Are we true believers!

reel

Alexa!
What is it?

Thanks.

This https//youtu.be/8bACuhV5RPM

Experiencing Quran is otherworldly though.

shukri

These signs accompany true believers

The believers are those whose hearts tremble when God is mentioned, and when His revelations are recited to them, their faith is strengthened, and they trust in their Lord (AQ 82)
Absolutely, God's allies have nothing to fear, nor will they grieve (AQ 1062)
Over it is nineteen. We appointed angels to be guardians of Hell, and we assigned their number
(a) to disturb the disbelievers,
(b) to convince the Christians and Jews (that this is a divine scripture),
(c) to strengthen the faith of the faithful,
(d) to remove all traces of doubt from the hearts of Christians, Jews, as well as the believers, and
(e) to expose those who harbor doubt in their hearts, and the disbelievers; they will say, "What did God mean by this allegory?" God thus sends astray whomever He wills, and guides whomever He wills. None knows the soldiers of your Lord except He. This is a reminder for the people (AQ 7430-31)

Question Do we already have these basic signs!

My last words for this thread

Every true believer will be accompanied by various signs
These signs will serve as a guideline for us to verify ourselves
Feel grateful for those who are blessed (with the signs) and self-reflect for others

Life is full of difficulties and challenges
We can't escape from it
But for the true believers God promised for them the happiness in this world and in the hereafter

1062 Absolutely, GOD’s allies have nothing to fear, nor will they grieve.
1063 They are those who believe and lead a righteous life.
1064 For them, glad tidings/joy and happiness in this world, as well as in the Hereafter. This is GOD’s unchangeable law. Such is the greatest triumph.

If we no longer fear or grieve in this life, I think we are blessed with a great sign of true believers.
And this stuff was experienced by Abraham, our exemplary imam in the Quran.

No fear
2679 "The One who feeds me and waters me."
2680 "And when I get sick, He heals me.

No grieve
37 102 When he grew enough to work with him, he said, "My son, I see in a dream that I am sacrificing you. What do you think?" He said, "O my father, do what you are commanded to do. You will find me, God willing, patient."

AND these signs (no fear, no grieve) are a climax for true believers, I suppose!

Ends.
Thank you to jkhan, Fusion, Wakas, Reel and good logic for participating in this discussion.
May God bless us!
So long!

Nom_de_plume

See this link
http//www.masjidtucson.org/publications/books/bp2/BeyondProbability_TheKey_AlFatehah.pdf?
Here the miracle-19 plays it vital role in this challenge

100% ignorant garbage for dummies
Simple digit flipping hide 18/19 fails show 1/19 hits
Zero consistency multiples posted with other chapters
Take any one parameter ~5 other chapters predictable
Apply same methods other numbers 7, 11, 13, 17, 23, 29
No 19 code in Qur’an any single parameter ~1/19 predictable
There’s no nice way to say it other than you guys are ignorant
Likewise you guys can’t read basic stuff suggest learn numbers

feminine and masculine eg nineteen morons (masculine)
تِسْعةَ عَشرَ بليداً

http//allthearabicyouneverlearnedthefirsttimearound.com/p3/arabic-numbers/

shukri

Coincidence or Planned Design?
http//www.masjidtucson.org/publications/books/bp2/BeyondProbability_TheKey_AlFatehah.pdf?

The combination of facts about the opening chapter of the Quran make it clear that its design is
not just coincidence. For instance, we notice in over a dozen facts a recurring pattern of the sura
number (1) and the number of each of the verses (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7). A simplified version of the
pattern is n = 1 1 * 2 * 3 * 4 * 5 * 6 * 7 *
Here, “*” is a placeholder for verse-level parameters, like the count of letters in each
verse. (These parameter numbers are always positive integers.) The resultant number “n”
is a multiple of 19.

You’ll see this pattern if you look at Fact 1 (1 1 2 3 4 5 6 7; in this case, the * symbol
represents an empty string) or Fact 4 (1 1 19,786 2 17,581 ... 7 43,6009; where the *
represents the number of letters in the verse followed by the gematrical value of that
verse).

There are only two possible explanations for over a dozen numbers following this
structure. One explanation is that “all this is coincidence and given a sufficiently large
sample of books you could get instances of facts whose probability of occurrence is one
in a million”. The other explanation, to borrow from Abdullah Arik’s “Beyond
Probability”, is that the Al-Fãtehah has been deliberately structured to result in this
remarkable mathematical system. Let us try to figure out which explanation makes more
sense using some simple probability calculations.

Suppose Fact 1 and Fact 4 (the first two occurrences of this pattern) occurred by random
chance. How do we calculate the probability of this occurring? To illustrate this, we’ll
further simplify a few things. Let us assume that the * parameters are single-digit
numbers (1-9). In that case, the resulting number “n” will have 15 digits and look like
1 1 * 2 * 3 * 4 * 5 * 6 * 7 *. Our next task is to calculate the probability that a randomly
chosen 15-digit number will satisfy the specified pattern and be a 19 multiple.

To calculate this probability empirically, we wrote a computer program that identified all
15-digit numbers satisfying the following sample conditions

The first number is 1 (for the sura number)
The second number is 1 (first verse)
The fourth number is 2
The sixth number is 3
The eighth number is 4
The tenth number is 5
The twelfth number is 6
The fourteenth number is 7
The entire number is a multiple of 19

Since we knew the first two digits had to be “1 1” (see conditions numbered 1 and 2 in
the list above), we told the computer to only consider numbers between
111,111,111,111,111 and 119,999,999,999,999 so it could complete the task faster. (If
we consider all 15-digit numbers from 111,111,111,111,111 to 999,999,999,999,999 we
get an even smaller probability, but that only strengthens the conclusion.)

Thank you.

shukri

Continuation

The computer found 251,735 such numbers out of a population of 8,888,888,888,888 possible
numbers (i.e., numbers that lie between 111,111,111,111,111 and 119,999,999,999,999).
Therefore, the chance of a number at random and by pure coincidence satisfying the 9 listed
conditions is 251,735 ÷ 8,888,888,888,888 or approximately 1 in 35 million! This is similar to the
odds of tossing a coin 25 times and getting heads every single time.

