Reincarnation
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Good morning to you too, Ahmed,
cheers taj
and that is why you need a professor hey, because that professor is a human who is from the humans who invented Tashkil, LOL
Since you are so above the tashkil and you don't need it in order to read the Quran correctly, to differentiate between the similarly written words, let me then ask you about this veeery simple Arabic word '' from the root Ba-Ya'-Nun. Can you tell me how many ways this word can be pronounced, and what every pronunciation mean? And also I would like you to write each pronunciation in Arabic and in English so that those who don't know Arabic can see the difference. Thank you.
I?m sooooorry bro, I?m not sitting an Arabic language test in here, I respond using the Quran according to the questions raised regarding the Quran, I don?t have time to waste with this type of silly questions
But if you put the question in conjunction with a Quran verse, I may look at it
can you gurantee to me first that the tashkil in the Quran as it is now has no errors?
Since you believe that there are errors in tashkil Al Quran then, please, bring out those errors!
wrong answer
my question was like this
can you guarantee to me first that the tashkil in the Quran as it is now has no errors?
This is a simple YES/NO answer, not to blabber that I believe that there is errors, I didn?t say there is errors as I don?t really know because I have not qualified the tashkil in it neither I?m interested to do as such, it is not like I will sit and count multiple of 19 LOL
But what I?m sure about is this
- the tashkil is man made and was added to the Quran
- there is a possibility of mistakes in any man made thingy, like the hadith and the bible exactly
with Allah, there is no time limit, he can use the past to indicate future, don't you know that?
Are you comparing us with Allah!?
What sort of question is that?
What in my comment made you think as such non sense?
But if we talk Rahmah ?Mercy? yes I can compare Allah with humans regarding the subject of Rahmah, and I will end up saying ?Allah is Arham Al Rahmeen?, in fact Mohammad was classified as Rahim in the Quran
And of course, Allah can use past tense to indicate the future.
that is the answer I was expecting
Did you see me or anybody else here say anything, let alone object, about that!? roll
I don?t know, I didn?t have my web cam on to see you or see anyone else.
Who is objecting exactly?
how about the people who died before mohammad then, are they included in that verse "You are Mayyit and they are Mayytoon"?
The Quran was a revelation to Muhammad. The ayah means "Death is written on you (Muhammad) and on them"
fine, I accept that interpretation, and ?them? are the ones who already dead as well in addition to the present and future ones
You ask about the people who died before Muhammad. What about those people!? Of course death was written on them too! What is your point?
what is your point using this verse?,
yes I know that death is written on everyone, what a heck of confusion you are making exactly?
I can see your non confidence indeed, you are dodging to tell us how do you think that the Quran approves reincarnation, just cut it short and we will see if you have a point
I want to know if you think that the people who died before Mohammad are dead and their souls are held somewhere until the JD or do you think the souls of those dead people are reincarnated in other humans?
Please cut it short taj and explain the Quran verses you think it support your incarnation.
Was there a Quran revealed to the people before the time of Prophet Muhammad (pbuh)? Can you answer that?
there was no Quran then, but there was Zaboor, Injil, and Torah, possibly many other messages sent that we don?t know of and was not told about in the Quran
Now let me ask you, where my answer of this silly question will take you exactly?, what are you building on? LOL
the flaw is evident because you are trying to use a noun to express a timed verb )
A timed verb!!!??? Another new rule of your invetion roll
yeh that is right I invented the followings
- Past tense
- Present Tense
- Future Tense
Mayyit is not even a noun. Mayyit is an ADJECTIVE = SSIFAH Dying/death is written on it/him/them.
Haha
Yokhrig Al Mayyit Min Al Hai
Haha again indeed, look again above and you will see that this is a name not an adjective, and sure in the verse Inak Mayyit, the word is also a noun and is called ?Khabar Ina? in that verse, this is something that is hard for you indeed to comprehend.
