Religous Pluralism

EdQ

I have already left the oppressive man made cult falsely named "Islam."

bravo bravo

As far the Quran, yes the essence still remains. I'm reading a very interesting thread on this forum suggesting the quran was never actually in Arabic. Perhaps I'll link it when I'm done reading what the conclusion was. Too bad those users are all unactive now.they were truly open minded.

Great. Goodbye.

unknownuser

Proof eh nice one.
https//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=11372.0
I really wish these users were online at see so much guidance in there posts. I wonder how long they studied to reach that point. I hope I go there soon as well inshAllah

I just realized something.

Someone please correct me, is the word madhab ever used in the Quran? Wow, not even once.
Who knows where these false religions came from.

brickwall brickwall

Controlling the masses.

unknownuser

Please remove the post mods .... '( '( '(

I don't want people I respect reel, Comrox, good logic, zulf etc getting upset at anything I say either. '( '(

I feel like everything I say comes out in elvish rotfl

Thnx hypno

Noon_waalqalami

Again I don't think ALL OF quran is corrupt. Just the part where the merciful god is calling people donkeys and throwing people in eternal hell fire rotfl

Peace, it's very wise advice from luq'man to his son not to prance about arrogantly mocking and ranting mindlessly.

311 alif lam meem
312 those signs the book the wise
313 guidance and mercy to the good doers
314 the ones keeping the connection and giving the recompense its and they in the last/afterlife themselves assured being
315 those on guidance from lord theirs and those themselves the succeeding
316 and among the humankind who purchases idle l-adthi/the tales to misguided about path the god in other than/without knowledge and taketh it mock of those for them punishment shameful
317 and when recited on him signs ours retreat arrogant of like if/be not heard them were in ears his deafness of in punishment dire
318 indeed the ones believes they of and do they of the righteous for them gardens the pleasures
319 eternally live therein promise the god truthful and he the mighty the wise
3110 creation of the heavens without columns thou seeing it and cast in the land firm mountains lest/that it shake with you and dispersed therein from each creature and descends we of from the heaven water so grew we of therein from each spouse noble
3111 this creation the god so show ye me what hath creation of the those who from besides him rather the wrongdoing in misguidance clear
3112 and surely gave we of luq'mna the wisdom that be thankful to god and whoever grateful so only grateful for soul his and whoever disregard so surely the god ample praiseworthy
3113 and when said luq'mnu to son his and he advises him O son mine not associate partners with the god indeed the associate partners surely wrong major
3114 and instruct we of the human with parents dual his carry him mother his weak of on weak and separation his in year two that be thankful to me and to parents dual your to me the destiny
3115 and if endeavor dual against you on that associate partners with me what not is to you in it knowledge so not obey them dual and accompany them dual in the world fair manner of and follows path who turns to me furthermore to me return yours so shall inform you in what be you working
3116 O son mine indeed it if were it weight grain from mustard seed so that be in rock or in the heavens or in the land comes with it the god indeed the god gentle aware
3117 O son mine establish the connection and direct in the fair manner and forbid about the wrong and patience on what struck you indeed such from matters the determination
3118 and not thou turn cheek your to the humankind and not walk in the land insolent of indeed the god not loves each self-conceited boaster
3119 and be moderate in pace yours and lower from voice yours indeed harshest the voices surely voice the donkeys (i.e. those ranting mindlessly)
3120 did not see ye of that the god subjected for you what in the heavens and what in the land and caused upon you favor his visible apparent it bounties his and among the humankind who argue in the god in other than/without knowledge and not guidance and not book illuminate
3121 and when said to them follows ye of what descends the god said they of rather we follow what found we of on it fathers ours even while be the devil calls them to punishment the blaze
3122 and who submitted a direction face/countenance his to the god and he good doer so verily clenched in the handhold the trustworthy/firm and toward the god end the determination
3123 and who disregard so not that grieve you disregard his to us return theirs so we inform them in what did they of indeed the god knower in what the breasts
3124 we grant enjoyment them little of furthermore we force them to punishment severe
3125 and surely if ask you them who creation the heavens and the land surely says they the god say the praise to god rather more them not knowing
3126 to god what in the heavens and the land indeed the god he the ample the praiseworthy
3127 and in case that what/whatever in the land from tree pens and the sea add to it from after it septet waters not exhausted communiqu? the god indeed the god mighty wise
3128 not creation yours and not resurrection yours except as/like soul single indeed the god hearer seer
3129 did not see that the god merges the night in the daytime and merges the daytime in the night and subjected the sun and the moon each flows to term specified and that the god in what thou working aware
3130 such because the god he the truth and that what calling from besides him the falsehood and that the god he the exalted the great
3131 did not see that the ship flow in the sea by favor it the god to show you from signs his indeed in such surely signs to each patient appreciator
3132 and when covers them wave like the shades called they of the god sincere for him the creed so when delivers them to the dry land so among them some are moderate and not denied in verses ours except each ungrateful of
3133 O you the humankind fear ye of lord yours and be mindful day of not availed begetter about offspring his and not offspring he avail about parent thing of indeed promise the god true so not let deceive you the life the world and not let deceive you in the god the deceiver
3134 indeed the god near/with him knowledge the hour and descended the relief and knowledge what in the wombs and not knows soul what hath it earned tomorrow and not knows soul in which land it die indeed the god knower aware