Based on this information, we can say that two such facts about Sura 1 coincidentally occurring is
like tossing a coin 50 times and getting heads every single time, i.e., 1 in (35 million) x (35 million)
or approximately 1 in a quadrillion. The more such facts that appear in a book or chapter, the
probability of them occurring purely by chance becomes even more minuscule. This probability
quickly approaches zero as we take additional mathematical facts into consideration.

Note a more general version of the pattern described, which considers aggregate parameters of
Sura 1, is
n = 1 # 1 * 2 * 3 * 4 * 5 * 6 * 7 *
Here, “#” represents sura-level aggregate parameters, e.g., the number of verses in Sura

An example of this pattern is seen in Fact 8 which starts with the sura number (1)
followed by the number of verses (7) in the sura, followed by each verse number and the
corresponding gematrical value of each letter within the verse. The additional
complexity implies an even tinier likelihood that a number will satisfy our sample
conditions by coincidence.

A reasonable person may therefore conclude that the structure of Sura 1, The Key, is by the
design of an Almighty Author, especially given that the mathematical structure encompasses the
entire book, not just the first chapter.

Ends.

Thank you.

jkhan

100% ignorant garbage for dummies
Simple digit flipping hide 18/19 fails show 1/19 hits
Zero consistency multiples posted with other chapters
Take any one parameter ~5 other chapters predictable
Apply same methods other numbers 7, 11, 13, 17, 23, 29
No 19 code in Qur’an any single parameter ~1/19 predictable
There’s no nice way to say it other than you guys are ignorant
Likewise you guys can’t read basic stuff suggest learn numbers

feminine and masculine eg nineteen morons (masculine)
تِسْعةَ عَشرَ بليداً

http//allthearabicyouneverlearnedthefirsttimearound.com/p3/arabic-numbers/

Before you make statement saying 100% garb.. First reflect if you are believer, why there are Arabic letters in Quran..

Why in chapter 2 and 3 it starts with Alif Lam MeeM and not in chapter 4? Why... Is the author has some sense in placing those mere arabic letters? It arabic letters has healing power for hearts they read them? It someone included these letters on top of 29 chapters noy in middle or end just to show this book is different? Or if you are a believer bring the reason for these letters to appear in the Quran? Do you have any valid reason of your own, if so elucidate it.. But you keep denying people who bring even the most convincing pattern... Or you want even a patten which God even not placed in it?
If until the day of judgement those letters didn't mean anything Quran then isn't it waste placing them logically? Or else tell us in black and white. WHAT GUIDANCE YOU GOT BY THESE VERSEA WHICH SHUKRI SPEAKS OF.. or what importance for you these letters in Quran? If nothing then why you say what you don't know of... It you want to say some coincidences somehow have occurred in Quran but fools are after it...
Well people yes I can see most sunni Muslims nowadays so proud of talking about numeric pattern but they totally discard ehere it originated... And they only most bring inconsistent lies...

Anyway.. Be happy with what you are satisfied. After all believera only will get convinced as per the verse... So.. I dont mind you reject it.. Coz verse confirms your stance..

Nom_de_plume

The computer found 251,735 such numbers …

lol ignorant of computing, statistics, and basic probability they teach 10 year olds.

Before you make statement saying 100% garb.. First reflect if you are believer

Anyway.. Be happy with what you are satisfied. After all believera only will get convinced as per the verse... So.. I dont mind you reject it.. Coz verse confirms your stance..

Is it a test for a believer to determine if they are too dumb to understand simple numerology tricks? What was the test conducted 1400 or 100 years ago?

People who identify themselves as believers also believe that stoning women after childbirth or marrying 6-year-old girls is acceptable.

Did you follow my instructions and try any of those methods, such as attempting different combinations of letters (which failed), or adding different numbers to the front or back? For example, in Ch1, they achieved monotonous work, which provided them with a sense of "arousal" as a reward.

Try applying the same techniques for any single multiple to other chapters, and you will experience approximately six instances of "arousal" (welcome to the nineteenth addicts disease club!)

Soon, you will find yourself scrutinizing your own posts, timestamps, street addresses, and everything around you.

Similarly, apply any parameter, whether it be verses, words, or combinations thereof, and you will encounter 6236/19 instances of "arousal"!

shukri

lol ignorant of computing, statistics, and basic probability they teach 10 year olds.

The facts given to you plain and clear
And up to you to accept it or not
No compulsion in religion.

3918 They are the ones who examine all words, then follow the best. These are the ones whom God has guided; these are the ones who possess intelligence.

Thank you.

shukri

Code 19 in the opening statement of the Quran (the Basmalah ... بِسمِ اللَّهِ الرَّحمٰنِ الرَّحيمِ)
https//www.masjidtucson.org/publications/books/bp/bp.pdf?
Coincidence or divine design?

Some highlights quoted from the Introduction of the book for our reflection!
(1) Many of us feel that the questions in our minds about the existence of God would be resolved if we witnessed a miracle from God, similar to the ones performed by Moses or Jesus that we read about in the scriptures. We may also think that it is not really fair to our generation that God does not send down miracles any more. Yet, let us be serious. With all the scientific and technological advancements that we have today, who would believe in the ancient type of miracles such as healing the sick, or reviving the dead? It would be more logical for God to send down a miracle that is more compatible for the minds and the lifestyles of the people in this day and age. The lack of a modern miracle contradicts the idea that God is the Most Wise. It also gives the impression that God is not adaptable to our higher levels of thinking. Is God only capable of miracles for simpler, more ancient minds? Did God deliver His miracles to a few small generations, while our generation is greater in number, and there are even larger generations to come?

To be continued

shukri

(2) The objective of this book is to present to the reader a mathematical system embedded in a scripture from God. This mathematical system is so inter-woven, so interlaced, and so pervasive throughout this scripture that it is beyond the probability of coincidence or human manufacture, proving its divinity and therefore the existence of God. This built-in system has been recently unveiled through the computer analysis of the original text of the scripture. It is the perfect opportunity for people who want to reaffirm their belief in God, and do not want to accept anything on blind faith. With this scripture and the new physical evidence, a clearer picture emerges There is only one God who is eternal, all knowing, and merciful. The One God who is in complete control of every little detail in the universe, and the One who can make Himself manifest for all.

