature and all other creatures, but man in over confident and arrogant, as described in the quran, and evident through history.
It is true that the creation will ever be going on, nonstop because if the creator stops creating, the creation is dead and the Creator is no more. But it is not true. He brings the life from the land that is dead is a perfect example to His endless, ongoing creation. Yet the law of nature which we have postulated so arrogantly is fixed as death from the living and no life or resurrection after the death. But there is resurrection after the death and it will not be the same as before for, naturally there are no fixed laws as the mortal men on the earth comprehend - with reference to creation-death-all new creations of varyingly new orders. Allah says you know not; Allah Knows.
All is law, Allah's law. If there is something that seems to be supernatural or above nature, it is so just because we don't understand Allah's laws fully. Anything real, whether people in general are able to sense or comprehend how it works or not, is still real. It follows law. If things won't follow law, they'd be irrational. Personally I don't think of Allah or "his" creation as irrational. It is only that some things we understand, and some things we don't.
Again I think it is a matter of definitions.
We stop from fixing and defining; moving and extending within the material ambience of our physics' intellectual capacity.
In any case... all praise to Allah