page one of oldest manuscripts MA VI 165 probability 95.4% between 649-675 CE
http//idb.ub.uni-tuebingen.de/diglit/MaVI165

https//s22.postimg.org/81vl4qx29/ch31v16-23.jpg

unknownuser

group

I know Im not saying anything of my own...I was just repeating some really old threads here. I mistakenly thought that was also the general consensus of this forum. Im new to this forum so I didnt know that the overall opinion was different than what those users posted. There very interesting threads though. Again nothing of my own conjecture. I dont know. I am interested in what both say. I believe what my moral compass (3030) can rest on.

b ow. angel

------------------------------------no more replies to this thread please. much grateful.-------------------------------------------------------

Anoushirvan

are you disagree with the meanings of islam =peace?

Yes, I disagree with this meaning in Quran.

Islam in Quran means soundness of the mind, more accurately action to perform soundness of the mind.
The goal is to clarify from spiritual confusion.

It doesn't mean peace in the sense of social peace of a community or a nation, this is a misinterpretation IMO, that can have far reaching consequences.

unknownuser

ive seen "peacemaking" hence a verb be a better fit than peace.
didnt br ayman write a book on this?

Also, "the only system/deen that will be accepted is soundness of mind?" . -verse i cant remember.

-----------------------------------------------------hide this thread pls---------------------------------------------------------------------------

unknownuser

sis comrox is an angel btw

huruf

Baitachal, I am not angry with you, of course not. This is a debate forum and we debate, some times hotter than others, but no reason to get mad at anybody when there is good will and I do not doubt your good will and in fact I can share your feelings many times, because many of us have gon through what you are going through amd besides because in, some tender way, I have adopted you. Your are a young person, full of honest rage at things that upset you very much and you cannot change. You have the unbearable vehemence of youth which makes everything so intense that you feel boiling all over. That I undrstand and I cannot get mad at somebody who tries. That is far more endearing and honest than keeping mum and put up with anything.

But tht, I acknowledge, my expression may be very very forceful and it may seem that I am angr when in fact I am not, I am just very much carried away with what I feel i should defend, not for my sake only but because I think that it is good, that it will do good, as truth does good.

So, sweet Baitachal, do not worry. I am not angry atany honest person however wrong she may be. We have been wrong, all of us, I think, about so many things, all through our life...

Also, when judging Qur'an, you have to remember a sentence by Cardinal Richelieu which is very enlightening

"Give me three lines written by the most innocent man on earth and I will find enough grounds to hang him."

This tells you that any text can be turned into an indictement of anybody if you have the will and lak of scruples to make of it what you want of it, regardless of its true content. Your evil design will reign supreme.

That is what has been done all along with revelation. Where it does nto serve the purposes of the shaytans simple impose on it a new version that will negate its nature and push it authoritatively.

