First Letters in some Chapters
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Dear All,
I have a question I still don't know whats the right answer. In Chapter 02, the chapter starts with "Alef Lam Meem" how would someone who never listened to a Sheikh Reading would be able to read that?
I mean suppose there is an Arabian Christian, can he read the Quran correctly without help of Sheikh? would he read "Alam" instead of "Alef Lam Meem" like how we read in Surat Al Feel "Alam tara kaifa...etc" its written same way.
If yes whats the prove, if not whats the prove.
anyone around here does have knowledge about the above subject?
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Peace AbulAziz Mohammed.
All "ALM" surahs are separated as verses on their own. Check them. All of them separately numbered as verse 1.
There is no mistaking them for "Alam".
In fact .Initial surah are clearly identified as either verses on their own or highlighted with "tilka, dhalika, Kitabun...in the case of "ALR"..i.e they are specifically highlighted as initials by the sentence that follows.For example we can clearly tell that surah 78 is not an initial surah because the first two letters are in a sentence and they make sense with the rest of the verse.
GOD has made sure we make no mistake about the initials.
We now know why GOD has placed them as simply letters at the beginning of the surahs.
GOD bless you.
Peace. -
Salaam,
is not hard to pronounce. In fact the combination occurs sometimes in the discourse as a standard word.
It is pronounced Alam/alem, depending on speed/slip of tongue (no vowel sound).
All letters in Quran are meant to be part of the text rather than anything else, even the chapters which begin with a sole letter and conjunction.
They are part of a hint towards a perceptive reader that the letters of Arabic are supposed to carry an innate meaning in themselves and from that form words with their respective meanings.
Someone knew Quran would require reinterpretation, so some help was left conveniently. It is not like the Quran interpretations you read portray the truth ultimately. No, its interpretation it biased and sometimes utterly imaginative and it is clear people tried to fill in their understanding of a faith into innocent passages.
Salaam
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Salaam alta,
The letters in question are part of the meaning of the discourse but mostly set there as a hint for the perceptive on how to interpret the Arabic language fundamentally.
One sign of that is that, for example, in chapter 36, 38 and 68 the letters are followed by a conjunction (و which is similar to the 'and' of English grammar. No qualitative literal work would begin a chapter with a conjunction. A conjunction is used for continuity of an ongoing context.
Salaam
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Salaam Man of Faith,
I agree that the Arabic letters coud have meanings but you still haven't answered my question that I have asked you multiple times with no answer from you.
WHAT IS THE SOURCE OF YOUR INNATE LETTER MEANINGS?
WHAT IS THE PROOF THE LETTERS MEAN WHAT YOU SAY THEY MEAN?If you can't understand my question then I will try to make it clear
I agree that the Arabic letters "noon" and "saad" can mean something in chapters 38 and 68.
If you say that the Arabic letter "noon" means x, what is the proof or evidence that "noon" means x?
Anyone can arbitrarily choose a meaning for a letter, but that would be a baseless personal opinion or fabrication or conjecture and in that way anyone can make anything mean anything based on personal desires.
If you are a man of integrity then kindly answer this question and don't be evasive like you have been so far. I hope you realize that by being evasive in answering this question, it damages your credibility.
May the infinite Creator guide us to the truth.
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I am not evasive.
And I am fully aware that a person could choose just about any meaning for the letters if they are dishonest and just wish to extract a random meaning. The innate meaning is not flexible but it always means the same no matter formed word, to "paint" a mental image of what is to be conveyed.
My method is analytical. I simply compare every Arabic word I investigate and analyze what letters they consist of and do some research on what meaning they have based on the data I have. It is not that I cannot be wrong temporarily while I work on improving the definition of an individual letter, but what can you expect out of a trial and error method? It is not uncommon in scientific research either even if when the discovery is made one has to be able to prove the thesis. I am still working on it, but I can obviously argue logical points such as that the letters have innate meanings using the arguments I have used. And I am entitled to ventilate my current research stage too even if I am not absolutely right. The truth will eventually speak for itself, and I feel I have good precision on the word Allah for example. It is a collective name while Rabb is the personal address for "God".
When I have been able to precisely define a letter then my definition of a word is very accurate.
