Is the Salat physical?
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Hi Phoenix1,
You are not giving it its proper dues, making it a mental exercise. It is communion, Body and Soul.
Like when you sleep, do you sleep upside down with your body dangling from the ceiling rotfl
Or would you say you can sleep in a metaphorical way, so that you just think about it...
How about you actually need the physical aspect of salat to nourish your Spirit? Thought about that?
And by the way do you exercise, it is good for you, or you can just do it in your mind, by thinking about it... rotfl bravo yay -
peace Noble,
you aren't getting the point.
Where in the quran does it say that salat requires bowing and prostrating physically, again?
I never said I take salat metaphorically.
I think that sitting down, relaxing, and thinking are very much physical actions.But please explain what you mean by "nourish your spirit?" what is that?
and why does salat require it's "proper dues?"
and what do you mean by "communion, body and soul?"
please explain so I can better understand your position.And yes, exercise is great. I like playing football. I'm not the fittest person alive though.
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The problem I see with a ritualistic salat (with the bowing and prostrating to the ground) is that it can't do anything.
What would shaking hands or hugging a beloved one do?
I agree that mechanical prostrating or salaat without feeiling (kushou3) will make prostration looks like an empty, meaningless movement; that's why prostration is linked to the pious, righteous believer. When you reach this point during your salaat, you will be overwhelmed and feel like like prostrating.
Thank you Samia
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Peace Ahmed, Samia
Yes indeed I second that, but I do not think metaphorists (whatever that means because I do no yet figure out what the word really means to them) will ever be close to Allah to feel what you are talking about (Khushu'u), and unless you feel it, you will not be compelled to totallly submit, which includes prostrate to the Most High... -
Peace Bro (or Dude?) FJ
I am an educator, so I try to find any resource to help me in my profession.
Unfortunately I also suffer from a mental illness (manic-depression) so my interest in psychiatry and neurology.Read bro read and I hope God helps you with your suffering.
Smile dude (bro?), its good for your health sun yay rotfl
Well, I am the kind of a person that burst into laughing very easely, so I smiled and laughed very much throughout my life. Yesterday I had a my imune system tested and it turned out weak
Everyone of you here is making sense but I cannot tell which one of you is right ???
... I incline a little bit towards physical explanation and, knowing the scientifically proven benefits of meditaion, I also like the non-physical.... whatever ??? ??? ???Peace
FJ -
Peace FJ
Yes laughter is good for your immune system. I also suggest (if you can afford it) Selenium supplements and Vitamin C.
I never said do not Meditate. But we cannot just live in our head. Worship is both mental and physical.
Now who are we worshiping? Allah.
Who revealed the Al-Quran? Allah.
We claim that we follow the Al-Quran alone? Yes.
So let us do it, how? Follow the instructions in the Quran.
Salat is well explained in Quran? Yes.
Do what we are told, perform Salat? Yes.
Is Salat physical? According to Al Quran, Yes...
Do It!
Salam -
... I incline a little bit towards physical explanation and, knowing the scientifically proven benefits of meditaion, I also like the non-physical.... whatever ??? ??? ???
Peace
FJHello mate
But the meditaion is already ordered to us many times in the Quran, why you are mixing it with Salat?
Cheers
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Salaam Phoenix1
Can only true believers feel this? if so, what about the rest? what are we supposed to do to feel that?
For your first question I would say yes. It is an active action, just like the reading/reciting during salaat, it has to be active and you should understand what you are saying. God forbids us from salat if we are in a state in which we cannot comprehend what we are saying. i understand from this that He does not want mechanical uttarance (or movements).
What I said above would cover your second question. No one can tell you what to do in order to "feel" in a specific way.
Salaam FJ
knowing the scientifically proven benefits of meditaion, I also like the non-physical
How is meditation "not physical"? I do not find it very different. Strangely enough, you have to wash before it and even wash your mouth and nostrils to prepare for that (from a book I read to learn how to meditate). You have to stay still, control your thoughts and concentrate on what you are doing. Stay still is physical, isn't it?
I am not a refernce in meditation, but I used it for sometime and I would sleep half an hour through it!! Was I doing it the wrong way? At the time it was very good for me, as I was very stressed, and it offered me extra hour or two of calm sleep.
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I thought they mean by meditation, the rememberance of Allah
well, if not then the Quran didn't order us to meditate
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Peace all
This is why it is important we know what each other means, because we might be at each other's throat for no reason, or the opposite we should be at each others throat for a good reason rotfl yay
Anyways to be serious, yes indeed meditation has not been ordered by Allah. However it intersects with remembrance of Allah if your focus while you meditate is Allah. You might call it an improved state of remembrance in this case, as you focus your attention solely on dhikr - (probably what Muhammed (pbuh) was doing just before he received the first revelation).
Meditation is about calming the mind by focusing on something, such as your breathing... You also let go of your inner voice and judgements by just letting thoughts and noises wash over you... You could also repeat a word to yourself that soothes you such as "Calm" or "Peace".
It has been found scientifically that there are numerous health benefits mental and physical for doing that.
It has also been found that Prayer is even more powerful in these matters!
I use meditation to regulate my breathing, especially when I am on the verge of having an anxiety attack, and it usually works for me, the word I use is "Astaghfiru Allah"... while I am exhaling and "Alhamdulillah" while I am inhaling....