But I agree that it can be an adjective
You need some serious Arabic lessons, I can do it free for you LOL
At least, I concluded what level you have in the Arabic language if you have any, thanks for letting me know
Please don?t think that Arabic is as easy as English or Spanish
Do yo think there are not in the Quran any ayat with the word 'Mayt'?
of course it is mentioned many times and I think it will refute you too becaus you will see that in these verses it does not mean already deadSince you know that there are ayat in the Quran containing the word 'Mayt', Show us that you know the difference, that 'Mayt' is not 'Mayyit' and bring those ayat!
I guess that was an assumption by you ?that I avoided it?, LOL, you like conjectures, don?t you?, but let me tell you that was the wrong conjecture
Look mister Taj, I don?t dodge or fear anyone on this planet,
I was refuting your false claim about Mayyit , that is why I brought the verses that included the same exact words with the same tashkil to expose your fatal mistake.
Now, it is my turn assume, why didn?t you bring these verses with the same tashkil first to support your argument?
why then YOU AVOIDED them?
let me ask you the same question
why then YOU AVOIDED the two verses I posted when you brought in ?Inak Mayyit verse??
Show us that you know the difference, that 'Mayt' is not 'Mayyit' and bring those ayat!
Haha
I?m not saying they are different, where you got this from?
Come on taj, don?t loose concentration, I said all the way that they mean the same and the tashkil has no effect on their meanings, they are one word, not two, look at the letters and compare again
You may have some rest first taj, your comments sound very tired, after the rest then compare the letters again and tell me if they look the same
if you think that using Tashkil which is nothing but sort of vowls in english is a strong evidence to prove your incarnation over the tens of crystal clear and direct verses others and myself posted that deny it, then fine go for it
OMG! You wrote "Which is nothing but sort of vowels in English"!!! So vowels are no big deal to you!!! roll Try to speak or write one English word without a vowel!
wow, you think back to front for sure, but I will excuse you due to my lack of English
what I meant mister, that it is nothing IN ARABIC because they are not letters, I didn?t mean they are nothing in English because I understand that vowels in English ARE BLOODY REAL LETTERS UNLIKE ARABIC
this discussion is really boring and I?m going to knock it of soon if you insist on this BS instead of discussing the Quran
please don?t waste my time brother taj, try to find a reincarnation advocate and get together in the chat chat
The ayat that you brought in your previous posts do not deny the possibility of reincarnation. As a matter of fact the Ayat + speak about the position of AL KUFFAR who believe that it is just ONE MOWTAH = ONE DEATH EXPERIENCE.
that is logically right, it is one taste of death, this is the only death that humans will feel ?Taste?, despite Allah told us about two death and two lifes, we only taste one death and 4456 confirmed that.
That ONE DEATH EXPERIENCE is just GRANTED ONLY to AL MUTTAQEEN but not to DENIERS.
Nor will they there taste Death, except the first death; and He will preserve them from the Penalty of the Blazing Fire, -
Yep, that is right, IT IS ONLY ONE TASTE OF DEATH FOR ALL OF US, the other death is a metaphor
This verse actually refute the satanic reincarnation concept, because it confirms resurrection on the JD after that only one taste of death.
I don't know why you are so happy with your denial when deniel is only the postion of Al KUFFAR! They insist that it is only one death
what a manipulation that was, it is you that are in denial by injecting non sense to Allah clear message and in the way misleading hundreds, I?m sure you will be held responsible by Allah in the JD for this non sense you are trying to promote using His words after twisting and manipulating it very bad indeed while you lack the language from the first place
"There is nothing beyond our first death, and we shall not be raised again."
That is right, they are denying the resurrection mister smart, a child who is a true believer will understand this verse with ease
"Except our first death, and that we shall not be punished"
I guess you didn?t read ? we shall not be punished?, LOL
See they are denying the resurrection
My respect to you and your intelligence just went down the drain, and it is time to knock it off
C u and enjoy your next lives when you will be reincarnated many times
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Peace Ahmed, Taj, all,
First of all, brother Ahmed, sister Taj is a she not a he and she already tried telling you that.
