We as Muslims Have Been Fasting the WRONG fast at the WORNG Time
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Salaam to You All My fellow Followers of The Quran and Our Prophet,
I know Ramadan 2021 is coming and I absolutely hate for true believers to perform the WRONG fast at the WRONG time of the year. With Allah's help and permission, I am trying to raise as much awareness as possible among my fellow believers who truly believe in Allah and His verses about the TRUE fasting and the CORRECT time of fasting that Allah has WRITTEN for us in the QURAN. My goal is to stop this incorrect fasting practice that causes so much harm to both body and soul and bears no fruit as evidenced by everything that is happening in the Islamic world.
Please, if you can, watch the following two videos and if you have any questions, let me know. I will be more than glad to answer any questions you might have.-
This 1st video is a short video and overview of the Quranic fasting
https//youtu.be/pG6wwBd1OgU -
In this 2nd video, I discuss fasting in much greater detail and explain 2187 and give several examples to clarify it for you
https//youtu.be/PPE4OLwcyHw
Please, do NOT go through this Ramadan without having watched these two videos. Please do NOT harm your body by performing the wrong fast. Fasting in the Quran has nothing to do with eating and drinking. Allah has detailed (WRITTEN) fasting for us in the Quran and has given us two very clear examples about it in the Quran. But the Umayyad associators after the prophet converted the best and happiest month of the year when we have to be celebrating the Quran into a month of hunger, thirst, self torture and technically mourning.
It truly pains my heart to see people doing the wrong fast and I pray to Allah that you could do the right fast this year at the right time, InShaAllah.
May Allah guide us all to His Direct Path. -
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Salam Brother,
Thanks for sharing.
But sorry to say that but your post just demonstrates how it is easy to manipulate words of the Quran for anyone who follows his fantasy.
And i was also in the past one of them. (and probably again today even if i am trying to be careful in my conclusion).The Quran is precise
- For Myriam it uses the form SAWM (only one time)
- For fasting it uses the form SIYAM.
The goal of the SIYAM is explained in verse 2183 (laʿallakum tattaqūna)
Verse 2183 only indicates that fasting is prescribed for the Mumins as it was the case for previous monotheistic communities (Jews in context).
Peace.
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Thank you for taking the time to comment but I don’t think you watched the full video.
Allah alone is my refuge from manipulating His words.
Sowm is the same as Siyam. Sowm is noun but Siyam is “masdar”. They have the exact same root with no difference at all. If you want we can talk Arabic grammer but I have an easier way to hopefully convince you )
Let’s focus on the word “YOM”. Do you agree that "YOM" includes both day (Nahar) and night (Layl) in Arabic and in the Quran?
I think that goes without saying for anyone who is familiar with the Quran, right? I am sure you already knew that.
Then you should know that before verse 2187 was revealed, fasting period (siyam) was 30 AYYAM meaning 30 days plus 30 nights NONSTOP. Do you really think the prophet and his followers would NOT eat and drink for 30 days and 30 nights nonstop and stay alive? Does it even make sense?
I ask one thing from you for Allah Please watch the 2nd video fully. If I am a lier, you can easily reject it. No harm done. At least you hear some Quran and feel much better about your faith. Maybe you can guide me too. Who knows?
But if what I say is true, InShaAllah you will fast correctly this Ramadan as Allah shows us in the Quran. I also explain 2187 in that video. 2187 itself proves that fasting has nothing to do with eating and drinking.
Last but not the least brother the purpose of fasting is to magnify Allah because of His Guidance (le tulakabberAllah ala ma hadakum 2185) and also for us to become pious by not lying, not arguing, not backbiting and focusing on Allah and His words during Ramadan.
How does staying hungry and thirsty makes you and I pious and God fearing? If that was the case, then all the homeless people would be the most pious and God fearing ones among us, wouldn’t they?
If you can find me ONE Quranic example of fasting by not eating and drinking, I will make a video and recant everything I have said and owe my guidance to you for the rest of my life.
Peace to you too. All best wishes and thank you for your comment but please watch the second one.
Fasting is so clear in the Quran and Allah gives us two very clear Quranic witnesses about it through Maryam and Zechariah.
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- In this 2nd video, I discuss fasting in much greater detail and explain 2187 and give several examples to clarify it for you
https//youtu.be/PPE4OLwcyHw
3800 min https//youtu.be/PPE4OLwcyHw?t=2273
peace, not always it depends on transgression
584 (feed 10 poor/10 days)
فمن so who لم not ىجد find فصىم fasiyamu/so abstinence (fast) شهرىن lunar cycles two...
فمن so who لم not ىستطع is able فاطعم so feeds ستىن group of (60) مسكىنا poor of589 (feed 10 poor/3 days)
فكفارته so reparation its اطعم feeds عشره group of (10) مسكىن poor...
فمن so who لم not ىجد find فصىم fasiyamu/so abstinence (fast) ثلثه trio (3) اىام dayslikewise to abstain depends on context e.g. from arguing, eating and drinking etc.