Ends.

jkhan

lol ignorant of computing, statistics, and basic probability they teach 10 year olds.

Is it a test for a believer to determine if they are too dumb to understand simple numerology tricks? What was the test conducted 1400 or 100 years ago?

People who identify themselves as believers also believe that stoning women after childbirth or marrying 6-year-old girls is acceptable.

Did you follow my instructions and try any of those methods, such as attempting different combinations of letters (which failed), or adding different numbers to the front or back? For example, in Ch1, they achieved monotonous work, which provided them with a sense of "arousal" as a reward.

Try applying the same techniques for any single multiple to other chapters, and you will experience approximately six instances of "arousal" (welcome to the nineteenth addicts disease club!)

Soon, you will find yourself scrutinizing your own posts, timestamps, street addresses, and everything around you.

Similarly, apply any parameter, whether it be verses, words, or combinations thereof, and you will encounter 6236/19 instances of "arousal"!

Just answer to my question that's more than sufficient.. Why arabic letters in 29 chapters and that too different letters 1 to 5 ... Just answer..no need any instructions from you... Keep it simple.. And answer.. If you don't have an answer.. It doesn't matter..

shukri

See this link
http//www.masjidtucson.org/publications/books/bp2/BeyondProbability_TheKey_AlFatehah.pdf?
Here the miracle-19 plays it vital role in this challenge
Can any human produce the surah like this?
If they can, just prove it!
And we will be their witnesses in the hereafter

I would like to see if anybody here willing to accept the challenge
Just produce your own surah with seven verses
And list down the in-built code 19 as been done by "Masjid Tucson"
And then give detail explanation for every fact you found one by one
The explanation is vital to avoid any junk code based on random permutation

Al-Fatihah means "the Opener" or "the Key"
Thus the challenge is to make a new opener or new key of the Quran
For the doubters of the Quran divinity and the mockers of miracle 19
Please accept the challenge!

Talk the talk is a waste of time
And it goes nowhere!

224 If you cannot do this and you can never do this then beware of the Hellfire, whose fuel is people and rocks; it awaits the disbelievers.

Glory be to God
Lord of the worlds!

Thank you.

Nom_de_plume

Code 19 in the opening statement of the Quran (the Basmalah ... بِسمِ اللَّهِ الرَّحمٰنِ الرَّحيمِ)
Coincidence or divine design?

no code 19 no coincidence no design it consistently fails for other verses in same chapter
it’s simply flipping through different iterations searching for multiples which is really dumb

Just answer to my question that's more than sufficient.. Why arabic letters in 29 chapters...

29 is not 19 is it?
initials (under study) not separate verses until 100s of years later suspect are abbreviations.

Again — what did 7431 mean to those believers at time of revelation and 1400 years after?

Lastly, I kindly request that you consider focusing your attention on one topic at a time and exhibit a willingness to independently acquire knowledge, rather than relying solely on others to provide information. It is considered polite to respond to questions posed to you instead of evading them. Furthermore, it would be advantageous for effective communication if you refrain from spamming threads and make an effort to utilize proper grammar, such as utilizing tools like OpenAI to assist you. Thank you for taking these suggestions into account.

I would like to see if anybody here willing to accept the challenge
Just produce your own surah with seven verses
And list down the in-built code 19 as been done by "Masjid Tucson"

Again — no 19 code they posted junk inconsistent with other chapters flipping numbers deceiving cowards hiding 18/19 of all failures only showing 1/19 predictable multiples to beguile those ignorant and themselves which works with any text and with any number (this is easy to understand simply try it for yourself and learn).

One popular form of Arabic poetry is the "Qasida," which typically consists of multiple stanzas, each containing a specific number of verses. While the number of verses in a Qasida can vary, it is not uncommon to find Qasidas with seven verses. These shorter Qasidas are known as "Qasida Sab'a" or "Qasida Munsariha."
Here is an example of a Qasida Sab'a

‎يا من له عطائه وفاءٌ مجملاً
‎يا من قلبه بالوصل لي على حرٍّ
‎يا من له تواضع الأنبياء لمجده
‎يا من له أنوارُ الأرض والسما أنفسٍ

‎إنما عفوه في الأرض عادةٌ لمجده
‎وعفوه في السما تجده بالمغفّرةِ

‎يا ليت من ينصف المظلومين من القتلة
‎يا ليت من ينتقم للمظلومِ مِن أعدٍّ

Translation
O one whose generosity is complete,
O one who grants me closeness in times of hardship,
O one whose majesty humbled even the prophets,
O one whose light resides within every soul on earth and in the heavens,
Indeed, His forgiveness on earth is customary to His glory, And His forgiveness in the heavens is found in His pardoning,
If only there were someone to seek justice for the oppressed from the killers,
If only there were someone to avenge the wronged from their enemies.

Arabic poem with 7 verses is attributed to the poet Ibn al-Qarih, and it goes as follows

‎أَمَّا الْوَرْدُ فَالْمُغْرِيَّةُ فِيهِ
‎وَأَمَّا الثُّوَى فَالْهَيَامُ فِيهِ
‎وَأَمَّا الزَّهْرُ فَالْجَمَالُ فِيهِ
‎وَأَمَّا الْوَصْلُ فَالسَّعَادَةُ فِيهِ
‎وَأَمَّا الرَّقِيقُ فَالْحَنَانُ فِيهِ
‎وَأَمَّا الْهَمَّ فَالصَّبْرُ فِيهِ
‎وَأَمَّا الدَّهْرُ فَالزَّوَالُ فِيهِ

Transliteration
Ammā al-wardu fal-mughriyyatu fīhi
Wa ammā ath-thūwā fal-hayāmu fīhi
Wa ammā az-zahru fal-jamālu fīhi
Wa ammā al-waṣlu fal-sa'ādatu fīhi
Wa ammā ar-raqiqu fal-ḥanānu fīhi
Wa ammā al-hamma fal-ṣabru fīhi
Wa ammā ad-dahru fal-zawālu fīhi

Translation
As for the rose, allure lies within it
And as for the aroma, it's in its vigor
And as for the flower, beauty lies within it
And as for connection, happiness lies within it
And as for tenderness, it's in affection
And as for worries, patience lies within them
And as for time, its passing lies within it

letters 19 19 19 21 20 18 19 = 135 total
words 7 verses x 4 words = 28 total
abjad value of poem = 5687 total

190 iterations ~10 multiples, 1900 ~100 multiples
Go start flipping thousands of ways (hide failures!)

ch, verse sequence
1 1234567 = 19 x 591,213

words, total
4444444 28 = 19 x 23391812

letters, words
135 28 = 19 x 172

ch, total words, letters
1 28 19 19 19 21 20 18 19 = 19 x 674,694,311,642,201

ch, verses, words, abjad total
1 7 28 5687 = 19 x 909,773

5687 28 7 1 = 19 x 2,993,309

I’ll leave numerous others as an exercise feel free to continue uncovering additional "facts."

