Homosexuality: A Cost To Society or Harmless
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Salaam all,
The above translation and verse numbering is from "The Message" by Progressive Muslims
Well it is an inaccurate translation. The word that is talked about here is FAHISHA and it means committing a bad act in public. This act can be sexual or non sexual. To ignore the public part of the meaning and to ignore that the act can be non sexual makes for an inaccurate translation.
Second point, they are restricted to their homes. Why? because they are a scandal and not because they have sex. It is because of the public part of their bad acts, whtever they are sexual or non sexual.
Salaam all and have a good day.
hussein
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Salaamun alaikum all,
"And the two women who commit lewdness, you shall bring four witnesses over them from amongst you; if they bear witness, then you shall restrict them in the homes until death takes them, or God makes for them a way out. And the two men who commit it from amongst you, then you shall annoy them. If they repent and amend, then leave them alone. God is Redeemer, Merciful". (415-16)
hlatif said
Well it is an inaccurate translation. The word that is talked about here is FAHISHA and it means committing a bad act in public. This act can be sexual or non sexual. To ignore the public part of the meaning and to ignore that the act can be non sexual makes for an inaccurate translation.
Brother Hussein,
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No where in the translation it says "private" lewdness only
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Can you please give me a reference of your opinion of the meaning of FAHISHA meaning "public" only
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"and do not come near FAWAHISH, publicly or privately" (6151)
Here FAWAHISH means both public AND private indecent acts because of the words following it "ma zahara minha wa ma batana"
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According to the Dictionary of The Holy Quran by Abdul Mannan Omar the word FAHISHATAN has the following meanings manifest improper conduct; gross sin; unseemly; immoral conduct; indecent or lewd or abominable word or deed; flagrant indecency; adultery; fornication; sodomy; illicit sexual intercourse. It does not say these acts are only public or only private.
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All the meanings imply sexual acts as sexual does not mean only intercourse but any immoral or indecent or sexual act that can imply a sexual advance or can elicit a sexual response from the other person is considered sexual also. When people are accused of SEXUAL harassment at work it does not mean actual SEX only, it could be any immoral or indecent sexual remark or advancement or foreplay etc.
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Please give me an example of a non sexual FAHISHA from Al-Quran
Brother Elke,
I checked on some other translations and it seems you may be right that the first part of the sign 415 could mean "any of your women" but the word "min" means "amongst" indicating that the verse refers to a female-female act.
Any comments from others?
Peace all, Tanveer
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Salaam brother Tanveer,
Thank you for prompting me to look the root F-Ha-SH. I did look it up at the LISAN ALARAB dictionary and this is what I found
Any ugly word or deed. Or any act or deed or word that exceed the limit in a bad direction. Adultery is considered a FAHISHA, but it is not the only FAHISHA.
You are right, I could not see the public part. Therefore, in this area, I am wrong and you are right. For this I thank you.
You had another question
- Please give me an example of a non sexual FAHISHA from Al-Quran
1732 Nor come nigh to adultery for it is a shameful (deed) and an evil, opening the road (to other evils).
So here the word adultery was used and it was mentioned as A FAHISHA rather than THE FAHISHA. If the Qur'an was to limit FAHISHA to sexual acts then the Adultery becomes AL FAHISHA.Those AYAT can be understood in non sexual ways
2169, 2268,3135,6151,728, 733,2419,2945Take care and have a good day
Hussein
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Salaamun alaikum Brother Hussein,
If you define a sexual act as adultery/fornication or sodomy, and a nonsexual act as an immoral or indecent or lewd act other than adultery/fornication or sodomy, then you are right that FAHISHA means sexual and non sexual bad acts.
In my mind I think of sexual acts to mean adultery/fornication as well as other lewd or immoral acts which explains my comments. Thank you for the references.
Regards,
Tanveer