Fast Poll
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Fasting is decreed upon us for a whole month (2185), not 10 days!
I believe the period begins when the first crescent of a new moon is sighted, as the Qur'an informs us that new moons (Literally crescents) are signs to mark fixed periods of time (2189). Calendars based on the Moon have the advantage of a very clear beginning to the month - New Moon. You can always guess the date - 1st for new moon crescent, about the 7th for half moon (D in the northern hemisphere), 15th for full moon, 21st for the other half moon, and 29th for the C shaped crescent.
Salam
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salam
i have very great respect for brother ayman.
I agree with him on shahr, siyyam, fasthowever, for me, shahr ramadan are three days of appearent full moon after the autum equinox.
Another interesting poll would have been " Are we in ramadan ?"
peace
Sister Noshirk.
Would you like to share your views on ramadan and shehr in detail?
I recently almost came to a conclusion regarding ramadan, and i do not believe that we are in ramadan, but would like to know your point of view.
Peace
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I voted 'no' because
-it seems the translation is for 'crescent moon' rather than full moon as far as I understand it.
-the Quran seems to talk about fasting for a month(s) (which ties in to the mention of a crescent moon as the beginning of a month) rather than x amount of days, I have read the posts here about 'completing the count' meaning 10 days but since it doesn't specifically say that, I'm not buying it so far.
-Ramadan in the Quran seems to be referring to a period after the rising of the star Sirius which is much later than the full moon after the summer solstice.
-traditional muslims always say that Ramadan is the 9th month which is odd in my opinion because it moves around i.e. in the western calendar which is fixed we have a start date (new year at winter solstice) so we can obviously say that september is the 9th month, yet the 9th month of the islamic calendar moves around constantly which is a contradiction I think. I know there is such a thing as islamic new year but this seems to have been connected to when Muhammed established himself in Medina(?) but a new year is when the sun starts another go around the earth not when some event happened. God mentions Ramadan in the Quran as pre-existing before Muhammed and says to follow the religion of Abraham which no doubt would have included a fasting month so it seems to me that to make something in Muhammed's life the new new year and therefore make the calendar move around constantly is a crazy innovation that Muhammed idolaters introduced and has no Quranic basis. So if we follow an old tradition of re-starting the count of the lunar months from the true new year (winter solstice) and the first new moon after that as the 1st month, then the 9th month would start around the same few weeks every year, mid August to mid September which is again far away from the summer soltice.
-"Ramadan" from the way various arabic speakers on here have translated it, apparently translates as 'after scorching heat' this would apply to autumn surely, not summer when we are still in the middle of scorching heat.
-fasting in autumn with shorter days seems to make more sense than fasting mid summer for health and perhaps agricultural reasons too and I firmly believe that God's religion is one that must make sense for the people otherwise we are doing it wrong, as he says he means no hardship for us.
Therefore I believe the true Ramadan for 2013 starts on 6th August (the predicted start of the 9th lunar month following the 2012 solstice) and runs until 5th October and I shall, God willing be attempting to fast between dawn and end of twilight (not dawn to sunset which I believe is wrong) for those times....unless I am convinced otherwise in the meantime. D
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Fasting is decreed upon us for a whole month (2185), not 10 days!
I believe the period begins when the first crescent of a new moon is sighted, as the Qur'an informs us that new moons (Literally crescents) are signs to mark fixed periods of time (2189). Calendars based on the Moon have the advantage of a very clear beginning to the month - New Moon. You can always guess the date - 1st for new moon crescent, about the 7th for half moon (D in the northern hemisphere), 15th for full moon, 21st for the other half moon, and 29th for the C shaped crescent.
This is false.
New moons are NEVER mentioned in the great reading. What is mentioned are crescents and those can be both the waxing and the waning crescents and they occur TWICE in the lunar cycle.
New moons are not literally crescents. Everyone knows that there are two crescents in the lunar cycle, the waxing and the waning crescent.
Peace,
Ayman
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This is false.
New moons are NEVER mentioned in the great reading. What is mentioned are crescents and those can be both the waxing and the waning crescents and they occur TWICE in the lunar cycle.
New moons are not literally crescents. Everyone knows that there are two crescents in the lunar cycle, the waxing and the waning crescent.
Peace,
Ayman
Reinventing out of whim, conjecture, and egoistical impulses
The real TRUTH is that Mr. Ayman's ideological belief boils down to an effort to simply deny the existence of the THIRD ARTICLE OF FAITH IN ISLAM, which I?ll explain later, but,
1ST The fact is that whether we like it or not; the terms ?Allaah?, ?The Qur?aan?, ?Islam?, and ?Muslims?, have found their rightful places within the global community and have all changed into PROPER names. The main reason is, fourteen centuries of numerous and frequent usage, has drawn global attention toward a PARTICULAR religion and culture.