Peace!

shukri

Arabic poem with 7 verses is attributed to the poet Ibn al-Qarih, and it goes as follows

‎أَمَّا الْوَرْدُ فَالْمُغْرِيَّةُ فِيهِ
‎وَأَمَّا الثُّوَى فَالْهَيَامُ فِيهِ
‎وَأَمَّا الزَّهْرُ فَالْجَمَالُ فِيهِ
وَأَمَّا الْوَصْلُ فَالسَّعَادَةُ فِيهِ
‎وَأَمَّا الرَّقِيقُ فَالْحَنَانُ فِيهِ
‎وَأَمَّا الْهَمَّ فَالصَّبْرُ فِيهِ
‎وَأَمَّا الدَّهْرُ فَالزَّوَالُ فِيهِ

Translation
As for the rose, allure lies within it
And as for the aroma, it's in its vigor
And as for the flower, beauty lies within it
And as for connection, happiness lies within it
And as for tenderness, it's in affection
And as for worries, patience lies within them
And as for time, its passing lies within it

letters 19 19 19 21 20 18 19 = 135 total
words 7 verses x 4 words = 28 total
abjad value of poem = 5687 total

190 iterations ~10 multiples, 1900 ~100 multiples
Go start flipping thousands of ways (hide failures!)

ch, verse sequence
1 1234567 = 19 x 591,213

words, total
4444444 28 = 19 x 23391812

letters, words
135 28 = 19 x 172

ch, total words, letters
1 28 19 19 19 21 20 18 19 = 19 x 674,694,311,642,201

ch, verses, words, abjad total
1 7 28 5687 = 19 x 909,773

5687 28 7 1 = 19 x 2,993,309

I’ll leave numerous others as an exercise feel free to continue uncovering additional "facts."

ch, verse sequence
1 1234567 = 19 x 591,213
Every chapter with seven verses will share this code ... nothing special on that!

And know we use the number of letters in each verse
1 19 19 19 21 20 18 19 = 19 x 6273259010622.05 (fail)

We insert the gematrical value of each verse next to the number of letters
1 19 1744 19 857 19 571 21 551 20 804 18 622 19 538 =
19 x 62723378872208269555326739045379975.68 (fail)

AND we insert the verse number before number of letters and gematrical value
1 1 19 1744 2 19 857 3 19 571 4 21 551 5 20 804 6 18 622 7 19 538 =
19 x 589039169466174714285344816884453611722080.94 (fail)

Over a dozen facts of the pattern n = 1 1 * 2 * 3 * 4 * 5 * 6 * 7 * in surah Al-Fatihah given by "Masjid Tucson".
And the calculation of the "probability" is done mainly on this pattern!

Try again!
Thank you.

jkhan

@NDP

Yes.. 29 is not 19 ..19 is not 10 and 10 is not 7...

Isn't it so easy to keep these letters on top of 19 chapters? Lol.. You are funny.. Isn't it so easy to select 19 letters for this purpose.. But God does what He does. So be patient.. Truth is the one that prevails, though falsehood is spread everywhere...
If a person has DNA and currency has its features to be called genuine then God's book will definitely have His signature...
No time to waste with pretenders.. There is lot a believer can do for fellow believers using the precious time...

Quran is not just a book just coz we say it is from God, it won't become from God.. But book itself will prove it is the book from God.. Wait patiently.. But even the truth is exposed pretenders won't believe... So good luck in your journey...

shukri

Bro Nom,
Look at surah Al-Fatihah below

11 In the name of God, the Almighty, the Merciful (بِسمِ اللَّهِ الرَّحمٰنِ الرَّحيمِ - basmallah)
12 Praise be to God, Lord of the worlds.
13 The Almighty, the Merciful.
14 Sovereign of the Day of Judgment.
15 You alone we serve, and You alone we seek for help.
16 Guide us to the straight path.
17 The path of those You have graced, not of those who have incurred

You see the "basmallah" in this surah is designated as 11 viz. verse one
And has been designed with its own built-in code 19
https//www.masjidtucson.org/publications/books/bp/bp.pdf?

Thus, anyone who wants to produce miracle surah like al-Fatihah also needs to design an opener verse comparable to built-in code 19 of verse 11 (basmallah)! Now the task becomes more difficult and more challenging!

Btw, thanks for your effort to prove something!
Be patient and good luck!

224 If you cannot do this and you can never do this then beware of the Hellfire, whose fuel is people and rocks; it awaits the disbelievers.

Thank you.

Note
In my #Reply 43, the phrase "And know we use the number of letters in each verse" should be read as "And now we use the number of letters in each verse".

Sorry for any inconvenience!

jkhan

Bro Nom,
Look at surah Al-Fatihah below

11 In the name of God, the Almighty, the Merciful (بِسمِ اللَّهِ الرَّحمٰنِ الرَّحيمِ - basmallah)
12 Praise be to God, Lord of the worlds.
13 The Almighty, the Merciful.
14 Sovereign of the Day of Judgment.
15 You alone we serve, and You alone we seek for help.
16 Guide us to the straight path.
17 The path of those You have graced, not of those who have incurred

You see the "basmallah" in this surah is designated as 11 viz. verse one
And has been designed with its own built-in code 19
https//www.masjidtucson.org/publications/books/bp/bp.pdf?

Thus, anyone who wants to produce miracle surah like al-Fatihah also needs to design an opener verse comparable to built-in code 19 of verse 11 (basmallah)! Now the task becomes more difficult and more challenging!

