Are Malaika angels?
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Peace everyone,
According to "traditional islam" malaika means angels (female creatures with wings). But does the Quranic evidence suggests that the word Malaika means angels (female creatures with wings)?
Quran 37150 Or did We create the Malaika as females while they witnessed?
Quran 4319 And they have claimed the angels who are with the Almighty are females! Have they been made witness to their creation? We will record their testimony, and they will be asked.
Quran 69 And (even] if We had appointed an angel as Our message-bearer, We would certainly have made him a man - and thus We would only have confused them in the same way as they are now confusing themselves.
Also see the two different translations of the word Malaika in verse 351 below.
Shabbir Ahmed 351 All praise is due to God, the Originator of all Highs and Lows. He appoints His universal forces, having multiple functions e.g. message-bearers. He increases in creation as He wills. Certainly, God has appointed due measure for all things and events.
Monotheist translation 351 Praise be to God, Initiator of the heavens and the earth; maker of the angels as messengers with wings of two, and three, and four. He increases in the creation as He wishes. God is able to do all things.
Are Malaika angels? And do Malaika have wings? It would be interesting to hear your thoughts and opinions regarding this topic.
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Are you making Gabriel and Michael into females?
They are by their natural form ethereal but can partake in this world in any form, e.g. any gender (angels are genderless). Wings is just a Pagan imagination because in worldly thinking there is a belief wings are required to ascend into Heaven as if there is a direction to head away in.
The word malaikat stems from the root me-la-ka which is the same one to symbolize king. Those beings are managers of affairs in Rabb and controls those they are above, i.e. all the worldly humans who have not ascended into "angels" (maleikat). Saying they are without free will is like a joke and contradicts the word's root, but things being against logic is not foreign to some people.
Be well
Amenuel -
Are Malaika angels? And do Malaika have wings? It would be interesting to hear your thoughts and opinions regarding this topic.
It is another neo-Mut'azila question? Another revisionist review? Another pseudo-sufist biased claim mingled with philosophy?
I think YES, your question is another misguided claim
Of course Angels exists, and are physical entities coming from different(s) dimension(s).
But maybe you want the approbation of Man of Faith, our neo-Mutazila philosopher....
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@ tara
look in the arabic , the freeminds interpretation is close to the meanings but
shabbir ahmed taranslation
he clearly miss arabic words that mean two three and four,
and one interesting thing yesterday i found there is one word awal before wings and awal mean one.
so in other words its a sequence of one two three four and so on, in mathematical language Allah is talking about some scientific or mathematical thing in the shape of set of natural numbers like this 1,2,3,4......
shabbir ahemd translation is not correct according to words original meanings,
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Yes, fye, Melak means master or ruler.
Miim-Lam-Kaf = to rule/command/reign, be capable, to control, power/authority, king, kingdom.
Source F-Arabic Root Dictionary
Melaikat has a suffix -t and a predicate/object carrier -ye , where is used to mark object in plural whereas it would have been singular/uncountable with (teh), i.e. melaikat are rulers in plural. This is against Islamic dogma and thus clerics have had to distort the meaning always attributed to the phenomenon which is called angels in English since in the Islamic doctrine Allah has no associates.
It does not end there either but successful humans are to be melaikat if they pass the test in this world, totally heretical against the Islamic dogma but compatible with what Jesus teaches in the Biblical Gospels.
Be well,
Amenuel -
Yes, fye, Melak means master or ruler.
Miim-Lam-Kaf = to rule/command/reign, be capable, to control, power/authority, king, kingdom.
Source F-Arabic Root Dictionary
Melaikat has a suffix -t and a predicate/object carrier -ye , where is used to mark object in plural whereas it would have been singular/uncountable with (teh), i.e. melaikat are rulers in plural. This is against Islamic dogma and thus clerics have had to distort the meaning always attributed to the phenomenon which is called angels in English since in the Islamic doctrine Allah has no associates.
It does not end there either but successful humans are to be melaikat if they pass the test in this world, totally heretical against the Islamic dogma but compatible with what Jesus teaches in the Biblical Gospels.
Be well,
AmenuelSalaam;
Amenuel, I acknowledge and appreciate your intelligence.