Also, I am a sister, in case you have forgotten. Salam
Can you kindly address her as sister or sis, and not bro or mister ?
I am joining this discussion not to take any sides but to find the truth. My current understanding is that there is no reincarnation, meaning another life on this current earth. I do however believe in resurrection, meaning other life not on the current earth but somewhere else.
Having said that, I believe that eventually we will have a total of two resurrections, and thus a total of three lives.
The first life was before our current life, and that life was not on the current earth but somewhere else. Before that first life, we were nothing. So first we were created, then our first life began, not on earth but somewhere else. Then we died and were resurrected on this earth, so our current life is the second life. Then we will die again and will be resurrected again somewhere else, other than the current earth, when we will be rewarded or punished for our deeds, and that will be our third and final life. There will be no death after that.
The evidence from al-qur'aan supporting this is the following
228 How can you reject God when you were dead and He brought you to life? Then He makes you die, then He brings you to life, then to Him you return.
The word "maut" is derived from the root "mat". According to Dictionary of the Holy Quran by Abdul Mannan Omar
MAATA To die, die away (fire), be burn out, become still (wind)
As you will notice, the meanings of "maata" imply a pre-existing stage. "To die" implies that it was "alive" before. "Die away (fire)" implies that the fire was burning or present before. "Become still (wind)" implies that the wind was moving before.
One has to be alive to die. Life does not imply a preceding death, but death implies a preceding life.
The words used in 228 are "wakuntum amwatan" and "thumma yumeetukum", both forms of the same word derived from the same root. So they cannot have different meaning. So it cannot mean "when you were NON-EXISTENT/NOTHING" in the first part and "then He makes you DIE" in the second part. Both parts mean death.
"Wakuntum amwatan" meaning "when you were dead" automatically implies that one was alive before. Allah could easily have said "you were nothing" in 228 but He does not say that. The arabic would be "wa-lam yaku shay-an" as in the following ayat
1968 Does man not remember that We created him before that and he was nothing (wa-lam yaku shay-an) at all ?
The God could easily have used the same words in 228, but He did not.
So putting 228 and 1968 together, the stages are as follows
Creation of mankind ---> first life (before this earthly life) ---> first death (wakuntum amwatan) ----> second life (on earth) ---> second death (thumma yumeetukum) ---> third life (hereafter) ---> return to Him.
So there are 3 lives and two deaths according to 228
One can be brought to life THEN return to Him (The God). There is no "death" in between these two last stages.
4011 They will Say "Our Lord, You have made us die twice, and You have brought us back to life twice. Now we have confessed our sins. Is there any way out of this path?"
The word used is "amattana" which is a form of the same word "maut" derived from the same root as in 228, and means "made us die". The people will remember everything when they are brought to life in the hereafter and they will remember 2 deaths and then being brought back to life twice, i.e. after each death. "Is there any way out of this path" means there will be no further deaths or lives.
Having said that, there is still no contradiction between 228 and 4011. 4011 also implies 3 lives and 2 deaths. "You have made us die twice" automatically implies that they were alive before each death. "You have brought us back to life twice" implies that they were brought back to life after each death. So combining the two parts implies 3 lives and 2 deaths.
Please note that 4011 is a statement being made by the people on the judgment day, and Allah is just quoting the statement made by people. It is possible by the people to make an imprecise statement. However 4011 still implies 3 lives and 2 deaths. The people mention two deaths, which automatically IMPLIES 3 lives. Then they talk ONLY about the two times they were BROUGHT BACK to life AFTER the two deaths, not the TOTAL number of lives. The first life after our creation was NOT BRINGING US BACK to life. Bringing back to life can happen only after death.