Arabic-English Lexicon by Edward William Lane
صوم
1 صَامَ , (S, M, &c.,) aor. يَصُومُ, (Msb,) inf. n. صَوْمٌ, and صِيَامٌ; (S, M, Mgh, Msb, K and ↓ اِصْطَامَ ; (M, K He abstained, (Msb, TA,) in an absolute sense (Msb this is the primary signification (TA this is said to be the signification in the proper language of the Arabs (Msb and in the language of the law, (Msb, TA,) he observed a particular kind of abstinence; (Msb i. e. (TA) he abstained from food (S, M, K, TA) and drink (M, K, TA) and coïtus (M, K and (S, * M, &c.) by a tropical application, (TA,) (tropical from speech (S, * M, Mgh, Msb, * K, TA or صَوْمٌ in the proper language of the Arabs signifies a man's abstaining from eating and by a secondary application, a particular serving of God ; (Mgh the abstaining from eating and drinking and coïtus from daybreak to sunset (KT accord. to Kh, it signifies the standing without work. (S.) صام الشَّهْرَ means صام فِى الشَّهْرِ agreeably with what is said in the Kur ii. 181. (TA.) And it is said (S, M) by I'Ab (S) that the saying, in the Kur , (S, M,) إِنِّى نَذَرْتُ لِلرَّحْمٰنِ صَوْمًا means (assumed tropical an abstaining from speech. (S, M, Msb.) One says also, صام الفَرَسُ, inf. n. صَوْمٌ (S, M) and صِيَامٌ, (M,) (assumed tropical The horse stood without eating of fodder; (S or abstained from the eating of fodder. (M, A, Mgh.) And صام عَنِ السَّيْرِ (tropical He abstained from going along, or journeying. (TA.) ―
If killed a gazelle or chicken (ate one yesterday) how many days of no talking?
595
او or كفاره reparation طعم sustenance (feed) مسكىن poor او or عدل equitable ذلك such
صىما siyaman/abstinence (fast) of لىذوق to taste وبال consequence امره directive hissee 7th line from top next to last word
https//corpuscoranicum.de/handschriften/index/sure/5/vers/95/handschrift/163https//i.postimg.cc/hD1CjVC5/ch5v94-103.jpg
- In this 2nd video, I discuss fasting in much greater detail and explain 2187 and give several examples to clarify it for you
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Sowm is the same as Siyam. Sowm is noun but Siyam is “masdar”. They have the exact same root with no difference at all. If you want we can talk Arabic grammer but I have an easier way to hopefully convince you )
The word siyam, which the Quran here (sura 2) and elswhere uses for "fasting" (from food, drink and sexual relationship) is a masdar of the word ṣâma. Because of the frequent use of ikhtilâf in Arabic, the exchange of wa and ya, the form swam is also possible. But in the Quran the form siyam is almost always used ; sawm appears ony in one place where the translation by "fasting" is, as a matter of fact, not possible. That the forms siyam and sawm are used by the latter Arabs quite at randon and interchgeably is a fact. But the Quran is precise. The word siyam is therefore certaintly a word of Arabic origin. The "illogical" use of sawm in sura 19 shows it means something different (even same roots)
The atoning fast was known to the Arabs, the Quran testifies to this through its persistence in the Pilgrimage compensation rituals S2.V196 and S5.V95. The term ṣiyâm/fasting can therefore be logically linked to the Arabic root ṣâma which originally meant to keep a horse tied up to harden it and thus remain standing without eating, the maṣâm designating the place where it was hindered. On the other hand, the word ṣawm, used only once in connection with Mary in S19.V26, is probably borrowed from Hebrew, perhaps via Syriac, in view of the "fast of speech" practiced by Christian monks and also found in Judaism, such is the case of Mary. We note that this is one of the many examples of nuances of meaning according to the etymologies and their contextualization by the Quran.
Let’s focus on the word “YOM”. Do you agree that "YOM" includes both day (Nahar) and night (Layl) in Arabic and in the Quran?
Yes but it is not an argument.
If I say "I worked 3 days" it doesn't mean that I worked 3*24 = 72 hours! right ?
And Quran proves us that it is during a time of the full day (from fajr to sunset). So clear..NB i have watched the whole video but there's a lot to say.
Peace be upon you
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Peace and blessings to you and thank you for your response )
I just have to clarify that I ONLY AND ONLY believe in Allah and His verses and do NOT follow Hadith or personal opinions of different mufassirs or dictionary writers. Allah tells us that the Quran is there to clarify everything else (Tibyanan le kol e shaiy) not vice versa. Just so you know how I approach the discussion.
You posed the following excellent question and point
"If killed a gazelle or chicken (ate one yesterday) how many days of no talking?"
Here is the answer In 2184, Allah makes it very clear for us in the Quran that each ONE day of fasting can be ransomed (atoned) by feeding ONE person from the average of what we eat, correct?
Back to your example Let's say a gazelle can feed 10 people and a chicken can feed 2 people for the sake of the example.
Here is the equation summary ONE day of fasting = feeding ONE person
We could easily conclude the following
For the gazelle, the person has to do a fasting (siyam) of 10 days, which includes 10 individual days of fast (sowm).
For the chicken (that you so mercilessly ate the other day eat ), the person has to do a fasting (siyam) of 2 days, which includes 2 individual days of fast (sowm).And of course by fasting I mean NO talking and praising and glorifying Allah just like Maryam and Zechariah fasted as detailed by the Quran for us.
I have a contest and a request I will send a $100 electronic Amazon gift card or the equivalent if you don't have access to Amazon if anyone in this forum can bring me any of the following from the Quran (not hadith or other opinions)
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An example in the Quran of someone fasting by NOT EATING AND DRINKING, OR
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A direct commandment from Allah in the Quran that we should NOT EAT AND DRINK while fasting, OR
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An example of an act of piety or righteousness (TAGHWA) mentioned in the Quran that involves NOT EATING AND DRINKING. (Ex. Lying, Bearing the correct testimony, Not accusing people wrongly, Talking nicely to people, Not yelling and screaming and so many others that are ALL directly mentioned in the Quran and
are ALL related to talking and the words that come out of a person's mouth).
