Does Islam accept LGBTQ community as Legitimate?
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Salaam all.
Does Islam accept LGBTQ community as Legitimate? If "No" why? and if "Yes" then what is their marriage and inheritance rights? Any answer from the Quran?
Thanx. N wasalaam. -
Well the Quran never said that homosexuality is haram and the verse of the people of lot just said they brought a new fahesha and then gave a list about what they did, i believe the people of lot were eveb not punished because of that, but because they challenge lot to bring the punishment of Allah if he is being truthful.
And the lot verse specifically talks about male homosexuality and the Quran never mentioned female so I don't see any reason why Islam can't accept lgb communities I don't know about the "t" tho
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¿Community? ¿Is there a heterosexual community? What kind of community is that? Qur`'an speaks of dhalimin, mufasiqun mufasidiin, the salihiin, qanitiin, and so on. It is moral deeds that make up qura'nic communities, not actions in one's own intimacy. Nowhere does the Qur'an base communities in any such a thing.
Salaam
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Peace all..
Asifzaheer's comments Does Islam accept LGBTQ community as Legitimate? If "No" why? and if "Yes" then what is their marriage and inheritance rights? Any answer from the Quran?
First of all exert little bit effort to understand what is ISLAM within Quran.. What can we mean by asking “Does ISLAM accept..?” Who is ISLAM to accept something and reject something?.. Once we surrendered unconditionally to God (Muslim) there are certain sets of laws which need to be applied in our ‘Way of Life’ and that is ACCEPTANCE purely personally… and maintain to practice only for God that’s Belief and Commitment and the degree of a person keep augmenting thus.…
Let me respond your questions within me based on Quran directly and indirectly but obvious….DOES ISLAM ACCEPT LGBTQ (lesbian, gay, bisexual, and transgender questioning) COMMUNITY AS LEGITIMATE? NO… No way… If Yes,,,,, to any of the person who have faith in God… Then He or She must bring forward his or her strong evidence within Quran of his or her own understanding which I doubt…
IF "NO" WHY?
Why God Created Adam as Male and then Created his Female partner and let them live on Earth after sometime and God let the human to spread….? Does the LGBTQ apply to Adam and His Wife? Was Allah against natural instinct of a human being? I mean to say… if LGBT is a kind of natural and normal as many a human claim and practice, then why God is against a natural physical requirement which He created?
But that was not the Way of God.. Absolutely contrary… Human can develop any sort of weakness / strength within him / her self… for that human himself may consider as a support for which there is no authority from God… God initiated with Male and Female… Things started to alter with the time… like the people of this world have chosen different religions/beliefs/dogmas… Did God create it? Or is it the weakness / strength of human? God promised to Adam that guidance will come…. So, God is free of blame of what human created out of their own will…
Dear Brother / Sister (Someone12) be very precise and knowledgeable and afraid of God before talk /present a mighty word, if you are really a believer in Your Creator… You agreed that Community of Lut especially Men practiced homosexuality… Yes in fact that was the truth if anyone read the relevant verses…but what you say later is blasphemy with or without knowledge..
Then why not go beyond that?.. I mean why not explore quran beyond what is written directly… guidance is not only from what is written unequivocally.. There is hidden aspects in quran which needs to unearth with knowledge.. that’s why God says explore quran and further says verify anything… Sometimes it is not required for point by point explanation by God for Dos / DON’Ts… for example like the people of Moses before sacrificing a cow (any cow would have worked)….. that’s shame on them… but God was patient and merciful ….
Ask everyone to themselves whoever inclined / susceptible to homosexuality and consider harmless and natural while still claim / wish to be a believer….
Why Lut being a messenger was disgusted by the act of Men of his community…If it is naturally allowed as it is human nature…What if all Men of this world only like homosexuality…and neglect women…Can you imagine the dilemma? Or vice versa…. Will then God’s system work…Why God didn’t make Man to bear child by having homosexuality? Is it the right system of God… if it is not the right system then why it should be in the allowed list?