2 lives would imply only one death
Life ---> death ---> life
1------------------------2However both 228 and 4011 clearly tell us about 2 deaths, therefore implying 3 total lives
Life ---> death ---> life ---> death ---> life
1-----------------------2-----------------------3We will eventually have a total of not 2 lives but 3 lives, and a total of 2 deaths.
7172 And your Lord took for the children of Adam from their backs, their progeny; and He made them witness over themselves "Am I not your Lord?" They said "Yes, we bear witness." Thus you cannot say on the Day of Resurrection that you were unaware of this.
All mankind was made to bear witness by Allah in our first life that He is our Lord and we all agreed. That must have happened in our previous life elsewhere, not on this earth. This conversation between Allah and children of Adam took place in the life preceding the earthly life.
Now it would seem that the following verses talk about one death only
3759 "Except for our first death, and we will not be punished?"
4435 "There is nothing but our first death; and we will never be resurrected!"Firstly, The word "first" automatically implies more deaths. If there was only one death then the verses would have said "death" only and not "first death".
Secondly, both verses are quotation of statement made by people while they were on earth, and people can make mistakes and what they said while being on earth might not be the absolute truth. While they were on earth, the people did not remember their ACTUAL FIRST DEATH preceding the life on earth, so they mistakenly think that the death after their life on earth is their first death and that is why they are addressing their death after their life on earth as their first death.
Now I can see that brother Ahmed will pounce on me here, and will have a "surprise" for me by quoting 4456
4456 They do not taste death therein except for the first death, and He has spared them the retribution of Hell.
One might think that 4456 implies that there is no death after the "first death", so there is only one death. However 228 and 4011 clearly mention two deaths, so is that a contradiction ? Brother Ahmed tries to resolve this by saying that the first death was just a metaphor but that cannot be true because 4011 says "you have made us die twice", so both deaths are referred to at the same time and therefore, the first death CANNOT be a metaphor.
This had me stumped for a while but then alhamdulillah I discovered what Allah is saying in 4456.
Let us take a closer look at this verse and the verses before and after
4455 They enjoy in it all kinds of fruits, in perfect peace.
4456 They do not taste death therein except for the first death, and He has spared them the retribution of Hell.
4457 As a blessing from your Lord. Such is the great triumph.As we can see that the context of these verses is heaven. In 4456 Allah is saying that the inhabitants of heaven will not taste death THEREIN (in heaven), except for the first death. So obviously He is talking about their death in heaven and not on earth. This solves the mystery where we were before our first death mentioned in 228 and 4011.
WE WERE IN HEAVEN BEFORE OUR FIRST DEATH !!! so we died while we were in heaven and then we were resurrected on earth. So we did die THEREIN (in heaven), and that was our first and only death in heaven, and 4456 is ONLY mentioning our death THEREIN (in heaven).
Mystery solved, no contradiction, and NO REINCARNATION.
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Peace Ahmed, Taj, all,
First of all, brother Ahmed, sister Taj is a she not a he and she already tried telling you that.
Also, I am a sister, in case you have forgotten. Salam
Can you kindly address her as sister or sis, and not bro or mister ?
Sorry, the name sounds male for me
but sure will address her as a she, i was not trying to insult her or somethin
salam
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Peace Hasan,
Thanks for the detailed reply. You've certainly provided some food for thought.
Those are the ones who squandered their own selves to abide in hell for a long time -ulaaekellezeena haseruu anfusahum fee cehenneme haaleduun (23103)
the word haaleduun may have a different meaning than eternal in terms of one?s stay in the hell because its dwellers will be transferrred to heaven after they pay for their past sins or if God pardons them.
I was not aware of this. Could you please quote the ayah in support of your position.
Hell will lie in wait (78 21), a goal for those who transgress the bounds of what is right (22). In it shall they remain for a long time ?ahkaaba (23).
