The Rights of Children
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Peace all,
Just have to get something off my chest here.
Is anyone else bothered by the fact that there is not a direct statement in Qur'an that says to be good to our children?
We are told not to kill our children, and that our children are a test, yes. But why not be good to them too?
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I imagine the various recommendations it gives in terms of how to behave/act towards others includes children.
I haven't studied this but I recall these verses
45 And do not give the immature ones your money for which God has made you overseers, and spend on them from it and clothe them, and speak to them in goodness.
2233 ...And the father for whom the child is born is responsible for both their provisions and clothing equitably....
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Peace Wakas,
I imagine the various recommendations it gives in terms of how to behave/act towards others includes children.
I've thought of this as well. But still, we don't parent other people, we parent children. So there's still a difference in treatment.
I see many Muslims seem to think that just because a person is your mother/father you can't say anything against them at all in any way. Parents seem to be entirely immune from criticism in this regard. Thus parents seem to be able to do whatever they want with no consequences because the child can't say anything.
I see a lot of people use the verse (that says we should not say anything against our parents when they're reaching old age) to justify the immunity. (To me though, "old" is subjective and implies an unsound mind.)
Anyways. This mentality just really gets to me.
I've thought of the verses like 6131 which says to not kill children out of poverty. I'm aware that the word itself doesn't have to be taken as actually killing them but fighting or mastering them, which would then sound like a verse on how we should treat our children (or rather, how we should not treat them). But obviously that does not make sense within the context of the rest of the verse.
I haven't studied this but I recall these verses
45 And do not give the immature ones your money for which God has made you overseers, and spend on them from it and clothe them, and speak to them in goodness.
2233 ...And the father for whom the child is born is responsible for both their provisions and clothing equitably....
Good verses, I'll look into them further.
peace
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Peace Comrox,
Peace all,
Just have to get something off my chest here.
Is anyone else bothered by the fact that there is not a direct statement in Qur'an that says to be good to our children?
We are told not to kill our children, and that our children are a test, yes. But why not be good to them too?
What does "good" mean, and which sorts of things might it include?
Peace.
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Peace all,
Just have to get something off my chest here.
Is anyone else bothered by the fact that there is not a direct statement in Qur'an that says to be good to our children?
We are told not to kill our children, and that our children are a test, yes. But why not be good to them too?
There is no verse that says to be "good" to the parents. Matter of fact, being "good to the parents" is the norm and it appears in its context among the Unlawful things for a submitter, making one who "isn't good" a big sinner.
Everywhere I read in the Quran is about being good to others, implicitly, for e.g in the verse that states when the foolish speak to you, respond to them with a word of peace.
The concept of being good can only be attained by Righteousness, which is the whole purpose of the "Worshipping".
Furthermore, God only specified what's relevant with His Wisdom. If you go to some silly Islamic Q&A site you'll find a ton of questions such as "is it ok to do such or such to my wife with my finger" and many hilarious questions. Of course God doesn't go into the subtle details of the Human life.
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It may ot specifically address children in general, but there are quite a few ayas regarding orphans and not to eat their wealth, and take care of them and send rather of our own wealh inthem instead of theirs if we can afford it. So if we are ordered to take good care of orphans it is undrstood that we fo so with the rest of the children, otherwise it would no tmake any sense.
Salaam
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Peace Wakas, es, Cerberus, huruf, peace
45 And do not give the immature ones your money for which God has made you overseers, and spend on them from it and clothe them, and speak to them in goodness.
This is a very good verse, definitely. If it was specifically referring to children, it would be perfect for me. Although it doesn't, it's still a good verse and inclusive of others who need our help. )
2233 ...And the father for whom the child is born is responsible for both their provisions and clothing equitably....
I suppose I should clarify. When I'm talking about good treatment to children, as well as a child's rights, I'm not talking about providing for their physical/worldly needs such as food, shelter, clothing, etc. I understand Qur'an tells us to provide for them in this sense. I'm talking about good treatment in terms of how we speak to them, listen to them, discipline them, behave around them, support their social, academic, and emotional needs, etc.
Looking into the full verse, I'm confused by it. "...No mother shall be harmed because of her child, nor shall a father be harmed because of his child..." Why is this mentioned? Why is the opposite not mentioned (no child shall be harmed because of their mother/father)? This reminds me of the story in which the youth is killed because of the oppression he may have caused to his parents (1880). Why, in these instances, don't the parents seem to be held responsible for the ways in which they raise their children? This all seems to be in the parents' favor.
Peace Comrox,
What does "good" mean, and which sorts of things might it include?
Peace.
Good question.