Salaam

imrankhawaja

Inrankhwaja,
Nushuz =\ fashiha.
Stop making your own definitions. You ignored again, what about when wife experiencing nushuz 4128.

i think i made a very simple defination, its another matter if you dnt understand..

you said nushuz = disobeyment ... i agree
i said disobeyment include , fahish acts, zina , adultery , cheating.. (why dnt u agree) ?

lets put it on test ,
can you find me any husband who allowed her wife to do these things ?
if she do these things what will be the response of husband?

is he allowed to use a word "disobeying women" for this situation.. or he will think that becoz quran did not meant cheating as (disobeyment) ..

if a man is not gentle man he will gona put the flowers in the neck of women for such a beautiful work done by her.. there are different varites of people exist in this strange world..

some of them dnt really bother what their women doing behind their back..
some of them forcefully push their wives to do prositution
but we know these type of people are not gentlemans..

when you manage to understand this , perhaps you change ur perception..

imrankhawaja

Yes, I disagree with this meaning in Quran.

handshake

its your right to disagree
BTW send me the source where you drive this interpretation i love to read that
peace

unknownuser

Huruf already explained the difference between the two words.

By your logic

If disobey = adultery

Then

Obey = legal sex

SO next time you obey people you'll be intending something else ok that's your logic.

Go one make up your false words to support your silly stories elsewhere, this thread is CLOSED.

huruf

Disobey is nushuz?

Prove it.

And whom should women, in plural obey. Not wives, there are no wives int he aya. And should not there be an order to disobey before you can disobey anything?

So does that mean that the husband in 4.128 disobeys his wife?

You cannot make words at will. Neither you nor any of the self-appointed interpreters of God through history. You need logic and consistency to put on the Qur'an's mouth any word and meaning you prefer.

Salaam

imrankhawaja

By your logic

If disobey = adultery

Then

Obey = legal sex

handshake

my logic huh?

the logic of every gentleman .. every gentle man thinks cheating = disobeyment ,

if you dnt beleive in that logic than you are living in different universe i think..

look my post again and try to attempt the answers of my questions ..

oy yeh obey = legal sex(wedlock) , and lot of other things same like disobeyment include lot of other things...

do me a favor make a list of things what you think are considered as disobeyments ?
you can also take a survey of proving quran wrong? by all thise husbands whose wives are cheating with them ?
ask them is it true that your wives are disobeying you while they cheat?

if your answers comes in "no" from atleast 10 husbands out of millions then i will think you make a great achievement

and learn some manner too .. God advise us to talk politely and humbly or do you have problem with this command of God too ?

peace and chill out

imrankhawaja

Disobey is nushuz?

Prove it.

baitachal said it , she need to prove it..

i said something else
i said cheating = disobeyment
or disobeyment = cheating along with lot of other things ...

salam

huruf

Disobeying is absolute nonsense.

Whohas given any oder to the women in order for them to be able to disobey.

And who are they supposed to oby to, apart from God?
Some imaginary husbands which are not brought into the question by God and where it does nto say anything abour married wome but about women in general?

The narcisistic view some males have of themselves as the centre of the life of any woman in the planet shows itself well in the view of this aya, which does not involve husbands or wives but men and women in general in society.

If men or people in genral are mentionned, we always think of them as men and think they exist by themselves, when mention of women is made it is different, automatically they do not exist by themselves but as the peripphery of some male.

The aya does not warrant that. It is very clear in its formulation.

And nushuz shoudl be interpreted as something that fits equally int he two occurrences in the Qur'an and other occurrences as a verb or other function.

Salaam

unknownuser

Ah that's an amazing quote huruf.

Truly, humans can find bad in everything.

One must be open to clarify and accept what is the most acceptable.

Yayayayayayayayayayayayay I love huruf

handshake handshake handshake pr pr pr

May I be as wise as well laugh

imrankhawaja

Disobeying is absolute nonsense.

And nushuz shoudl be interpreted as something that fits equally int he two occurrences in the Qur'an and other occurrences as a verb or other function.

Salaam

w salam,

tell this to baitachal..

she claimed herself that nushuz=disobeyment

first of all tell her what does it mean ?

perhaps she will get agree with you becoz she think you are a wise women..

unknownuser

Sorry I just said what corpus said.

I think you are all wise group group group

imrankhawaja

Sorry I just said what corpus said.

I think you are all wise group group group

so its mean you are a blind follower who beleives whatever corpus said ..?