Personal Identity and the Soul
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nafs is the controller of an individual , in humankind human nafs is the main character that leads everything related to human being and his actions,
whereas about body our soul told us what to eat, the requirements of body is seperate from soul and connected with it same time , example if we steal something for eating , we did it for body but soul is responsible. we dnt know how our own body behave and looks like , and if something wrong happen to our body how we will gona repair or replace it , we are confused in every aspect, nothing we know fullly about our seen things as well as hidden things. for me human being is a pair of neg and positive like everything else , our bodies and characters are two sides of a pair, we dnt really understand fully, we have been given limited knowledge
and about ghualam ahmed pervaiz, i used to listen him alot and i like him as well , his concepts about quran are very different from traditional people but again , when i study some interpretation of quran regarding chapter 27 sunra naml i feel something fishy i go through it and find a clear contradiction of language with lot of interrpretation, due to which i decided not to beleive anybody untill research the things by our ownself , its a safe way, and its not a rocket science to understand or research something speacially in this era when everyhting is in hand and in our finger tips,
peace
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nafs is the controller of an individual
Agreed, my speculation is as follows, the nafs is us, the personality, the ego, what
drives us, that which will be judged. The ruh is the life force that animates us. The body
is the vehicle or housing in which the nafs exist in the earthly physical reality, for instance
if we humans lived in another physical environment our bodies would be different but the
nafs would be the same. -
Agreed, my speculation is as follows, the nafs is us, the personality, the ego, what
drives us, that which will be judged. The ruh is the life force that animates us. The body
is the vehicle or housing in which the nafs exist in the earthly physical reality, for instance
if we humans lived in another physical environment our bodies would be different but the
nafs would be the same.yeh exactly hawk, you describe it in more easy way, i agree,
God bless you -
Last week I witnessed an interesting and revealing event (at least from my perspective).
I used to think that there are no good or bad/evil babies/toddler.. all human children are neutral..
Toddler, fresh from the oven, not much of life experience.. there couldn't be a bad/evil toddler as such there isn't any good toddler either as comparison.Watching a bunch of toddler playing on the playground, I saw a distinctive attitude in one toddler..
He doesn't mind when other toddler grabbed his toys. (while other toddler usually cry or at least try to grab it back).. he just grab another toy.. another toddler approached him and again grab his toy.. and he just grab another toy.... and then another toddler approached him (to take his toy).. and this "good toddler" just hand over his toy to the approaching toddler..This distinctive toddler has a good "soul"... at least compared to the other (normal) toddler..
At early age, he seems to have a good control of his self/ego and show a very strong empathy towards others.. stronger compared to the other toddler..I mentioned this to a (Buddhist) friend of mine, and his remark is interesting..
"Inside that good toddler is an "old" soul... the soul who has incarnated many times, more than the other toddler, and has learn his lesson well on what's the most important thing in life"Just sharing...
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Dogs do that too. May be they are older souls. Or may be they are more aware of the environment because practically it is less work to grab something else than to quarrl for the one thing.
Salaam
Could be.. but I haven't saw that in dogs yet.. have you?
It shows that there are more than merely the physical body and/or brain which determine one's character and attitude..
Back to the specific toddler, he did deliberately hand out his toy to others..
As if he understood giving is more noble than taking.. loving is more noble than hating... (expressed by crying on toddler)
The thing which even most adult do not understand. -
Last week I witnessed an interesting and revealing event (at least from my perspective).
I used to think that there are no good or bad/evil babies/toddler.. all human children are neutral..
Toddler, fresh from the oven, not much of life experience.. there couldn't be a bad/evil toddler as such there isn't any good toddler either as comparison.Watching a bunch of toddler playing on the playground, I saw a distinctive attitude in one toddler..
He doesn't mind when other toddler grabbed his toys. (while other toddler usually cry or at least try to grab it back).. he just grab another toy.. another toddler approached him and again grab his toy.. and he just grab another toy.... and then another toddler approached him (to take his toy).. and this "good toddler" just hand over his toy to the approaching toddler..This distinctive toddler has a good "soul"... at least compared to the other (normal) toddler..
At early age, he seems to have a good control of his self/ego and show a very strong empathy towards others.. stronger compared to the other toddler..I mentioned this to a (Buddhist) friend of mine, and his remark is interesting..
"Inside that good toddler is an "old" soul... the soul who has incarnated many times, more than the other toddler, and has learn his lesson well on what's the most important thing in life"Just sharing...
Maybe the toddler was exceptionally observant and had good parents/role models that he learned from. I know that even when I was really young, I was really aware of my surroundings and other people. I was also really sensitive. Maybe this is a part of who I truly am, or maybe this had to do with the fact that I went through some pretty traumatic experiences when I was an infant, I don't know.
Maybe the toddler you spoke about does have an "old soul" as your friend mentioned, and he has "seen" more than the others.
