Issue with Salat/ prayer
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Peace Noon.
It does not say "Tarafayi Mina Al Nahar" . The example you gave has "Mina" which gives the meaning of inclusion."Tarafayi Al Nahar" are proximities of boundary ,it does not have to include/be part of Nahar,but at proximity to from both ends. The beguinning and end of the day. i.e near both ends of the day.
GOD bless you.
Peace. -
peace GL and Noon,
this root (ta -ra- fa) is quite interesting and quite technical upon using as per quranic grammer.
i have noted very interesting thing about this root when applied by wrong concept of undertanding i ll try explain it in the end.
(Taraf) its a direction/sides pointing towards something at its borders/edges/ends can be used as DUAL ends like a thing only two ends like a crisp/choclate ends of packing.
it can b used a plural form for having more than 2 ends/edges/borders like borders of some countries, border/edges of page.
and at one verse root use it as indefinate noun what i want to discuss.(3127)
3127 if we interpret it the way of cutting/blocking the borders lines of enemies/opponents instead of cutting them in (parts) make more sense and less barbarianism.
and one more thing attached with this root another meanings like a GRAZE/eyesight
when we use a word (taraf)
automatically eye look towards the direction where somebody pointed us with the help of his hands. the eyes have a direction towards the ends/edges/borders of something.in case of the hoors (eyesight/looking/glance) will look at the direction towrds your eyes.
btw the word in verse of salat used DUAL form (ends/edges/sides/parts/portions/sections)
example (sides/ways)of road in dual carrige way. day and night working on same pattern.
we can also say two sides of one picture.my two cents
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Peace Noon.
It does not say "Tarafayi Mina Al Nahar" . The example you gave has "Mina" which gives the meaning of inclusion."Tarafayi Al Nahar" are proximities of boundary ,it does not have to include/be part of Nahar,but at proximity to from both ends. The beguinning and end of the day. i.e near both ends of the day.
GOD bless you.
Peace.Lol you are extremely confused.... That's manifest..
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3127 arafan (a part/portion) of the ones reject they of
11114 arafayi (parts/portions two) l-nahri/the daytimePeace..
Just copying and pasting Arabic and translation won't make sense...
You are going offline...
Those who know about the word taraf, knows it's entire occurences... Don't adjust 3127 to 11114...
If you claim both are portions... Then you will end up clueless what are those portions of nahar... We knows for this word lots identical and similar meaning are there... But if you take as part of portion for 11114 then time of that part or portion will end up clueless though zulafan manal Lail is given...
But If Taken as ENDs... Then it is perfect.. Just check definition for ENDs... Nahar has many portions /parts.. But nahar has two Ends... That's teo twilights and not sunset and sunrise or before sunrise or before sunset...
God is perfect in placing words... -
Peace jkhan.
It is clear again that it does not say "Tarafayi MINA Al Nahar" . You need to look at the roots of taraf when it is not followed by "Mina". It just means near the boundary / at the boundary/ i.e Near both ends of the day.
One part just before the day beguins and the other end just after the day ends. At proximity of both ends.Or let us see other Qoran verses that confirm your view.
It is you who is contradicting 913-4
GOD bless you.
Peace. -
It does not say "Tarafayi Mina Al Nahar" . The example you gave has "Mina" which gives the meaning of inclusion.
peace -- point was it cannot mean "ends" rather daylight split in two sections/portions.
3127 to severed arafan (?a part/portion?) of the ones reject they of
11114 the connection arafayi/parts/portions two l-nahri/the daytimedawn -- first appearance of light in the sky before sunrise
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2458 connection l-fajri/the dawn
341 and glorify ? wal-ib'kri/and the early part
4055 and glorify with praise lord your ? wal-ib'kri/and the early part
652/1828 the ones calling lord theirs bil-ghadati/in the morning -
2238 wal-alati/and the connection l-wusa/the middle (i.e. noon)
3818 yusabbi'na/glorified be ? wal-ishraqi/and the sunshine
sunset -- time in the evening when the sun disappears
- 1778 establish l-alata/the connection to decline the sun to darkness the night
2458 connection l-ishai/the evening of
11114 and brought of al-layli/the night
341 and glorify bil-ashiyi/in the evening
3818 glorified be bil-ashiyi/in the evening
4055 and glorify with praise lord your bil-ashiyi/in the evening
652/1828 the ones calling lord theirs ? wal-ashiyi/and the evening
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Peace jkhan.
