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  4. Was The Messenger Of The Qur'aan An Orphan?

Was The Messenger Of The Qur'aan An Orphan?

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    Grourself
    wrote on last edited by
    #1

    Was The Messenger Of The Qur'aan An Orphan?
    (A child left father and motherless)

    The book is the source of guidance for those who are trusting with The God.

    Ya-Ta-Ma-Yatim n. m. (pl. yataama) This word is used in the Qur'aan 23 times.

    Ya-ta-ma to become an orphan, become without father before puberty or maturity, become isolated, lonely, solitary, weary, jaded, become motherless (beast), become a widow.

    English Definition Orphan (noun)
    1 a child deprived by death of one or usually both parents
    2 a young animal that has lost its mother
    3 one (anyone) deprived of some protection or advantage
    transitive verb to cause to become orphaned

    When analyzing the Qur'aan the more correct meaning of yatim is

    Yatim = Solitary = Left alone in the society = the helpless.

    The primary English meaning of orphan is not suitable. However, the word orphan has a less frequently used meaning of one deprived of some protection or advantage. This meaning is the only one that consistently fits in every ayat where the verb ya-ta-ma appears. 4127 and 936 below prove this point.

    Wayastaftoonaka fee alnnisa-i quli Allahu yufteekum feehinna wama yutla AAalaykum fee alkitabi fee yatama alnnisa-i allatee la tu/toonahunna ma kutiba lahunna watarghaboona an tankihoohunna waalmustadAAafeena mina alwildani waan taqoomoo lilyatama bialqisti wama tafAAaloo min khayrin fa-inna Allaha kana bihi AAaleeman

    Literal And they ask for your opinion/clarification in the women, say "God decreed/clarifies in them, and what is read/recited on you in The Book in the women minors/orphans (yatama) that lose their father, those who you did not give them what was written/dictated to them, and you desire that you marry them, and the weakened from the children/new borns, and that you take care of to the orphans/minors that lose their father with the just/equitable; and what you make/do from goodness, so that God was/is with it knowledgeable."

    936 Alam yajidka yateeman faawa

    Literal Did He not find you solitary/lonely/helpless, so he sheltered (you)?

    The use of Ka and kum and huma in the verses below prove that the messenger was NOT an orphan in the conventional sense of the word. Here is the context

    1. La tajAAal maAAa Allahi ilahan akhara fataqAAuda mathmooman makhthoolan

    Literal Do not make/put with God another god, so you sit/remain blamed/lowly abandoned/deserted.

    1723 Waqada rabbuka alla taAAbudoo illa iyyahu wabialwalidayni ihsanan imma yablughanna AAindaka alkibara ahaduhuma aw kilahuma fala taqul lahuma offin wala tanharhuma waqul lahuma qawlan kareeman

    Literal And YOUR Lord passed judgment/ordered that you not serve except (only) Him, and with the parents/father and mother a goodness if the old age reaches one of them or both of them at/by/near you ,so do not say to them "Ugh !" And do not deprive/yell at them, and say to them a gracious/kind saying/word.

    (See also Your Lord 933) Ma waddaAAaka rabbuka wama qala Your Lord has not forsaken thee,

    1724 Waikhfid lahuma janaha alththulli mina alrrahmati waqul rabbi irhamhuma kama rabbayanee sagheeran

    Literal And be lenient/comforting/lower to them the humility's/humbleness's wing/side from the mercy (be kind), and say "My Lord have mercy upon them as THEY brought me up young."

    1725 Rabbukum aAAlamu bima fee nufoosikum in takoonoo saliheena fa-innahu kana lil-awwabeena ghafooran

    Literal Your Lord (is) more knowledgeable with what (is) in your selves, if you be correct/righteous, so that He truly is to the repentant a forgiving. (Your Lord 6152)

    The addressee of 17 23 is the messenger. It is referring to his parents, 1724, both of them. 1725 is addressing the people, plural.

    I also note by the use of imma in 1723 that the messenger is not given knowledge of the future here in his personal life.

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      progod
      wrote on last edited by
      #2

      God bless all,

      I agree that Muhammad, the messenger of the Koran was not an orphan.
      1723 points to this and the context is obviously that of an orphan. The work done of the Q dictionary shows that the yateeman can also mean lonely giving it meaning that does not contradict with the previous verse. Thank you for enlightening us. Even I was not aware of this meaning.

      Godbless,
      Anwar

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        unknownuser
        wrote on last edited by
        #3

        Peace

        If his father died before he was born as well his mother died when he was 6 years old, therefore, at least Mohammad was an orphan from the age of 6, don't you guys agree?

        therefore the verse about Allah helping Mohammad when he was orphaned may be talking about the period when he was 6 years old up to marrying Khadija i guess

        peace

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          el-Aziz
          wrote on last edited by
          #4

          God bless all,
          I agree that Muhammad, the messenger of the Koran...