Allah is our witness that if anyone brings me one example of the abovementioned 3 items in the Quran, I will keep my word and send you an electronic $100 gift card.
Think about it this way Allah tells us in the Quran to wash ourselves when we use the restroom. right?
Isn't fasting in Ramadan more important than washing ourselves after using the restroom in your opinion?
If we were supposed to NOT eat and drink for 30 days, wouldn't it be worth for Allah to directly tell us NOT to eat and drink just like he tells us to wash ourselves after restroom?Peace and blessings to you. Thanks for taking the time listening to me in that video. I am so grateful for your time hail
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Yes but it is not an argument.
If I say "I worked 3 days" it doesn't mean that I worked 3*24 = 72 hours! right ?
And Quran proves us that it is during a time of the full day (from fajr to sunset). So clear..NB i have watched the whole video but there's a lot to say.
Peace be upon you
Thank you for watching it. The reason why I thought you didn't is that I actually explained the word "YOM" in detail. Lets look at two verses from the Quran together from my video
- He said, "My Lord, make for me a sign." He said, "Your sign is that you will not (be able to) speak to the people for three (3) ay’yam (days plus nights; 72 hours NONSTOP) except by gesture. And remember your Lord much and glorify in the evening and the morning." (341)
Example of Zechariah, John The Baptist’s father and Maryam’s teacher
Allah imposed a mandatory 3 day fast on him during which he would NOT be able to talk to any human beings for a consecutive 72-hour period.
But how can we be sure that a YOM also included the night?- (Zechariah) said, "My Lord, make for me a sign." He said, "Your sign is that you will not speak to the people for three nights, (while being) sound.“ (1910)
In this verse, Allah puts the emphasis on the nights so we all know that “Yom” includes the night period.
This verse proves without a doubt that when Quran mentions “Yom” or “AYYAM”, it means a 24-hour period of both “day” and “night” NONSTOP.Read both 342 and 1910 and you will know for sure. You sound very educated in Arabic so I am sure you will see that the Quran is very specific and makes it clear that "YOM" does include "Nights" as well. As such, fasting by NOT EATING and DRINKING is completely out of question in the Quran and not even possible due to 2187.
Also, pay attention that Zechariah SAID (talked about) something he should NOT have said or talked about by doubting Allah for a quick second and asking for a sign. Consequently, Allah taught him a lesson and imposed a fast (NOT TALKING) as an atonement and ransom for 3 days and 3 nights as specified by the Quran.
I hope this helped and thank you for taking the time to respond brother. Peace and blessings to you bravo
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I just have to clarify that I ONLY AND ONLY believe in Allah and His verses and do NOT follow Hadith or personal opinions of different mufassirs or dictionary writers. Allah tells us ttat the Quran is there to clarify everything else (Tibyanan le kol e shaiy) not vice versa. Just so you know how I approach the discussion.
Hi brother, you seem a good guy and i wish you the best for your life inshallah.
A question Were you born speaking the Arabic Koranic language directly?
If not, how do you learn the language of the Koran (your methodology)?Thank you because I am curious to know how you do it even without the classical dictionaries (and sorry if I did not understand the deep meaning of your sentence above).
- A direct commandment from Allah in the Quran that we should NOT EAT AND DRINK while fasting, OR
Knowing the structure of the Quran is important, especially the flow of discourse.
I invite you to consult my pdf to have a better view of the structure of the passage on fasting in Sura 2 (https//reveniraucoran.fr/wp-content/uploads/2021/02/Literary_Composition_of_the_Quran-2021-01-24.pdf).The words "Eat and drink" are found in verse which deals with the particular theme of sexual intercourse during fasting (permission? under what conditions? restrictions?).
It begins by evoking the time of night. Thus, logically (coz we are in fact at night), the Qur'an calls for "Eat and Drink" (it is permitted at night but only...)
until dawn (represented by the white thread that stands out from the darkness of the night). Then, practice fasting continously (which is in opposition to what is permitted at night no eating, drinking, or sexual intercourse) until night.
Two distinct phases in the day set in opposition to each other. So, everything is clear when one respects the flow of discourse.May Allah guide us in a better conduct.
Sorry if i was a little ironic (i hope you have a little bit of humor - otherwise, accept my forgiveness). -
No need for apology at all. Of course I do accept dictionaries as far as they give us the meanings of the word and the specifics but some dictionaries start delving into tafsir of the Quran, which becomes the opinion of the author at that point. Some just document common beliefs of the people.
Back to the fasting topic
The only reason why we assume the flow you mentioned is because we grew up believing fasting is not eating and drinking. That's why our brains automatically makes that flow and that association.
Nowhere in that verse Allah says do NOT eat or drink. Let me give you an example
Again, read these two examples
Ex 1) Eat and drink until morning. Then, take care of your younger brother up to the night.
Ex 2) Eat and drink until morning. Then, go to school until night.
Does it mean you should NOT be eating and drinking while taking care of your younger brother or while in school? Of course NOT
Also, there are two other things that the verse tells us to do until dawn in that verse
1.Talk and have contact with your wives
2.Seek what Allah has written for you
3.Eat and drink
Until dawn, Then complete the fast...Do you have to stop 1 and 2 as well? If you apply negation, you have to negate 1 and 2 as well because that is the natural flow but you can't because then you have to stop seeking what Allah has written for you, which results in you NOT fasting and saying prayers and paying zakat and etc.