It is clear again that it does not say "Tarafayi MINA Al Nahar" . You need to look at the roots of taraf when it is not followed by "Mina". It just means near the boundary / at the boundary/ i.e Near both ends of the day.
One part just before the day beguins and the other end just after the day ends. At proximity of both ends.Or let us see other Qoran verses that confirm your view.
It is you who is contradicting 913-4
GOD bless you.
Peace.Are you kidding.... Is that you really... That ridiculous..
Why it is needed to be said tarafayi minal nahar... Dude tarafayi itself means Two Ends ...do you copy?... Nahar is day... Remember.. Non other but DAY.... so.. It reads TWO ENDS DAY.... Needless to use the word minal..
Now look zulafan MINAL Lail.... Coz it is not a particular time.. Extended with the convenience but not too late.. Coz it should be close proximity to TARAFAYI... that's why MINAL is used with Lail... Nahar only tarafayi coz nahar has only two tarafayi and no need to say from tarafayi... But Nahar has part/s at various time... But only twin ends.. That's TEILIGHTS at both sides...
Just go back to basic big brother... That would help...I am curious to know your five prayers timing with the veres of Quran... For that may be waqas would help you... Coz he found two per 24hrs. Day... Lol...
Funny again you are claimimg like my hadith follower friend
... If you pray magrib just seeing sun down.. Then why not pray Fajr just seeing sunrise ...okay let's turn to reality what you do... At least why not pray just..you know just just before sunrise the Fajr... Why taking it well inside darkness while magrib is in good day light portion... Keep a good constant approach to 11"114...
I don't see any difference in you to someone who follows hadith.... I wonder you are stuck in between hadith and QURAN.... rotfl That's just pathetic... -
20130 "Bear then patiently what they say, and glorify your Lord by the praising of Him before the rising of the sun and before its setting, and during hours (aana) of the night do also glorify (Him) and during parts (atraf) of the day, that you may be well pleased"
Note the above well known verse to all... But still why they mix up coz they are biased...
Here Instead of tarafayi God used the word atraf (means three or more parts of nahar) ..so simply day has various portions same as night...
See.. God used (Aana -hours) of night... God didn't use the word atraf Lail with intent... Coz it is so easy to find out parts of nahar (day) by observing and perceiving it.. Coz its visible and manifest.. But at night things are not visible cannot perceive but only with time spend... So god use (aana) ...here also God didn't use MINAL before even atraf but used before Lail.. All know what are the atraf of nahar.. So many parts we divide the day... Even in all languages... But night is like early night or late night etc. But parts of day has specific names in almost all languages..
See all indications... God had used before rising sun... In fact it just before rising.. God didn't use a word Fajr.. But before rising.. Before setting sun.. Before setting is in fact parts of day.. It already mentioned in the verse.. But specifying giving importance to before setting... Simply God's explanation is incredible... -
I am really astonished to see that God used taraf or it's related words only with NAHAR(DAY) and other relevant topics... BUT NEVER WITH NIGHT (LAIL)
BUT God used Aana(hours/watches) with NIGHT (LAIL) and not with Nahar..
That's really amazing... I never knew it.. Just now God exposed that to me...
Alhamdullah
This Quran daily teaching me... It's amazing book.. One could have been from God.... Undeniable -
Peace jkhan.
Let me show you the error of your understanding about daytime and night time
2187
....You may eat and drink until the white thread of light becomes distinguishable from the dark thread of night at dawn. Then, you shall fast until sunset.
Is Qoran saying fast only daytime?
Is Fajr part of day or night? What about "Ila Al Leyl" does it mean dark or sunset?"Al Khaitu Al Aswad Min Al Khaiti Al Abyad" are both nightime brother. And" Ila Al Leyl" means to sunset.
So as you can see there is "Al Khaitu Al Abyadu in nightime. i.e light period of night.GOD would not define day and night for us in Qoran to leaves us guessing when does day/night start and another one ends!!!!
How dark do you want it to be before you start your night?
Sunrise to sunset is consistent and clear to everyone in the world. No guessing brother. As defined in 913-4 .Tarafayi Al Nahar are not the Nahar itself brother.They are just Fajr and Maghrib. The borderlines of the day.
I can see you going in circles with me here, so I will stop to leave you to reflect on this.
GOD bless you.
Peace. -
20130 "Bear then patiently what they say, and glorify your Lord by the praising of Him before the rising of the sun and before its setting, and during hours (aana) of the night do also glorify (Him) and during parts (atraf) of the day, that you may be well pleased"
Note the above well known verse to all... But still why they mix up coz they are biased...
where is l-alata mentioned in 20130?