          It has no way been established that there was a person by the name of Muhammad who authored the Koran.

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            truth
            wrote on last edited by
            #5

            Peace,

            Thank you for this excellent insight.

            The factuality of orphan stories in relation to the messenger are based upon nothing but conjecture. One must keep in mind that even the so called 'sira' stories are fairly blank about the messenger's early life and have to resort to such fabrications as 'clouds always shaded him' and that 'his chest was opened up by two angels and his heart was washed' type of nonsense.

            So I do not place any trust in the alleged histories. I think that instead of cold hard fact, later story writers created these histories based on snippets from the reading and their own understanding of the verses.

            The orphan story almost certainly is based on 936...

            Did He not find you an orphan and He sheltered you?

            Alam yajidka yateeman faawa

            And this is where grourself's insight comes in. In this verse it is more likely that the messenger had become isolated and alienated due to his position following the way of straightness.

            So the translation is more like...

            Did He not find you alienated and He sheltered you?

            Alam yajidka yateeman faawa

            All messengers are alienated/estranged by their communities. Their words fall on firstly ridiculing, then hostile and finally deaf ears. It is their trust in the God and thereby His support that brings them through.

            Regards.

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              unknownuser
              wrote on last edited by
              #6

              Hello

              1724 is directed at any believer IT IS NOT DIRECTED TO MOHAMMAD, this is obvious from 1714

              Also brothers and sistera, "Yatim" means orphan, it never meant isolated, this is another case of clear cut manipulation

              Mohammad was not isolated, he was supported by his very well respected grand father then another very well respected Quraishi leader "His uncle" then at 25 he was very well supported by his very rich wife, then by many strong Qurashii people, like Hamza, Abu Bakr and Omar

              i wonder why those muslims promote this non sense

              possibly they want to look smart?

              i guess this is the only motive

              Peace to all

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                truth
                wrote on last edited by
                #7

                If his father died... mother died...

                ...don't you guys agree?

                may be talking about...

                ... i guess

                Quite alot of 'ifs', 'may be's, 'i guess'es, and questions there. Do you still not see that it's irrelevant and based only on conjecture.

                Peace.

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                  unknownuser
                  wrote on last edited by
                  #8

                  Haha nice try

                  I'm asking , If someone whom his mother and father died is an orohan or not?

                  obvioulsy for someone like you who wants to manipulate the clear meaning of orphan to be isolated must not agree

                  all you ideas Oben are rediculous and have no merit neither any sense but clear cut conjectures

                  Regards

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                    truth
                    wrote on last edited by
                    #9

                    Haha nice try

                    I'm asking , If someone whom his mother and father died is an orohan or not?

                    If you examine your words above, you'll see that your statement is not about "someone" or 'anyone'. It's straight from the alleged siras of the messenger. You're swallowing the story and regurgitating it with plenty of doubtfulness and uncertainty.

                    Your uncertainty is well founded and the doubt is proper, because these alleged stories are fabrications based upon misunderstandings of the reading.

                    Here's another story for you by modern bearded 'scholars'...

                    THE PROPHECY IS FULFILLED
                    On Monday, 12th of Rabi-al-Awwal -- 570 years after Jesus ascended into heaven to await his return before the end of the world -- Lady Amina gave birth to her blessed son in the house of Abu Talib. Ash-Shaffa, the mother of Abd Al Rahman, attended his birth and as Lady Amina gave birth her blessed baby was delivered prostrating upon his tiny hands and knees, then sneezed and said, "Al Hamdulillah" -- praise be to Allah -- whereupon a voice from the heavens replied, "May Allah have mercy upon you."

                    http//www.islamic-paths.org/Home/English/Muhammad/Book/Millennium_Biography/Chapter_008.htm

                    So the baby was born prostrating and said "Al Hamdulillah" and a voice from heaven replied....

                    These nonsensical stories are fabricated and embellished by misguided so called scholars who seek to magnify an ordinary human being. But they also require misguided intellectually challenged people to accept and swallow the rubbish they create.

                    Enjoy the stories Ahmed.

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                      Grourself
                      wrote on last edited by
                      #10

                      Peace

                      Truth wrote

                      So the translation is more like...

                      Did He not find you alienated and He sheltered you?

                      Alam yajidka yateeman faawa

                      All messengers are alienated/estranged by their communities. Their words fall on firstly ridiculing, then hostile and finally deaf ears. It is their trust in the God and thereby His support that brings them through.

                      Excellent rendition backed up by the reading. This is an example of the God explaining the message, the book explains itself.

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                        truth
                        wrote on last edited by
                        #11

                        Just a few more points in relation to the misconception of the messenger being an orphan.

                        These stories all rely upon the "sira" of a so called "Ibn Ishaq" who has been discredited by two other alleged scholars "Malik" and "Hanbal". In this 'sira' a monk finds the boy "Muhammad"...

