Malika...
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For example I bringforth the following verse
2283 "And if you are on a journey and cannot find a scribe, then a security deposit taken. And if one of you entrusts another, then let him who is entrusted discharge his trust and let him fear Allah , his Lord. And do not conceal testimony, for whoever conceals it - his heart is indeed sinful, and Allah is Knowing of what you do."What is your thought in this verse...
My view is... To hide a testimony you don't need to do any physical action... Just being silent is enough... Since he didn't do any action malaika doesn't record as per you... Is that correct... He concealed a testimony with intention that I was in his heart.. Do you see how God put the verse... His heart sinful... Is it required to be recorded or not ...in fact it should be recorded.. He avoided by not doing any action... Sinful heart concealed the testimony... In fact it is a big sin.. But no action literally...That's my understanding... I don't know how others feels... Welcome your opinion... Coz before opening this topic I was not sure... But now I feel more towards that malaika knows everything about a person...
Or even this verse
3167 " ... saying with their mouths what was not in their hearts...."
I submitted part of the verse to emphasize with topic... But read full verse...
Here malaika can record something... Coz they utter something that may be pleasant and not harmful... But it is not in their hearts... So what will be in the record books? Something which is useless OR should that cover everything?
Impossible brother... Record book should depict the reality... Not external words... I don't think that's Enough...
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541 " O Messenger, let them not grieve you who hasten into disbelief of those who say, "We believe" with their mouths, but their hearts believe not .... "
In the above verse it must that Malaika assigned to Record what these people worded... If it remains as they worded and it is a proof that they believed... Coz they have spoken and that's what malaika recorded... But with what intent they uttered that they "believe"... That should be recorded at the same time... Coz mere words of a person won't tell the true story of him.. So noble writers should know what is in our hearts when we put them in words... Even we don't put them in words they deserve to know for better recording...
That's my understanding.... I respect others understanding as well... But I am happy with what God guides me with...
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We need to ask the following question
If GOD knows everything why do we need our life recorded and witnessed by Malaika? Is GOD not enough as a reckoner?Then we will come to realise that it is for the purpose of providing the evidence needed on judgement day.so that everyone will play their own recorded tape of their life .
Of course GOD is enough as a reckoner but we will also be our own reckoner with the evidence provided.
Malaika are the tools , their job is to collect the evidence.This renders what they know or do not know irrelevant as their own knowledge is not required with the evidence. So apart from our curiosity about the Malaika, what they know or do not know has no importance or effect or role on the job they do .
GOD bless.
Peace. -
That is nonsense....
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God will mock them and will increase their arrogance as they stray. (215)
Proof
You had no idea of what the Book was, nor Iman (4252)
No iman which a self professes will be of any use to it if it did not have iman before and earn good in its iman. (615
The Arabs say, ´We have iman.´ Say ´You do not have iman´ (4914)
I swear by your Lord that they will not be considered believers/muslims until they let you/364 judge their disputes and then they will find nothing in their souls to prevent them from accepting your judgment, thus, submitting themselves completely to the will of God (465)
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We need to ask the following question
If GOD knows everything why do we need our life recorded and witnessed by Malaika? Is GOD not enough as a reckoner?Then we will come to realise that it is for the purpose of providing the evidence needed on judgement day.so that everyone will play their own recorded tape of their life .
Of course GOD is enough as a reckoner but we will also be our own reckoner with the evidence provided.
Malaika are the tools , their job is to collect the evidence.This renders what they know or do not know irrelevant as their own knowledge is not required with the evidence. So apart from our curiosity about the Malaika, what they know or do not know has no importance or effect or role on the job they do .
GOD bless.
Peace.I wish if you bringforth verses of Quran rather than speak with preconceived thoughts... Coz QURAN does matter for all of us...
Yes... GL.. Malaika are imperative in God's Kingdom.. Though God can handle everything allalone, but God opted malaika in everything.... Almost everything... That may look funny for certain people but that's the truth... One would say like you claimed above, why God needs Guards in Hell... Is God fear that those in hell will escape?without malaika God has not planned this kingdom... Even before He create human He was having a close dialog with malaika that everyone knows... Though malaika refused but still God proceeded...
If one underestimatw the vested power of malaika then it is Upto him.. For me malaika assigned to record knows about us everything.. That is to say... Our thoughts our movements our wording our hiding our actions withouy intent all.. Nothing they will leave apart.. They record everything then only it is complete...
Thank you... Let those who explore in this topic explore further to know truth... What is best than self perceived truth with guidance of God... Up to you people to decide...
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I swear by your Lord that they will not be considered believers/muslims until they let you/364 judge their disputes and then they will find nothing in their souls to prevent them from accepting your judgment, thus, submitting themselves completely to the will of God (465)
They try to fool God and the believers, but they fool only themselves and do not even realize it. (29)
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Blind men and an elephant....