Also, as I mentioned the word AYYAM includes both day and night. How could have anyone fasted both day and night for 30 days?
Fasting was initially 30 days and 30 nights of NOT talking but Allah discounted the nights.Please watch this video and scroll to 900. I explain 2187 in excruciating detail with several examples.
https//youtu.be/PPE4OLwcyHw
By the way, thank you for your very kind comment. I am NOT a good person at all. I consider myself a horrible person. I am hoping and praying that with spreading His word, Allah will have mercy on me and help me become better.
Thanks for bearing with me and reading my comments and explanations and watching my very boring videos. I appreciate it
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Here is the answer In 2184, Allah makes it very clear for us in the Quran that each ONE day of fasting can be ransomed (atoned) by feeding ONE person from the average of what we eat, correct?
peace -- no not always again you neglect 589 feed 10 poor/3 days?
فكفارته so reparation its اطعم feeds عشره group of (10) مسكىن poor...
فمن so who لم not ىجد find فصىم fasiyamu/so abstinence (fast) ثلثه trio (3) اىام dayslikewise saudi billionaires can feed a whole city, no made up restrictions (limits) by money-grubbers.
2184 ... وعلى and on الذىن the ones ىطىقونه can afford it فدىه ransom (payment) طعم sustenance (feed) مسكىن poor
And of course by fasting I mean NO talking...
no talking 2 months if you kill a large camel, right?
a billion people don't talk for a whole month, text only right?
I will send a $100 electronic Amazon gift card
Also, as I mentioned the word AYYAM includes both day and night.
context is your friend!
3418 ... سىروا travel they of فىها therein لىالى layaliya/nights واىاما wa-ayyaman/and (by) days of امنىن safe
give $99 to first homeless person you see and keep $1 for yourself! ;D
peace
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I read your comment several times to make sure but I don't see anything that disproves what the Quran says. There was no text messages back then so I am not sure what this argument has to do with what the Quran legislates.
Do you really think billionaires fast anyway? Or do you think they pretend they are fasting but eat inside their houses in secret? Allah knows best.
Your comment about "Layaliya wa ayyaman amenin" actually proves what the Quran says one more time that AYYAM includes both day and night. That's why Allah mentions it to emphasize the night and the fact that YOM includes both day and night. I think that is a basic concept of language in Arabic. Yom never means days in Arabic. The word for day is "NAHAR".
Please read the following two verses. Allah can not make it any clearer for us
Lets look at two verses from the Quran together from my video
- He said, "My Lord, make for me a sign." He said, "Your sign is that you will not (be able to) speak to the people for three (3) ay’yam (days plus nights; 72 hours NONSTOP) except by gesture. And remember your Lord much and glorify in the evening and the morning." (341)
Example of Zechariah, John The Baptist’s father and Maryam’s teacher
Allah imposed a mandatory 3 day fast on him during which he would NOT be able to talk to any human beings for a consecutive 72-hour period.
But how can we be sure that a YOM also included the night?- (Zechariah) said, "My Lord, make for me a sign." He said, "Your sign is that you will not speak to the people for three nights, (while being) sound.“ (1910)
In this verse, Allah puts the emphasis on the nights so we all know that “Yom” includes the night period.
This verse proves without a doubt that when Quran mentions “Yom” or “AYYAM”, it means a 24-hour period of both “day” and “night” NONSTOP.You mentioned
no talking 2 months if you kill a large camel, right?
a billion people don't talk for a whole month, text only right?Why is that surprising to you? Doesn't Allah say to fast two consecutive months (60 days) to those who "YuZAHERUNA Min AZWAJEHEM" (making the wrong statement about their wives) before they can touch them again? Why was that surprising?
A big camel that feeds 60 people requires 60 days of fasting. I don't see what is wrong with that.
The Quran is very clear about fasting. We should never let our belief or how we feel or what a billionaire would or would not do or a technological change influence our understanding of the Quran. Allah says that HE wants EASE for the believers and not hardship.
My challenge for you is still there I will send a $100 electronic Amazon gift card or the equivalent if you don't have access to Amazon if anyone in this forum can bring me any of the following from the Quran (not hadith or other opinions)
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An example in the Quran of someone fasting by NOT EATING AND DRINKING, OR
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A direct commandment from Allah in the Quran that we should NOT EAT AND DRINK while fasting, OR
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An example of an act of piety or righteousness (TAGHWA) mentioned in the Quran that involves NOT EATING AND DRINKING. (Ex. Lying, Bearing the correct testimony, Not accusing people wrongly, Talking nicely to people, Not yelling and screaming and so many others that are ALL directly mentioned in the Quran and
are ALL related to talking and the words that come out of a person's mouth).
Allah is our witness that if anyone brings me one example of the abovementioned 3 items in the Quran, I will keep my word and send you an electronic $100 gift card and if you don't want the money, I will sure donate it but bring me an example.
Thank you all and God bless. I don't think there is much more than I can add to this topic anymore. It is between you and your Lord giveup
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I read your comment several times to make sure but I don't see anything that disproves what the Quran says. There was no text messages back then so I am not sure what this argument has to do with what the Quran legislates.
Do you really think billionaires fast anyway? Or do you think they pretend they are fasting but eat inside their houses in secret? Allah knows best.
Your comment about "Layaliya wa ayyaman amenin" actually proves what the Quran says one more time that AYYAM includes both day and night. That's why Allah mentions it to emphasize the night and the fact that YOM includes both day and night. I think that is a basic concept of language in Arabic. Yom never means days in Arabic. The word for day is "NAHAR".