The word ?Allaah?, just like its equivalent word, ?God? in English, must be treated just the same when it comes to writing it in English, i.e. we must CAPITALIZE it. Otherwise, we?ve not appreciated His majesty?s stature the way He deserves. God must not be replaced by ?the god?.
By using the definite article ?the? we have included Him among a bunch of other ?gods? and then separated Him from the rest by putting the definite article ?the? before it, i.e. calling Him ?the god?. ?The boy? means a certain specified boy from among others. So, using ?the god? for God is idolatry and committing blasphemy against Allaah, swt, God, the Almighty.
2ND ?The Qur?aan? is a proper name and is not supposed to be translated when used in another language like English. Muhammad is Muhammad no matter in what language. Translating The Qur?aan to ?the great reading? is certainly a great disrespect to its divine origin and stature, if not a blasphemy. The Torah (the Old Testament) is the Torah, the Injeel (the New Testament) is the Injeel, and the Qur?aan (the Last Testament), should likewise be the Qur?aan.
3RD The terms ?Islam? and ?Muslims? must not be translated either, not to an even somewhat popular terms like ?submitting? and ?submitters?, let alone ?peace making? and ?peace makers?! CHRISTIANS follow CHRISTIANITY, JEWS follow JUDAISM, and by the same token, MUSLIMS follow ISLAM. Now back to our main topic.
According to The Qur?aan, there exist THREE MAIN ARTICLES OF FAITH, which together and hand in hand, comprise the CONSTITUTION of ISLAM. These three main articles are defined, and declared as being obligatory on the part of Muslims to believe-in them. The outstanding examples of numerous verses in The Qur?aan regarding these three articles of faith, are verses 262, 569, and 2177.
Let us define these ARTICLES.1st Believing-in, worshiping, and obeying the ONE and ONLY GOD, ALLAAH, swt.
2nd Believing-in the LAST DAY and the ultimate JUDGEMENT, the aim and the end result, i.e. the PURPOSE of the CREATION and the EVOLUTION of the UNIVERSE.
3rd LEADING A RIGHTEOUS CONSTRUCTIVE LIFE while living here on Earth.
The first two articles are mainly PHILOSOPHICAL beliefs and do not have much to do with our everyday life ACTIONS. BUT when it comes to the third article, it is a completely different story. Here, our faith/religion is materialized and defined completely based on our LIFESTYLE; period! In other words, ?you are what you eat?!
The Qur?aan almost 100% of the time defines the believers as those who believe +/AND lead a RIGHTEOUS CONSTRUCTIVE LIFESTYLE/?AMILA SAALIHAN. This third article is imperative in completing the belief in ISLAM as a whole ideological school.
A good example of the definition of this third article is the verse 2177 among other numerous verses. The third article of faith in Islam is all about the real deal, i.e. ACTION, ACTION, ACTION, PRACTICE, PRACTICE, PRACTICE, LIFESTYLE, LIFESTYLE, and again, LIFESTYLE. It is about the PHYSICAL community ACTIONS in bringing about better living conditions to everyday life of individual self, and the Muslim community as a whole.
According to The Qru?aan; (in verbal/oral format, in simple language, easy to understand, or better to say, The UNPHILOSOPHIZED Qur?aan, the ?word of GOD? in 96); we are obligated to physically and practically perform a set of RITUALS called SHA?AA?IRALLAAH. We are to practice them on a regular basis throughout our lifetime to satisfy the implementation of the third article of faith, which in turn satisfies the completion of the first two.
Let us see what Mr. Ayman is up to. He, over the years and in an unsuccessful effort, has tried to wipe the third article of faith off the face of Islam. He?s been trying to reinvent the wheel all over again. But he is pretty oblivious of the fact that the wheel that was built thousands of years ago has already passed the test of time and has been extremely popular and a complete success. This pretty new reinvention has no other place but to end up in the dust pan of history just like multitudes of others before it.
The goal of Mr. Ayman?s Exotic, and out of this world translation and interpretation of the verses of The Qur?aan, together with the aid of some ?scientific archeological findings?, is to mainly create confusion and doubtfulness within his surroundings regarding the existence of
? The city of Mecca
? The city of Medina
? The Sacred Mosque/Al Masjidilharaam
? The Ka?bah
? The knolls of ASSafa and AlmarwahThe wishful result would be the denial of all the practical rituals prescribed by GOD, the Almighty, in The Qur?aan.