According to Muhammed Asad the word ahkaab, that is, for a long time means not for ever because the term hukb or hikbah (of which ahkaab is the plural) denotes no more than a period of time (Jawharee). Hukb is simply years (As?s, Q?m?s, Lisan al-?Arab, etc); it is obvious that it signifies a limited period of time, not eternity.
As for those who bring wretchedness upon themselves, (they shall live) in the fire, where they will have (nothing but) moans and sobs (to relieve their pain) (116), therein to abide as long as the heavens and the earth endure ? unless thy Sustainer wills it otherwise (107)
God shall say "The fire will be your abode, therein to abide ?unless God wills it otherwise." (6 12
It is clear from 11107 and 6128 that the duration of suffering in hell will be limited by God?s mercy because scorching a sinner there eternally for the sins he has committed in his life time of say only 60 years is unjust. Requiting an evil should be only an evil like itself (42 40). Otherwise, it won?t be fair but evil in itself. Evil does not fit God.
He has willed upon Himself the law of mercy (612).
He says My mercy overspreads everything (7156)Peace,
Hasan Ak?ay -
Hello Hassan
But don't forget brother that it was stated as Ahqabaa, with your own words it is the plural of Huqb
therefore if Huqb means years, then the plural of it indicates a very long time indeed
Salam
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Peace be upon all of you,well....i do believe in reincarnation,just like many of you i used to think that reincarnation ment to come back sometimes as an animal,well....most people who are ignorant about that issue think like that,that belief of coming as an animal as originated in India,than later on the bouddhist took it too.Reincarnation is the oldest belief of humans through time,but eventually it did change it's original meaning,resurection is reincarnation but shaped in a way of people who are too materialistic to understand.Resurection of the body came from the grec than later on the christians developped it,because of theire belief that Jesus died and resurected on the third day.Well....i'm a medium if you ask me on what base do i hold on,to that belief,i will simply tell you on the justice of God.Now if you tell me that this life is short,than when you die some people will be burning in hell for eternity,now the question is why would God punishe us for eternity for such a short time of life???? they will be crying in hell for his mercy,than he will just let them burn and ignore them,now is that mercy to all of you????? Now in your book it is written that wathever good happens to man comes from God,wathever bad happens to man comes from his own hand.Now how would you explain to me,the fact that they are some rich and some poor people,a child who dies before attaining puberty and many more....does it make sense to all of you that God creates all this things because he feels like it???? than why would a person who commit suicide be thrown into hell,because of that action that he or she did to itself,after all he didn't choose this life so why should he be blame????? now in reincarnation God in his infinite mercy gives man many chances to progress(because progress is a natural divine law of God,while eternal punishment goes against that law),it is done for many reasons,since every soul has to progress in order to do that some come back on earth for a mission,some for expiation and some simply to learn a lesson(in the physical form).Now the reason why we forget our past life it's in order not to burden you to progress,because some past maybe to heavy for us,God gives us a chance to be us,but you don't loose everything,we still have the intuition,for every life it's a road to progress.But that does not mean that it is imposed,the soul chooses to come back or not knowing that it can still progress in the spiritual world,but the incarnation is a faster way to progress.They are other worlds lower than earth(when i say lower i mean in a moralistic way),in this worlds life are more harder,because the souls have not attain a high level of counsciousness like us(human),but it will innevitably progress.Mankind thinks that they are some inhabited planets,simply because there is no oxygene in them,well...if we did not visit the sea we would never know that they are actually livings creatures breathing another type of air.What i'm trying to say is that death does not exist only in the human words,but the body does,but YOU don't.Evil does not exist,because God does not create evil,but rather it only exist in the word of man(i'll explain myself,coldness does not exist,because it is only a lack of heat,but it only exists in human words to express they're feelings,same thing as evil it is only a lack of the mercy and the divine presence of God in us.).Mohammed himself was a medium,he received a revelation brought to him by Gabriel,in which in the human understanding he is an angel,but for me he is a higher spirit,now a medium can only decsribe to you in the way that he understands,because human language is insufficient sometimes to describe certain feelings,just like the pain of hell,it is describe to you in a way that you can understand,but it does not mean that it will happen like the way it is described in your book,nothing will be discribe to you in a way that is outside of your imagination.A prophet is usually a higher spirit who has accepted the mission given to him by God in order to teach and boost the undertanding of lower souls that have decided to incarnate themselves in the physical worlds,but because they come as human they will make some mistakes,and he did make some mistakes on some issues,or again i ask myself if it is not the understanding of what some man have made out of the quran,because a medium can only tell you something based on what he feels or what he understands from the revelations he gets,but he did make a good job.Now i can speak for hours i know that many people will not agree with what i'm saying,i am not here to convince but rather to share with you,what i know.one thing that we must know is that,it's not because so and so calls himself a christiam or a muslim or a jew......that they will attain the higher vibrations(you may call it paradise,as you want),but rather by the pureness of the heart,and how much good you do on earth.