Please read the following two verses. Allah can not make it any clearer for us
Lets look at two verses from the Quran together from my video
- He said, "My Lord, make for me a sign." He said, "Your sign is that you will not (be able to) speak to the people for three (3) ay’yam (days plus nights; 72 hours NONSTOP) except by gesture. And remember your Lord much and glorify in the evening and the morning." (341)
Example of Zechariah, John The Baptist’s father and Maryam’s teacher
Allah imposed a mandatory 3 day fast on him during which he would NOT be able to talk to any human beings for a consecutive 72-hour period.
But how can we be sure that a YOM also included the night?- (Zechariah) said, "My Lord, make for me a sign." He said, "Your sign is that you will not speak to the people for three nights, (while being) sound.“ (1910)
In this verse, Allah puts the emphasis on the nights so we all know that “Yom” includes the night period.
This verse proves without a doubt that when Quran mentions “Yom” or “AYYAM”, it means a 24-hour period of both “day” and “night” NONSTOP.You mentioned
no talking 2 months if you kill a large camel, right?
a billion people don't talk for a whole month, text only right?Why is that surprising to you? Doesn't Allah say to fast two consecutive months (60 days) to those who "YuZAHERUNA Min AZWAJEHEM" (making the wrong statement about their wives) before they can touch them again? Why was that surprising?
A big camel that feeds 60 people requires 60 days of fasting. I don't see what is wrong with that.
The Quran is very clear about fasting. We should never let our belief or how we feel or what a billionaire would or would not do or a technological change influence our understanding of the Quran. Allah says that HE wants EASE for the believers and not hardship.
My challenge for you is still there I will send a $100 electronic Amazon gift card or the equivalent if you don't have access to Amazon if anyone in this forum can bring me any of the following from the Quran (not hadith or other opinions)
-
An example in the Quran of someone fasting by NOT EATING AND DRINKING, OR
-
A direct commandment from Allah in the Quran that we should NOT EAT AND DRINK while fasting, OR
-
An example of an act of piety or righteousness (TAGHWA) mentioned in the Quran that involves NOT EATING AND DRINKING. (Ex. Lying, Bearing the correct testimony, Not accusing people wrongly, Talking nicely to people, Not yelling and screaming and so many others that are ALL directly mentioned in the Quran and
are ALL related to talking and the words that come out of a person's mouth).
Allah is our witness that if anyone brings me one example of the abovementioned 3 items in the Quran, I will keep my word and send you an electronic $100 gift card and if you don't want the money, I will sure donate it but bring me an example.
Thank you all and God bless. I don't think there is much more than I can add to this topic anymore. It is between you and your Lord giveup
No dear brother peace..
Your intention is pure probably.. But you have to ponder few key words..
UNTIL... Why God needs to use the word UNTIL and WHITE THREAD AT DAWN connecting with food and drink?
If one can eat and drink after white thread at dawn, why it is at all required to be mentioned? So meaningless to say eat and drink with cut point using UNTIL in the verse.. People do eat and drink whether God say or not... Look at the complete usages of HATHTHA in Quran for further clarification..COMPLETE.... if siyam is entire Yom, why siyam needs to be COMPLETED at ila Lail?
If it completes at the fall of night, then when to resume again? That's at dawn..
Quran verses very manifest... Siyam do involve with keeping away from food and drink and sex... And that's Don't's of siyam.. Dos of siyam is lot. Magnify God etc..Your couple of examples of UNTILL is really ridiculous.. No connection at all.. No one uses "until" unless there is restriction beyond that point..
Other key word is PERMITED FOR YOU NIGHTS...
If one says Nights permitted, that directly means Days (nahar) are NOT allowed in the context of the verse and the usage of words. So that means siyam is not 24 hours... And that further proves siyam is during genuine day time.. That's dawn to night fall...
If God used the word UNTIL in connection with food and drink then one would naturally perceive when to stop having sex.. That also at dawn.. Beyond dawn no sex.. So when to do again.. With the fall of night.. Not explained by God but self perception according to clear verse..If the above explanation doesnt impress you, then you have found your own Quran...
God doesn't need to say Don't do.. But can explain in different way... God didn't say don't do sex during nahar... So common sense.. Same for eat and drink.. -
Salaam to You All My fellow Followers of The Quran and Our Prophet,
It truly pains my heart to see people doing the wrong fast and I pray to Allah that you could do the right fast this year at the right time, InShaAllah.
May Allah guide us all to His Direct Path.Salaam ThelosttruthsofIslam,
Thank you for sharing your opinion about fasting. I also didn't do fasting by not eating and drinking, but the other way around by feeding the poor.
Here , I just want to share what I have done for years regarding fasting,2183 O you who believe, fasting has been decreed for you as it was decreed for those before you, perhaps you may be righteous.
2184
ayyāman = (Fasting for) days
maʿdūdātin = numbered.
faman = So whoever
kāna = is
minkum = among you
marīḍan = sick
aw = or
ʿalā = on
safarin = a journey,
faʿiddatun = then a prescribed number
min = of
ayyāmin = days
ukhara =other.
waʿalā = And on
alladhīna = those who
yuṭīqūnahu = can afford it,
fid'yatun = purchase/provide
ṭaʿāmu = food
mis'kīnin = a poor
.
.So it said "yuṭīqūnahu" means can afford it. If it means "can't afford it" in my opinion it should be "la yutiqunahu", So from here I know that during my fasting I have to feed the poor.
but first let me show you how the people of the book fasting in the past,
Isaiah 58
5 Is it such a fast that I have chosen? a day for a man to afflict his soul? is it to bow down his head as a bulrush, and to spread sackcloth and ashes under him? wilt thou call this a fast, and an acceptable day to the Lord?