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Peace Green Anarchism..
Here is a conversation between two people at GOD sThey will come to each other, and confer with one another.
One of them will say, "I used to have a friend.
"He used to mockDo you believe all this? "After we die and turn into dust and bones, do we get called to account?' "
He will say, "Just take a look!"
When he looks, he will see his friend in the heart of Hell.*
He (will go to him and) say, "By God, you almost ruined me.
"If it were not for my Lord's blessing, I would have been with you now.
"(Do you still believe) that we die,
"only the first death, and we never receive any requital?
"
Brother,
Redemption by each individual is for themselves only This should be the Greatest TriumphSuch is the greatest triumph.
This is what every one of us should work for.Do you know where you will be then? Work for your redemption, I work for mine, brother jkhan will work for his like every other human will choose their own way. None of us is the other Wakeel, nor should we mock each other .
Malaika are recording us and will be witnessing . Let us see then what will be in store for us when it matters.
GOD bless you.
Peace -
Brother G A.
i thought I’d begin by reading your post, but then I thought, why should I? You never read any of mine..
When I will meet you brother,I will immediately start talking about global warming,it will be a real ice breaker.
I forgot to tell you I can also do magic.
When I drive my car I always turn into a road.
When I throw a melon in the water it turns to a water melon.
I make the ocean say hello. it waves. I light up a stadium with a soccer match.
I can create a word that start with E and ends with E but only has one letter in it. EnvelopEHowever I cannot use "beef stew" as password because it is not "Straganof"! But I can make trees access the internet. They log in!
So you probably understand me better now?
Let s see if we get somewhere, you may read this one?
GOD bless you.
Peace. -
Brother G A.
i thought I’d begin by reading your post, but then I thought, why should I? You never read any of mine..
When I will meet you brother,I will immediately start talking about global warming,it will be a real ice breaker.
I forgot to tell you I can also do magic.
When I drive my car I always turn into a road.
When I throw a melon in the water it turns to a water melon.
I make the ocean say hello. it waves. I light up a stadium with a soccer match.
I can create a word that start with E and ends with E but only has one letter in it. EnvelopEHowever I cannot use "beef stew" as password because it is not "Straganof"! But I can make trees access the internet. They log in!
So you probably understand me better now?
Let s see if we get somewhere, you may read this one?
GOD bless you.
Peace.Salam Brother good logic,
My opinion you are wasting your time with this person.
Sectarian spirit with no way out (only God may help..).God bless you.
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Peace Green Anarchism..
Here is a conversation between two people at GOD sThey will come to each other, and confer with one another.
One of them will say, "I used to have a friend.
"He used to mockDo you believe all this? "After we die and turn into dust and bones, do we get called to account?' "
He will say, "Just take a look!"
When he looks, he will see his friend in the heart of Hell.*
He (will go to him and) say, "By God, you almost ruined me.
"If it were not for my Lord's blessing, I would have been with you now.
"(Do you still believe) that we die,
"only the first death, and we never receive any requital?
"
Brother,
Redemption by each individual is for themselves only This should be the Greatest TriumphSuch is the greatest triumph.
This is what every one of us should work for.Do you know where you will be then? Work for your redemption, I work for mine, brother jkhan will work for his like every other human will choose their own way. None of us is the other Wakeel, nor should we mock each other .
Malaika are recording us and will be witnessing . Let us see then what will be in store for us when it matters.
GOD bless you.
PeaceBrother GL...
Stupid can't be fixed... That's all I can say...
I am not an enemy of anyone here... I know how to deal with the mentality of each person...
God knows my intention...
Guided ones are much perceivable when they write in this forum...
And I am not a child who cannot understand the one who passes time at the expense of others..Advices won't work for stupids who claims others stupids...
If the intention of a person for guidance then speak directly with verses of God... If he or she fails to do so then such hilarious actions suits them... Some people try to be judge gor example Green Anarchism allegedly Mahdist... rotfl
Whatever... Keep advising if you want... They will never change... Their intention is very much manifest with the tone of what they write...
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Salam Brother good logic,
My opinion you are wasting your time with this person.
Sectarian spirit with no way out (only God may help..).God bless you.
I was updating my spice collection when I realized that they all had expired, what a waste of thyme.
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37
It is He who has sent down to you, , the Book; in it are verses precise -
they are the foundation of the Book - and others unspecific. As for those in whose hearts is
deviation , they will follow that of it which is unspecific, seeking discord and seeking
an interpretation . And no one knows its interpretation except Allah.