Btw, thanks for your effort to prove something!
Be patient and good luck!

224 If you cannot do this and you can never do this then beware of the Hellfire, whose fuel is people and rocks; it awaits the disbelievers.

Thank you.

Note
In my #Reply 43, the phrase "And know we use the number of letters in each verse" should be read as "And now we use the number of letters in each verse".

Sorry for any inconvenience!

Brother Shukri..
Time one spends on anything is worthy if it really meaningful... So don't waste time on pretenders...

Just ask him whether he believes in entire Quran first of all.. I am 100 % sure he is not .. Many a threads of his as NDP and as NWQ is proof for that... Let him reply that he believes in entire Quran... Even he replies Yes.. It is a pretention.. So.. Just relax and use your valuable time in which it has worth...

Note... One thing I realized in my life with Quran is... By going after pretenders to respond them we don't learn anything.. But search to answer true questions of believers raised with right intent then you will learn a lot with true guidance from God... There are a lot that we don't know in Quran to learn, so apply your time on it.. I know it is your life and your freedom to do what you like, but as believer and all believers are brothers I suggest you.. Just avoid.

He doesn't believe in entire Quran, he doubts... So why talk about numeric pattern to a person who in the first place not even accepted Quran in its entirety.. What matters for him symmetry thereafter?
If a son doesn't respect father at all, what benefit informing him that your father is passed away come and show final respect...lol... No use of numerics for those who don't believe in Quran in the first place.

Thank you...

shukri

Brother Shukri..
Time one spends on anything is worthy if it really meaningful... So don't waste time on pretenders...

Just ask him whether he believes in entire Quran first of all.. I am 100 % sure he is not .. Many a threads of his as NDP and as NWQ is proof for that... Let him reply that he believes in entire Quran... Even he replies Yes.. It is a pretention.. So.. Just relax and use your valuable time in which it has worth...

Your suggestion is greatly appreciated sun
Thanks.

good_logic

Peace All.

Who is GOD addressing here? Those who received GOD s scripture including Qoran are also included, why not?

Those who received the scripture rejoice in what was revealed to you; some others may reject parts of it. Say, "I am simply enjoined to serve/follow/ubud God, and never associate any idols with Him. I invite to Him, and to Him is my ultimate destiny."
وَالَّذينَ ءاتَينٰهُمُ الكِتٰبَ يَفرَحونَ بِما أُنزِلَ إِلَيكَ وَمِنَ الأَحزابِ مَن يُنكِرُ بَعضَهُ قُل إِنَّما أُمِرتُ أَن أَعبُدَ اللَّهَ وَلا أُشرِكَ بِهِ إِلَيهِ أَدعوا وَإِلَيهِ مَـٔابِ

GOD is talking to the generations after Mohammed here as included are all those who received scripture before and Qoran. The messenger here cannot be Mohammed!!!

We revealed these laws in Arabic- locked mathematically with a specific code to preserve it-, and if you ever acquiesce to their wishes, after this knowledge has come to you, you will have no ally, nor a protector, against God.
وَكَذٰلِكَ أَنزَلنٰهُ حُكمًا عَرَبِيًّا وَلَئِنِ اتَّبَعتَ أَهواءَهُم بَعدَما جاءَكَ مِنَ العِلمِ ما لَكَ مِنَ اللَّهِ مِن وَلِىٍّ وَلا واقٍ
We have sent messengers before you, and we made them husbands with wives and children. No messenger can produce a miracle without God's authorization, and in accordance with a specific, predetermined time.
وَلَقَد أَرسَلنا رُسُلًا مِن قَبلِكَ وَجَعَلنا لَهُم أَزوٰجًا وَذُرِّيَّةً وَما كانَ لِرَسولٍ أَن يَأتِىَ بِـٔايَةٍ إِلّا بِإِذنِ اللَّهِ لِكُلِّ أَجَلٍ كِتابٌ
God erases whatever He wills, and fixes. With Him is the original Master Record.
يَمحُوا اللَّهُ ما يَشاءُ وَيُثبِتُ وَعِندَهُ أُمُّ الكِتٰبِ

Or what is being fixed here?

Whether we show you what we promise them, or terminate your life before that, your sole mission is to deliver (the message). It is us who will call them to account.
وَإِن ما نُرِيَنَّكَ بَعضَ الَّذى نَعِدُهُم أَو نَتَوَفَّيَنَّكَ فَإِنَّما عَلَيكَ البَلٰغُ وَعَلَينَا الحِسابُ
Do they not see that every day on earth, brings them closer to the end, and that God decides their life span, irrevocably? He is the most efficient Reckoner.
أَوَلَم يَرَوا أَنّا نَأتِى الأَرضَ نَنقُصُها مِن أَطرافِها وَاللَّهُ يَحكُمُ لا مُعَقِّبَ لِحُكمِهِ وَهُوَ سَريعُ الحِسابِ
Others before them have schemed, but to God belongs the ultimate scheming. He knows what everyone is doing. The disbelievers will find out who the ultimate winners are.
وَقَد مَكَرَ الَّذينَ مِن قَبلِهِم فَلِلَّهِ المَكرُ جَميعًا يَعلَمُ ما تَكسِبُ كُلُّ نَفسٍ وَسَيَعلَمُ الكُفّٰرُ لِمَن عُقبَى الدّارِ
Those who disbelieved will say, "You are not a messenger!" Say, "God suffices as a witness between me and you, and those who possess knowledge of the scripture."
وَيَقولُ الَّذينَ كَفَروا لَستَ مُرسَلًا قُل كَفىٰ بِاللَّهِ شَهيدًا بَينى وَبَينَكُم وَمَن عِندَهُ عِلمُ الكِتٰبِ

Yes Qoran testifies to this . GOD sending a messenger to unveil the mathematical composition of His last scripture.
GOD bless you all.
Peace.

Nom_de_plume

ch, verse sequence
1 1234567 = 19 x 591,213
Every chapter with seven verses will share this code ... nothing special on that!

same like 1 3 2 4 3 6 4 6 or any 3 4 6 6 letter words ... nothing special about that!