Maybe it has something to do with this study
The study, published in Psychological Science, was broken into two experiments involving a total of 112 three-year-old children, an equal number of boys and girls, split into teams of two. In both experiments, two children were left alone in an observation room. Each child had to work with his or her partner to get a rewardfour identical gummy bears, four identical stickers, or four of another prizethat was trapped at the back of a long, transparent box. When the kids simultaneously pulled on each end of a rope, they could bring the prizes to the front of the box and grab their reward through a hole. If only one kid pulled the rope, the prizes remained out of reach.
Sometimes the box had two holes, one on either side, enabling each child to pull out two prizeseasy and fair. But even when the box had only a single hole, the child who got to the reward first shared it equally with his partner in the vast majority of cases, more than 70 percent of the time.
In roughly 80 percent of these cases of cooperation, the sharing was passive, meaning that one child took what was fairtwo prizesand left the other two for his or her teammate. Other times, one child would take two prizes and actively give two to the other child, or would tell that child to collect his or her fair share if he or she neglected to do so at first.
Rarely was there any arguing, and physical conflicts were almost nonexistent.
This was all generally true regardless of what the prize was (though in the first experiment, the researchers found that children were more likely to share gummy bears than stickers).That's the explanation of the study, and then the author of the article goes on to suggest an explanation for kids' different sharing habits
According to the studys authors, the answer might lie in the fact that the kids had to work together in order to earn their reward. Only by collaborating were they able to get their prizes, and their collaboration evoked their burgeoning sense of fairness.
The situation of peers jointly collaborating toward a mutual outcome might exemplify the fundamental context in which a sense of equality emerges, write the authors, who were led by Felix Warneken, a psychologist at Harvard.
In other words, this type of cooperation encourages kids to recognize that other people have a right to enjoy the same rewards and privileges that the kids want for themselves.
The researchers note that previous research has found that chimpanzees wont share their spoils in the same way, which makes them less likely to want to work together in the first place.
Humans, by contrast, seem to possess a strong propensity for fairness that encourages them to cooperate rather than compete over limited resources, trusting that theyll benefit in the end. And now theres evidence that this propensity can be demonstratedand perhaps nurtured furtherthrough collaborations that take place when were hardly more than toddlers.
The present study, write the authors, suggests that competition over resources is mitigated in human children by an emerging sense of equal sharing of the spoils, which enables successful collaboration.Source http//greatergood.berkeley.edu/article/item/does_sharing_come_naturally_to_kids
Maybe the toddler you witnessed understood the need to collaborate.
Could be.. but I haven't saw that in dogs yet.. have you?
It shows that there are more than merely the physical body and/or brain which determine one's character and attitude..
Back to the specific toddler, he did deliberately hand out his toy to others..
As if he understood giving is more noble than taking.. loving is more noble than hating... (expressed by crying on toddler)
The thing which even most adult do not understand.I think children are a lot more "pure" and "good" than most adults sometimes. I wonder why that is. I wonder why our "personal identity" changes that way as we grow older. Are children more "pure" inside?
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That is interesting, Jafar. The concept of reincarnated souls is obviously true. And otherwise the god phenomenon is unfair considered in what kind of environment some children grow up as it obviously feels the opportunity should be the same overall. Yesaya taught that one's deeds are returned in their entirety of something, depending on whether they are good or ignorant like.
Be well
Amenuel -
Epigenetics contains the wisdom sought
Epigenetics allowing for transfer of behaviours down ancestral chain
Dr Bruce Lipton PhD helpful - Spontaneous Evolution, Biology of BeliefRuh Breath/Shakti
Nafs Individual Identity (Linguistic Structure Output)23100 - Haply I may do good in that which I have left. By no means! it is a (mere) word that he speaks; and before them is a barrier until the day they are raised.
Be forewarned, beliefs in all besides Absolute Decree (i.e. Pure Noble Guidance) esp. thoughts and ideas of individuals leading to worldview will have profound infinite consequences
More to the story? Find out the true relation between Names ("Taught Adam the names" such that all shall clear be Sight
For that foresight, determination, peace make
Error, hindsight, misery obtained, foresight, determination yet once more sought, the lesson first repeated once moresun
- Living Enlightenment
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Peace all,
We can see that the body stays here on earth, and the nafs goes to judgment, but what happens to the ruh after death?
Any opinions?same when a soul is sleeping , in a peaceful atmosphere searching here and there , going in gardens, meeting with people who you like , its like dreams state, an suddenly they wull awake when horn is blown,
for the one who is wicked the state of sleep is uncomfortable ,
in quran death is given example as sleep.
but death and life are gr8 signs of lord to test us, nobody really knows waht will happen, to them after death. but this death exist and we need to understand God is shoing his signs in every aspect of life he is watching over his creation.
near death experiece documentry may be help,
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Huruf,
The memory is suppressed. It is reachable by becoming closer to your real person and actually is there all the time but the bodily clouds the perception of it. Past experiences leave an imprint on your "soul" (person) and your balance as a person depends on your past living. This imprint is what Quran speaks of in chapter 2 underneath a fabricated context imposed on an innocent discourse and the language uses the word 'khatam' for it.
The body and the world works as a contradiction to your real spirit of your soul and is designed to corrupt it, all in an ingenious test environment. The "purer" and more physically detached the more hooked up to your real identity you become, and that shows in your way of Being.