? Denial of daily obligatory prayers/SALAAT
? And with it, denial of QIBLAH; our physical direction, i.e. facing toward ALMASJIDILHARAAM in MECCA, during salaat
? Denial of Hajj pilgrimage
? Denial of obligatory charity/Zakaat
? Denial of fasting during the whole month of Ramadzan, and?Of course all these conjectures by Mr. Ayman might be the result of a lifelong ideological isolation, a larger than life ego, and or maybe comes from a chronic laziness to completely forgo the ?time consuming, hard, and laborious? religious rituals. Then again, GOD knows best.
Now, a note on the ?WHEEL? above, which I believe it does not need reinventing.
What I meant by the term ?wheel? is actually the religion of GOD, i.e. the ISLAM, 319. Islam has been around since the Prophet Noah?s time defined by the same three main articles. In the meantime since the Satan had sworn not to leave us alone, thus humans kept going astray from the right path, kept damaging the wheel on the way to getting lost. GOD, the Almighty, out of his mercy, kept sending messengers and prophets with books and guidance to warn us, not to get lost completely. He inevitably kept annihilating those communities completely lost with no hope on their repentance, replacing them with new ones.
Again; and I should reiterate that Muslims have no quarrels with the sectarians other than saying to them that, it?s better for you to start cleansing the house. The religion MUST be about the worship of GOD Alone. All we are saying to them is to stop idolizing the prophets and ?saints? and worship GOD alone. We are saying that the testimony of faith/Shahaadah must be all about GOD Alone. We are saying to them not to commemorate anyone in their daily Salaat prayers except GOD. We are saying to them not to call upon anyone else in the call to prayer/ADZAN, but GOD. We are saying not to implore anyone in your DU?AA?, but GOD. We are saying to them The Qur?aan is the ONLY source of religious guidance; do not use any other source like hadith, sunnah, rawaayah, and? alongside with The Qur?aan. We are telling them that there is only one SACRED mosque and that is the one in the city of Mecca with the KA?BAH right in the middle of its courtyard. We are saying to them that the months of performing HAJJ pilgrimage are the four consecutive sacred/HARAAM months. We are asking them to restore those FOUR months back to their original place within the Islamic lunar calendar in order to minimize the hardship on the people trying to perform their GOD prescribed HAJJ pilgrimage. And finally, we are telling them not to make unlawful what GOD has not made unlawful and vice versa. We are not declaring anything new. We are just propagating the practice of the faith according to The Qur?aan Alone. We are telling them to reform and repent and come back to The Qur?aan. That?s all. No reinventions, at all.
Peace,
Khalil -
Reinventing out of whim, conjecture, and egoistical impulses
The real TRUTH is that Mr. Ayman's ideological belief boils down to an effort to simply deny the existence of the THIRD ARTICLE OF FAITH IN ISLAM, which I?ll explain later, but,
1ST The fact is that whether we like it or not; the terms ?Allaah?, ?The Qur?aan?, ?Islam?, and ?Muslims?, have found their rightful places within the global community and have all changed into PROPER names. The main reason is, fourteen centuries of numerous and frequent usage, has drawn global attention toward a PARTICULAR religion and culture.
The word ?Allaah?, just like its equivalent word, ?God? in English, must be treated just the same when it comes to writing it in English, i.e. we must CAPITALIZE it. Otherwise, we?ve not appreciated His majesty?s stature the way He deserves. God must not be replaced by ?the god?.
By using the definite article ?the? we have included Him among a bunch of other ?gods? and then separated Him from the rest by putting the definite article ?the? before it, i.e. calling Him ?the god?. ?The boy? means a certain specified boy from among others. So, using ?the god? for God is idolatry and committing blasphemy against Allaah, swt, God, the Almighty.
2ND ?The Qur?aan? is a proper name and is not supposed to be translated when used in another language like English. Muhammad is Muhammad no matter in what language. Translating The Qur?aan to ?the great reading? is certainly a great disrespect to its divine origin and stature, if not a blasphemy. The Torah (the Old Testament) is the Torah, the Injeel (the New Testament) is the Injeel, and the Qur?aan (the Last Testament), should likewise be the Qur?aan.
3RD The terms ?Islam? and ?Muslims? must not be translated either, not to an even somewhat popular terms like ?submitting? and ?submitters?, let alone ?peace making? and ?peace makers?! CHRISTIANS follow CHRISTIANITY, JEWS follow JUDAISM, and by the same token, MUSLIMS follow ISLAM. Now back to our main topic.