http//www.spiritwrittings.com/kardecspiritsbook2chapt4.html#Reincarnation -
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Peace komla. Absolutely fantastic post. ! idea
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Peace Komla,
Indeed good post, and i agree with a lot of things, but i agree not with your understanding of reincarnation being the oldest understanding of humans. This is simply not true. It was an old greek philosophy that was spread and eventualy influenced Buddhism and Hinduism. Can you prove your claim by showing proofs of thinking found in ancient scriptures and thinking? And also have you read the latest understandings of reincarnation stories? I believe myself people can talk with conciousnesses that have moved back to the universe conciousness, or they can pick up the resonance of the deceased persons in the Quantum field. I keep an open mind about it..
Read my post and give your idea
http//www.free-minds.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=5417
Peace
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Peace be with all of you.....well brothers reincarnation has always existed trought time but unfortunately that belief has been changed just like many other religions.The gospel(the injil,like you call it),has been changed trought time but it contain some incredible passages about it,i don't know if any one of you has read it before,if not i suggest you to do it.Jesus(isa),spoked many time about reincarnation but only in parables,infact many of what he has said are still not understood until this days(the quran tells you that Jesus will be a sign for the hour if i'm not mistaken),in the injeel(the gospel),he speaks about the return of the prophet Elijah,through john the baptist(you call him Yahya,if i'm not mistaken),his disciples asked him how would they realise his return,but jesus simply told them he already came,but they did not recognise him.(let me explain this,it was rather the same soul,that habited the body of Elijah that came back again on earth in a mission to teach back human again),now like i've said resurection is a common belief to christians.By the way if all simply because of their belief that Jesus resurected again in a body on the third day.Now what people seem to misunderstand is the spiritual body,which we call the perisprit and the physical body,most people tend to mix this up(and i understand,because it's only a materialistic way of seeing things),but wen you will resurect,it's only to find again your real you in spirit,the body is nothing but a cover for you to feel the materialistic world,just like wen an astronote has to wear a special suit for him to go to space as well a swimmer has to wear a special suit for him to go to the water.Well....i'm maybe going out of subject,this was just to give an exemple.because if you go with logic,will it make sens to you to believe in a soul(to have that belief,is to actually believe in a spiritual world),but wen you tell me that resurection is in a physical form is to actually deny the spiritual world(and all your pain,your joy is only physical and nothing else and nothing more).Now for those who believe that reincarnation is also the fact to come back as an animal,well...first of all,i respect that belief because it shows you how to appreciate all the creations of God from a fly to a lion,and with that belief,those who carry that appreciate every life more than most people who claim to detain the whole truth......according to their religion.Now....there is no regression,again if God is so mercyful why would he put us in a state of high consciousness to a state of low consciousness,with that how can we learn from our mistakes,if you have done something wrong,well won't you need all your counsciousness to feel the guilt of your action???? and later on repent. Bthe way if all of you make your researches you will find out that the real christians used to believe in reincarnation,but everything changed after the coming of the popes and all those clergies,who changed that belief because it did not suit them,to make their story of jesus resurected in body credible they had to adapt that whole belief of resurection.