And know we use the number of letters in each verse
1 19 19 19 21 20 18 19 = 19 x 6273259010622.05 (fail)

they tried letters only first ch (failed!) then tried adding 1 and freaked out!
how many other chapters have the same exact pattern? how many failures?

Over a dozen facts of the pattern n = 1 1 * 2 * 3 * 4 * 5 * 6 * 7 * in surah Al-Fatihah given by "Masjid Tucson".
And the calculation of the "probability" is done mainly on this pattern!

flipping digits and freaking out! did I not say to try it? there are thousands!

eg with only a few totals; forget individual letter values would fill the forum with multiples.

‎أَمَّا الْوَرْدُ فَالْمُغْرِيَّةُ فِيهِ
‎وَأَمَّا الثُّوَى فَالْهَيَامُ فِيهِ
‎وَأَمَّا الزَّهْرُ فَالْجَمَالُ فِيهِ
وَأَمَّا الْوَصْلُ فَالسَّعَادَةُ فِيهِ
‎وَأَمَّا الرَّقِيقُ فَالْحَنَانُ فِيهِ
‎وَأَمَّا الْهَمَّ فَالصَّبْرُ فِيهِ
‎وَأَمَّا الدَّهْرُ فَالزَّوَالُ فِيهِ

Translation
As for the rose, allure lies within it
And as for the aroma, it's in its vigor
And as for the flower, beauty lies within it
And as for connection, happiness lies within it
And as for tenderness, it's in affection
And as for worries, patience lies within them
And as for time, its passing lies within it

letters 19 19 19 21 20 18 19 = 135 total
words 7 verses x 4 words = 28 total
abjad value of poem = 5687 total

v lt w w1 gv1 w2 gv2 w3 gv3 w4 gv4 tot
1 19 4 1 42 2 241 3 1366 4 95 1744
2 19 4 1 48 2 547 3 167 4 95 857
3 19 4 1 48 2 243 3 185 4 95 571
4 21 4 1 48 2 157 3 251 4 95 551
5 20 4 1 48 2 441 3 220 4 95 804
6 18 4 1 48 2 76 3 403 4 95 622
7 19 4 1 48 2 240 3 155 4 95 538

28 135 28 7 330 14 1945 21 2747 28 665 5687

1 1 42 2 241 3 1366 4 95 4 19 1744
2 1 48 2 547 3 167 4 95 4 19 857
3 1 48 2 243 3 185 4 95 4 19 571
4 1 48 2 157 3 251 4 95 4 21 551
5 1 48 2 441 3 220 4 95 4 20 804
6 1 48 2 76 3 403 4 95 4 18 622
7 1 48 2 240 3 155 4 95 4 19 538 = 19 x

1
1 1 42 2 241 3 1366 4 95 1744 4 19
2 1 48 2 547 3 167 4 95 857 4 19
3 1 48 2 243 3 185 4 95 571 4 19
4 1 48 2 157 3 251 4 95 551 4 21
5 1 48 2 441 3 220 4 95 804 4 20
6 1 48 2 76 3 403 4 95 622 4 18
7 1 48 2 240 3 155 4 95 538 4 19 = 19 x

1
1 1744 1 42 2 241 3 1366 4 95 4 19
2 857 1 48 2 547 3 167 4 95 4 19
3 571 1 48 2 243 3 185 4 95 4 19
4 551 1 48 2 157 3 251 4 95 4 21
5 804 1 48 2 441 3 220 4 95 4 20
6 622 1 48 2 76 3 403 4 95 4 18
7 538 1 48 2 240 3 155 4 95 4 19 = 19 x

1
1 1 42 2 241 3 1366 4 95 1744 19 4
2 1 48 2 547 3 167 4 95 857 19 4
3 1 48 2 243 3 185 4 95 571 19 4
4 1 48 2 157 3 251 4 95 551 21 4
5 1 48 2 441 3 220 4 95 804 20 4
6 1 48 2 76 3 403 4 95 622 18 4
7 1 48 2 240 3 155 4 95 538 19 4
28 7 330 14 1945 21 2747 28 665 5687 135 28 = 19 x

1
1 42 2 241 3 1366 4 95 4 19 1744 1
1 48 2 547 3 167 4 95 4 19 857 2
1 48 2 243 3 185 4 95 4 19 571 3
1 48 2 157 3 251 4 95 4 21 551 4
1 48 2 441 3 220 4 95 4 20 804 5
1 48 2 76 3 403 4 95 4 18 622 6
1 48 2 240 3 155 4 95 4 19 538 7 = 19 x

1
1 42 2 241 3 1366 4 95 1744 1 4 19
1 48 2 547 3 167 4 95 857 2 4 19
1 48 2 243 3 185 4 95 571 3 4 19
1 48 2 157 3 251 4 95 551 4 4 21
1 48 2 441 3 220 4 95 804 5 4 20
1 48 2 76 3 403 4 95 622 6 4 18
1 48 2 240 3 155 4 95 538 7 4 19 = 19 x

1 42 2 241 3 1366 4 95 1744 19 1 4
1 48 2 547 3 167 4 95 857 19 2 4
1 48 2 243 3 185 4 95 571 19 3 4
1 48 2 157 3 251 4 95 551 21 4 4
1 48 2 441 3 220 4 95 804 20 5 4
1 48 2 76 3 403 4 95 622 18 6 4
1 48 2 240 3 155 4 95 538 19 7 4
7 330 14 1945 21 2747 28 665 5687 135 28 28 = 19 x

1
1 42 2 241 3 1366 4 95 4 19 1744 1
1 48 2 547 3 167 4 95 4 19 857 2
1 48 2 243 3 185 4 95 4 19 571 3
1 48 2 157 3 251 4 95 4 21 551 4
1 48 2 441 3 220 4 95 4 20 804 5
1 48 2 76 3 403 4 95 4 18 622 6
1 48 2 240 3 155 4 95 4 19 538 7
7 330 14 1945 21 2747 28 665 28 135 5687 28 = 19 x

19 4 1 42 2 241 3 1366 4 95 1 1744
19 4 1 48 2 547 3 167 4 95 2 857
19 4 1 48 2 243 3 185 4 95 3 571
21 4 1 48 2 157 3 251 4 95 4 551
20 4 1 48 2 441 3 220 4 95 5 804
18 4 1 48 2 76 3 403 4 95 6 622
19 4 1 48 2 240 3 155 4 95 7 538
135 28 7 330 14 1945 21 2747 28 665 28 5687 = 19 x