By the way, Samia, you do not need to wash to perform meditation as it is not a religious ceremony...
But the origin is religious from Buddhim and Yoga...
Salam -
Peace FJ
Yes laughter is good for your immune system. I also suggest (if you can afford it) Selenium supplements and Vitamin C.
I never said do not Meditate. But we cannot just live in our head. Worship is both mental and physical.
Now who are we worshiping? Allah.
Who revealed the Al-Quran? Allah.
We claim that we follow the Al-Quran alone? Yes.
So let us do it, how? Follow the instructions in the Quran.
Salat is well explained in Quran? Yes.
Do what we are told, perform Salat? Yes.
Is Salat physical? According to Al Quran, Yes...
Do It!
SalamVery well said brother... My eyes are opening but very slowly. .
Ahmad wrote
Hello mateBut the meditaion is already ordered to us many times in the Quran, why you are mixing it with Salat?
Cheers
Bro AB I know the meditation is mentioned in Quran but isn't Idolfree sugesting that Salat is Meditaion?
Samia wrote
How is meditation "not physical"? I do not find it very different. Strangely enough, you have to wash before it and even wash your mouth and nostrils to prepare for that (from a book I read to learn how to meditate). You have to stay still, control your thoughts and concentrate on what you are doing. Stay still is physical, isn't it?Stayin still is physical but I think what we are talking here is about body movements, not stillness. What about sleep is it physical because one lays down and closes the eyes?
Peace
FJ -
never said do not Meditate. But we cannot just live in our head. Worship is both mental and physical.
Now who are we worshiping? Allah.
Who revealed the Al-Quran? Allah.
We claim that we follow the Al-Quran alone? Yes.
So let us do it, how? Follow the instructions in the Quran.
Salat is well explained in Quran? Yes.
Do what we are told, perform Salat? Yes.
Is Salat physical? According to Al Quran, Yes...
Do It!peace Noble,
I disagree with FJ here. Not very well said at all. You are assuming that salat is perfectly clearly described as a ritual. It's not. You said "Do It!" My question is, do what???
No one is living in their heads.
What I'm saying is that the PHYSICAL (our actions) are a result of our SPIRITUAL state. A person cannot ride a bicycle unless one first LEARNS to ride one. A goalie cannot dive for the ball instinctively unless he has learned and practiced it. A person who thinks cockroaches are gross will never eat one.
What we do is a reflection of what is inside us.
So first, we must change what is inside us to change what we do. That's a fact.
How do we change ourselves? how do we go from bad to good, rejector to believer? we observe SALAT.
We do not worship anything. God is not a person who wants to be loved and have his ego stroked.metaphor
Dictionary.com Unabridged (v 1.0.1)
metaphor /mtfr, -fr/
noun- a figure of speech in which a term or phrase is applied to something to which it is not literally applicable in order to suggest a resemblance, as in A mighty fortress is our God.
- something used, or regarded as being used, to represent something else; emblem; symbol.
"prostrate" is a metaphor in the quran
124 LO! Thus spoke Joseph unto his father "O my father! Behold, I saw eleven stars, as well as the sun and the moon I saw them prostrate themselves before me!"
suns and moons prostrating?? wtf?? please explain.1315 And before God prostrate themselves, willingly or unwillingly, all that are in the heavens and on earth, as do their shadows in the mornings and the evenings.
all things and their shadows too?1649 For, before God prostrates itself all that is in the heavens and all that is on earth - every beast that moves, and the angels these do not bear themselves with false pride
2218 ART THOU NOT aware that before God prostrate themselves all that are in the heavens and all that are on earth the sun, and the moon, and the stars, and the mountains, and the trees, and the beasts? And many human beings , whereas many will inevitably have to suffer ; and he whom God shall scorn will have none who could bestow honour on him for, verily, God does what He wills.
556 prostrate themselves the stars and the trees
and look at this
62 He it is who has created you out of clay, and then has decreed a term - a term known to him. And yet you doubt
CLAY?????????
Humans are definitely NOT made of clay. Is the Quran wrong, or worse, a metaphor o????? -
peace AB,
I will skip the questions you asked of me that can be easily answered by actually reading the article I referenced.
There are very few things that dont have a physical dimension considering our body is the vehicle that we use to do stuff. For example, in that case I could say "physical ibadah", "physical zakat", "physical sadaqat"... it just doesn't sound right, or at least not to me.
Great, for many it sounds perfect sense according to the Arabic Quran
For many it sounds perfect? I have never heard someone say "physical zakat" or "physical sadaqat". Perhaps you can provide evidence for this apparent perfect sounding phrasing.
I didn?t use 2945 to prove that salat is physical, I only used it to prove that it is something else to Zikr Allah
Let me quote what you said after referencing 2945 (emphasis mine)
Therefore Salat is a physical action and includes Sijood
Please bro, be straightforward and explain to me, I know the story well, what is your point?
My point is that the references I cited are examples of those younger than 40 (although no specific age is given for Joseph, its unlikely he was older than 40).
And lastly, if you wish to accuse me of twisting signs/ayatin, at least have the courtesy to point out exactly what I apparently "twisted" rather than making a vague reference.
Wakas