Incontrovertible that Lut’s Community practiced homosexuality….Please read the first 10 verses of Chapter 23…. Does it allow homosexuality? Or reject.. any direct order or we can apply God bestowed intelligence to grasp something beyond… that’s exploration… not explicit…but in fact obvious…after all the first 10 verses state that they are believers and they will be successful…So can we include homosexuality into these 10 verses as allowed and still be Believers???
Have you noticed God says He saved Lut and his family… believers were very few in Lut community.. Weren’t they? That’s my understanding …. Were the females of Lut community saved? Or did the females come up to Lut and demanded to bring the destruction? What about the children? Why such a devastating disaster from God to a community which practiced homosexuality + other unacceptable unethical acts…? Didn’t God concentrate in Lut’s story fundamentally of homosexuality to give us a huge advice to be away from it?26165-166 “Do you approach males among the worlds, and leave what your Lord has created for you as mates? But you are a PEOPLE TRANSGRESSING."
Does the above verse indicate for anyone that Homosexuality is allowed for MEN? Does God need to spoon-feed ? what is the end result… TRANSGRESSION… what did They transgress? How can a mater being transgressed if there is no restriction already? If the above verses state for MEN saying “…. And leaving what Your Lord has created for you as Mates..” what we have to deduce what is the mates of Females? What logic? what is the fate of those who keep transgressing without reforming?
If it is meant for Males only, what make anyone to ponder that the cases of Lesbian is different and it is allowed? Do you think your Lord is so unfair in great level? While crystal clearly rejecting the homosexuality of Men and discard and allow the females? God is just.. don’t you know that if you are a believer.. -
Sodomites didn't only commit same sex intercourse but also treated their guests in the town very bad. Especially when they were rebuked.
780 And Lot, he said to his people "Do you commit immorality such as none of those of the worlds had done before?"
781 "You are approaching the men out of desire instead of the women! Indeed, you are a transgressing people."
782 The only response of his people was "Drive them out of your town, for they are a people who make out to be pure!"
783 We saved him and his family, except for his wife; she was of those who were destroyed.
784 And We rained down upon them a rain, so see how was the punishment for the criminals.Reminds me of this some christian anti-abortionists were enjoying their coffe in a coffe shop which was owned by a homosexual. After he saw their flyer he felt "offended" and kicked them out. Also said some perverted stuff.
https//www.youtube.com/watch?v=YtAvYTfLmAg
I personally don't care about them as long as they can control their lusts and desires. There is a lot of raping, drug abuse and suicide going on in this kind of communities which is not reported in the media. Some Transsexuals can also not deal with reality. LGBT movement is also a tool for the Elite because it destroys a stable family unit. LGBT is a religion - pure indoctrination.
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Why God Created Adam as Male and then Created his Female partner and let them live on Earth after sometime and God let the human to spread….? Does the LGBTQ apply to Adam and His Wife? Was Allah against natural instinct of a human being? I mean to say… if LGBT is a kind of natural and normal as many a human claim and practice, then why God is against a natural physical requirement which He created?
The beginning of the history of mankind begins with a male and a female, not only in the Qur'an or the Torah. Even in mythologies like the japanese Shintoism - Izanagi and Izanami or the greek mythology like Gaia and Uranos. Imagine when those were both males - the story would have ended right away ;D
@Asifzaheer Another thing is that you use your Organs for their purpose - which is natural. I use my eyes to see and my ears to hear, i hope you understand what i mean )
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Peace jkhan
Please do not turn your opinions into the will of God, if Allah did not say something then it is not for you to say it for him.
Peace S12 !!!