4 1 42 2 241 3 1366 4 95
4 1 48 2 547 3 167 4 95
4 1 48 2 243 3 185 4 95
4 1 48 2 157 3 251 4 95
4 1 48 2 441 3 220 4 95
4 1 48 2 76 3 403 4 95
4 1 48 2 240 3 155 4 95
28 7 330 14 1945 21 2747 28 665 = 19 x

4 1 1744 19 1 42 2 241 3 1366 4 95
4 2 857 19 1 48 2 547 3 167 4 95
4 3 571 19 1 48 2 243 3 185 4 95
4 4 551 21 1 48 2 157 3 251 4 95
4 5 804 20 1 48 2 441 3 220 4 95
4 6 622 18 1 48 2 76 3 403 4 95
4 7 538 19 1 48 2 240 3 155 4 95 = 19 x

1
4 1 1 42 2 241 3 1366 4 95 1744 19
4 2 1 48 2 547 3 167 4 95 857 19
4 3 1 48 2 243 3 185 4 95 571 19
4 4 1 48 2 157 3 251 4 95 551 21
4 5 1 48 2 441 3 220 4 95 804 20
4 6 1 48 2 76 3 403 4 95 622 18
4 7 1 48 2 240 3 155 4 95 538 19 = 19 x

1
4 1 1744 1 42 2 241 3 1366 4 95 19
4 2 857 1 48 2 547 3 167 4 95 19
4 3 571 1 48 2 243 3 185 4 95 19
4 4 551 1 48 2 157 3 251 4 95 21
4 5 804 1 48 2 441 3 220 4 95 20
4 6 622 1 48 2 76 3 403 4 95 18
4 7 538 1 48 2 240 3 155 4 95 19 = 19 x

1
4 1744 1 42 2 241 3 1366 4 95 1 19
4 857 1 48 2 547 3 167 4 95 2 19
4 571 1 48 2 243 3 185 4 95 3 19
4 551 1 48 2 157 3 251 4 95 4 21
4 804 1 48 2 441 3 220 4 95 5 20
4 622 1 48 2 76 3 403 4 95 6 18
4 538 1 48 2 240 3 155 4 95 7 19 = 19 x

1
4 1 42 2 241 3 1366 4 95 1744 1 19
4 1 48 2 547 3 167 4 95 857 2 19
4 1 48 2 243 3 185 4 95 571 3 19
4 1 48 2 157 3 251 4 95 551 4 21
4 1 48 2 441 3 220 4 95 804 5 20
4 1 48 2 76 3 403 4 95 622 6 18
4 1 48 2 240 3 155 4 95 538 7 19 = 19 x

1
4 19 1 42 2 241 3 1366 4 95 1 1744
4 19 1 48 2 547 3 167 4 95 2 857
4 19 1 48 2 243 3 185 4 95 3 571
4 21 1 48 2 157 3 251 4 95 4 551
4 20 1 48 2 441 3 220 4 95 5 804
4 18 1 48 2 76 3 403 4 95 6 622
4 19 1 48 2 240 3 155 4 95 7 538
28 135 7 330 14 1945 21 2747 28 665 28 5687 = 19 x

1
4 1 19 1744 1 42 2 241 3 1366 4 95
4 2 19 857 1 48 2 547 3 167 4 95
4 3 19 571 1 48 2 243 3 185 4 95
4 4 21 551 1 48 2 157 3 251 4 95
4 5 20 804 1 48 2 441 3 220 4 95
4 6 18 622 1 48 2 76 3 403 4 95
4 7 19 538 1 48 2 240 3 155 4 95
28 28 135 5687 7 330 14 1945 21 2747 28 665 = 19 x

4 1744 1 19 1 42 2 241 3 1366 4 95
4 857 2 19 1 48 2 547 3 167 4 95
4 571 3 19 1 48 2 243 3 185 4 95
4 551 4 21 1 48 2 157 3 251 4 95
4 804 5 20 1 48 2 441 3 220 4 95
4 622 6 18 1 48 2 76 3 403 4 95
4 538 7 19 1 48 2 240 3 155 4 95
28 5687 28 135 7 330 14 1945 21 2747 28 665 = 19 x

1
1744 19 4 1 1 42 2 241 3 1366 4 95
857 19 4 2 1 48 2 547 3 167 4 95
571 19 4 3 1 48 2 243 3 185 4 95
551 21 4 4 1 48 2 157 3 251 4 95
804 20 4 5 1 48 2 441 3 220 4 95
622 18 4 6 1 48 2 76 3 403 4 95
538 19 4 7 1 48 2 240 3 155 4 95 = 19 x

1
1744 1 42 2 241 3 1366 4 95 1 4 19
857 1 48 2 547 3 167 4 95 2 4 19
571 1 48 2 243 3 185 4 95 3 4 19
551 1 48 2 157 3 251 4 95 4 4 21
804 1 48 2 441 3 220 4 95 5 4 20
622 1 48 2 76 3 403 4 95 6 4 18
538 1 48 2 240 3 155 4 95 7 4 19 = 19 x

1 135 7 14 21 28 28 28 = 19 x
1 135 5687 7 14 21 28 28 28 = 19 x
1 28 28 135 = 19 x
1 28 28 330 1945 2747 665 135 = 19 x
1 5687 330 1945 2747 665 28 135 = 19 x
1 330 1945 2747 665 5687 135 = 19 x
1 28 135 5687 = 19 x
1 28 5687 28 135 = 19 x
1 5687 28 330 1945 2747 665 28 135 = 19 x
1 28 135 28 330 1945 2747 665 = 19 x
1 28 5687 28 330 1945 2747 665 135 = 19 x
1 28 5687 135 28 330 1945 2747 665 = 19 x
1 5687 7 330 14 1945 21 2747 28 665 28 28 = 19 x
1 135 28 5687 7 330 14 1945 21 2747 28 665 28 = 19 x
1 28 28 135 7 330 14 1945 21 2747 28 665 5687 = 19 x