Some letters are easier to figure out than others. For example, simply implies 'be' and adhesion.
Certain words I have researched extra much recently on and those were and which have similar structure. Both give an attribute state Be Thereof X. is to be realized (or whole as it literally says) and to be determined. Both alef and meem are easy letters to understand their exact meaning. As you probably know meem prefixes words such as Muslim and Mumeen because it refers to attribute (which is true). And alef is the most frequent letter in Arabic. It is used as a modifier inside words too and which is marked phonologically by a longer hollow sound until the next letter in pronunciation.
Of course I analyze each letter in every word and I focus on "secure" words that seem safe as to what they mean since that is more reliable. Common affixes and pronouns are also easy letters to study plus actually prepositions.
Well that I already have written about as to what you said I am evasive about.
Salaam
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Salam man of faith,
I do get the point of conjunction, the theory is good but still it doesn't solve the problem at hand. There are other chapters that don't have that conjunction what do we make of those?
One thing I have been pondering is that in chapter 36, verse no. 82, there is a word "Kun" and then it's "Fayakun" what I have been thinking is that the first "Kun" has only "Kaaf" and "Nun" to make it "Kun" while the kun in "Fayakun" has the additional "Waaw" to make it Kun. What is the Creator hinting at by adding that extra "waaw" for the same sounding "Kun?" -
Sorry. Double posts.
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Peace altafalvi.
You want to know this
What are the meaning of these "letters." I asked a lot of people but everyone had the same answer "allah knows best, nobody knows them." Wondering why put them in first place if only Allah knew the meaning.Are you aware of this The Quranic Initials constitute a major portion of the Quran's 19-based. mathematical miracle.
http//submission.org/App1.html
GOD bless you.
Peace. -
Salaam alta,
All letters in the whole Quran are intended to be part of the discourse. Even in chapters introduced without a conjunction after the the letters, they are supposed to be interpreted as words. It is part of a deliberate hint into interpretation as according to the author rather than men's "wannabe" interpretations. The author knew it would require such measures.
For example, in chapter 38 it starts with Saad followed by a conjunction, then (and) and continues Al-Quran dhi al-dhekr. The phrase loosely means "Perceive and the Quran will make sense to you", basically (lit. Perceive and the Quran you regard (note the aldhekr is directed towards you)) It is bound to the provoking of thought that passage. It was the passage that first made me suspicious of the sole letters. The continuous narration of the same chapter explains about man's distortion of the meaning of Quran. Kafar means to distort through fabrication/conjecture. Those are the people the Rabb threatens with Hell in Quran primarily. It is guaranteed Gehenna members.
But people here accuse me of conjecture for exposing conjecture which is a bit ironical when one makes a realization.
Salaam
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Salam Goodlogic,
Yeah I am aware of the mathematical relation of the quran with the number 19. This guy Rashad Khalifa who made all those studies finally made a very damning claim that he was the messenger mentioned in chapter 36. Anyways my primary concern is to unravel the limitless wisdom that is bound in those alphabets. Hope the Creator opens its locks to me.
Salam Man of Faith,
I agree with you. The author surely know what IT has hidden in those letters. I think when the Creator says that it will protect ITS zikr, it surely points to these "Huruf E Muqattaat" which seriously no Mullah or scholar can decipher or change or corrupt it. I met with certain Sufis (I still do), they have a very interesting take on all these letters, about the chapter 36, one of them said it refers to the heart of Muhammad and to the knowledge of Unseen that his heart possesses.Anyway it has left me all the more bewildered. Like you pointed the chapter 38 ayah about perceiving; well I try to talk to the Quran and see what it gives me in return. In my previous post I asked about the Kun and Fayakun that also has my head scratching, then there is Surah Teen - Wattini Wazzaytuni..By the fig and by the Olive...interestingly olive is mentioned quite a number of times in the quran. What I am thinking is why the Creator is swearing by its Creation and that too olive, what is so special about olive that the Creator gave it such a special place...
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Salaam alta,
There is no "magical" or superstitious/farfetched meaning with the letters but just a deliberately left sign for a perceptive person who looks for something beyond all fabricated interpretations of Quran from people without understanding. The Arabic language structurally works around three letters to form trilateral words which is a rule of thumb except in certain cases where they are narrowed down to two even though usually stemming from the same trilateral root.