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Peace,
I have done research on this, i study it. I'm a theologist, and no you are wrong on this. Only a small group believed in this, the Essenens. And this was of their background, they were influenced by the Stoicins. So they took it with them into Christianity. The Nazarenes, the group that really belonged to Jesus, didn't believe in reincarnation. Also is the understanding of reincarnation from your point of view, a made-up dogma. Like true monotheism is found everywhere on earth, in all cultures the One true God, the All, is acknowledged by all cultures, even though most only focus on their made-up idols, also all believe in resurrection or passing on of their 'souls'. This is common with all cultures around the whole globe. So the true monotheism and belief in the next life is common and can be traced in all cultures. Reincarnation is only found with Buddism, Hinduism, Sikhism, some Christian sects and some other religious sects. And all of them are influenced by the same group of Greeks, the Stoicins.
Also in the old understandings of rebirths, it meant that the same kind of persons would be born on earth every time again and again, not the same souls, the kind of persons. Like the Buddha will be reborn again and again on this earth, not the same soul, the same obligation will be given to a new soul. So the same 'job' will be passed on again and again.Peace
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peace be with you...good you have done your research so did i,i've studied this as well,without forgeting i am born in a christian family,than if indeed you did study this than you would know also about a christian group called "Cathar" in the middle age,and i suppose you've also read the gospel,sice you've made your researches,in one of your post you asked me to show you in any scripture if reincarnation was indeed there,so all i did was to refer you to one of the passage so you can take it,and tell me for yourselve what you think about it.Now...i am not here to convince with my belief and say who is wrong and not,because this is what most people do in religion arguing,discussing,debating without coming to a common understanding,i will also bring you scientifical proof indeed that scientists are now interested in that issue of reincarnation,but that is not the issue,let me tell you why...to be able to believe is not necessary to see but to understand,infact wait...let me make you a whole resume of this issue since you did study,so i suppose you know,but i'll just refresh you on that incase.
RESURECTION AND REINCARNATION.
Reincarnation was part of one of the dogmatic belief of jews,in the name of resurection;only the saducees,thought that everything finishes at death,so they did not believe in it.Now the ideas of the jews on that point,like many others,was not clairely define,because they only had a vague and incomplete notion about the soul and the link it has with the body.They thought that a man who has died could come back to life again,without knowing exactly how would that happen.They used to define resurection to what spiritism call reincarnation.In truth resurection suppose the coming back of the body that is dead,in what science even prove itself to be materialisticly impossible,even wen the element of that body has been dispersed and absorbed.Reincarnartion is the coming back of the soul(the real YOU!!),or the spirit in a corporal life,but in another body that has been done exclusively for it,and it has nothing to do with the old body.The word resurection,could be indeed be used for Lazaruth(the one jesus resurected from the dead in the gospel or injil),but not for Elijah,or the other prophets.Than if we go with that belief of the jews that John the baptist(yahyiah)was Elijah,than the body of john could have only been the one of Elijah,because according to the gospel we know john the child as well as his father and mother,Than it could only be John reincarnated and not resurected.