According to The Qur?aan, there exist THREE MAIN ARTICLES OF FAITH, which together and hand in hand, comprise the CONSTITUTION of ISLAM. These three main articles are defined, and declared as being obligatory on the part of Muslims to believe-in them. The outstanding examples of numerous verses in The Qur?aan regarding these three articles of faith, are verses 262, 569, and 2177.
Let us define these ARTICLES.1st Believing-in, worshiping, and obeying the ONE and ONLY GOD, ALLAAH, swt.
2nd Believing-in the LAST DAY and the ultimate JUDGEMENT, the aim and the end result, i.e. the PURPOSE of the CREATION and the EVOLUTION of the UNIVERSE.
3rd LEADING A RIGHTEOUS CONSTRUCTIVE LIFE while living here on Earth.
The first two articles are mainly PHILOSOPHICAL beliefs and do not have much to do with our everyday life ACTIONS. BUT when it comes to the third article, it is a completely different story. Here, our faith/religion is materialized and defined completely based on our LIFESTYLE; period! In other words, ?you are what you eat?!
The Qur?aan almost 100% of the time defines the believers as those who believe +/AND lead a RIGHTEOUS CONSTRUCTIVE LIFESTYLE/?AMILA SAALIHAN. This third article is imperative in completing the belief in ISLAM as a whole ideological school.
A good example of the definition of this third article is the verse 2177 among other numerous verses. The third article of faith in Islam is all about the real deal, i.e. ACTION, ACTION, ACTION, PRACTICE, PRACTICE, PRACTICE, LIFESTYLE, LIFESTYLE, and again, LIFESTYLE. It is about the PHYSICAL community ACTIONS in bringing about better living conditions to everyday life of individual self, and the Muslim community as a whole.
According to The Qru?aan; (in verbal/oral format, in simple language, easy to understand, or better to say, The UNPHILOSOPHIZED Qur?aan, the ?word of GOD? in 96); we are obligated to physically and practically perform a set of RITUALS called SHA?AA?IRALLAAH. We are to practice them on a regular basis throughout our lifetime to satisfy the implementation of the third article of faith, which in turn satisfies the completion of the first two.
Let us see what Mr. Ayman is up to. He, over the years and in an unsuccessful effort, has tried to wipe the third article of faith off the face of Islam. He?s been trying to reinvent the wheel all over again. But he is pretty oblivious of the fact that the wheel that was built thousands of years ago has already passed the test of time and has been extremely popular and a complete success. This pretty new reinvention has no other place but to end up in the dust pan of history just like multitudes of others before it.
The goal of Mr. Ayman?s Exotic, and out of this world translation and interpretation of the verses of The Qur?aan, together with the aid of some ?scientific archeological findings?, is to mainly create confusion and doubtfulness within his surroundings regarding the existence of
? The city of Mecca
? The city of Medina
? The Sacred Mosque/Al Masjidilharaam
? The Ka?bah
? The knolls of ASSafa and AlmarwahThe wishful result would be the denial of all the practical rituals prescribed by GOD, the Almighty, in The Qur?aan.
? Denial of daily obligatory prayers/SALAAT
? And with it, denial of QIBLAH; our physical direction, i.e. facing toward ALMASJIDILHARAAM in MECCA, during salaat
? Denial of Hajj pilgrimage
? Denial of obligatory charity/Zakaat
? Denial of fasting during the whole month of Ramadzan, and?Of course all these conjectures by Mr. Ayman might be the result of a lifelong ideological isolation, a larger than life ego, and or maybe comes from a chronic laziness to completely forgo the ?time consuming, hard, and laborious? religious rituals. Then again, GOD knows best.
Now, a note on the ?WHEEL? above, which I believe it does not need reinventing.
What I meant by the term ?wheel? is actually the religion of GOD, i.e. the ISLAM, 319. Islam has been around since the Prophet Noah?s time defined by the same three main articles. In the meantime since the Satan had sworn not to leave us alone, thus humans kept going astray from the right path, kept damaging the wheel on the way to getting lost. GOD, the Almighty, out of his mercy, kept sending messengers and prophets with books and guidance to warn us, not to get lost completely. He inevitably kept annihilating those communities completely lost with no hope on their repentance, replacing them with new ones.