443 O you the ones believes ye of not thou approach ye of l-alata/the connection and are you intoxicated until know ye of what thou speaking ...
(i.e. don't rant mindlessly)
https//i.postimg.cc/7PtymYG7/ch20v124-ch21v1.jpg
peace!
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where is l-alata mentioned in 20130?
443 O you the ones believes ye of not thou approach ye of l-alata/the connection and are you intoxicated until know ye of what thou speaking ...
(i.e. don't rant mindlessly)
https//i.postimg.cc/7PtymYG7/ch20v124-ch21v1.jpg
peace!
Peace...
Just read at least what others write if you have any sort of interest I'm replying... Did I bring 20130 to give the timing of Salat.... I brought it to explain what I explained in it... I am not hadith follower to take 20130 to show Salat in it... Lol..Just sharpen your vision...
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Peace jkhan.
Let me show you the error of your understanding about daytime and night time
2187
....You may eat and drink until the white thread of light becomes distinguishable from the dark thread of night at dawn. Then, you shall fast until sunset.
Is Qoran saying fast only daytime?
Is Fajr part of day or night? What about "Ila Al Leyl" does it mean dark or sunset?"Al Khaitu Al Aswad Min Al Khaiti Al Abyad" are both nightime brother. And" Ila Al Leyl" means to sunset.
So as you can see there is "Al Khaitu Al Abyadu in nightime. i.e light period of night.GOD would not define day and night for us in Qoran to leaves us guessing when does day/night start and another one ends!!!!
How dark do you want it to be before you start your night?
Sunrise to sunset is consistent and clear to everyone in the world. No guessing brother. As defined in 913-4 .Tarafayi Al Nahar are not the Nahar itself brother.They are just Fajr and Maghrib. The borderlines of the day.
I can see you going in circles with me here, so I will stop to leave you to reflect on this.
GOD bless you.
Peace.Brother GL
I am not after you but I am after what's against Quran in my understanding... That's all..
I have no knowledge you are one of those closest to God or one despised... That's in God's. In hand...Did I say I breakfast at sunset... Don't get me at all what I am explaing all the time...
If Iam bothered at Fajr to see when white thread clearly appears and I will definitely bother in the other end when I want to break it.. So do you get when I am breaking a fast... Don't invite me for break fast... Nothing would be balance for me when I want to break fast.. rotflYes it's fine.. If you want to go away from the topic... But whenever I find truth I will bring in sha Allah....
I wonder why most of the people who claim quran is the only source have somehow managed to take Salat as physical and worked out timing for it three.... Waqas case is very rare... He must have a reason for it...
Teo prayers are of course inside night... And one prayer is definitely inside day...
God guide us.... After all.... I think taking one God and keeping the morals and helping poor and keeping our hearts pure and by not rejecting His verses will do in sha Allah....
Salat is just timed remembrance biut we do remember God manana times....
Keep up the Good works... -
Peace jkhan.
How dark do you want it to be before you start your night?
Sunrise to sunset is consistent and clear to everyone in the world. No guessing brother. As defined in 913-4 .Peace GL
How bright you want it to be before you stop eating at Fajr?? rotfl
The opposite... -
Salam Brothers and Sisters!
This matter is not going to be resolved until you keep all relevant Ayats in view.
Please have a look at below variations of words for Salah and check what is the differenceCount = 32
The addition of with a word can change the meaning to great extent.Peace!
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Slm centi50,
why do you recite the Quran during your pray (Namaz) ? means this you holding the Quran in your hand while you pray.
indeed there is no written how many time you do , its you decision agains Allah, this makes more sense than the obligatory movements what is written, like some of my friends saying , ooops its time to pray ,i will pray quickly and come to you ... do you see what i mean ....
do you also say the dua of ettehiyyat? if you , i would not do it sinse you say
may Allah accept your dua's and Insha Allah we will guide to the strait pathSalam Kaltun,
I recite Quran because with the Quran have verses to praise, exalt and remember His greatness, His Mercy and ultimately our dependence on each of these attributes (11-7; 2014; 17111; 245).