So what i would do i will give you the exact page and chapter of the gospel for you to see it for youself(saint john,chapter 3,;5 from 1 to 12;saint matthiew chapter 11,from 12 to 15......and many more you asked me for proof i did,now for you to find ou). now my question to you is what's the goal of resurection,i challenge you to give me at least 10,if you see any justice in that to burn for eternity,and everything man sees or understand it's always in a materialistic way,now me i can give a thousand reasons for reincarnation,but one of the strongest reson i can give you,it's because only reincarnation explains the infinite justice of God.doesn't it say in the quran that God made man out of his spirit?????so what makes a human,it is rather the soul and the body but withought the soul,can we still call it a human,or a thing.The soul you can interpreted it asyour intellect,but not the body.now....sourate 91 ayat 7 to 10 what does it say?????it only talks about your soul because it's you not the body that you are in. Pecae be with you and sorry if i might have said something that offended you,this is not my intention brother. -
Peace with you all,
Firstly, I want to offer two versions of reincarnations, which i personally believe
One, is the reincarnation that concerns with the aftermath. The Buddhist concept of reincarnation doesn't necessarily acknowledge the term of soul; nor they acknowledge that the soul after which we are born into (either celestial beings, humans, or animals, or lesser and painful existence) are eternal. The buddhist quoted the transformation like from milk to butter, from butter to ghee. The butter is not the same as milk, nor the ghee is the same as butter, but they come from milk.
Peace, that is to clarify those who think we are the same soul after reborn.
While there are some buddhist schools who coined a new term for soul called 'alaya vinnana' or the storage of consciousness; within this theory, they spoke that when our body died, it returned to the elements (maybe that's why corpses are excellent fertilizer) whilst the spiritual elements (the mind) also dissolved (that explains why we forget who we are on the next life) but a tiny seed which stored all the imprints of our lives (which explain the influence of this seed on those who can recall past lives and to the general personality). But Dalai Lama himself spoke that this theory is made upon desperation to search for one speck of element which we people can proudly call as soul or the unchanging foundation. Therefore, this theory is a conjecture.
Reincarnation are complex yet simple, this paradoxical nature of aftermath is perfectly allegorized by the milk, butter, ghee.
There is also another allegory of reincarnation that is of a candle.
Say that a lit-on candle is flaming. Suppose that the life is the flame. Once it is almost exhausted (either of low wax supply, or blown out suddenly) another candle is put so that the flame can be put on the second candle. In this parable, the flame on the second candle is not the first candle, yet it comes from the second candle.Second, the reincarnation of every moment concept. Buddhist concepts are very general because it also taken from watching the nature's cyclic, everchanging nature. So did the reincarnation. The reincarnation in the second concept is the reincarnation of mind. Yes. Everyday, and even every moment, we are undergoing reincarnation.
Buddha ever spoken (Of course I paraphrased this story, and you can question the originality of this story ) of this when he addressed his monks with a question. 'Say, how long do you think one life is?"
One monk answers, "It is as long as eating a bowl of rice."
The Buddha asked for another opinion and he gets the second answer, "It is as long as drinking a cup of water."
The Buddha asked for the third opinion and he gets the final answer according to this myth, "It is as long as one breathe."
The Buddha exclaimed, "Indeed, life is only as long as one breathe."
The Buddha meant that life is just one breathe because the stream of mind (emotion, will, consciousness, memory, and .... sorry i forgot) is always eevrchanging. One moment we are happy, the next ten seconds we can be neutral (indifferent) or maybe crying. One moment we aware of ourselves fully (especially for those who are new with their lover), one moment we are zoning out (or boredom and imagine if we ask people who they are in those zoned out, they would answer 'Ha?'.
Shortly, reincarnation is the everchanging process of mind, plus our body elements (which feed the vermins and maggots and grow into trees from our mere corpse), which is a natural way of how things are,The question which people should put here is that If we are everchanging, is there finality? Or can we progress or not if everything is like maelstorm of change?
Anybody could come with a good answer?Peace to all and thank you so much for reading.
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Peace be upon you all,
Just wanted to add that the Khamitans (ancient egypt) believed and promoted reincarnation, and this is where the greeks and many others came to learn life sciences. I am told that if you master meditation (breathinig, posture, etc) that one can see back to a previous life. But of course I have not confirmed that for myself. But I am indeed practicing meditation and working on my health which is a very important factor in spirituality. If your vehicle is faulty you cant get very far.