However, this isn't a philosophical forum.
Here Schopenhauer, Nietzsche, Voltaire, etc. have no place. Likewise Lacan, Althusser, Todorov or Derrida here isn't a structuralist-type psychoanalysis forum.
The same about politics here talking about Lenin, Marx, Fanon or intersectional politics make no sense.
What is this forum? To talk about Quran. If we want to dismantle the erroneous conceptions shared by Sunnite or Shiite sects, we must study them from our critical point of view.
I think philosophy is a very serious element against this purpose.
Peace brother.
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Philosophy? It was an explanation on what melak means according to what you asked involving logic and reason, and according to etymology.
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@ tara
.....and one interesting thing yesterday i found there is one word awal before wings and awal mean one.so in other words its a sequence of one two three four and so on, in mathematical language Allah is talking about some scientific or mathematical thing in the shape of set of natural numbers like this 1,2,3,4......
shabbir ahemd translation is not correct according to words original meanings,
Salam imrankhawaja
Where did you see the word awal in the ayat? Do you have any idea what you are talking about?
It shows that you do not know anything about Arabic. A brotherly suggestion to you please learn some Arabic before challenging scholars like Dr. Shabbir Ahmad.
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Salaam;
Amenuel, I acknowledge and appreciate your intelligence.
However, this isn't a philosophical forum.
Here Schopenhauer, Nietzsche, Voltaire, etc. have no place. Likewise Lacan, Althusser, Todorov or Derrida here isn't a structuralist-type psychoanalysis forum.
The same about politics here talking about Lenin, Marx, Fanon or intersectional politics make no sense.
What is this forum? To talk about Quran. If we want to dismantle the erroneous conceptions shared by Sunnite or Shiite sects, we must study them from our critical point of view.
I think philosophy is a very serious element against this purpose.
Peace brother.
Try to focus on the root word which I thought to be Malak or master.
Mof spoke about a few verses in Quran like one saying we just gain mastery surah 3-ish ALLAH knows best.
I don't believe that to be away from the topic I hope that doesn't introduce new and unfounded beliefs.
Another root word thing from the 5or 6 Aran words I know from Quran commentary.
Ilah means God.
ALLAH is almighty God the God or the one God.
The prefix I guess is al-
Why do translators simply say God when the word al-lah is written?
And back to angels
Isn't malakat the realm of the master?
Recall the verse where angels are meantioned holding up ALLAH's throne.
Also the verse where Adam is broght into view of iblis (before his rebellion) and the angels.- at does this denote "place" or realm maybe world? It changes the word master no doubt but how?
Lol first reasoning about djinn and now angels oh yeah this is the seventh heaven there is a verse about the highest heaven or something. Also a verse speaking that ALLAH has set his throne over the seas.
This is where the Quran shows it's balance there is a sea of water and also a sea of stars.
Does anyone know of any more seas or any context clue verses to guide our reasoning.
And also thanks for trying to weed out any philosophical garbage but those men were reasoners they had to start with a truth they exist and reason with other truths until an agreeing fact was found.We have ship's to sail through both the water seas and the star seas and we can reason toward as well has backward these verses had to always be true. A sea is not just a bunch of water it is a collective body of blank water is just implied like with the saying a mustard seed everything surrounding it is implied toward out understanding through reason.
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Philosophy? It was an explanation on what melak means according to what you asked involving logic and reason, and according to etymology.
I'm not talking about this specific issue, but from a general perspective.
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Yes, lostintheworld, but I was talking about this particular issue.
Be well
Amenuel -
Salam imrankhawaja
Where did you see the word awal in the ayat? Do you have any idea what you are talking about?