And also
They are not all the same; among the people of the Book are an upright nation. They recite God's revelations during the night while they prostrate. 3113
This verse speaks of the righteous and how they recite the Scripture while prostrating. Prostration, being one of the positions of the Salat
The Quran does not specicify any number of units for prayers. It leaves it to our discretion But also it did not forbid you to doing units, as I said before, sometime I do 2 sometime 3 sometimes 4
No I don't to tahyyatu. Prayer is to commemorate God, and God Alone (6162; 2014; 2945)
That's how I do my salat
God bless you
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Peace everyone...
When we look at 2458?
We can notice that there is a requirement of permission in THREE OCCASIONS? it is obvious that the key here is sleeping / in a state of relaxation without proper cloths ?. Remember you can only ask permission if they are in privacy only.. that?s very important.. and it is considered as privacy time and it is (junah) mingling during these times unless without permission..
NO. 01 ..Before Fajr Salat ?? that?s very privacy.. coz that?s a time we do sleep in general and we get up for the Fajr Prayer unless we have more dedication before fajr salat..As a believer you can?t sleep till fajr light creep in? So kid knows Dad has done salat.. No more permission is required till sunrise and till the word comes Isha (unless they happened to remove cloths for resting/sleeping in between Fajr & Isha) that?s optional? which is AL DHAHEERATHI (this is a very special word, only once in quran)
NO. 02 ?. After Isha Salat.. it?s not in order.. just I took the Isha since Salat is mentiond? So for those who take Sunset is Isha.. then prays Isha at the best time which as soon as it sets.. So the moment dad finish Salat? it?s privacy.. no more mingling?Every time kid wants to meet him needs permission?
Just after sunset still darkness didn?t even creep in and the kid wants to take permission and dad is in a state of privacy? That?s out-and-out nonsense ?. Practically weird and a useless advice?But if the Isha Salat is well after sunset (for example normal time where Isha is being practiced by general Muslims around the world) Then it is really night and once the salat finishes it is non other than resting taking into consideration of the time period(Mohamed?s time) the instruction was given in the book?But with current day life style it still goes further?but the quran is first to the people of Mohamed.. Sunset doesn?t suit with common sense for the Salat Isha and also with the word ISHA itself doesn?t suit to sunset..?
NO. 03 AL DHAHEERATHI (only once in quran)? NOONTIME / MIDDAY ?.. God has not mentioned any salat name here is with a very specific reason?. Coz God cannot mention the name of the salat for an OPTIONAL TIME and for OPTIONAL ACT?. Removing cloths and having rest at midday is absolutely optional depending on the day?s situation..But before Fajr Salat and After Isha is absolute coz We got to do salat Isha and Fajr in a very limited time and that TWO TIMES are within the period of Extreme Privacy coz of human nature Sleep etc...
Midday Salat is not mentioned coz the Al Salat Al Wusta (223 is much extended period (177? So God cannot say BEFORE or AFTER SALAT.. coz the believer has the option to do salat before having rest or after having rest at midday ? the reason God has given such an extended period to the Wusta is coz we are much busy and we are occupied a lot and easy to forget the salat? But salat isha and Fajr are both while at home depending on the verses?Coz Unless we are at home before and after Isha salat kids can?t take permission..
Salat wusta we can perform it before we go to rest in midday(optional) and also we can pray after having the rest?. Coz timing for it is 1778 Liduliki Al Shams (when the sun decline from the High Point).. God Cannot Say BEFORE Liduliki Shams.. coz it is not the time and cannot say AFTER lidulki shams.. coz it is not a just after Lidulki shams? time is much EXTENDED.. That?s the reason God says 2238 Guard specially the Middle Salat.. missing this salat with worldly exposure and busy atmosphere is very much vulnerable? making this salat is not easy but performing the other two salat while at home and also in a relaxing situation is much easier and also at cooler night time.. coz God says Day is busy 737 ?Indeed, for you in the day (Nahar) is prolonged occupation/activity? and 2547 etc..
When the DAY is much occupied for livelihood and still to remember God is a tricky task?3832 That?s why God has given intentionally a much lengthy period to perform it and instructed us to GUARD IT though all salat needs to be guarded..but singled out with intent not coz the reward for it is higher but coz of the business and human love towards worldly materials..Chapter 629-11 is another sign of day prayer... there are lots common sense in it.. as well 4103
God guide us..
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6209 O You who believe! When called for the prayer (As salat) of/on the Day of congregation, haste unto remembrance of Allah and leave your trading. That is better for you if you did but know.
6210 Then when the prayer (As salat) is concluded, then disperse in the land and seek of Allah's bounty, and remember Allah much, that you may be successful.