                        The answers Muhammad gave Buhairah convinced him ninety-nine percent that the young boy, in whose company he was, was none other than the one prophesied in the scriptures to become the last Prophet of Allah. However, one thing bothered him, Abu Talib had referred to Muhammad as being his son, and the scriptures stated quite clearly that the last prophet would be an orphan, so he inquired about Muhammad's parents and was told that indeed Muhammad was an orphan, and that Abu Talib was not his real father, rather, he was his paternal uncle. Now, Buhairah knew for certain that his dearest wish had been fulfilled and that he had been blessed to live long enough to meet the boy destined to be the last Prophet of Allah.

                        from http//www.islamic-paths.org/Home/English/Muhammad/Book/Millennium_Biography/Chapter_011.htm

                        There are therefore agendas underlying this. Yet I don't personally know of any prophecies of a "last prophet" in any "scriptures". Nevertheless, the reason that "Muhammad" is made an orphan is due to the requirements of this "sira" which is nothing more than the fabricated history of someone hundreds of years after the events. "Ibn Ishaq" is said to have lived about 100 years after the events he wrote about.

                        Much of the stories of "Muhammad's" early life are devotional glorifications of a human being and are entirely fabricated. The later stories contain many controversial events which again cannot be substantiated at all.

                        I found an interesting post which you may wish to peruse in relation to siras and their role in misguiding people http//forums.muslimvillage.net/index.php?showtopic=12725&mode=threaded&pid=170772

                        Also http//en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sira

                        Regards.

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                          unknownuser
                          wrote on last edited by
                          #12

                          Haha nice try

                          I'm asking , If someone whom his mother and father died is an orohan or not?

                          If you examine your words above, you'll see that your statement is not about "someone" or 'anyone'. It's straight from the alleged siras of the messenger. You're swallowing the story and regurgitating it with plenty of doubtfulness and uncertainty.

                          WRONG AGAIN

                          it is from the Quran Oben

                          Your uncertainty is well founded and the doubt is proper, because these alleged stories are fabrications based upon misunderstandings of the reading.

                          Ahmed is laughing again and saying

                          who are you to tell the arabs that they understand arabic wrong?

                          Here's another story for you by modern bearded 'scholars'...

                          THE PROPHECY IS FULFILLED
                          On Monday, 12th of Rabi-al-Awwal -- 570 years after Jesus ascended into heaven to await his return before the end of the world -- Lady Amina gave birth to her blessed son in the house of Abu Talib. Ash-Shaffa, the mother of Abd Al Rahman, attended his birth and as Lady Amina gave birth her blessed baby was delivered prostrating upon his tiny hands and knees, then sneezed and said, "Al Hamdulillah" -- praise be to Allah -- whereupon a voice from the heavens replied, "May Allah have mercy upon you."

                          and the point is?

                          So the baby was born prostrating and said "Al Hamdulillah" and a voice from heaven replied....

                          and the point is?

                          These nonsensical stories are fabricated and embellished by misguided so called scholars who seek to magnify an ordinary human being. But they also require misguided intellectually challenged people to accept and swallow the rubbish they create.

                          I don't give a fluke about what you just said because I'm basing in on the Qiuran that Allah said Mohammad was an orphan

                          that is

                          Oo Ar Pe Itch Aa and In

                          Enjoy the stories Ahmed.

                          Thank you bro

                          Best Regards

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                            unknownuser
                            wrote on last edited by
                            #13

                            From pbs.org

                            575 Muhammad Becomes an Orphan

                            When Muhammad was five or six his mother took him to Yathrib, an oasis town a few hundred miles north of Mecca, to stay with relatives and visit his father's grave there. On the return journey, Amina took ill and died. She was buried in the village of Abwa on the Mecca-Medina Road. Halima, his nurse, returned to Mecca with the orphaned boy and placed him in the protection of his paternal grandfather, Abdul Al-Muttalib. In this man's care, Muhammad learned the rudiments of statecraft. Mecca was Arabia's most important pilgrimage center and Abdul Al-Muttalib its most respected leader. He controlled important pilgrimage concessions and frequently presided over Mecca's Council of Elders.

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                              truth
                              wrote on last edited by
                              #14

                              Haha nice try

                              I'm asking , If someone whom his mother and father died is an orohan or not?

                              If you examine your words above, you'll see that your statement is not about "someone" or 'anyone'. It's straight from the alleged siras of the messenger. You're swallowing the story and regurgitating it with plenty of doubtfulness and uncertainty.

                              WRONG AGAIN

                              it is from the Quran Oben

                              Ahmed, you are proving yourself to be a liar. Did you not write...

                              If his father died before he was born as well his mother died when he was 6 years old, therefore, at least Mohammad was an orphan from the age of 6, don't you guys agree?