I absolutely agree, if it is an advice… I don’t think it is merely an advice… isn’t it dude? I hope it is something that you have found out in my previous thread which I have changed the will of God and have said what Allah has not said…
Would you kindly point out manifestly what are those?Do you always take quran directly? That’s not the way according to God… Explore..no need to explore if things are open or explicit……
I ask simply dude… Do you have sisters or wife or mother or daughters? Do you ask them to fast? Have Quran ever ordered females to fast if you take quran directly? What is actually stated in quran…2183 tone of quran is male form… Do you agree that females should fast? From where did you get that females are ordered to fast… is it direct way or common sense …
Or else take this example… Have God prohibited (HARRAMA) directly in quran eating other human? Do you prohibit? And how? Dead body is different to living human…. It all from commonsense and exploration… pls use your wits…
While in 415 -16 why God specify female and male.. Coz God knew, if not explained separate for men and women in this case it would be complicated…(unfortunately –**Fahisha **it is translated as simply as immorality in these verses which I extremely against for which four witnesses required..)
Now explain to me by these verses why God give sort of punishment to those who did fahisha men and women separately? What they did? Remember for adultery there is different punishment prescribed in quran..Okay, let me put this way…. For any act, two factors… either ALLOWED or NOT ALLOWED… I am in the group of not allowed for LGBTQ (remember based on Quran’s obvious advice)… You seems in the ALLOWED group.. you said indirectly I have made something NOT ALLOWED, but give your reasons to ALLOW it? Coz you said “I Don’t see any reason why Islam can’t accept LGB..”
Pls be calm and don’t rush… explore and come back to us… give your thoughts…I will never compel to go in line with my view… You have free will and freedom.. choose whatever you like…. -
Peace jk
No if the quran never states that eating human flesh is haram then it isn't, the Quran is not a how to live your life handbook, it is up to you to think for your self and know what is right or wrong, the Quran doesn't have to have a say in every time you do, just like eating shit is not haram but you still don't eat it because you know the effects decided not to but you can't tell someone how decides to eat it that it is haram because the Quran may have implied it, but you tell them your personal reasons for not eating it.
Also when any command is given in the Quran it is in genderless form but for this case it clearly says "you approach men" not you approach the opposite gender or something like that. Plus the Quran never even said to punish them or that it is haram or anything so you can't say what Allah didn't say, uf you think it is not ok then fine but that is your opinion not Allah's and you can't make a rule or try to control people to follow your opinion on what Allah wants, because something bothers you doesn't mean it bothers Allah after all Allah just wants us to worship him
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after all Allah just wants us to worship him
in some parts of the book author want people worship allah..
in some parts Allah is totally free of need...in a bigger picture how do we know what GOD want ?
how do we know if any God even exist or not ?whatever we know about GOD is the result from the records of early people, not from the direct communication of God.
the recent GOD in human form was "OSHO" who gathered lot of followers. if that person happen to exist in past people labelled him in the list of krishna, rama, jesus etc..
also a recent prophet who perform miracles exactly like other prophets was " sathya sai baba " .
THOUGHT has created the idol and then THOUGHT started worshiping that idol what thought has created..generations worshiped blindly what thought has created.(OUR STORY).
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Peace!!
1732 “And do not approach unlawful sexual intercourse (zina). Indeed, it is ever an immorality (fahisha) and is Evil as a way.”
Let me further explain, anyone who is in support of LGBQT better respond with logic…
What exactly God command by verse 1732 is NOT to APPROACH (Zina)..what is infact Zinah? Am I right if I elaborate this way “zina is having sex with another person who is not legally ours through marriage… Is that fine…? Hope okay.. better explanation is welcome..
Simple language illegal sexual intercourse as translated above… So who is allowed to marry according to God in quran..crystal clear in quran male for female (various conditions and rules apply)…
So to have sex with another woman for a woman or Man to Man, they first should marry before they touch each other…. Right or wrong?… coz without marriage there is no sex according to orderly way of God, otherwise it will be ZINAH… supported by 2305-06 “And they who guard their private parts, Except from their wives or those their right hands possess, for indeed, they will not be blamed - ..” Other than those will be blamed…then…Who are these people in the end? The real successful believers 2301 and they will inherit the Janna 2310….