It shows that you do not know anything about Arabic. A brotherly suggestion to you please learn some Arabic before challenging scholars like Dr. Shabbir Ahmad.
w salam brother,
u did not properly understand what i try to say, sorry for misunderstanding first of all all i cear what i try to say.
i said the root translation meaning prounouncing in arabic http//corpus.quran.com/wordmorphology.jsp?location=(3519)
its Uli which root words are here see another link(1) Noun
(2419) awwala (the) first
(3962) awwala (the) First
(511415) li-awwalin for first of us
(6141 awwala (the) first
(62532) l-awalna (of) the former (people)
(61637) awwalu (the) first
(73826) lilhum about the first of them
(7392) lhum (the) first of them
(714340) awwalu (the) first
(83117) l-awalna (of) the former (people)
(83816) l-awalna (of) the former (people)
(91311) awwala first
(910810) awwali (the) first
(15107) l-awalna (of) the former (people)
(15137) l-awalna (of) the former (people)
(1754) lhum (for) the first of the two
(1771 awwala first
(175113) awwala (the) first
(175910) l-awalna the former (people)
(18489) awwala the first
(185515) l-awalna (of) the former (people)
(20659) awwala the first
(21514) l-awalna (to) the former
(211049) awwala (the) first
(23816) l-awalna the former (people)
(2553) l-awalna (of) the former people
(265110) awwala (the) first
(261375) l-awalna (of) the former (people)
(261964) l-awalna (of) the former (people)
(276812) l-awalna (of) the former (people)
(284310) l-l former
(287010) l-l the first
(3333 l-l the former
(354316) l-awalna (of) the former (people)
(36795) awwala (the) first
(37593) l-l the first
(371686) l-awalna the former (people)
(39124) awwala (the) first
(412115) awwala (the) first
(4366) l-awalna the former (people)
(4387) l-awalna (of) the former (people)
(43817) awwalu (would be the) first
(44355) l-l the first
(44567) l-l the first
(46172 l-awalna (of) the former (people)
(53253) wal-l and the first
(53504) l-l the first
(53565) l-l the former
(56133) l-awalna the former (people)
(56393) l-awalna the former people
(56493) l-awalna the former
(56624) l-l the first
(5732) l-awalu (is) the First
(59211) li-awwali at (the) first
(68157) l-awalna (of) the former (people)
(77163) l-awalna the former (people)
(77385) wal-awalna and the former (people)
(79255) wal-l and the first
(83137) l-awalna (of) the former (people)
(92134) wal-l and the first (life)
(9345) l-l the first
(2) Adjective
(98321) awwala (the) first
(91002) l-awalna the first
(16249) l-awalna (of) the ancient
(20217) l-l the former
(20515) l-l (of) the former
(2013313) l-l the former
(232426) l-awalna our forefathers
(236810) l-awalna (to) their forefathers
(238312) l-awalna (of) the former (people)
(26265) l-awalna (of) your forefathers
(261845) l-awalna the former
(283617) l-awalna our forefathers
(37172) l-awalna former
(37715) l-awalna (of) the former (people)
(371265) l-awalna (of) your forefathers
(44810) l-awalna the former
(50153) l-awali the first
(56482) l-awalna former
(87185) l-l former
(3) Time adverb
(6946) awwala (the) first
(6110 awwala (the) first
Noun
(21795) yul O men
(21972 yul O men
(226915) ul those
(3745) ul men
(3132 li-ul for the owners
(3189) wa-ul and owners
(319010) li-ul for men
(484) ul (of)
(459 wa-ul and those
(48315) ul those
(4957) ul the ones (who are)
(510012) yul O men
(87510) wa-ul But those
(98611) ul (the) men
(911311) ul near of kin
(111167) ul those possessing a remnant
(121116) li-ul for men
(131914) ul men
(145212) ul men
(1759) ul those of great military might
(2054 li-ul for possessors
(2012816) li-ul for possessors
(24223) ul those of virtue
(24229) ul (to) the near of kin
(243151) ul having no physical desire
(24449) li-ul for those who have vision
(27333) ul (are) possessors
(27335) wa-ul and possessors
(287617) ul possessors of great strength
(336 wa-ul And possessors
(3519) ul having wings
(3829 ul those of understanding
(38439) li-ul for those of understanding
(38456) ul possessors
(39923) ul those of understanding
(391812) ul the men of understanding
(392130) li-ul for those of understanding
(40543) li-ul for those
(46354) ul those of determination
(4816 ul possessors of military might
(59239) yul O those endowed
(65415) wa-ultu And those who (are)
(65613) ulti those (who are)
(6510 yul O men
(73113) ul possessors
Noun
(2494) li (the) people
(2507) la (the) people
(224817) lu (by the) family
(224819) walu and family
(3112) li (of the) people
(3336) wala and (the) family
(333 wala and (the) family
(45412) la (the) family
(71303) la (the) people
(71414) li (the) people
(8522) li (of) people
(8542) li (of) people
(85413) la (the) people
(12612) li (the) family
(14612) li (the) people
(15592) la the family
(15613) la (to the) family
(1964) li (the) family
(27569) la (the) family
(2 -
and can you see a clear difference in all these places only this one verse is giving different meaning from the rest of the quran.
