24:41
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peace be upon you all,
Something came to me about this sign today, so I thought I'd post some notes
Do you not see that Allah is He, Whom do glorify* all those who are in the heavens/skies and the earth? And the birds with wings outspread, each one knows its SLW and its glorification*. And Allah is Knower of what they do.
Notes
*root Siin-Ba-Ha, you must read discussion of this root here.
2441 is discussing 'birds' in plural.
SLW core meaning of go/turn towards in a positive/close manner . Note, in 2441 it is not "aqeemu/establish al-SLW", this implies what came before is a representation/example of SLW AND a representation/example of SBH.Now, having said that, some questions came to mind how do we know about our SLW? How could birds know about their SLW? When birds fly with their wings extended/outspread/straight, what does this act say to you? When do they do this?
Then this got me thinking about how do birds know which direction to go in when they migrate? Allow me to quote from this site
Homing - Little is known about how birds navigate. Experiments show that most migratory birds have a built-in sense of direction and know innately which direction they need to travel. First year Starlings in Europe kept in a covered cage and away from birds which have already migrated once or more, still move to the correct side of the cage when the time comes for them to migrate.
Clearly, they have received their instruction, have we received ours?
Feedback appreciated.
Wakas
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Salaamun alaikum Wakas,
One very vital clue in my opinion, is the fact that kullun alima salatuhu could apply to each BIRD, as opposed to birds knowing thier salaat and tasbeeh collectively. This to me, shows the dynamic each bird employs in flight relative to one another as well as knowing how to fly with minimal effort.
Another interesting point is that the verse ends with 'Allahu alima bimaa yaf'aloon'. Why is 'feel' used at the end, instead of amal or anything else? In my opinion, because one's salaat and tasbeeh collectively add up to one's constant habitual action, or 'feel'. Another interesting place where 'feel' appears in 23/4 where it says 'li-AZ-ZAKAATI FA'ILOON'. 35/18, remember?
And not only is it not 'aqeemu salaat', its also not 'aqeemu AS-SALAAT'. As-salaat, as obviously you know, is something specific referrred to throughout the text.
good discussion, shukran.
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Peace Mquran and Wakas,
Just a thought I have had recently.
Based on your knowledge of the arabic text surrouding and describing slw, how do you guys feel about slw meaning "instruction"...either referring to instruction/direction in sense of which we are used to as well an innate instruction/direction of which we may or may not be aware?
I'm getting ready to see how this all fits into the verses, but thought I would run this idea off of you arabic "experts" too.
peace.
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peace,
The migration is an extension on the sign on my part, but with or without it, I still arrived at a similar understanding.
When birds fly with their wings extended/outspread/straight, what does this act say to you?
I dont want to give my thoughts before hearing answers from others. Anyone?
mq - 3518 is interesting isn't it. The sign ends with "wa-ila Allahi al maseeru" - "and to God is the journey's end / homecoming" Is there anything that can be likened to a journey/homecoming in the context?
salikah - I'm actually quite poor at Arabic, its just I have good resources. Funnily enough, yesterday, I was thinking how al-slw can be likened to the active walking/undertaking of "al ssirata al mustaqeema". It is the process of walking/undertaking, going/turning towards, following closely, walk/follow behind closely of such a path/instruction.
Since we know the truth (or direction if you will) can be found in the horizons and within ourselves , there is no need for us to limit where the truth comes from, i.e. it could be innate like you said (what i call the 'internal compass') or from the external world, including signs within and outwith al-quran. It all points to the same thing.There is no doubt that if one took slw as "instruction" its not just any instruction, its always in a close/positive manner, it has a certain direction. This can be seen throughout al-quran and also the Classical Arabic meanings. I believe thats why Ayman thinks its "learning connection" due to slw inherently containing information/direction/instruction.
Wakas
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Peace be upon you all,
You all are getting me back to the meditation understanding.
It involves the stilling of the thoughts (our earth born conditionings) in order to "hear" the God within.
So salaat would be recieiving the "instruction/learning connection" WITHIN while zakaa would be purifying the outer.
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Peace be upon you MQ, WAKAS, and all,
MQ
Why is 'feel' used at the end, instead of amal or anything else? In my opinion, because one's salaat and tasbeeh collectively add up to one's constant habitual action, or 'feel'. Another interesting place where 'feel' appears in 23/4 where it says 'li-AZ-ZAKAATI FA'ILOON'. 35/18, remember?
Please elaborate for me. Can you translate the verses and add teh word "feel" where you are stating it is located.
Wakas
When birds fly with their wings extended/outspread/straight, what does this act say to you? When do they do this?The thought that comes to me is that they are relying on the WIND/AIR to carry them. Wind/AIR is closely linked to RUH(divine energy). BUt thats as far as I can get right now. Looking foward to more excellent analysis.
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Salam all,
Excellent thread Wakas!
The following is for you Kyle
FM
234. And they are active towards bettermentShabir
234 They are the setters up of the Just Economic Order of ZAKAT (in which wealth circulates in the society and nourishes every individual).Waallatheena hum lilzzakati faAAiloona
Clearly, birds have received their instruction, have we received ours?
We received our salat from the God, His Angels (forces of control, divine inspiration) and His messengers
- O you who believe, you shall remember God frequently.