But those firm in knowledge say, "We believe in it. All is from our Lord." And no one will be
reminded except those of understanding.We constantly debate or give our opinions of the unseen, to look behind the curtain, we can have
those discussions as long as we remember what is the hidden.peace
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We constantly debate or give our opinions of the unseen, to look behind the curtain, we can have
those discussions as long as we remember what is the hidden.Salam hawk99,
For a debate you need that the other person at least "try to read honesty your post"
i quote good logic " thought I’d begin by reading your post, but then I thought, why should I? You never read any of mine.."
and the response from Green Anarchism "Yeah, why should I listen to moral relativism?".Yes you can give your opinions (or use this site to promote your ideologies - why not), but without denigrating the other or making fun of them in a perfidious way (sarcasm).
God bless you.
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Brother GL and others.. ...
Just give little more thoughts with my question by comparing verses 8210-12 and 5016-18 what do you think...
They malaika know everything about us perhaps.. What actually the word Yalfizu means.. It occurs once.. Is it utter?
Salam Jkhan,
maybe you want to consider these following verses,4119 And the Day when the enemies of God will be gathered to the Fire, forcibly.
4120 When they come to it, their own hearing, eyes, and skins will bear witness to everything they had done.
4121 And they will say to their skins "Why did you bear witness against us?" They will say "God made us speak; He is the One who causes everything to speak. He is the One who has created you the first time, and to Him you return."
4122 And there was no way you could hide from the testimony of your own hearing, or your eyes, or your skins. In fact, you thought that God was unaware of much of what you do.
so it's not necessarily that Malaika will testify against us in the last day.
So if we check the verses that you mentioned,
5017 When the two receivers meet <yatalaqqā l-mutalaqiyāni> on the right and on the left.
5018 He does not utter a word except a watcher is constantly with him.
The hearing, the eyes, are also receivers, and they are located in the right and left. It could be them, since the verses didn't mention the word "malaika", and also in these following verses,
8210 And over you are those who recording <laḥāfiẓīna>
8211 Honorable scribes.
8212 They know what you do.
And even the word hafiz most of the time were translated as guardian (and most of the time refer to malaika), I prefer the other meaning as the ones I bold below,
Ha-Fa-Za = To preserve/guard/protect a thing, take care of a thing, prevent a thing from perishing, to be careful/mindful/regardful/attentive/considerate concerning a thing, to keep a thing, put in store, retain a thing, learn a thing by heart (commit to memory), to remember, to defend, keep a thing from getting lost, to be observant or watchful, apply oneself/assiduously/constantly/perseveringly, vigilant or heedful, to anger a person or be angered.
Peace
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Salam Jkhan,
maybe you want to consider these following verses,4119 And the Day when the enemies of God will be gathered to the Fire, forcibly.
4120 When they come to it, their own hearing, eyes, and skins will bear witness to everything they had done.
4121 And they will say to their skins "Why did you bear witness against us?" They will say "God made us speak; He is the One who causes everything to speak. He is the One who has created you the first time, and to Him you return."
4122 And there was no way you could hide from the testimony of your own hearing, or your eyes, or your skins. In fact, you thought that God was unaware of much of what you do.
so it's not necessarily that Malaika will testify against us in the last day.
So if we check the verses that you mentioned,
5017 When the two receivers meet <yatalaqqā l-mutalaqiyāni> on the right and on the left.
5018 He does not utter a word except a watcher is constantly with him.
The hearing, the eyes, are also receivers, and they are located in the right and left. It could be them, since the verses didn't mention the word "malaika", and also in these following verses,
8210 And over you are those who recording <laḥāfiẓīna>
8211 Honorable scribes.
8212 They know what you do.
And even the word hafiz most of the time were translated as guardian (and most of the time refer to malaika), I prefer the other meaning as the ones I bold below,
Ha-Fa-Za = To preserve/guard/protect a thing, take care of a thing, prevent a thing from perishing, to be careful/mindful/regardful/attentive/considerate concerning a thing, to keep a thing, put in store, retain a thing, learn a thing by heart (commit to memory), to remember, to defend, keep a thing from getting lost, to be observant or watchful, apply oneself/assiduously/constantly/perseveringly, vigilant or heedful, to anger a person or be angered.
Peace
Peace.. Brother...
Yes those are wonderful verses...
But my extreme concern was the capacity of malaika not how we our body testifies on the day of judgement... We ourself will accept on that day everything... That's more than enough to cast one into hell... Even malaika record or not God alone is enough to decide since He witnesses everything...
But malaika who are assigned on everyone to record has been given the capacity record precisely... And that same record book would be at the hands of every individual on that day and on it nothing will be left out.... To leave out nothing on a book which is the biography of a person then the one who wrote should have massive capacity... Including to know what we think in our hearts
.... That's my point... Thank you brother for your comments.. Valuable as always.
God bless us.. -
But my extreme concern was the capacity of malaika not how we our body testifies on the day of judgement...
But malaika who are assigned on everyone to record has been given the capacity record precisely...
