Would like to learn more....
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Hello to all,
I apologise for the length of my post. I wish to include my reasons for coming here and posting. Any responses or advice would be most appreciated!
I have been interested in Islam for quite some time, but only recently did I stumble upon this website and the idea of Quranism.
I was raised in a Christian (very relaxed, no church attendance or anything) home, but after being scolded in school R.E classes for asking questions, and being told that I had to accept or go to hell, I stopped believing. I became agnostic for several years, but I've always felt that there was something missing in me.
When I reached university I studied abroad in Indonesia and got to visit a girls' pesantren, I made friends with several students and was surprised at how friendly and happy they were. Unfortunately after 9/11 Australia painted a fairly horrible image of Muslims as oppressed, barbaric people and although I knew this was wasn't true, I didn't know any people of Muslim faith till my trip abroad.
Seeing how, despite religion these girls were just like me, I began to read a bit about Islam and what I read, I found drawn to. However, reading about the ahadith ( I hope I'm using the correct term) and the conflicts between Sunni and Shi'a and other Islamic denominations scared me. For a peaceful religion, there is an awful lot of bloodshed and hatred..
Then the other day (literally the other day!) I came across a blog written by a woman who calls herself a Quran only Muslim. From her entries and her reasoning of why she doesn't accept the Hadith, I began to wonder if Quran only Islam might be what I'm seeking. I find myself agreeing to what I've been reading about it, and I've been thinking constantly about what I've read and how I feel about it.
However, I know practically nothing about Islam and the Qu'ran (I started reading it online) but am very interested in learning more. I still don't know if Islam is what I seek, but I hope that just by searching and learning I will find what it is I'm looking for.
Seeking
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Hi, welcome to the forum.
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Btw, I live in Indonesia.
I'm not surprise if you receive warm welcome in pesantren. I think if you visit Indonesia, then most probably you'll meet friendly people here, not only in pesantren. If you visit ordinary formal schools, I suppose you'll also receive hospitality from the students.
However, regardless of the hospitality/friendliness in pesantren, I think the truth is that pesantren is the place where human's mind is brainwashed gradually by educational system. Those who study in pesantrens are taught to believe in scholars, hadiths, sunna, etc.
In short, they are being set up to study "idolatry" and deceived to believe that the lessons they get from their religious teachers are "truth".
Thank the Lord, back then (when I was at school age) my parents placed me in ordinary formal schools, there I was still have to study the religion of Islam (because it is compulsory subject), but not as much if we become students (santris) in Islamic boarding school (pesantren).
Salm.
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Welcome,
Please first find what Allah the Exalted has informed us in the Qur'aan about the true Christians
http//haqeeqat.org.pk/English%20Tafsir%20e%20Haqeeqat/00.Arabic%20Text/005.%20Al%20Maida/temo5.082b.gif
http//haqeeqat.org.pk/English%20Tafsir%20e%20Haqeeqat/00.Arabic%20Text/005.%20Al%20Maida/temo5.082a.gif
http//haqeeqat.org.pk/English%20Tafsir%20e%20Haqeeqat/00.Arabic%20Text/005.%20Al%20Maida/temo5.082c.gif
http//haqeeqat.org.pk/English%20Tafsir%20e%20Haqeeqat/00.Arabic%20Text/005.%20Al%20Maida/temo5.082.gifYou will certainly find the most intense people with regard to hostility and ill-will against those who have heartily believed are the Jews and those who ascribed feminine named sculpted idols as partners to Allah the Exalted.
And you will certainly find the nearest of them the believers with regard to feeling of love and compassion for them who have heartily believed are the people who identified themselves saying "We are Nisa'ara Christians"
This is because there are certainly such people present amongst them who are devoted to learning and are seekers of the appreciation and approval of Allah the Exalted.
And it is a fact that they the Christians do not puff with feel of grandeur and pride.
Translation after grammatical segmentation and parsing of sentencesMany of the "Christians" retained the status of Muslim till the days of revelation of Qur'aan. They accepted and believed in the Messenger and Qur'aan, saying "We were Muslims even hitherto". They were not affected by widespread "ahadith" concocted by their clergy.