Be well
Amenuel -
Huruf,
The memory is suppressed. It is reachable by becoming closer to your real person and actually is there all the time but the bodily clouds the perception of it. Past experiences leave an imprint on your "soul" (person) and your balance as a person depends on your past living. This imprint is what Quran speaks of in chapter 2 underneath a fabricated context imposed on an innocent discourse and the language uses the word 'khatam' for it.
The body and the world works as a contradiction to your real spirit of your soul and is designed to corrupt it, all in an ingenious test environment. The "purer" and more physically detached the more hooked up to your real identity you become, and that shows in your way of Being.
Be well
AmenuelSura 2 is a very lonng one, can you be more precise?
Salaam
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i think MOF is reffering about the verse seven of chapter 2, if i m not wrong.
Edip-Layth (Quran A Reformist Translation)
27 God has sealed their hearts and their ears; and over their eyes are covers. They will incur a great retribution.The Monotheist Group (The Quran A Monotheist Translation)
27 God has sealed their hearts and their ears, and over their eyes are covers. They will incur a great retribution.Muhammad Asad (The Message Of Quran)
27 God; has sealed their hearts and their hearing, and over their eyes is a veil;7 and awesome suffering awaits them.Rashad Khalifa (The Final Testament)
27 GOD seals their minds and their hearing, and their eyes are veiled. They have incurred severe retribution.Shabbir Ahmed (Quran As It Explains Itself)
27 God (His Law of Cause and Effect) has sealed their hearts and their hearing, and on their sight there is a veil. And theirs will be a tremendous suffering. -
Basically I am, yes. Those translations are very weak though. And it is not a correct statement either, because the awakening of one's spirit is entirely up to the person themselves and their way of Being. "The sign is in their way of Being", i.e. one can more or less see whether a person is "guided" (developed) or not by their way of being. In the passage khatam is used to say "the imprint or sign" in order to say how one can distinguish between people. It is good advice in order to know which people to use most resources on and is obvious in a scripture meant as a manual or instruction, although obviously one should never withhold information from anyone (if they care to listen).
Be well
Amenuel -
same when a soul is sleeping , in a peaceful atmosphere searching here and there , going in gardens, meeting with people who you like , its like dreams state, an suddenly they wull awake when horn is blown,
for the one who is wicked the state of sleep is uncomfortable ,
in quran death is given example as sleep.
but death and life are gr8 signs of lord to test us, nobody really knows waht will happen, to them after death. but this death exist and we need to understand God is shoing his signs in every aspect of life he is watching over his creation.
near death experiece documentry may be help,
Your response indicates to me that you are referring to the nafs and not the ruh,
my question is "what happens to the ruh after death"?Ruh Breath/Shakti
Nafs Individual Identity (Linguistic Structure Output)I agree with you definitions, same question, "what happens to the ruh after death"?
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Your response indicates to me that you are referring to the nafs and not the ruh,
my question is "what happens to the ruh after death"?I agree with you definitions, same question, "what happens to the ruh after death"?
Transferred on perhaps? Like the cycle of energy?
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Your response indicates to me that you are referring to the nafs and not the ruh,
my question is "what happens to the ruh after death"?I agree with you definitions, same question, "what happens to the ruh after death"?
i havnt read or research much on this issue, but as far i think, its something regarding to alam e arwah(world of rooh) alme barzakh in arabic , the dimenshn for keeping soul in safe custody and when day of recokening happen these will connected back to characcter and body what will be required to meet up the criteria for hereafter, but usually people consider rooh and soul in a same sense i think these both things are connected with eachother, human being is in a pair like everything is in a pair , consist of body(material) and rooh/soul/charaacter(immaterial) ,
Allah knows best how the things will be adjusted after death, let us die then we will get correct answers, lol
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Ruh does not die
To my current knowledge it is unbornBreath - one part of our Spirit (the inhale/in-breath) is within our body
The other part of our Spirit is outside of our body and flows according to the decree of the Absolute, the Almighty
Yes this means we have existence both within our body and outside of our body
We are just as much 'out there' as 'in here' though one would be compelled to believe by misguided ones that our body is our true natureKnowledge of this is key to comprehending our true eternal existence
The Ruh shall not be destroyed
The physical body decays
One can send commands directly to the Ruh and the Ruh will respond accordingly. It is interactive. It is a Living Breath
On that day, the Spirit and the angels who stand in lines will not speak except those whom the Beneficent God has permitted, and he will speak the right words.This is through the still small voice of the Heart. Gently at the level of nearing silence communicate with the Ruh on the in-breath, serenely. One will feel tingles of light flowing through the physical manifestation when this is correctly executed. See where it leads - it is your direct connection to the Absolute, the All-High
There is a nerve centre in the region of the heart which enables this - the Command reaches the heart from Allah and flows out from within by mercy of the Holy
Further research keywords The Little Brain In the HeartIndeed it is of the greatest favours of our Rabb, the Pure, the Holy, the Wise, the Protector