God bless us..Salam Jkhan,
yes, I got your point. I was thinking the same the whole time, until I realize that the things God Called "Receivers" is not the Malaika, but our hearing and eyes, they are sitting on the right and left all the time as part of our body, and will testify against us on the last day.The word Malaika is also recorded in my mind, because when I was a child, teachers at school taught me that there were two angels sitting on my right and left shoulders who recorded everything I did .
But it's up to you brother.
Peace.
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Salam Jkhan,
yes, I got your point. I was thinking the same the whole time, until I realize that the things God Called "Receivers" is not the Malaika, but our hearing and eyes, they are sitting on the right and left all the time as part of our body, and will testify against us on the last day.The word Malaika is also recorded in my mind, because when I was a child, teachers at school taught me that there were two angels sitting on my right and left shoulders who recorded everything I did .
But it's up to you brother.
Peace.
1061 "And, , you are not in any matter or recite any of the Qur'an and you do not do any deed except that We are witness over you when you are involved in it. And not absent from your Lord is any of an atom's weight within the earth or within the heaven or smaller than that or greater but that it is in a clear register."
661 "He is Dominant over all His creatures and He sends guards to watch over you until death approaches you. Then His angelic Messengers will, without fail, take away your souls."
4380 " Or do they think that We hear not their secrets and their private conversations? Yes, , and Our messengers are with them recording."
Peace...
I appreciate your way of thought... But Quran cannot be neglected and cannot be taken for granted... We all can ponder but we should conclude within Quran... So unfortunately I am not with your opinion which is against Quran...
Hands and eyes are there in right and left.. Fine.. They OR all organs probably may witness against the evil disbelievers in the day of judgement... But recording is must and that take place through noble angels.. That you can't deny brother..
Just take look above verses... If my previous verses not enough in case..
Look at the verse 4380 ... It is clearly stated Messengers do record..It is not that I'm against your view always but unfortunately for you, I am with Quran and QURAN always speaks the truth and not our understanding...
If you still insist that there is no malaika (literally messengers) recording 24/7 then it is fine your view.. But revisit quran and come back to me.. That's worthy as a believer...
Infront of truth I am always bending my head... Coz beyond truth nothing there......Warusuluna ladaihim yakthabun.... 4380
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If you still insist that there is no malaika (literally messengers) recording 24/7 then it is fine your view.. But revisit quran and come back to me.. That's worthy as a believer...
Infront of truth I am always bending my head... Coz beyond truth nothing there......Warusuluna ladaihim yakthabun.... 4380
Salam Jkhan,
yes you're right. I'm not insist on that. I just make comments about the verses that you quoted, 5017 and 8210, that they are not necessarily Malaika. I am fully aware of that, and there will be a book for us.1713 And We have attached to the neck of every human being his deeds, and We bring forth for him a record <kitaban> on the Day of Resurrection which he will find on display.
1714 Read your record <kitabaka>! It is sufficient for you that you are aware of yourself today.
Peace
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Peace Iyyaka.
I hope no one here thinks good logic does not read their posts/replies/views...
I have no problem with anyone whether they read my posts, ignore them or mock them..
I have no issue with GA or anyone else ,I hope he recognises the lightheartedness that I use with him, I am not being sarcastic with him, just a little humour that goes back since his days as "Mahdi".
I ask forgiveness from anyone who has any inkling that I use sarcasm or mock any of their post/view.
I read all the posts that I reply to and many of those that I do not take part in. I hope my intention is always the curiosity to learn and take the best of what is said.. Of course I also give my opinion and share stuff.Just thought I clarify that I have nothing but love and good intention towards all brothers and sisters here, and I apologise if I misunderstood you , offended you or anyone else.
GOD bless you.
Peace brother. -
Peace Iyyaka.
I hope no one here thinks good logic does not read their posts/replies/views...
I have no problem with anyone whether they read my posts, ignore them or mock them..
I have no issue with GA or anyone else ,I hope he recognises the lightheartedness that I use with him, I am not being sarcastic with him, just a little humour that goes back since his days as "Mahdi".
I ask forgiveness from anyone who has any inkling that I use sarcasm or mock any of their post/view.
I read all the posts that I reply to and many of those that I do not take part in. I hope my intention is always the curiosity to learn and take the best of what is said.. Of course I also give my opinion and share stuff.Just thought I clarify that I have nothing but love and good intention towards all brothers and sisters here, and I apologise if I misunderstood you , offended you or anyone else.
GOD bless you.
Peace brother.Peace brother GL,
Sorry but I don't really understand your reaction.
Yes you're a good guy.
I probably misspoke then.God bless you.
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Sorry I misunderstood you.
I thought you hinted at sarcasm between me and GA. when I joked that I was not going to read his post.
I was not sure.
I was clarifying that I read all posts when I reply.
Do not worry ,my fault.
GOD bless you.
Peace.