Please read Qur'aan according to the rules of critical reading of any non-fiction book and you will not face any problem, Allah the Exalted so willing. Better to Start with the meanings of the title of Book, because
Experts and educationists suggest that the first rule in critical reading is that you must know what kind of a book is in your hand; and they say that we should know this as early in the process as possible, preferably before we begin to read. Many readers ignore titles and prefaces because, perhaps, they do not think it important to classify the book they are about to read. However, the author of a book facilitates its reader to know the kind of book he is being given by assigning it a title. Obviously, a descriptive and illustrative title will be considered the best for a reader to facilitate him immediately classify the book in hand.
side pane entry3. Importance of the title of a book Perception and meanings conveyed by the title
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Harmony be upon you,
And had the "true" Christians seen weird rituals and Paganism I doubt they would have reacted the same, shortly after the messenger of the recitation (Quran) had vanished, particularly because Jesus warned them of the Pagans "with their many words" and rituals to be seen by men.
Hav faith
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Thank you for your kind words! I apologise for my late reply...
I have started reading the Quran from the beginning in order to learn more, taking note of verses I am unsure of for later reflection.
I've also looked at other forums, but it seems that there are many who are hostile towards Quran only Muslims....?
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Hi, Welcome )
I am glad you found your way here. Your story is similar to mine except that I was raised in Sunni family even though I did not know what Sunni is until I found out. I always thought I was Muslim and never agreed to apostasy rules, stoning people to death for adultery, and all and some I just made peace with. But still, I always thought they are lying about it or just do not know. My love for God and Prophet Mohammad never went though. I always thought it is the people who are lying about Islam until I searched and found out the barbaric shria law and all in Sunni. I cried thinking this is actually the true Islam and couldn't stop wonder why will God say all this. Despite this, I did not stop believing in God nor stop loving him. But to cut the story short, I came upon Qur'an alone recently. I think it is because I always prayed to God to guide me always and I still do. Those prayers were answered. I even became agnostic recently because of all the confusion of what was right and what was wrong. Thankfully, God guided me and I hope God keeps guiding me and all of us.
Us Muslims, who follow only Qur'an, are hated because 98%+ of Muslims are secterians and follow Hadiths etc. Do not worry about them, and btw, read the Qur'an from this site as it is non-secterian. Other Qur'an translations have sectarian bias and the translates put their own opinions in brackets confusing others and mixing human words with God's. And make sure to seek guidance from God by praying after every time you read Qur'an. It says in Qur'an to do this as Satan will try its best to deviate us when we are learning and going on straight path.
I know this will be difficult time for you, at least it is for me. There will be many doubts coming. But if we are honest and want to be guided by praying to God and putting all trust on God alone, we will be guided. I am still learning and reading Qur'an. I am so far in third chapter. I take notes of whatever I read like write the Chap number etc for every rule/law it is in Qur'an.
May God guide us all and bless us, and God alone knows the best.
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Peace,
The struggle does not stop when one discards all the hadith though. Then you have to combat a completely perverted scripture instead and narrations of old.
Have faith
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Salam FindingRightPathToAllah,
The laws about stoning and apostasy always scared me. The media in my home country Australia loves highlighting these laws and stating that they are Islamic laws (hence Australia 'shouldn't allow Muslims into the country' but all these laws seem to come from ahadith rather than the Qu'ran...I have only read just under half the chapters in the Qu'ran, yet I'm yet to come across any verses sanctioning stoning or killing. It's sad that People are claiming that Islam=Syariah law.
While I am still learning and studying about Islam and the Qu'ran, I am worried about people's reactions if they knew I was learning about Qu'ran only Islam. I've seen some pretty horrible reactions on forums to Qu'ran only Muslims..
I wish you the best in your reading of the Qu'ran! I've been reading it online but I'll follow your advice and read the one on this site.
Thank you again for your kind words and advice!
Seeking -
Salam Man of Faith,
I guess the upside is that without the Hadith, it might be easier to understand the Qu'ran? I haven't read any Hadith so I can't speak from experience, but from what (admittedly, little) I have read of the Qu'ran, it is a lot easier to read than, say, the Christian Bible.