6211 But when they saw some merchandise or pastime they break away to it and leave You standing. Say That which Allah has is better than pastime and merchandise, and Allah is better (of)The Providers.
These are very familiar verses among conventional Muslims and quran based Believers?.There are so many explanation based on these verses that the salat here is from Midday time?
Yes.. beyond doubt this is the salat indicated by verses 2238 and 1778? 4103..For those who say that there is no Salat when the sun declines from it?s peak, let?s see how they deduce?(remember for them only TWO salat/24hrs day namely FAJR & ISHA? So these verse should be one of these two salats.. lets work out)
Can this 629-11 be FAJR Salat?
As per the context of the three verses? it seems that the trading and much more activities have been taking place when the moment of salat occurs? simply a long day in between an instruction is given to leave the business..Can this be before Fajr Salat? Even in today?s modern life Congregations won?t take place specially for trading (let?s take it as weekly trade fair)? Taking this salat as Fajr is far from certainty?God say Night is for you to sleep and rest and that?s nature and that?s what happening though people do change the nature.. but not successful.. Simply imagining that people were gathered well before fajr in the complete darkness to sell their harvests, etc.. that?s insane in the time of Mohamed? So.. simply it was not FAJR SALAT?
Then, Can this 629-11 be ISHA Salat?
Remember these verses first of all should suit to the people which were revealed to? whether it suits to later communities like us or not is irrelevant.. Coz trend of people change with the development of technology?Can we compare the trade mentioned here with online trade we deal 24/7? No? Do we really gather now on a given day mainly for trade and amusement? That has no such values? it may be happening in remote villages to bring their weekly harvests to a certain place where people used to gather to buy their weekly requirement? ? but for modern life it is faded off? weekly harvest wont take place overnight to sell it before fajr? that?s totally weird
BUT, it was an imperative part and parcel of yester year people?That?s must ?. That?s the life style..so gathering of almost by everyone is much expected?that?s core of their life..
On a such Day when the time comes for Salat, leaving business and gathering to a certain place to perform the salat together (but individually) must have a real meaning for integrity? Coz the salat ISha and Fajr doesn?t seems such prayers according to quranic context of the verses.. even the Midday Prayer on days other than congregation day? God never even ordered perform salat in cluster ? but when people are around and gathered for any purpose it seems like making it together seems kind of hefty instruction? even 4103
Now let?s see 629-11 is Isha salat or not?
God says to leave the business but after concluding the salat Disperse and seek the bounty of God?This is not actually a kind of instruction after ISHA salat?Remember Night is not at all encouraged by God to seek his bounty but night is for Sleep, Rest, to praise the Lord, recite quran etc, etc.. but never dealt with the word of amusement or business.. Modern people may do anything? that?s irrelevant .. coz first quran should match to the people it was revealed..
By 6211? it clearly indicates that though salat is concluded, business or amusement is not concluded at all? it was ongoing process? but they are heading towards it with the love in them.. It seems like they were performing salat and finished it and heading? but Probably (Mohamed) was still performing salat in standing (watharaku Kaaima)? coz salat is individual though they made it together? they can conclude when they want? 4103
If we take the salat ended was Isha then business and amusement should be in late night?. But These indications shows us that having late night business and late night amusement is not at all the trend of the yester year people?And even after the salat God instruct to disperse the land and seek the bounty which is totally contradictory statement when God says night is for other matter which was excluded for business and amusement..? ?. haste unto remembrance of Allah and leave your trading. That is better for you if you did but know.?
There is no such statement by God to any Salat? That?s better for you if you, but know, has a real meaning? This is salat has much extended time but still God says when it is called for salat hasten only on the day of congregation?while clearly for three salat times are given and you can perform it within those periods before it is over?but saying to hasten only on the day of congregation must have a real value?
? First of all Salat is a new addition to the life of those Arabs ?
? It may give them a knowledge how Mohamed and others performing it
? Integrity and unity?
? Get to know of people who are Muslims while they are among them performing salat?
? Knowing who is muslim and who is not is very key for the life style of then? Many wars took place? so knowing muslims and their strength ? Coz on a gathered day almost all are there?.can easily identify who is Muslim/Munafiq / Kafir?.that?s a kind of support for the hearts of the very minority of Muslims who were raising a huge community?
? There could be many more reasons?. Anyone can produce such reasons?Can there be only TWO SALAT God ordered in Quran? For me and in my total understanding of quran? NO chance..
Simply question to those who say only TWO Salat is what is the salat mentioned in 629-11? is it Fajr or Isha... ;D