when i was saying awal mean one what i told you was transaltion meaning of this word
yes arabic is not my first language but i have a little bit knowledge about it .in my school they teach us as second language , and more over my own mother languages urdu and punjabi also derived from arabic , lot of words of arabic are same in my language ,
anyway apart from my knowledge you can clearly see only in one place it meaning are interpreted as wings and on all other places its same idea of first, former ,one as a meaning , and this verse is 35 1
now come to the point of shabbir ahmed , i did not challange him niether i said anybody wrong ever , i told according to his views he missed literal meaning of words pronounce like uli, and arabic words
(35111)
mathn
two where is this word in shabbir ahmed translation.(35112)
wathultha
or three where is this word in shabbir ahmed translation.(35113)
waruba
or four. where is this word in shabbir ahmed translation.even is somebody have no understanding regarding arabic but todays websites like this solved lot of problems , thanx To God who gives everybody eyes brain and sense , jazak Allah
God bless you brother , i m a student like you no body can intereprete the actual meaning of quran apart from God, so thats y lot of interpretaation of here in the market so that we can cheeck,
if you properly understand all this what i m tryinng to say there is something fishy about the wings(Allah knows best) , that what tara asked , that was our subject was .
peace. -
Actually it was quite inappropriate to call it philosophical viewpoint since I was factual, Zulf. I listed definitions for Miim-Lam-Kaf (Mi-La-K) plus made logical remarks concerning Melaikat being without free will considered the etymological root (king/ruler).
Be well
Amenuel -
Peace everyone,
Here are some more verses regarding Malaika (commonly translated as angels).
The Monotheist Group 5327 Those who disbelieve in the Hereafter name the Malaika (angels) with feminine names.
Shabbir Ahmed 5327 Only those who do not believe in the Hereafter consider the Malaika (forces in Nature) as flying female beings and name them with female names.
The Monotheist Group 1740 Has your Lord preferred for you the males, while He takes the females as Malaika (angels)? You are indeed saying a grave thing!
Also, the Quran suggests that humans have not witnessed the creation of Malaika. In other words, the Quran suggests that humans don't know what Malaika look like.
The Monotheist Group 4319 And they have claimed the Malaika (angels) who are with the Almighty are females! Have they been made witness to their creation? We will record their testimony, and they will be asked.
We can see in verse 4319 that humans have not been made witness to the creation of Malaika. Thus, the Quran suggests that humans don't know what Malaika look like.
It seems that those who say that Malaika are females or human-like creatures have based their views purely on conjecture.
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It is true that a lot of people often depict beautiful and clement females as angels and that is for some reason the connotation for them.
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To most people, most things are philosophical. Unless we have practical and direct experience, it would be not much more than theory and philosophy. It seems to me also that it is usually the ones who have least practical knowledge and experience that are most aggressive in defending their stance. It is probably like this because if it is just an idea, which you identify with and build your personality from, then criticism of this idea is fatal and you will defend it will full force. However, if you have practical knowledge and experience of something, then there is not such a great need to defend it... because you know it is real no matter what people say.
So, that was some half off topic philosophy from my side.Regarding angels... I find it funny how people take them as female. The gender thing is amazing, as this means that such angel species would also have males, and produce children, because this is what sex/gender is all about. It's about mixing DNA for offspring. Perhaps some people do think angels are beings that copulate and give birth to children. But it cannot be done with only females though, unless they are lesbians who auto-replicate or something like that. Reminds me about the so called 72 virgins.... and that it is also claimed that most inhabitants of hell are female. So, basically, both hell and heaven are jam packed by females. Sounds like a pathetic male fantasy.