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The laws about stoning and apostasy always scared me. The media in my home country Australia loves highlighting these laws and stating that they are Islamic laws (hence Australia 'shouldn't allow Muslims into the country' but all these laws seem to come from ahadith rather than the Qu'ran...I have only read just under half the chapters in the Qu'ran, yet I'm yet to come across any verses sanctioning stoning or killing. It's sad that People are claiming that Islam=Syariah law.
Stoning and the death penalty for apostasy, both are not mentioned in the Qur'an.
I think "sharia law" is one of the major scams in this world.
Salm.
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I apologise for the length of my post. I wish to include my reasons for coming here and posting. Any responses or advice would be most appreciated!
welcome
No need to apologize, you're not guility of anything.I was raised in a Christian (very relaxed, no church attendance or anything) home, but after being scolded in school R.E classes for asking questions, and being told that I had to accept or go to hell, I stopped believing. I became agnostic for several years, but I've always felt that there was something missing in me.
You're free to ask any questions here..
Questioning things is a sign that your brain is at work.Seeing how, despite religion these girls were just like me, I began to read a bit about Islam and what I read, I found drawn to. However, reading about the ahadith ( I hope I'm using the correct term) and the conflicts between Sunni and Shi'a and other Islamic denominations scared me. For a peaceful religion, there is an awful lot of bloodshed and hatred..
islam is not a religion it's an attitude.
Having said that, the religion of Judaism, Christianity and Islam are indeed full of bloodshed, conflicts and hatred, since around 3000 years ago up until today.
Then the other day (literally the other day!) I came across a blog written by a woman who calls herself a Quran only Muslim. From her entries and her reasoning of why she doesn't accept the Hadith, I began to wonder if Quran only Islam might be what I'm seeking. I find myself agreeing to what I've been reading about it, and I've been thinking constantly about what I've read and how I feel about it.
I believe it's God that you might be seeking and not some human written books...
I still don't know if Islam is what I seek, but I hope that just by searching and learning I will find what it is I'm looking for.
Being islam is the recommended attitude, which is
"Let Your will be done, on earth as it's in heaven"
(Matt 6)Life is a journey, and it will be full with joy and also tears.. nonetheless the above attitude shall help you getting through it.
Salam / Peace
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Salam Man of Faith,
I guess the upside is that without the Hadith, it might be easier to understand the Qu'ran? I haven't read any Hadith so I can't speak from experience, but from what (admittedly, little) I have read of the Qu'ran, it is a lot easier to read than, say, the Christian Bible.
Well. The "hadith" does surely not help in any way except to cloud your mind. I would not open a "hadith book" and be ready to risk believing in anything that it says. I studied Bukhari for strictly educational purposes a while back and I am surprised that anyone believes in the garbage at all. They make the faith into a mockery, a joke.
But unfortunately the people behind (probably exactly them) the hadith managed to taint the interpretation of the recitation called Qur'an while they were at it, so what you read is not always what the original language wanted to convey. Things like cutting hands, polygamy, ritualistic prayer, holy house in Mecca, and tons of other nonsensical stuff is also an object of their imagination who tried to interpret it and failed miserably and was unfortunately canonized as law and followed strictly for centuries, even over a millennium now.
The historical war that emerged that we know about was likely between both power-hungry people and people who defended the real decree, what was really what the prophet had said. There is only unreliable sources, but there are small stories of people who wanted to adhere only to what the Qur'an said and they were incredibly suppressed and could as well have been annihilated and extinct. What I suspect is that the scripture was also abandoned for years and later found somehow and interpreted by people who could not really interpret it and they inserted verse numbering that is faulty by often splitting up clauses and they added diacritical marks according to their understanding which cause confusion now when we are trying to understand it. We became lost in translation by other words and the "hadith" that was compiled to give understanding to the decree also was used to understand the book called Qur'an. We can clearly see that the "hadith" is compiled by those who perverted the interpretation because in these inventions the same linguistic errors reoccur, for example, words' meaning.
While I am still learning and studying about Islam and the Qu'ran, I am worried about people's reactions if they knew I was learning about Qu'ran only Islam. I've seen some pretty horrible reactions on forums to Qu'ran only Muslims..