The sole letters are a remarkable exception and obviously you can see that these are not standard words but they are used in such manner to make the perceptive reader aware that the letters are supposed to have their own innate meaning. If you wrote;
,
then obviously you intended to use the as part of the sentence. Yet this is not standard as Arabic does not use a sole letter except the conjunction written/interpreted apart elsewhere in the discourse. The only explanation for this is that the was intended as an exception to demonstrate something, i.e. to know the secret of Arabic (also Hebrew) one should look on letter level.
This is also another sign that the writer had a certain link to the Rabb, because this is a subtle hint that was semi-hidden. The author knew people would fail to interpret it and distort it since otherwise there was no reason to leave the hints behind.
But if we go to distortion and the saying Quran is undistorted this is wrong because all the different versions are a testament to its distortion and not to mention that researchers have found a transcript which contained two different versions of the same text but one deliberately erased from the surface. The method using "innate letter meanings" can actually be used in exposing erroneous passages.
I know the interpreters deliberately forced a sectarian doctrine into the interpretation of Quran. Namaz/salateh is one example of this. It never existed in the true faith as a ritual but somebody forced salateh to connote this. Salateh refers to one's perception/way of life basically and is completely innocent of what people have ascribed to it.
Salaam
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Peace altafalvi.
I see ,you want to individually and personally receive your own scripture from the creator.
GOD in Qoran says HE Alone chooses who to send to warn/clarify/deliver a message.
But that is fine,We have the freedom to accept or reject.
Rashad fabricated all that stuff, even if it agrees with Qoran.
GOD bless you.
Peace. -
Salaam good logic,
I agree that the Creator wishes to choose whomever IT wishes to.
Peace be upon you too.
Salaam Man of Faith,
I totally second your point about the letters being not "magical/superstitious" kind of stuff. But the thing is that people and especially the mullahs have over time made these letters appear to be some sort of unbreakable code which no human can understand. They even preach that no one knows its meaning except Allah. I have encountered and continue to encounter such mullahs all my life.
I would love to know how do you go about your analytical process of verifying/understanding the words of the Quran. maybe I too can apply it. Furthermore I would also want to know what exactly is the method of "innate letter meanings?"
Regarding the namaz/salah, I am with you on this, it was definitely not the ritual that the muslims are doing everyday, it was more about establishing rather exercising. Throughout the Quran, it says Aqqimuss Salaah, which means to Establish Salaah; now you can only establish something which is always in motion, in this case, its our mind, our concentration, which ought to establish unwavering, unfaltering connection with our Rabb only then Salaah is established. but unfortunately, this community has totally deviated from the real teachings of Rasulallah and got itself back into the mode of established rituals like namaz, fasting, sacrifice of the animal (i can't think of one ayah in the quran where it says you have to sacrifice animal) which are all the rituals of the pagans..
Seriously the interpreters, the scholars, the mullahs have pretty much messed up big time the teachings of Rasulallah.
A saddened follower of Prophet Muhammad
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Peace altafalvi.
Yes,I did notice the "IT". I use "HE" for my- no gender- Creator.
That is also fine ,we both have that freedom of choice.
GOD bless you.
Peace. -
Salaam
Extract from a dictionary definition for 'it'
"a person or animal whose sex is unknown or disregarded <don't know who it is>, a group of individuals or things, or an abstract entity"
Source Merriam-Webster English dictionary
I do not see any disrespect towards the Rabb by using 'it' in English. He is factually wrong. You have no real known nature concerning the Rabb as to its origin, so it is not really wrong to use the definition on the 'abstract entity' basis. The Rabb has no gender and genders are only invented for this illusive world we live in. Those not bound to flesh are genderless.
Salaam
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Peace Man of Faith,
And I am fully aware that a person could choose just about any meaning for the letters if they are dishonest and just wish to extract a random meaning.
It is not that I cannot be wrong temporarily while I work on improving the definition of an individual letter, but what can you expect out of a trial and error method? It is not uncommon in scientific research either even if when the discovery is made one has to be able to prove the thesis. I am still working on it,
Thank you for admitting that your innate letter meanings are pure fabrication and conjecture and for admitting that extracting random meanings is dishonesty.