6 Is not this the fast that I have chosen? to loose the bands of wickedness, to undo the heavy burdens, and to let the oppressed go free, and that ye break every yoke?
7 Is it not to deal thy bread to the hungry, and that thou bring the poor that are cast out to thy house? when thou seest the naked, that thou cover him; and that thou hide not thyself from thine own flesh?
So fasting based on the verses above is to do good things such as feed the poor, clothe them and help them. It's inline with my understanding of 2184.
And let me continue pairing the context of those verses,
Isaiah
8 Then shall thy light break forth as the dawn, and thine health shall spring forth speedily and thy righteousness shall go before thee; the glory of the Lord shall be thy reward.2187 ...And you may eat and drink until the white thread is distinct from the black thread of dawn;
Isaiah 58
9 Then shalt thou call, and the Lord shall answer; thou shalt cry, and he shall say, Here I am. If thou take away from the midst of thee the yoke, the putting forth of the finger, and speaking vanity;2186 And if My servants ask you about Me, I am near answering the calls of those who call to Me. So let them respond to Me and believe in Me that they may be guided.
Isaiah 58
6 Is not this the fast that I have chosen? to loose the bands of wickedness, to undo the heavy burdens, and to let the oppressed go free, and that ye break every yoke?2193 And fight them so there is no more persecution, and so that the system is for God. If they cease, then there will be no aggression except against the wicked.
Regarding feeding the poor and clothe them, I recall this verse,
589 God will not hold you for your casual oaths, but He will hold you for what oaths you have made binding; its cancellation shall be the feeding of ten poor from the average of what you feed your family, or that you clothe them, or that you free a slave; whoever cannot find such shall fast for three days; this is a cancellation for making your oaths when you swear. And be careful from making oaths. It is such that God clarifies for you His revelations that you may be thankful.
to me is just a relief from ten to three.
So at this point, I feed a poor and clothe them, then I seek what God has written for us, by studying Quran intensively to seek the hadyi (guidance).
2187 It has been made permissible for you during the night of fasting to approach your women sexually. They are a garment for you and you are a garment for them. God knew that you used to betray your souls, so He has redeemed you, and forgiven you; now you may approach them and seek what God has written for you. And you may eat and drink until the white thread is distinct from the black thread of dawn; then you shall complete the fast until night; and do not approach them while you are devoted in the masjid. These are the boundaries of God, so do not transgress them. It is thus that God clarifies His revelations to the people that they may be righteous.
To me, Fasting is part of the Hajj and Umra (2183-2203).
When I studied the Quran intensively on particular topic, I have to avoid sex and clear my mind as per instruction in 2196,
here is my translation for 2196,
wa-atimmū = And complete
l-ḥaja = haji
wal-ʿum'rata = and the Umrah
lillahi = for Allah.
fa-in = And if
uḥ'ṣir'tum = you are abstain from sexual intercourse
famā = then
is'taysara = easy to obtain
mina = of
l-hadyi = guidancewalā = And (do) not
taḥliqū = annoy
ruūsakum = your head
ḥattā = until
yablugha = reach
l-hadyu = guidance
maḥillahu = solvedfaman = Then whoever
kāna = is
minkum = among you
marīḍan = ill
aw = or
bihi = in
adhan = annoyed
min = of
rasihi = your head
fafid'yatun = then provide
min = of
ṣiyāmin = fasting
aw = or
ṣadaqatin = charity
aw = or
nusukin = sacrifice.fa-idhā = Then when
amintum = you are secure
faman = then whoever
tamattaʿa = took advantage
bil-ʿum'rati = to observe
ilā = until
l-ḥaji = argue
famā = then
is'taysara = easy to obtain
mina = of
l-hadyi = guidancefaman = But whoever
lam = not
yajid = find
faṣiyāmu = then a fast
thalāthati = of three
ayyāmin = days
fī = during
l-ḥaji = arguing
wasabʿatin = and seven
idhā = when
rajaʿtum = you bring answertilka = This
ʿasharatun = (is) ten (days)
kāmilatun = in all.dhālika = That
liman = (is) for (the one) whose,
lam yakun = not is
ahluhu = those
ḥāḍirī = dispute on
l-masjidi = masjidil
l-ḥarāmi = haram
wa-ittaqū = wa-ittaqū
l-laha = Allah
wa-iʿ'lamū = and know
anna = that
l-laha = Allah
shadīdu = (is) severe
l-ʿiqābi= (in) retribution.Only for people whose not in dispute (hujjah) regarding masjidil haram, as stated on this verse,
2150 And from wherever you go out, you shall set your face towards the Masjidil Haram. And wherever you may be, you shall all set your faces towards it; that the people will have no room for debate <hujjatun - hajj> with you, except those of them who are wicked. You shall not be concerned by them, but be concerned by Me; so that I may complete My blessings upon you and that you may be guided.
I still have a lot things need to share, but I hope it's enough for now. I don't want to cause debate, just want to share my understanding.
I respect your opinion, whatever you believe as long as it is based on God's scriptures.
Peace
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How does staying hungry and thirsty makes you and I pious and God fearing? If that was the case, then all the homeless people would be the most pious and God fearing ones among us, wouldn’t they?
Bro ThelosttruthsofIslam,
I think fasting during Ramadan has a lot of wisdom.
Experiencing the real hunger and thirst are needed to nourish our soul
At least for the one who really appreciates his fasting.Why?