I touched on this in what I said above to Wakas. Let me first say that I do not have children, so my answer will lack first-hand experience of being a parent. I do have experience being a daughter though.
To me, "being good" (or not good) to our children is determined by how we speak them (what words we use, when they're used, our tone when we say them, how we respond when our children speak to us, etc.), how we listen to them, how we discipline them (in what way, for how long, etc.), how we encourage them, how we behave around them (as parents are the first role models for their children), how we show them our love and care, how we teach them to be functioning adults in a diverse and social world, how we support their social, academic, and emotional needs, how we support their life goals or dreams, etc - More encompassing, how we support a child who is unique in their own right. To be good to children is to have ultimately formed a relationship built on mutual respect and consideration between parent and child, a relationship that is emotionally healthy, an overall positive experience for both involved, and strong enough to last a lifetime. This relationship would also involve regular and open communication/interaction, love, trust, and in some form at some time, compromise or sacrifice on one's part for the sake of the other.
I'd be interested to hear if your definition is different in this context. )
There is no verse that says to be "good" to the parents.
What's your take on verses such as 283, 436, 6151, 1723, 298, and 4615, then?
Matter of fact, being "good to the parents" is the norm and it appears in its context among the Unlawful things for a submitter, making one who "isn't good" a big sinner.
I would imagine whether or not someone is good to their parents depends on their age, maturity, and the relationship they have with their parents. There are people who love their parents dearly. Likewise, there are people who hate their parents. Some of them have reasons that may be justified, others may not. (Unless it's not true hate.)
Everywhere I read in the Quran is about being good to others, implicitly, for e.g in the verse that states when the foolish speak to you, respond to them with a word of peace.
The concept of being good can only be attained by Righteousness, which is the whole purpose of the "Worshipping".
It's interesting that in 2177, parents aren't mentioned at all (not specifically). But then again, in this verse nothing is spoken about doing good, but rather who to spend your money on.
Furthermore, God only specified what's relevant with His Wisdom. If you go to some silly Islamic Q&A site you'll find a ton of questions such as "is it ok to do such or such to my wife with my finger" and many hilarious questions. Of course God doesn't go into the subtle details of the Human life.
Why did He go into the details of singling out being good to parents then? (If that's what you understand the above verses to mean, that is.) Is it not relevant for Him to mention specifically to treat children well/be good to them, in turn? (Are we just supposed to provide for children's physical needs and refrain from killing them?)
I suppose one could say that doing good to children doesn't need to be mentioned as we are told children are a test so, the test could be about how we raise them. Perhaps being good to children also doesn't need to be mentioned if the society in which Qur'an was revealed only had a problem with treating parents unjustly, but then I feel that would go against the notion that Qur'an is for all mankind (I know that's still been a debate in this forum). I just don't think these are good enough reasons for not including a simple verse. I don't understand His reasons.
It may ot specifically address children in general, but there are quite a few ayas regarding orphans and not to eat their wealth, and take care of them and send rather of our own wealh inthem instead of theirs if we can afford it. So if we are ordered to take good care of orphans it is undrstood that we fo so with the rest of the children, otherwise it would no tmake any sense.
Salaam
I'm not sure.
Some further ramblings
I'm finding 436 to be fascinating. While children are not mentioned specifically, we are instructed to do good to the relatives (of which include children, of course) and those committed to us by oath... I'm just thinking out loud here, but could children be a part of those who are committed to us by oath? Certainly, right, if we take this translation?
298... As I understand it, being good to one's parents is not simply equivalent to obeying one's parents. 298 does make it seem that way though
"And We instructed the human being to be good to his parents. But if they strive to make you set up partners with Me, then do not obey them."
If being good is not talking about being obedient to parents in the above verse, then I don't see why "but" is inserted at the start of the next sentence. If it is talking about being obedient, than the "but" would make perfect sense.
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Peace,
I think this is precisely the issue. All children are unique as are all families, so how one should treat children differs significantly. If I think about my cousin' and step-siblings' children, well, all of them are so different. What one child is receptive to, the other isn't. Which sensitivities I have to be aware with one doesn't faze another. What one parent / set of parents can provide (I'm particularly talking about basic needs here), another might be unable to fulfil that. Therefore, I think it becomes difficult to dictate family structure, provision of care, etc. as Allah's creation is do diverse. I think it is left to us and we are judged accordingly.
Peace.
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Yes, I agree, we are told in many aspecs and asages what our behaviour should be individuals, but are not given details, which is logical since the Qur'an gives freedom to each person to develo his or her own personality a potential. If it gave details it would be forcing us into patterns which are not moral or necessary directives bus just varieties.