7 14 21 28 5687 135 = 19 x
7 330 14 1945 21 2747 28 665 5687 = 19 x
7 14 21 28 28 1 5687 135 = 19 x
7 14 21 28 28 5687 1 28 135 = 19 x
7 14 21 28 28 5687 28 135 1 = 19 x
7 14 21 28 1 5687 28 28 135 = 19 x
7 14 21 28 135 1 5687 = 19 x
7 330 14 1945 21 2747 28 665 5687 1 28 28 135 = 19 x
7 330 14 1945 21 2747 28 665 5687 135 28 = 19 x
7 330 14 1945 21 2747 28 665 28 1 135 = 19 x
7 330 14 1945 21 2747 28 665 1 28 28 = 19 x
7 330 14 1945 21 2747 28 665 5687 135 1 28 = 19 x
7 330 14 1945 21 2747 28 665 28 135 5687 1 28 = 19 x
7 330 14 1945 21 2747 28 665 28 135 5687 28 = 19 x

28 5687 135 = 19 x
28 28 1 5687 330 1945 2747 665 135 = 19 x
28 5687 330 1945 2747 665 135 = 19 x
28 28 5687 7 14 21 28 = 19 x
28 1 28 5687 135 330 1945 2747 665 = 19 x
28 135 330 1945 2747 665 5687 1 = 19 x
28 330 1945 2747 665 135 5687 1 28 = 19 x
28 330 1945 2747 665 1 135 = 19 x
28 7 14 21 28 28 1 135 5687 = 19 x
28 28 1 5687 135 = 19 x
28 135 1 5687 = 19 x
28 330 1945 2747 665 135 5687 28 = 19 x
28 1 135 330 1945 2747 665 28 5687 = 19 x
28 1 7 14 21 28 135 28 5687 = 19 x
28 28 135 5687 330 1945 2747 665 1 = 19 x
28 135 5687 1 28 7 14 21 28 = 19 x
28 28 135 330 1945 2747 665 = 19 x
28 135 330 1945 2747 665 28 1 5687 = 19 x
28 5687 1 330 1945 2747 665 28 135 = 19 x
28 135 1 28 330 1945 2747 665 = 19 x
28 1 135 28 7 14 21 28 = 19 x
28 135 28 7 14 21 28 1 5687 = 19 x
28 1 28 7 330 14 1945 21 2747 28 665 = 19 x
28 135 28 7 330 14 1945 21 2747 28 665 = 19 x
28 7 330 14 1945 21 2747 28 665 135 1 28 5687 = 19 x
28 7 330 14 1945 21 2747 28 665 135 28 1 = 19 x
28 7 330 14 1945 21 2747 28 665 5687 28 = 19 x
28 7 330 14 1945 21 2747 28 665 5687 1 28 = 19 x
28 1 135 7 330 14 1945 21 2747 28 665 28 5687 = 19 x
28 135 5687 28 1 7 330 14 1945 21 2747 28 665 = 19 x
28 1 135 5687 28 7 330 14 1945 21 2747 28 665 = 19 x
28 5687 28 1 7 330 14 1945 21 2747 28 665 135 = 19 x
28 28 135 5687 7 330 14 1945 21 2747 28 665 1 = 19 x

135 1 28 = 19 x
135 28 = 19 x
135 28 330 1945 2747 665 5687 1 28 = 19 x
135 28 5687 1 330 1945 2747 665 = 19 x
135 28 330 1945 2747 665 5687 28 = 19 x
135 5687 28 330 1945 2747 665 = 19 x
135 5687 1 28 28 = 19 x
135 1 28 330 1945 2747 665 5687 28 = 19 x
135 28 5687 330 1945 2747 665 28 1 = 19 x
135 1 5687 28 330 1945 2747 665 = 19 x
135 5687 7 14 21 28 28 1 = 19 x
135 28 7 330 14 1945 21 2747 28 665 5687 = 19 x
135 1 28 7 330 14 1945 21 2747 28 665 5687 = 19 x

330 1945 2747 665 28 5687 28 = 19 x
330 1945 2747 665 28 5687 1 28 = 19 x
330 1945 2747 665 5687 1 28 135 28 = 19 x
330 1945 2747 665 135 28 1 = 19 x
330 1945 2747 665 5687 28 135 28 = 19 x
330 1945 2747 665 5687 28 135 1 28 = 19 x
330 1945 2747 665 5687 28 = 19 x
330 1945 2747 665 1 28 135 28 5687 = 19 x
330 1945 2747 665 135 28 28 5687 = 19 x
330 1945 2747 665 28 135 1 28 5687 = 19 x
330 1945 2747 665 135 1 28 5687 = 19 x
330 1945 2747 665 1 5687 28 28 = 19 x
330 1945 2747 665 135 28 5687 28 1 = 19 x
330 1945 2747 665 1 135 28 28 = 19 x
330 1945 2747 665 5687 1 28 = 19 x
330 1945 2747 665 28 135 28 1 = 19 x

5687 135 1 = 19 x
5687 330 1945 2747 665 28 1 135 28 = 19 x
5687 1 330 1945 2747 665 135 28 = 19 x
5687 1 330 1945 2747 665 = 19 x
5687 135 28 7 14 21 28 28 1 = 19 x
5687 7 14 21 28 1 135 = 19 x
5687 28 1 7 14 21 28 135 = 19 x
5687 135 330 1945 2747 665 1 28 28 = 19 x
5687 135 7 14 21 28 1 = 19 x
5687 135 28 28 330 1945 2747 665 = 19 x
5687 28 1 28 7 14 21 28 = 19 x
5687 330 1945 2747 665 28 1 = 19 x
5687 1 28 28 135 7 14 21 28 = 19 x
5687 7 330 14 1945 21 2747 28 665 28 135 = 19 x
5687 135 7 330 14 1945 21 2747 28 665 28 1 = 19 x
5687 7 330 14 1945 21 2747 28 665 135 1 28 28 = 19 x
5687 1 135 7 330 14 1945 21 2747 28 665 28 28 = 19 x
5687 1 28 135 7 330 14 1945 21 2747 28 665 = 19 x
5687 28 28 1 7 330 14 1945 21 2747 28 665 = 19 x
5687 28 135 1 7 330 14 1945 21 2747 28 665 = 19 x