                              therefore the verse about Allah helping Mohammad when he was orphaned may be talking about the period when he was 6 years old up to marrying Khadija i guess

                              which I commented on above?

                              Show me where in the "Quran" you got the information that his "father died before he was born" and his "mother died when he 6 years old" and was "an orphan from the age of 6"'; also tell us where he married "Khadija".

                              Peace.

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                              • U Offline
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                                unknownuser
                                wrote on last edited by
                                #15

                                Haha nice try

                                I'm asking , If someone whom his mother and father died is an orohan or not?

                                If you examine your words above, you'll see that your statement is not about "someone" or 'anyone'. It's straight from the alleged siras of the messenger. You're swallowing the story and regurgitating it with plenty of doubtfulness and uncertainty.

                                WRONG AGAIN

                                it is from the Quran Oben

                                Ahmed, you are proving yourself to be a liar. Did you not write...

                                If his father died before he was born as well his mother died when he was 6 years old, therefore, at least Mohammad was an orphan from the age of 6, don't you guys agree?

                                therefore the verse about Allah helping Mohammad when he was orphaned may be talking about the period when he was 6 years old up to marrying Khadija i guess

                                which I commented on above?

                                Show me where in the "Quran" you got the information that his "father died before he was born" and his "mother died when he 6 years old" and was "an orphan from the age of 6"'; also tell us where he married "Khadija".

                                Peace.

                                You are the confused liar here, I said he was an orphan because of the history reacords AND ALLAH CONFIRMED THAT HISTORY RECORD IN THE QURAN

                                that is why I will take the hisory records AS TRUE, and that is why you want to manipulate the compelling evidence in the Quran regarding the word Yatim

                                now I was blooody asking if some one lost his father would that be an orphan or not

                                answer the damn question before you accuse me of being lieing

                                you are the confused one here who abused Dhul Qarnin when he sugggested Pork is halal, and you are coming doing the same exact stupid thing by promoting lies, non sense and crap

                                one of your blunders is making alcohol allowed, exactly as Dhul Qarnin did, who you want fool?

                                certainly not me and I will always keep an eye on the non sense you post

                                please answer that question that you ran from it

                                how many letters the the root of the word Ankaboot have?

                                4 or 5

                                and state them please

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                                  unknownuser
                                  wrote on last edited by
                                  #16

                                  Oben,

                                  another one of your blunders is suggesting to make salat naked

                                  lol lol lol lol

                                  another one is suggesting that other verses than 9128 & 9129 been added to the Quran

                                  lol lol lol lol

                                  you are so funny mate, but that is not an intended fun btw, that is a result of the ignornace you have

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                                    truth
                                    wrote on last edited by
                                    #17

                                    You are the confused liar here, I said he was an orphan because of the history reacords AND ALLAH CONFIRMED THAT HISTORY RECORD IN THE QURAN

                                    that is why I will take the hisory records AS TRUE, and that is why you want to manipulate the compelling evidence in the Quran regarding the word Yatim

                                    now I was blooody asking if some one lost his father would that be an orphan or not

                                    answer the damn question before you accuse me of being lieing

                                    you are the confused one here who abused Dhul Qarnin when he sugggested Pork is halal, and you are coming doing the same exact stupid thing by promoting lies, non sense and crap

                                    one of your blunders is making alcohol allowed, exactly as Dhul Qarnin did, who you want fool?

                                    certainly not me and I will always keep an eye on the non sense you post

                                    please answer that question that you ran from it

                                    how many letters the the root of the word Ankaboot have?

                                    4 or 5

                                    and state them please

                                    Peace.

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                                      unknownuser
                                      wrote on last edited by
                                      #18

                                      Peace oben

                                      take care,

                                      PS i was not shouting though lol

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                                        unknownuser
                                        wrote on last edited by
                                        #19

                                        Peace be upon you Ahmed and Truth,

                                        As a moderator I state

                                        Truth, please refrain from calling others Liars.

                                        Ahmed Control yourself. Being called a Liar does not give you the green light to call people ignorant, stupid, etc etc. Your conduct continues to exceed the limits. Consider yourself warned.

                                        Thank you Truth for ending the Argument in the peaceful manner.

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                                          unknownuser
                                          wrote on last edited by
                                          #20

                                          Peace be upon you Ahmed and Truth,

                                          As a moderator I state

                                          Truth, please refrain from calling others Liars.

                                          Ahmed Control yourself. Being called a Liar does not give you the green light to call people ignorant, stupid, etc etc. Your conduct continues to exceed the limits. Consider yourself warned.

                                          Thank you Truth for ending the Argument in the peaceful manner.

                                          Bro I ws not offedned of being called a liar but I just reserved my right to responde and I used that right

                                          I like truth, at least he keeps my mind working, he is also a country man, no hard feelings man lol

                                          i also like you too

                                          peace

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