The plce of those possible details on the other hannd is taken over by the histories of prophets. Speaking about children we have the way Ibrahim interacts with his son, for instance, full of tenderness and respect. That is worth many directives.
Salaam
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Salam peace
Children's right are spread all through the Quran, I think. Just veeeeeery few examples and quotes that crossed my mind.
Right to have a name and family (335) ?Name them by their fathers?.
Right to be clothed and fed and over their future inheritance
22233 (wich you read ?a father shall not be harmed because of his child? but it is common sense you can understand ?don?t use your children to harm?),
768 ?And they give food out of love to the poor and the orphan and the captive?,
9015 (the better path is the feeding) "of an orphan in relation"
410 "Those who consume the money of the orphans illicitly, in fact they are consuming fire in their bellies, and they will endure the Blaze"
6152 ""And do not come near the money of the orphan, except for what is best, until he reaches his independence; and give honestly full measure and weight equitably."Right to be defended and protected
4.75 And why do you not fight in the cause of God, when the weak among the men and women and children say "Our Lord, bring us out of this town whose people are wicked, and grant us from Yourself a supporter, and grant us from Yourself a victor!"
666 (moral and spiritual protection)
24.33, if you want to consider children here.Right to life
1731 And do not kill your children
818-9 And when the girl killed in infancy is asked, / For what crime was she killed?"And soooooooooo many others
sun
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all children deserve to be loved... i really love kids..
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I would imagine whether or not someone is good to their parents depends on their age, maturity, and the relationship they have with their parents. There are people who love their parents dearly. Likewise, there are people who hate their parents. Some of them have reasons that may be justified, others may not. (Unless it's not true hate.)
It's interesting that in 2177, parents aren't mentioned at all (not specifically). But then again, in this verse nothing is spoken about doing good, but rather who to spend your money on.
Why did He go into the details of singling out being good to parents then? (If that's what you understand the above verses to mean, that is.) Is it not relevant for Him to mention specifically to treat children well/be good to them, in turn? (Are we just supposed to provide for children's physical needs and refrain from killing them?)
You're basing the issue on the "being good" alone. why not add a small verse where God would say "be good to the children" ? etc I get your point. But you didn't get mine.
God says, again, in the context of LAWFUL/UNLAWFUL things to be good to the parents even when you no longer need them i.e if you grew up or in their old age where they tend to become a "weight".
1723 Your Lord decreed that you shall not serve except Him, and do good to your parents. When one of them or both of them reaches old age, do not say to them a word of disrespect nor raise your voice at them, but say to them a kind saying.
Being good to the parent is an attitude to hold whatever reason you have, it is the NORM(Not to be taken as being good to someone, as a good deed or out of friendship etc); It's the law for any submitter to God. and in other verses, God goes into even more details saying that you should remain good to them even if they go against God.
And the following verse shows the wisdom behind it "as they have raised me when I was young" i.e Gratefulness.1724-25 And lower for them the wing of humility through mercy, and say "My Lord, have mercy upon them as they have raised me when I was young. Your Lord is fully aware of what is in yourselves. If you are good, then He is to those who repent a Forgiver"
How can one seek to be thankful to God if he can't be grateful to his parents? Thankfulness comes after attaining Righteousness.
And when you say, a small verse about children, what about grand children, they deserve some love too.
What about...what about ...literally everyone ?
Comparing parents' right to children's right or anyone else isn't an obvious thing to do. Specially the mother.
4615 We instructed the human being to honor his parents. His mother bore him with hardship, gave birth to him in hardship, and his weaning lasts thirty months. Until he has attained his maturity, and reaches forty years, he says "My Lord, direct me to appreciate the blessings You have bestowed upon me and upon my parents, and to do righteousness that pleases You. Let my progeny be righteous. I have repented to You; I am of those who have peacefully surrendered."
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Peace,
Thank you all for your additional input.
22233 (wich you read a father shall not be harmed because of his child but it is common sense you can understand dont use your children to harm”
I'm not sure how you are reaching that conclusion.
And the following verse shows the wisdom behind it "as they have raised me when I was young" i.e Gratefulness.
I think this brings up a good point.
I'm thinking now that perhaps raising children well could, possibly, be a pre-condition for doing good to parents. Otherwise, if a person doesn't raise their children well at all, then how are they deserving of receiving good treatment?
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More thoughts
I also think about other verses which say that one cannot use their children for their own gain or to save themselves (5817, 7011 - I'm sure there are more) prove that we are all responsible for ourselves. of course, and we will all stand on our own, no matter if we've raised children or not.