With honesty tell me anyone Has Allah allowed this shameful act?
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Islam aims for something and LGTBQ aims for something different.
According to Islam, regardless of being Heterosexual or homosexual or whatever, one should aim to become someone that is not driven by temptations. The tempter in Islam is referred to as Satan. In Buddhism the tempter is referred to as Mara. Both are personifications. In broader philosophies temptations are referred to as...temptations.
The force that dictates the sexual attractions on us is a force that is enforced on all creatures as small as insects. If we are more than that, then perhaps we can free ourselves from it? And only engage in such things willingly, not compulsively, with thoughtfulness.
Now the LGBTQ people, are mostly hedonistic people, their aim in life is to create pleasure and maintain pleasure, to live in happiness. If you're hedonistic it's really not in your own interest to adhere to principles that will limit your pleasure. Example, marrying one person. Why would you do that ? So we're seeing polyamory. Engaging in pleasure-seeking with the opposite sex only, why would you do that ? Bisexuality is a good deal. and it's on the rise too.
So you can see how some principles fit in one worldview and don't fit in another worldview. And those folks are trying to break free from those principles that are enforced by a worldview that doesn't concern them (mostly from western christian heritage).
But at the end of the day, you do you. You believe in your divine nature and understand that you're more than flesh ? you try to follow one path. You don't believe in a divine nature and you have a flesh that naturally wants to seek pleasure and self-fulfillment ? you follow another path, a path that is enforced on you by your own flesh in my opinion.
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Salaam to all
Thanx to all. Now I have a new perspective on this issue. -
Zina comes from the root ZN, what means weightage, press, force. In that sense only 'Rape' comes under the concept of Zina, Quran condemns such forceful acts (rape as well as all suppressive acts on other human beings) as 'fahisha' and advice not to come near it. So zina does not include "sex with mutual consent between partners (zawaj)" Guarding private parts surely means 'guarding from doing rape' that is,'refraining from forcing to sex' anyone who do not have consent for it.
Peace!!
1732 “And do not approach unlawful sexual intercourse (zina). Indeed, it is ever an immorality (fahisha) and is Evil as a way.”
Let me further explain, anyone who is in support of LGBQT better respond with logic…
What exactly God command by verse 1732 is NOT to APPROACH (Zina)..what is infact Zinah? Am I right if I elaborate this way “zina is having sex with another person who is not legally ours through marriage… Is that fine…? Hope okay.. better explanation is welcome..
Simple language illegal sexual intercourse as translated above… So who is allowed to marry according to God in quran..crystal clear in quran male for female (various conditions and rules apply)…
So to have sex with another woman for a woman or Man to Man, they first should marry before they touch each other…. Right or wrong?… coz without marriage there is no sex according to orderly way of God, otherwise it will be ZINAH… supported by 2305-06 “And they who guard their private parts, Except from their wives or those their right hands possess, for indeed, they will not be blamed - ..” Other than those will be blamed…then…Who are these people in the end? The real successful believers 2301 and they will inherit the Janna 2310….
With honesty tell me anyone Has Allah allowed this shameful act?
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Zina comes from the root ZN, what means weightage, press, force. In that sense only 'Rape' comes under the concept of Zina, Quran condemns such forceful acts (rape as well as all suppressive acts on other human beings) as 'fahisha' and advice not to come near it. So zina does not include "sex with mutual consent between partners (zawaj)" Guarding private parts surely means 'guarding from doing rape' that is,'refraining from forcing to sex' anyone who do not have consent for it.
Salam Soito...
Interesting your view...
I understand you as under. ..
Zina = Doing Rape. (rape is always by force)
Guarding private parts = Not Doing rape..
Then, does it cover everything dear? Or everything comes under fahisha...
Sex is of various nature.... Give you few examples..Sex for business (💰... That's with consent...so approaching... So not zina.. So then what?
Sex for fun, that's with consent.... So not zina... Then what?