You should feel honored and not frightened. It is them that are wrong and not you. But do not engage in discussions if you are not confident because they may give you things you may hearken onto before you are ready for it.
I wish you the best in your reading of the Qu'ran! I've been reading it online but I'll follow your advice and read the one on this site.
The one on this forum is among the best translations available using relatively traditional understanding, but you may not trust it blindly.
Have faith
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Us Muslims, who follow only Qur'an, are hated because 98%+ of Muslims are secterians and follow Hadiths etc. Do not worry about them, and btw, read the Qur'an from this site as it is non-secterian. Other Qur'an translations have sectarian bias and the translates put their own opinions in brackets confusing others and mixing human words with God's. And make sure to seek guidance from God by praying after every time you read Qur'an. It says in Qur'an to do this as Satan will try its best to deviate us when we are learning and going on straight path.
References of major difference between the sectarian and this non-sectarian translation?
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I've also looked at other forums, but it seems that there are many who are hostile towards Quran only Muslims....?
Welcome to the forum, I hope you find what you are seeking.
Online people tend to be a lot more hostile than real life. Generally muslims like to help or "guide" people to islam if that is the persons interest. So if you did mention to someone in the open about following the Quran and disregarding hadith they would say it's a dangerous thing to do, an erroneous act or you don't have enough knowledge to understand.
Muslims feel offended. The reason is because it is perceived as "intentionally refusing to follow the prophet" so I guess it comes across as offensive or maybe even irrational. Though, not only the prophet but also it comes across as disregarding learned scholarly work.
Unfortunately majority of people that I have come across have a misinformed and misunderstanding of how muslims who uphold the Quran, follow the Quran.
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Peace,
And most fall victim to the phenomenon of 6116, sadly enough.
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Salam (I apologise for the lateness of my replies! I have been reading everyone's messages, but unfortunately my work has been very hectic lately so I haven't been able to sit down and reply...)
I have no idea how to quote replies very well, so if this is hard to read, I apologise!
Stoning and the death penalty for apostasy, both are not mentioned in the Qur'an.
I think "sharia law" is one of the major scams in this world.
Salm.
I remember reading a book on the history of Islam (I really regret leaving it in storage when I moved overseas, I want to read it again!) about how Syariah law is not Islam, but based on a mix of local cultural practices and ahadith which are now considered as part of Islam. It saddens me to see how people are abusing the religion in order to control people (though it's not just the people promoting Syariah-this happens in every religion unfortunately...)
welcome
No need to apologize, you're not guility of anything.You're free to ask any questions here..
Questioning things is a sign that your brain is at work.islam is not a religion it's an attitude.
Having said that, the religion of Judaism, Christianity and Islam are indeed full of bloodshed, conflicts and hatred, since around 3000 years ago up until today.
I believe it's God that you might be seeking and not some human written books...
Being islam is the recommended attitude, which is
"Let Your will be done, on earth as it's in heaven"
(Matt 6)Life is a journey, and it will be full with joy and also tears.. nonetheless the above attitude shall help you getting through it.
Salam / Peace
I just wish the teachers who taught the RE classes in my primary school had been as open minded as the people on this forum. I remember asking a question regarding something in the Bible (I can't remember the details, sorry) and the teacher's response was 'because it's in the Bible.' No discussion, or explanation, or anything. I asked a few more questions in a few later lessons, and all I got was 'because it's in the Bible' or 'because God said it is.' I understand faith is accepting things that may not have a clear answer, but he always seemed frustrated with me because I had asked a question. '(
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Well. The "hadith" does surely not help in any way except to cloud your mind. I would not open a "hadith book" and be ready to risk believing in anything that it says. I studied Bukhari for strictly educational purposes a while back and I am surprised that anyone believes in the garbage at all. They make the faith into a mockery, a joke.
But unfortunately the people behind (probably exactly them) the hadith managed to taint the interpretation of the recitation called Qur'an while they were at it, so what you read is not always what the original language wanted to convey. Things like cutting hands, polygamy, ritualistic prayer, holy house in Mecca, and tons of other nonsensical stuff is also an object of their imagination who tried to interpret it and failed miserably and was unfortunately canonized as law and followed strictly for centuries, even over a millennium now.