I find the following verse concerning
985 And do not be impressed by their wealth and their children; God only wishes to punish them with it in this world, and so their souls will be taken while they are rejecters.
People are punished by their children? ???
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Additional and intriguing verses on children that I've come across -
6140 "Losers are those who have killed their children foolishly, without knowledge..."
The next two I am quite fond of, at the end of 411 "...Your parents and your children, you do not know which are closer to you in benefit - a directive from God, for God is Knowledgeable, Wise."
4135 "O you who have believed, be persistently standing firm in justice, witnesses for Allah , even if it be against yourselves or parents and relatives."
So I suppose 4135 could be the verse that states pretty clearly, IMO, that parents can't be unjust to their children. But perhaps it's first better to define what "just" means, to really understand what parents/people can and can't do.
Anyways. peace
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Is it matter of deserving? And if it is do you really think that a child or young person is always capable of judging hoy much his or her parents hve done for him or her? Young people articulrly in this age are very rarely in a situation where they can really be impartial and knowledgeable enough to judge and least of all to deserve. How perfect must amother be so that her child when he or she climbs on to the chair of judge declares her innocent.
Regarding the mother in particular
46.15. ... His mother bore him with hardship, gave birth to him in hardship, and his weaning lasts thirty months.We owe her that at least. We may hate her for other things, but at least that we shuld acknowledge and be humble. Otherwise we are not worth our birth. We do not deserve to have been born.
I personally have had a lot of awful misgivings with my mother and I can say that she was awfully partial aginst me and I have suffered in my young years very, very much as we all know how one can suffer in those years. But I would be a bitch if I hadn't given her that, that she bore in hardship, gave birth to me and suckled me. I have had much more love from and for my father who died soon, and as my mothr became very old I never lied to her that she was wonderful with me and thank God I had the opportunity to talk out with her what had weighed on me from her behaviour, she cried and she asked me that a forgive her. Not that a needed that she asks my forgiveness, I did not need that and whatever I suffered because of her I had forgiven a long time ago, but it gave me hainnes to see that at least all shadows between us wer cleared. I thank God so much that when she died we were in eace and love between each other and I know that she did her best to do then what she had not done when I was younger. I thought that God had allowed her to become so old so that she hd the time and leisure to show the best of herself and I had the hainess to see it. My memory of her now is a happy one without shadows.
Parents are not superhuman, or gods, they are people, common people and they become what they should become by being parents, for them we are a learning ground and a learning tool.
While I understand and agree that parents can be awfully unjust and harmful and that we should not lie to them because of respect as to how we feel about their parenting and our suffering because of it, children must also learn that persons are imperfect, that parents have limitations, that they themselves are also learning. And above all that we are too young to be able to be fair judges, and in fact that we should not be judges, just defend ourselves from our parents when we feel that they are unjust.
Also today teenagers are so full of hot air that they would claim nythig is due to them just like that. It is very hard to be a parent today. As we grow older we should put ourselves in their shoes. And not forget that may be indeed they do not deserve our devotion because they may not have been absolutely devoted to us, but then we should also acknowledge the good they did do to us. To say that it was due, does not make it less good. And finally we may have really bad , or evil or harmful parents, in that case we should be equally thankful that we are born and do wht we are capable of doing without lying to ourselves. Something in which we do not put our heart rarely is worthwhile doing.
Salaam
And the mother, no matter what else, gave us life -
And the mother, no matter what else, gave us life
Be careful with that expression around here, it might be considered blasphemous as you associate mothers with their god. Hush hush.
Be well
Amenuel -
Peace,
Thank you all for your additional input.
I'm not sure how you are reaching that conclusion.
I think this brings up a good point.
I'm thinking now that perhaps raising children well could, possibly, be a pre-condition for doing good to parents. Otherwise, if a person doesn't raise their children well at all, then how are they deserving of receiving good treatment?
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More thoughts
I also think about other verses which say that one cannot use their children for their own gain or to save themselves (5817, 7011 - I'm sure there are more) prove that we are all responsible for ourselves. of course, and we will all stand on our own, no matter if we've raised children or not.
I find the following verse concerning
985 And do not be impressed by their wealth and their children; God only wishes to punish them with it in this world, and so their souls will be taken while they are rejecters.
People are punished by their children? ???
--
Additional and intriguing verses on children that I've come across -
6140 "Losers are those who have killed their children foolishly, without knowledge..."
The next two I am quite fond of, at the end of 411 "...Your parents and your children, you do not know which are closer to you in benefit - a directive from God, for God is Knowledgeable, Wise."