Hunger and thirst are two kinds of torture received by God enemies in the hereafter
In fact these tortures only a tip of the iceberg compared to various other tortures in real hellfireJust do this
During the peak of hunger and thirst (during fasting) just imagine that we are in the hellfire
Receive a lot of painful retribution for our sins
These tortures are indefinite and will not end forever
Are we willing to accept it?For me the real experiencing of hunger and thirst are a great wisdom from God
AND I personally had experienced the extreme thirst during my fast and
This experience is still sculpted in my heartI also put my finger into the flame of fire just to experience the real torture of the hellfire
Now I surrender to GOD
God's vengeance is unbearable
And I know experiencing is different from imaginary
The experience will stick in the heart forever.Just my take.
Thank you. -
Fasting makes me feel good, I fast on thursdays, skip two meals and strict veg on that day. Our Ramadan fasting is a good practice, if practiced in the best way. Communities fast to keep themselves fit both mind and body, some communities fast to keep away from seasonal diseases. It should be a cultural thing that has no direct simple reason, except to see this as a good practice. But by fasting we make sure we do not waste and not go excess harming our body by eating excess in the name of feasting at the end the fasting.
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Thank you everyone. I started fasting by NOT EATING AND DRINKING when I was 6 years old and never missed a day of WRONG fasting my entire life up until Allah taught me what the real fasting was. However, it is NOT about what I unknowingly did, how I feel about fasting or if it makes me feel good or healthy, or if I can or cannot do it. It is ALL about what Allah has WRITTEN for us in His Book to follow.
If NOT EATING AND DRINKING was a cause for piety and righteousness, then most Hollywood MODELS, ACTRESSES, ACTORS and people with eating disorders such as BULIMIA would be the most pious in the world as they don’t eat for long periods of time. Please go on YouTube and type fasting and you will see that for yourself.
As I mentioned, NOT EATING and DRNKING has never been written for us in the Quran because it simply does NOT lead to “taghwa”. Take a look at current Islamic societies and how people cut each other’s head off during Ramadan while fasting. That should be a huge wake up call that something is NOT right. In fact, by NOT EATING and DRNKING, majority of Muslims sleep during the day and bing eat during the night, which is THE unhealthiest thing one could do. Please look around and you will see how drowsy people are in Ramadan very clearly.
Month of Ramadan is THE month of celebration, being active, doing E'tekaf, worshipping the lord and praising and glorifying Allah NOT the month of being drowsy and hungry and thirsty. In the old testament and new testament, you always see their fasting associated with MOURNING for causes such as destruction of Jerusalem, captivity or for Jesus Christ. NOT EATING and DRNKING actually was very common amongst Syrian Christians who mourned and self-flagellated before their conversion to Islam. Unfortunately the Syrian version of Islam managed to become victorious by defeating the Meccan/Medinian version of Islam during the Umayyads and that’s how we ended up with this mourning practice of not eating and drinking.
Anyway, back to the Quran
Please read the following two verses. Allah cannot make it any clearer for us
- He said, "My Lord, make for me a sign." He said, "Your sign is that you will not (be able to) speak to the people for three (3) ay’yam (days plus nights; 72 hours NONSTOP) except by gesture. And remember your Lord much and glorify in the evening and the morning." (341)
Example of Zechariah, John The Baptist’s father and Maryam’s teacher
Allah imposed a mandatory 3 day fast on him during which he would NOT be able to talk to any human beings for a consecutive 72-hour period.But how can we be sure that a YOM also included the night?
- (Zechariah) said, "My Lord, make for me a sign." He said, "Your sign is that you will not speak to the people for three nights, (while being) sound.“ (1910)
These two verses proves without a doubt that when Quran mentions “Yom” or “AYYAM” for fasting, it means a 24-hour period of both “day” and “night” NONSTOP. And that’s how fating was up until verse 2187 of the Quran was revealed and Allah discounted the nights to the believers.
The only reason why we assume we have to fast by NOT EATING AND DRINKING is because we grew up believing fasting is not eating and drinking. That's why our brains automatically make that that association. Nowhere in the Quran Allah says do NOT eat or drink. Let me give you an example
Again, read these two examples
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Talk to your wives AND Seek what Allah has written for you AND Eat and drink UNTIL DAWN. Then, take care of your younger brother up to the night.
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Talk to your wives AND Seek what Allah has written for you AND Eat and drink until morning Eat and drink UNTIL DAWN. Then, go to school and complete your homework until night.
Do these examples mean you should NOT be eating and drinking while taking care of your younger brother or while in school completing your homework? Of course, NOT
As you can see, there are two other things that the verse tells us to do until dawn in that verse
1.Talk and have contact with your wives AND,
2.Seek what Allah has written for you AND,
3.Eat and drinkUntil dawn, Then complete the fast...
Do you have to stop 1 and 2 as well?
If you apply negation, you have to negate 1 and 2 as well but you can't because then you have to stop seeking what Allah has written for you, which results in you NOT fasting and saying prayers and paying zakat and etc.BUT more importantly, the word AYYAM includes both day and night. How could have anyone fasted both day and night for 30 days?
As clearly evidence by the Quran, Fasting was initially 30 days and 30 nights of NOT talking (Also includes texting) and believers were only allowed to communicate through gesture but Allah discounted the nights at 2187.