- And glorify Him morning and evening.
- He is the One who reaches out (yusallee) to you, along with His Angels, to lead you out of darkness into the light. And He is ever Merciful towards the believers.
Like birds, the goal of salat is to follow the straight/right direction during our life.
- Take from their money a charity to purify them and develop them with it, and reach out (salli) to them. Your reaching out (salataka) is a tranquility for them; and God is Hearer, Knowledgeable.
One cannot be from almusalleen (7443) or can be inattentive from his salat
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They said We were not of those who reached out (almusalleena).
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And we did not feed the poor person.
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And we used to participate with those who spoke falsehood.
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And we used to deny the Day of Judgment.
7447.Until the certainty came to us. -
So woe to those who reach out (musalleena).
1075.But are totally heedless of their salat. -
They only want to be seen.
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And they deter from helping others.
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Clearly, they have received their instruction, have we received ours?
Salaam Wakas
Good point you raised here, our instruction must be the Reading.
Peace...
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peace All,
When birds fly with their wings extended/outspread/straight, what does this act say to you?
The thought that comes to me is that they are relying on the WIND/AIR to carry them.
Exactly. They are using what they have to work WITH God's laws, in order to acheive their goal of flight.
This to me, is a representation of slw for us. Similarly, it can also be a representation of sbh.
Wakas
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Peace be upon you Wakas,
Kyle wrote
The thought that comes to me is that they are relying on the WIND/AIR to carry them.Exactly. They are using what they have to work WITH God's laws, in order to acheive their goal of flight.
This to me, is a representation of slw for us. Similarly, it can also be a representation of sbh.
yay I won!!
Seriously, I am following your reasoning, I think Ican add to it, but I need more time.
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Clearly, they have received their instruction, have we received ours?
I was pondering this question, and the Ayah.
Birds follow their instinct, as all animals do. Perhaps instinct is the language that God has given to the animals to follow. Humans use words, thoughts, feelings to honor/worship/glorify God. This is our language.
Yet for us to really hear God we have to go within , to the heart. We have to make the other distractions go away. That is done in meditation, and I think of salat as a form of meditation. We remove ourself form the thoughts of earthly things, silent our mind and heart and turn within and go before God.
Now just as each type of animal has its own "instinct to follow", for example birds fly and hunt worms, fish swim, etc. So each human , or groups of humans ( religions) , have thier own type of salat they follow.
So what is salat?
Is it a set of certain words and movements, people of a certain religion do? Or is it deeper then that, is it more primal?
Is it something we can only grasp when we get beyond the material
level ?Animals do not have to get beyond their mind, as they do not have free will, they like all other creations, just do what they were created to do.
this is a very interesting topic, that I need to think more about.
Peace
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Peace be upon you silentsalaam,
Exactly my thoughts! D
Still have to work this all out but I really think this is the answer.
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Peace to All
brother wakas, great post btw, and will try to find how it can be related to other verses from the Quran
just a small note brother mquran "Fa'iloon" does not mean Feel at all,
it means "to action it"
F'el is the verb "To do" and is one of the basics in arabic and there is only one meaning to it which is To Do any Action
peace
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I know the following verse which decribe the birds being arranged in straight lines "like rows", would that mean it is theor arrangement while praying as humans do?, Allah knows best
"Do they not observe the birds above them, spreading their wings and folding them in? None can uphold them except (Allah) Most Gracious Truly (Allah) Most Gracious Truly it is He that watches over all things. "
(19)
Please note, Yusuf Ali commited a mistake in his translation as always, he forgot to translate the Arabic word " ", which is describing the birds as flying in rows "Saffat"
Peace
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Peace,
I usually see birds fly in triangles.
^
/ \Joe
That is right and if you look at this tringle you will see that it consist from two lines
in fact the best word to translate "SAFFAT" should be lines
the point is they form an arrangment in lines as we do in our salat
peace
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peace,
please see the following thread for discussion on translating 2441 and 6719
http//www.free-minds.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1179
6719 is discussing wings outspread & their contracting, i.e. both parts of flapping their wings to fly.
Thank you brother
Yes I agree (Yakbodn) is to spread the wings to fly, my only point here is "Saffat" which menas lines, and that is my observation that possibly they are praying while making this formation, regardless of their wing status
peace and thanks for the link
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Selam brothers,
I wish I could give any input but I do not speak Arabic ops However, there is one thing I wanted to say about birds. One day as I returned from work I saw a swarm of crows flaying - we have a lot of them in my country lol . I stood there and observed for several minutes. I saw them flying in two, three, four and even more. The first would flap the wings for several times and then outspread them and then the other bird/s followed suit. I also saw them flaying together, all of them, a big swarm. But there was smth interesting... I saw one bird flying alone - flapping its wings and then outspreading them - among all the others this one was alone and latter another bird joined!!
I hope this helps a bit.
God knows betterMay He bless us all.
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Peace all,
another thought about birds
One sura says the birds know their salat. Always made me think of the times of days - fajr and ichaa - when birds gather and sing.
Great to see with swallows cause they fly together as well.
Before, this always made me wonder why the birds had only two salat... lol (this was when i still did 5!)
LK