4135 "O you who have believed, be persistently standing firm in justice, witnesses for Allah , even if it be against yourselves or parents and relatives."
So I suppose 4135 could be the verse that states pretty clearly, IMO, that parents can't be unjust to their children. But perhaps it's first better to define what "just" means, to really understand what parents/people can and can't do.
Anyways. peace
Good intake on verse 4135, sister.
God states in 6415 that our wealth and our children are a test / trial for us.
And like with every trial, some succeed and some fail.
Some parents might mess up their kid?s psychological and physical development with scars that might mark them for life.
This video explains (in a funny way) how that can be made
https//www.youtube.com/watch?v=mLLP5eWeJIA
In the Quran 1880 there is also the opposite example a child that would have made his believing parents' life painful with his disbelief and thus God sent a prophet to kill him at a young age. (the story starts at 1860)
Just my 2 cents on the subject, God Knows best !
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Peace huruf,
Is it matter of deserving? And if it is do you really think that a child or young person is always capable of judging hoy much his or her parents hve done for him or her?
A child being capable of judging how much parents have done for them? No. Not objectively at least. But, children are still very perceptive, perhaps more than we give them credit for.
Children also learn their environment. There is at least an understanding to some degree. A child who is not able to be a child for example, for whatever reason, is likely going to show that. The example that comes to mind is the young Syrian boy whose picture went viral after he was rescued from an attack. There was absolutely no emotion on his face. This was his environment, his reality, and he was completely conditioned to believe that there is no other environment other than this war.
In these situations, these extreme situations, young children (and even adult children) may be unable to tell if they are, or have been in, a bad situation. When they can't recognize a bad situation, others need to, to be their voice and stand up for them, especially when they cannot stand up for themselves.
Young people articulrly in this age are very rarely in a situation where they can really be impartial and knowledgeable enough to judge and least of all to deserve. How perfect must amother be so that her child when he or she climbs on to the chair of judge declares her innocent.
I'm not talking about young children in particular anymore. A lot of adults may not realize they've been through childhood trauma or abuse until they've reached adulthood (at which point I'm sure they've grown up, matured, learned other environments, understand right from wrong, etc.).
Regarding the mother in particular
46.15. ... His mother bore him with hardship, gave birth to him in hardship, and his weaning lasts thirty months.We owe her that at least. We may hate her for other things, but at least that we shuld acknowledge and be humble.
And the mother, no matter what else, gave us life
With all due respect, I would disagree strongly with the above. A lot of people are capable of having children, physically. Doesn't mean they should be having them. Doesn't mean they're good parents. Doesn't make them automatically more (or less) of a parent just because they go through the physical burdens of carrying a child (or not).
Otherwise we are not worth our birth. We do not deserve to have been born.
Some kids who have been through really traumatic and abusive situations may feel this way. They may feel they're worthless or shouldn't have been born just because their parents tell them to.
The parent(s) makes the choice of having a child; the child itself does not have a say in the process.
I personally have had a lot of awful misgivings with my mother and I can say that she was awfully partial aginst me and I have suffered in my young years very, very much as we all know how one can suffer in those years. But I would be a bitch if I hadn't given her that, that she bore in hardship, gave birth to me and suckled me. I have had much more love from and for my father who died soon, and as my mothr became very old I never lied to her that she was wonderful with me and thank God I had the opportunity to talk out with her what had weighed on me from her behaviour, she cried and she asked me that a forgive her. Not that a needed that she asks my forgiveness, I did not need that and whatever I suffered because of her I had forgiven a long time ago, but it gave me hainnes to see that at least all shadows between us wer cleared. I thank God so much that when she died we were in eace and love between each other and I know that she did her best to do then what she had not done when I was younger. I thought that God had allowed her to become so old so that she hd the time and leisure to show the best of herself and I had the hainess to see it. My memory of her now is a happy one without shadows.
Thank you for sharing your story. I'm very sorry for all you and your mother have gone through. group
I'm glad it sounds like you and your mother found peace. I'm not sure some family relationships are as fortunate.
Parents are not superhuman, or gods, they are people, common people and they become what they should become by being parents, for them we are a learning ground and a learning tool.
No one has to become a parent. We have a choice these days. Plenty of people are choosing to be child-free.
In the Quran 1880 there is also the opposite example a child that would have made his believing parents' life painful with his disbelief and thus God sent a prophet to kill him at a young age. (the story starts at 1860)
I know the story. I just wish there was the opposite example. Obviously as huruf said parents are not gods nor perfect, but if we're talking about killing, I would hope parents would be more well equipped to deal with an unstable person than a small child that must be killed instead. -\
Peace. peace