Brothers and Sisters Allah says you need two just witnesses to prove a point. I have more than two witnesses from the Quran but here I give you two
First Quranic Witness (Maryam)
So, eat and drink and look forward (to the birth of your child). Then if you see any human being, say, "I have vowed a fast for The Rahman (The Most Gracious), and THEREFORE, I shall never talk to any human beings THIS YOM (day plus night, 24 hours).“ (1926)2nd Quranic Witness (Zechariah)
He said, "My Lord, make for me a sign." He said, "Your sign is that you will not (be able to) speak to the people for three (3) ay’yam (days plus nights; 72 hours NONSTOP) except by gesture. And remember your Lord much and glorify in the evening and the morning." (341)How many Quranic witnesses do you have? Bring your witnesses and we can talk more for sure.
My challenge for all of you is still there I will send a $100 electronic Amazon gift card or the equivalent if you don't have access to Amazon if anyone in this forum can bring me any of the following from the Quran (not hadith or other opinions)
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An example in the Quran of someone fasting by NOT EATING AND DRINKING, OR
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A direct commandment from Allah in the Quran that we should NOT EAT AND DRINK while fasting, OR
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An example of an act of piety or righteousness (TAGHWA) mentioned in the Quran that involves NOT EATING AND DRINKING. (Ex. Lying, Bearing the correct testimony, Not accusing people wrongly, Talking nicely to people, Not yelling and screaming and so many others that are ALL directly mentioned in the Quran and
are ALL related to talking and the words that come out of a person's mouth and NONE is related to NOT EATING AND DRINKING).
Allah is our witness that if anyone brings me one example of the abovementioned 3 items in the Quran, I will keep my word and send you an electronic $100 gift card and if you don't want the money, I will sure donate it but bring me an example.
Please watch this video and scroll to 900. I explain 2187 in excruciating detail with several examples if you care to learn what the Quran tells us.
https//youtu.be/PPE4OLwcyHwWe all need to stop following the Umayyad Islam and come back to the original true Islam and the TRUE Quran. We should stop following the religion of the Umayyads (Syrian Islam) who buried the truth of the Quran under a ton of false hadith. Allah commands us NOT to follow hadith. When are we going to wake up and listen to Allah. Here is my video about the hadith and some of the verses where Allah tells us not to follow them
https//youtu.be/tno0dgHfr-8
I have nothing more to add but wish you all the best. Please take a moment out of your busy life and think and meditate and contemplate on those verses. It will make sense eventually just like it did for me after reading them day and night during my Salat for months.
Peace and Blessings to you all sun
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Bro ThelosttruthsofIslam,
Would you help me for a second
About the words "أَيّامًا مَعدودٰتٍ" mention in verse 2184
Some say The word "madooda" is used in Arabic to typically denote a number from 3-10 and no more
In your opinion, is it correct or not?
If that is the case, Ramadan fasting only for 3-10 days and not a whole month!*Just for my record
Thank you. -
Bro ThelosttruthsofIslam,
Would you help me for a second
About the words "أَيّامًا مَعدودٰتٍ" mention in verse 2184
Some say The word "madooda" is used in Arabic to typically denote a number from 3-10 and no more
In your opinion, is it correct or not?
If that is the case, Ramadan fasting only for 3-10 days and not a whole month!*Just for my record
Thank you.Peace and Blessings to you )
Of course. I would love to help wherever I can. That is a great question. "AYYAM" can be any number of days >= 3 so we know for sure that fasting (siyam) includes at least 3 days of fast (sowm).
Allah says that His book is detailed, clear, specific and is there to clarify everything we need to know. So we have to look for the answer within the Quran. If you look at 2185, it says
"The month of Ramadan is the one in which the Qur'an was revealed as guidance for mankind and with vivid features of guidance and the Criterion ;so those of you who are present during the month (SHAHR) must fast therein"
So, at this point we know we have to fast the duration of the SHAHR. But how many days are there in a "SHAHR" that we have to fast therein?
The Quran has the clear answer for us at 584
"And he whoever does not find (a slave to free), then fasting for two consecutive months (SHAHRAIN) before they touch one another; And he who is unable, then the feeding of sixty poor persons (1 person for each day).This verse fixes the number of days in a qur'anic month (Shahr) to 30 days. Fasting two consecutive Quranic months (Shahrayn) or alternatively feeding 60 people (i.e., 1 person for each day of fasting). 30 days in each month (Shahr) equals 60 days in two months and 60 people. Consequently, each Quranic month is 30 days and NEVER 29 days.
So Fasting is ALWAYS and EXACTLY 30 days.
Just so you remember In 2184, Allah makes it very clear for us in the Quran that each ONE day of fasting can be ransomed (atoned) by feeding ONE person from the average of what we eat, which gives us the following equation that I used for 584. ONE day of fasting = feeding ONE person
I also have a video about this if you would rather hear it https//youtu.be/8wcq5ur7w9I
I hope it helped,
Mahdi -
Bro ThelosttruthsofIslam,
Thanks for your response
I do not know arabic and that's why I ask this question to you
AND from your writing I conclude that the words "ayyamam madooda" are not limited to a maximum 10 days but will go beyond it as well as for 30 days (the whole month of Ramadan)It helps me a lot.
Thanks again,
Salam. -
That is correct. It literally means "A counted (calculated, enumerated) number of AYYAM (days plus nights)".
Allah is telling you that "the number" is very definite and calculated/enumerated. That is the clue that the exact number is there in the Quran. And as you can see from the verses I sent you, the exact number is precisely calculated/enumerated and stated to be 30 AYYAM--not one day less and not one day more.
Book of Allah is THE PERFECTION OF BEAUTY. If you follow it and mediate/contemplate on it, you will never go wrong )