Again; and I should reiterate that Muslims have no quarrels with the sectarians other than saying to them that, it?s better for you to start cleansing the house. The religion MUST be about the worship of GOD Alone. All we are saying to them is to stop idolizing the prophets and ?saints? and worship GOD alone. We are saying that the testimony of faith/Shahaadah must be all about GOD Alone. We are saying to them not to commemorate anyone in their daily Salaat prayers except GOD. We are saying to them not to call upon anyone else in the call to prayer/ADZAN, but GOD. We are saying not to implore anyone in your DU?AA?, but GOD. We are saying to them The Qur?aan is the ONLY source of religious guidance; do not use any other source like hadith, sunnah, rawaayah, and? alongside with The Qur?aan. We are telling them that there is only one SACRED mosque and that is the one in the city of Mecca with the KA?BAH right in the middle of its courtyard. We are saying to them that the months of performing HAJJ pilgrimage are the four consecutive sacred/HARAAM months. We are asking them to restore those FOUR months back to their original place within the Islamic lunar calendar in order to minimize the hardship on the people trying to perform their GOD prescribed HAJJ pilgrimage. And finally, we are telling them not to make unlawful what GOD has not made unlawful and vice versa. We are not declaring anything new. We are just propagating the practice of the faith according to The Qur?aan Alone. We are telling them to reform and repent and come back to The Qur?aan. That?s all. No reinventions, at all.
What does this have to do with the simple fact that new moons are NEVER mentioned in the great reading and that what is mentioned are crescents (which are both waning and waxing)?
I don't understand why you are so attached to meaningless proper names. By converting the god given true universal concepts into proper names you are essentially making them completely meaningless and untruthful just like your proper name "Khalil" is meaningless and untrue since you are not really a "friend". It is not my fault that you don't understand the difference between a universal concept that has meaning and a meaningless proper name that doesn't reflect truth so please don't take out your frustration on me. )
Peace,
Ayman
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Peace kgwithnob,
I thought you were a Sunni up until your last paragraph. Then I realized you probably are a Submitter.
Abdelilah
I consider myself a Muslim, the kind that is defined in The Qur'aan, nothing else. See for example, verse 2278 below.
.
Peace,
Khalil -
What does this have to do with the simple fact that new moons are NEVER mentioned in the great reading and that what is mentioned are crescents (which are both waning and waxing)?
I don't understand why you are so attached to meaningless proper names. By converting the god given true universal concepts into proper names you are essentially making them completely meaningless and untruthful just like your proper name "Khalil" is meaningless and untrue since you are not really a "friend". It is not my fault that you don't understand the difference between a universal concept that has meaning and a meaningless proper name that doesn't reflect truth so please don't take out your frustration on me.
Peace,
Ayman
The issue of proper names is just the tip of a huge "iceberg" of a completely new religion being introduced by Mr. Ayman trying to misrepresent the whole identity of the true religion of ALLAAH, swt, globally known as ISLAM.
Besides, all human languages have their own rules and regulations which have evolved naturally from their beginnings through their history for meaningful communication. One cannot just jump in the middle and all of a sudden starts INVENTING new rules, denying the existence of already established sensible ones, replacing them with his invented strange nonsense.
Rules of existence and use of proper names within a language are no exceptions.
Peace,
Khalil -
To define the Arabic ?shahr? as being constituted of 10 days whilst taking into account the Quran?s use of the word as being a solar-lunar month of 28-30 days is not tenable.
To define the start of a lunar month as being anything other than the lunar system definition of post-sunset crescent birth is invention.
To define Ramadan, or any other lunar month at that, as being marked by seasonal astronomical solar events is an astronomical heresy.
Ramadan is constituted of 28-30 days (depending on the method of determination of the crescent birth, whether by visibility or by mathematical determination).
Ramadan starts at sunset of the evening following the day of the birth of the new moon.
Ramadan is a lunar month of twelve lunar months which, together, constitute a lunar year.
This is what I have observed of my studies of the Quran, Arabic, and basic astronomy.
My studies are on-going.
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Peace uq,
To define the Arabic ?shahr? as being constituted of 10 days whilst taking into account the Quran?s use of the word as being a solar-lunar month of 28-30 days is not tenable.
To define the start of a lunar month as being anything other than the lunar system definition of post-sunset crescent birth is invention.
To define Ramadan, or any other lunar month at that, as being marked by seasonal astronomical solar events is an astronomical heresy.
(emphasis mine) No one here claims that shahr is 10 days nor argues when to start a lunar month.
My studies are on-going.
Then continue here if you want to read about what claims are made http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9188.0
Abdelilah
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Peace kgwithnob,
You really believe Abraham's followers were named what would have been at their time a gibberish word from a future language called Arabic that wasn't even invented yet (i.e Al-Muslimeen)?
brickwallAbdelilah
Whatever the word might had been at the time of Abraham, pbuh, ALLAAH, swt, has used its equivalent in Arabic, which is /Al-Muslimeen.
Peace,
Khalil