You admit you can be wrong and your method is a trial and error method. Trial and error method is the same as random meaning based on pure conjecture with no source or basis. In other words, you are extracting random meanings. Then you base your understanding on those random meanings and translate entire verses based on those random meanings which are baseless personal opinion and pure conjecture. This is intellectual dishonesty and deception of the highest degree.
Trial and error = conjecture
You should not derive meanings randomly based on pure conjecture and then present them as the absolute truth thereby deceiving others, for example your conjectures about meaning of salat, iman, allah, qatl etc. which you present as absolute fact. I have proven time and again that your fabricated meaning of salat makes no sense and does not fit in verses such as 1187, 11114, 1778, 2458, 3356 etc. and you continue to parrot the fabricated meaning despite that. To make your fabricated meaning fit, you resort to despicable tactics such as omitting original Arabic phrase of the verse out of the translation, changing word order of the original verse and ignoring basic Arabic grammar, and making contradictory translations of words just to fit your fabricated meaning.
For example, you translate "fajr" as "dawn" in 1778 and "wickedness" in 2458 just to fit your fabricated translation. Your translation of 1187 involves completely changing the grammatical word order of the original verse. In 1187 instead of saying "behavior commands you", you say "commanded behavior of yours". You omit the phrase "tarafay al-nahaar" from the translation of 11114 to fit your fabricated salat meaning
http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9605447.msg358252#msg358252
I have already proven how your fabricated meaning of salat does not make any sense at the following posts
http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9607181.msg363076#msg363076
http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9607181.msg363266#msg363266
http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9607181.msg363413#msg363413You have changed the meaning of "quyyum al-salat" twice in the last 4 months, based on your innate letter meanings, and each time you presented the meaning as the correct meaning
http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9607223.msg363637#msg363637
You admitted yourself that your translation of 1187 has "problems"
http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9607223.msg363590#msg363590
http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9606632.msg363488#msg363488You still haven't come up with translation of 1187 that makes sense using your fabricated meaning of salat. This is proof that your meaning of salat and your innate letter meanings upon which salat meaning is based, are pure conjecture and fabrication. I would urge you to stop this intellectual dishonesty and deception and stop fabricating meanings of quranic words just to fit your own personal desires and wishes.
The innate meaning is not flexible but it always means the same no matter formed word, to "paint" a mental image of what is to be conveyed.
If the innate letter meaning is always the same, then why do you translate "fajr" as "dawn" in 1778 and then turn around and translate it as "wickedness" in 2458? Isn't that intellectual dishonesty and deception?
My method is analytical. I simply compare every Arabic word I investigate and analyze what letters they consist of and do some research on what meaning they have based on the data I have.
Aah .... so your innate letter meanings are based on some secret "data" that you have. What is the source of that "data"? Is it some secret "wahi"/channeling from God to you?
And I am entitled to ventilate my current research stage too even if I am not absolutely right.
But then don't present your fabrications and conjectures as correct and the truth. Be honest and every time you present your fabrications, please also say that it is just a conjecture instead of saying you "have good precision".
and I feel I have good precision on the word Allah for example. It is a collective name while Rabb is the personal address for "God".
When I have been able to precisely define a letter then my definition of a word is very accurate.
Some letters are easier to figure out than others. For example, simply implies 'be' and adhesion.
Certain words I have researched extra much recently on and those were and which have similar structure. Both give an attribute state Be Thereof X. is to be realized (or whole as it literally says) and to be determined. Both alef and meem are easy letters to understand their exact meaning. As you probably know meem prefixes words such as Muslim and Mumeen because it refers to attribute (which is true). And alef is the most frequent letter in Arabic. It is used as a modifier inside words too and which is marked phonologically by a longer hollow sound until the next letter in pronunciation.
Of course I analyze each letter in every word and I focus on "secure" words that seem safe as to what they mean since that is more reliable. Common affixes and pronouns are also easy letters to study plus actually prepositions.
There we go again! brickwall brickwall brickwall
May the infinite Creator guide us all to the truth.