The historical war that emerged that we know about was likely between both power-hungry people and people who defended the real decree, what was really what the prophet had said. There is only unreliable sources, but there are small stories of people who wanted to adhere only to what the Qur'an said and they were incredibly suppressed and could as well have been annihilated and extinct. What I suspect is that the scripture was also abandoned for years and later found somehow and interpreted by people who could not really interpret it and they inserted verse numbering that is faulty by often splitting up clauses and they added diacritical marks according to their understanding which cause confusion now when we are trying to understand it. We became lost in translation by other words and the "hadith" that was compiled to give understanding to the decree also was used to understand the book called Qur'an. We can clearly see that the "hadith" is compiled by those who perverted the interpretation because in these inventions the same linguistic errors reoccur, for example, words' meaning.
You should feel honored and not frightened. It is them that are wrong and not you. But do not engage in discussions if you are not confident because they may give you things you may hearken onto before you are ready for it.
The one on this forum is among the best translations available using relatively traditional understanding, but you may not trust it blindly.
Have faith
To be honest, I don't think I've read any hadith before, but from what I've heard and read about them, is that they are used in Syariah law and were written well after the passing of the Prophet, but I thought the Qu'ran said that it is a complete text and that you do not need other texts to understand it? (I could be wrong, if I am please correct me!)
I have started reading the Qu'ran translation from this site, however the more I look at the Arabic in other Qu'ran translations, I'm seriously considering studying Arabic...are there textbooks on Classical Arabic I wonder....?
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peace,
You are doing the right thing by reading The Quran. Best to read alongside study tools, such as those here.
With regard to stoning not being from Quran, you can read about this here
http//learn-about-islam.com/2011/10/31/stoning-to-death-allowed-2/Thank you very much for the link! It did clear up a few questions I had regarding some of the verses (it could just be that I'm mentally burnt out as of late, but sometimes I'll be reading the Qu'ran and although it's in English, I get very confused as to what it means...I am definitely going to have to take some time to sit down and read it much slower than I have been-I get really interested in it and I find myself reading quickly but not taking the time to actually think about what I've read. It's a big problem of mine that I need to work on.)
I have read about just under half of the chapters in the Qu'ran, and I haven't found a single reference to stoning, cutting off of hands or the oppresssion of women in it. It seems that all the negative attention that Islam receives is solely due to extremist groups and Syariah law, and not actually due to the religion itself.
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Welcome to the forum, I hope you find what you are seeking.
Online people tend to be a lot more hostile than real life. Generally muslims like to help or "guide" people to islam if that is the persons interest. So if you did mention to someone in the open about following the Quran and disregarding hadith they would say it's a dangerous thing to do, an erroneous act or you don't have enough knowledge to understand.
Muslims feel offended. The reason is because it is perceived as "intentionally refusing to follow the prophet" so I guess it comes across as offensive or maybe even irrational. Though, not only the prophet but also it comes across as disregarding learned scholarly work.
Unfortunately majority of people that I have come across have a misinformed and misunderstanding of how muslims who uphold the Quran, follow the Quran.
Is it true that if you see a Musim brother/sister doing something that is not in line with Islamic beliefs, you are to (gently) remind them so that they can correct themselves? If so, I can understand why people may be against others not following the hadith, and how they may see it as refusing to follow the Prophet/ authenticated hadith.
However, if someone holds different beliefs regarding Islam, why are they so hostile towards them? It is true that people can be more aggressive on the internet towards others of differing beliefs, but I just can't understand why we can't just support each other? If we hold different beliefs, but are sincere, isn't that enough? Why do some people feel that they have to try and bully others into believing what they do??
As I have literally just started reading the Qu'ran, I know nothing about Islam, but I see this hostility towards Muslims who may have differing opinions and views and it scares me. I know that not all Muslims are like this and that there is aggressiveness in many religions over differing beliefs, but....I don't know....why can't we all just get along? (Yes, I am this naive... -[ )