Sex on instant attractions... With consent... Not zina... Then what?
Sex under compulsion... Take story Yousuf was seduced... God saved him... Suppose.. Did he caught up with her seduction then Yousuf also culprit... Though he was not the one initiated... Is it rape? I mean zina...? One interested... One not but seduced and commited ultimately .. If not zina then what?
What you call for above act in Arabic? And are they allowed? Since not included under zina or private part guard...
Are you sure about what you say?
Coz honestly I never look dictionaries of Arabic to grasp quran... I read Quran in Arabic meticulously and look all translations possible... If Iam not happy with any of the translation which doesn't give a Quranic flow meaning then I reject and search my own meaning with loads of comparisons.. .. Coz I don't have the dictionary which Mohamed used or people of Mohamed used... If dictionary came late then I don't depend.. If right I accept... That's fine...
I myself found out that all translations for 'Ummi' were wrong.. But I deduced that Mohamed was literate with all ummi verses... Then later I knew articles written by many same as my understanding .. So I was happy... Had I depended on translation or dictionary ummi would have been still Illiterate for me..
By this I don't ask you not to refer... I told my way... So pls double check whether your dictionary reference of zina tally with Quran.. Pls with kindness translate all zina verses in your way... Let me see whether has meaning... -
In Persian زن means woman, in that sense زنا means womanize in Persian. That Persian meanings unfortunately entered into meaning of Arabic Quran.
Salam Soito...
Interesting your view...
I understand you as under. ..Salam Soito...
Interesting your view...
I understand you as under. ..
Zina = Doing Rape. (rape is always by force)
Guarding private parts = Not Doing rape..
Then, does it cover everything dear? Or everything comes under fahisha...
Sex is of various nature.... Give you few examples..Sex for business (💰... That's with consent...so approaching... So not zina.. So then what?
Sex for fun, that's with consent.... So not zina... Then what?
Sex on instant attractions... With consent... Not zina... Then what?
Sex under compulsion... Take story Yousuf was seduced... God saved him... Suppose.. Did he caught up with her seduction then Yousuf also culprit... Though he was not the one initiated... Is it rape? I mean zina...? One interested... One not but seduced and commited ultimately .. If not zina then what?
What you call for above act in Arabic? And are they allowed? Since not included under zina or private part guard...
Are you sure about what you say?
Coz honestly I never look dictionaries of Arabic to grasp quran... I read Quran in Arabic meticulously and look all translations possible... If Iam not happy with any of the translation which doesn't give a Quranic flow meaning then I reject and search my own meaning with loads of comparisons.. .. Coz I don't have the dictionary which Mohamed used or people of Mohamed used... If dictionary came late then I don't depend.. If right I accept... That's fine...
I myself found out that all translations for 'Ummi' were wrong.. But I deduced that Mohamed was literate with all ummi verses... Then later I knew articles written by many same as my understanding .. So I was happy... Had I depended on translation or dictionary ummi would have been still Illiterate for me..
By this I don't ask you not to refer... I told my way... So pls double check whether your dictionary reference of zina tally with Quran.. Pls with kindness translate all zina verses in your way... Let me see whether has meaning... -
AS all,
Newbie here. I see nowadays how many Muslims who identify as homosexuals are pushing an agenda that it's okay to be both and claim it's not a sin. There are some gay imaams that are conducting marriage ceremonies between gay and lesbian Muslims in order to 'legitimise' their relationships o
Instead of going through the Quran trying to find evidence that it's okay to be gay as long as it's not 'forced' like Lot's people, why not look at what defines a legitimate relationship according to the Quran.
- We know that sex outside marriage is not permitted so that marriage is the only option.
- Marriage is defined by the Quran as being a between a man and a woman.
- Therefore any physical relationship outside of marriage is prohibited.
So given the above why is there all this discussion about trying to condone homosexuality as a legitimate relationship. If Islam doesn't allow it, then we should accept it.